THE 2019 Hopkins Lacrosse Fallout Shelter (44, we want more!)

[youthathletics]

4 of the attack recruits are small - e.g. Chauvette 5'10" 165 Cohen 5'9" 160
5? Really??

Go look at PSU's top 6-8, all smaller guys. Their best player #1 is smaller than the size you are concerned about. JHU's best player is only 5'10"

there is nothing wrong with small. Biter was probably 5'7" but if you are small, you better be fast and quick to the point you can beat a guy otherwise you get what you have with Hopkins i.e. you don't get the defense moving on slides to open up easy passes to open guys.

I do not disagree, but ball movement and IQ can also that problem. A recruited D1 attackman that is smaller in size typically has the skill set and IQ to succeed..it often falls on the coach to utilize it. IMHO, Petro/Benson did just that with #32....to the point where I saw Landon's offense implemented to help him succeed.

[Sagittarius A*]

4 of the attack recruits are small - e.g. Chauvette 5'10" 165 Cohen 5'9" 160
5? Really??

Go look at PSU's top 6-8, all smaller guys. Their best player #1 is smaller than the size you are concerned about. JHU's best player is only 5'10"

there is nothing wrong with small. Biter was probably 5'7" but if you are small, you better be fast and quick to the point you can beat a guy otherwise you get what you have with Hopkins i.e. you don't get the defense moving on slides to open up easy passes to open guys.

I do not disagree, but ball movement and IQ can also that problem. A recruited D1 attackman that is smaller in size typically has the skill set and IQ to succeed..it often falls on the coach to utilize it. IMHO, Petro/Benson did just that with #32....to the point where I saw Landon's offense implemented to help him succeed.

Attackmen and goalies can be undersized and successful. Midfielders and defensemen not so much. Certainly not SSDMs. Some midfielders can be smaller but a whole midfield line of them cannot work. ACC and Big teams are large and physical. They push us around. Many people were saying after the Ohio state game that we just weren’t big enough or athletic enough to compete. We do have size and athleticism but it was sitting on the bench in that game. I don’t think there’s another coach in D1 who would play the players Petro plays. Its frustrating to watch.

[youthathletics]

4 of the attack recruits are small - e.g. Chauvette 5'10" 165 Cohen 5'9" 160
5? Really??

Go look at PSU's top 6-8, all smaller guys. Their best player #1 is smaller than the size you are concerned about. JHU's best player is only 5'10"

there is nothing wrong with small. Biter was probably 5'7" but if you are small, you better be fast and quick to the point you can beat a guy otherwise you get what you have with Hopkins i.e. you don't get the defense moving on slides to open up easy passes to open guys.

I do not disagree, but ball movement and IQ can also that problem. A recruited D1 attackman that is smaller in size typically has the skill set and IQ to succeed..it often falls on the coach to utilize it. IMHO, Petro/Benson did just that with #32....to the point where I saw Landon's offense implemented to help him succeed.

Attackmen and goalies can be undersized and successful. Midfielders and defensemen not so much. Certainly not SSDMs. Some midfielders can be smaller but a whole midfield line of them cannot work. ACC and Big teams are large and physical. They push us around. Many people were saying after the Ohio state game that we just weren’t big enough or athletic enough to compete. We do have size and athleticism but it was sitting on the bench in that game. I don’t think there’s another coach in D1 who would play the players Petro plays. Its frustrating to watch.

That is why I absolutely love what PSU and Brown --> UVA have done. They have broken away from the norms of what every past pre-2005ish player and coach have believed to be the hardened rules of lacrosse. They have embraced that the growth of the sport and rules changes via contact, demanded design changes. Coaches began collaborating with Hockey and Hoops coaches more and more, using deception, more screens/picks, and ball movement which in the end diminishes the value of the old school big strong/tall lumbering defensemen that are need to stop the big lumbering midfielders. Most goals are being scored right around the crease, you seldom see a downhill midfielder shooting any more.

Outside of Dox on UVA, most of those guys are lean 6' and under as well. Conrad cancels out your belief of small SSDM's...you are likely referring to JHU's, who I believe was hung out to dry and ran far too many reps, until later in the season when help was utilized.

All I am saying is that JHU, like many teams are struggling to adapt to a shift in the sport. Coaches jobs are on the line based on W's and L's, so they are very leery of change..especially significant change. Petro and Benson clearly tinkered with it this year, and frankly I believe this year was eye opening to them realizing that they had the talent, players were being moved around regularly ..just not the chemistry of a group of 6 at any given time, (see PSU and UVA)...they use a short bench to keep cohesion.

JHU will be fine.

[Sagittarius A*]

Ryan Conrad is listed as 6’ 0” 190 lbs on UVA’s website.
There aren’t a lot of players on their entire team under 6 feet tall.
What are you even talking about?

[youthathletics]

You were arguing the case that size matters, and if you believe an and inch or two in height is a make or break deal in lacrosse WRT wins and losses. I simply beg to differ.

[Typical Lax Dad]

You were arguing the case that size matters, and if you believe an and inch or two in height is a make or break deal in lacrosse WRT wins and losses. I simply beg to differ.

Michael Sowers
Grant Ament
Chris Gray
Jeff Teat

They are small attackmen but are big enough

[Sagittarius A*]

You were arguing the case that size matters, and if you believe an and inch or two in height is a make or break deal in lacrosse WRT wins and losses. I simply beg to differ.

Michael Sowers
Grant Ament
Chris Gray
Jeff Teat

They are small attackmen but are big enough

Again, attackmen and goalies can be undersized and successful. Midfielders and defensive players not so much.

[HopFan16]

Many people were saying after the Ohio state game that we just weren’t big enough or athletic enough to compete.

Those "many people" are not smart. The Jays were leading that game 12-10 with 8 minutes left in the 4th quarter. Then it was tied 13-13 with 2 minutes left. OSU scored with 50 seconds left in the game to win. The issue was not size. The issue was we couldn't win a faceoff in the 4th quarter. Inacio was on an absolute tear. I'm pretty sure that game qualifies as "competing."

Ohio State's large and athletic players didn't seem to help them much against Michigan a few weeks later.

Hop needs to get bigger and faster at two specific positions—SSDM (which has been a problem for years) and offensive midfield (which became a problem this year due to the graduations of Tinney, Fraser, and Valis all at once, compounded by DeSimone losing his burst and the coaching staff refusing to play the tallest fastest most athletic midfielder on the team for most of the season).

IF a lot of things go right next year—DeSimone finds that first-step again, Zinn plays a lot more, at least 1 or 2 of these incoming freshmen SSDM/two-way middies pan out, Blondell or Rodgers or someone can step up at LSM, maybe 1 of the Mabbett/Degnon/Lilly trio steps up—then it's possible the middle of the field is stronger and/or more athletic next year. That and goaltending are clearly the two biggest question marks for me headed into 2020.

[Typical Lax Dad]

You were arguing the case that size matters, and if you believe an and inch or two in height is a make or break deal in lacrosse WRT wins and losses. I simply beg to differ.

Michael Sowers
Grant Ament
Chris Gray
Jeff Teat

They are small attackmen but are big enough

Again, attackmen and goalies can be undersized and successful. Midfielders and defensive players not so much.

I agree. I also believe the transition from HS to college is easier for attackmen/goalies than it is for middies/defenders....generally.

[youthathletics]

Hop needs to get bigger and faster at two specific positions—SSDM (which has been a problem for years) and offensive midfield (which became a problem this year due to the graduations of Tinney, Fraser, and Valis all at once,

Joel Tinney just called and said "I am not tall" but I play like it.

[DALaxDad]

The good news is the Jays start next year with one of the top 5 attackmen in the country. Epstein is the real deal.

[HopFan16]

Hop needs to get bigger and faster at two specific positions—SSDM (which has been a problem for years) and offensive midfield (which became a problem this year due to the graduations of Tinney, Fraser, and Valis all at once,

Joel Tinney just called and said "I am not tall" but I play like it.

You'll notice I said "bigger AND faster"—Tinney was the quickest player on any field he was on. Both in terms of lateral agility and dodging, and straight-line speed getting up and down the field. His quickness was sorely missed this year, both in breaking down defenses from the midfield and getting back in the hole to prevent transition opportunities and put a body on their crashing middies.

[youthathletics]

Hop needs to get bigger and faster at two specific positions—SSDM (which has been a problem for years) and offensive midfield (which became a problem this year due to the graduations of Tinney, Fraser, and Valis all at once,

Joel Tinney just called and said "I am not tall" but I play like it.

You'll notice I said "bigger AND faster"—Tinney was the quickest player on any field he was on. Both in terms of lateral agility and dodging, and straight-line speed getting up and down the field. His quickness was sorely missed this year, both in breaking down defenses from the midfield and getting back in the hole to prevent transition opportunities and put a body on their crashing middies.

Exactly...size does not matter.

[51percentcorn]

Just for the record - I am not opposed to smaller (in terms of height and weight) players - I do think there are positions - SSDM in particular - where you can't be a certain someone's size and be highly successful on a consistent basis. And all the players previously mentioned - Bitter, Sankey, Teat, Sowers, Kraus, Ament, Tinney etc. all have at least one apparent thing in common - beyond average quickness and most of them play attack. My point in citing Angelus/Murphy/Cohen/Chauvette (if HF16 is right Chauvette is off this list for a year - he's listed as Culver '19 - he's going somewhere else to PG?) is that this appears to be 4 versions of the same player - 5'9"/10" 165 lbs - so they are not getting much done on a DI lacrosse field through size and strength. I've seen Angelus play on several occasions for PVI - nice player - smart/unselfish/I wouldn't say blinding quickness but he's quickish - what do you need 4 of them for? Epstein hopefully here for the next three years - the three rising juniors - also of the same approximate stature that can play attack for you are here for the next two. With Epstein - what do you need - you need SHOOTERS - you need someone to catch the ball and put it past the goalie - Kyle Wharton/Brandon Benn not to mention Ryan Brown would score 50+ with 32 behind the cage. Forry Smith's accuracy and craftiness will net him more than 20 if he's the attackman joining the line next year but you need Shooters who can step down and rip it from 12 yards out - not 4 kids who generally need the ball in their stick some to use their quickness to be effective.

[Homer]

My point in citing Angelus/Murphy/Cohen/Chauvette (if HF16 is right Chauvette is off this list for a year - he's listed as Culver '19 - he's going somewhere else to PG?) is that this appears to be 4 versions of the same player - 5'9"/10" 165 lbs - so they are not getting much done on a DI lacrosse field through size and strength. I've seen Angelus play on several occasions for PVI - nice player - smart/unselfish/I wouldn't say blinding quickness but he's quickish - what do you need 4 of them for?

Because "attackmen with good stick skills for their age group who aren't reliant on plus-level athleticism or size" are a relatively easy type to project when you're restricting yourself to scouting players under age 15? When all you have is a hammer....

[foreverlax]

You were arguing the case that size matters, and if you believe an and inch or two in height is a make or break deal in lacrosse WRT wins and losses. I simply beg to differ.

Michael Sowers
Grant Ament
Chris Gray
Jeff Teat

They are small attackmen but are big enough

Again, attackmen and goalies can be undersized and successful. Midfielders and defensive players not so much.

Size does matter, but athleticism can make it a non-factor.

[DMac]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOGj8qM6hQ0

[youthathletics]

Size does matter, but athleticism can make it a non-factor.

No doubt forever, and to say size is an issue on this team means they are also saying they have no athleticism...essentially calling into question the current players and recruits as not athletic enough.

[foreverlax]

Size does matter, but athleticism can make it a non-factor.

No doubt forever, and to say size is an issue on this team means they are also saying they have no athleticism...essentially calling into question the current players and recruits as not athletic enough.

Yup....not a good look. I doubt there is a "bad" athlete in all of D1....some are just "better".

[primitiveskills]

You were arguing the case that size matters, and if you believe an and inch or two in height is a make or break deal in lacrosse WRT wins and losses. I simply beg to differ.

Michael Sowers
Grant Ament
Chris Gray
Jeff Teat

They are small attackmen but are big enough

Again, attackmen and goalies can be undersized and successful. Midfielders and defensive players not so much.

The bigger issue at M was production and being able to affect a defense, not necessarily size. There was one game the entire year (Princeton, with Baskin) where a midfield initiator had a significant effect on the game. Whether they had that ability sitting on the bench, who knows. But they chose not to change personnel and it put an extraordinary amount of pressure on Williams and Epstein to make the D uncomfortable.

That said, the offense managed in most games to perform well enough to win. The defense was very experienced but looked lost a lot of the time (starting to become a Hop trademark). And not trying to get more out of the goalie position was headscratching to say the least.