Hobart 2024

[Bartfromboston]

Shot selection has been a real problem so far through the scrimmages and yesterday. Herlihy, considine, Peterkin - all with poor quality shots. Herlihy has always had that issue of shooting from midfield - when he is hot, it looks awesome, but most times, it’s just poor judgment/ball hogging. Typically one of the lowest shooting percentages in the Atlantic 10. Our answer should be to work through X and better shots on spinning and get the defense off their heals. Not try and dodge from 20-30 yards which is what is happening far too much. Patterson helps with that a ton because he makes things happen from behind the cage. Ward looks injured. Troy B looks a little too - not much mobility. Rosa started at Attack. I heard Stillwell was injured as well, although he was dressed. I expect guys like Stillwell, Envin (injured) to run through M going forward.

[SMAIN]

Defense disorganized? Confused? I thought Raymond was an expert in this area and I get the impression Raymond intimidates the players and maybe not to well liked.
This past summer my lady and I were in Geneva and of course we had to stop at Wegman's (her favorite) and who is walking towards us but the big guy himself (Raymond). I attempted to get his attention by saying, hi coach, played Lacrosse for Hobart back in the 50's..... but what I got in return was mumble, mumble and he kept walking. Well, my lady and I looked at each other and said I guess he was in a hurry.... but not impressed. If he had any class he should have said sorry I can't talk to you now I'm running late.

[FMUBart]

No not all day.
Tanner John was complicated. Nice guy, unbelievably hard shot, but created much of his own situation.

Tanner was invited to come being vastly unprepared for that environment and was treated like a kid who sailed through Avon old Farms or Hotchkiss who wasted an upbringing of resources and opportunity. Raymond was a young HC and knew less but I see the same treatment of these kids today. Some get ruined early and never contribute who literally have all conference abilities. If they aren’t prepared immediately for everything they’re kind of tossed aside and given up on pretty quickly. When you have a kid like Tanner, the second you go down that path as oversee, HC, mentor you’ve lost him. Some of these kids were done before jr year, and kept for avg gpa or other reasons, that should really just be cut at that stage and I feel like the coaches know it.

Zach Reed even with injuries is another example. Constantly yanked in and out. I’ve heard podcast comments on allowing kids to play through mistakes but I don’t see it all that much universally but rather selectively to chosen kids. Not to make it sound like one of those “he plays favorites” complaints but for example I love Will delanos game and glad he was able to play through a lot of unforced errors last year. But other Sophs with a 20-21% shooting on volume and not good Gb/TO ratio as a soph is done. Same with middies. Other kids shoot liek Simas and they don’t get five years of near unlimited run. Simas was bizarre because he was as talented as any kiddie we’ve had in more than a decade imo but it never quite clicked into that “who’s this kid at Hobart?” Season

Don't remember Tanner John, but remember Zach Reed. He was a good "little" player that probably should've gone D3. We seem to land plenty of those guys--they have their moments, but overall they're good athletes without the requisite size to be a consistent contributor in D1 lacrosse.

As I stated(as did BartfromBoston), some of the shots are beyond dumb...low angle or from too far out. I remember the Kerwick days when he would say, "we outshot them 35 - 25" despite the fact the 20 of the 35 shots had zero chance of scoring. It seemed to me that there were times yesterday when guys were determined to "get their shots" regardless of the quality of the shots. Perhaps several of them have the green light at all times?

[oldbartman]

It's not just me and the posters on this thread. This is from the Lacrosseplayground.com website, Which is run by the Alford brothers (Maryland grads) and Adam O'Neill (journalist) . Scroll down.

https://www.lacrosseplayground.com/5-5-week-1/

[Laxgunea]

Ouch!

[Ketch]

It's not just me and the posters on this thread. This is from the Lacrosseplayground.com website, Which is run by the Alford brothers (Maryland grads) and Adam O'Neill (journalist) . Scroll down.

https://www.lacrosseplayground.com/5-5-week-1/

No place to go but up. We will not play worse than yesterday.

[Farfromgeneva]

Shot selection has been a real problem so far through the scrimmages and yesterday. Herlihy, considine, Peterkin - all with poor quality shots. Herlihy has always had that issue of shooting from midfield - when he is hot, it looks awesome, but most times, it’s just poor judgment/ball hogging. Typically one of the lowest shooting percentages in the Atlantic 10. Our answer should be to work through X and better shots on spinning and get the defense off their heals. Not try and dodge from 20-30 yards which is what is happening far too much. Patterson helps with that a ton because he makes things happen from behind the cage. Ward looks injured. Troy B looks a little too - not much mobility. Rosa started at Attack. I heard Stillwell was injured as well, although he was dressed. I expect guys like Stillwell, Envin (injured) to run through M going forward.

We haven’t had a guy feeding from x in a while. Can’t even recall after Cam stone who graduated around 2014. Then it was the Frank Brown show for a couple of years working from the GLE w the ball, 2018 was a get it together year w young kids then 19-22 was solid with a lot of iso and ball movement but initiated always from up top.

It’s harder and harder to keep rosa from starting as much as folks suggest he isn’t one right now. Kid has like 25 goals on 80 shots now over maybe 25 games. Rides harder than many. Doesn’t take many bad shots.

Not trying to isolate but I’m increasingly pressed to make the case for Delano over Rosa when we’ve got feeders from the X like Patterson and Evnin now plus we know Dattellas and Barthelme are going to hold the rock and work down low for periods of time so not sure the need is there for a kid with vision but smaller size and can’t get to 25% shooting

[Farfromgeneva]

Defense disorganized? Confused? I thought Raymond was an expert in this area and I get the impression Raymond intimidates the players and maybe not to well liked.
This past summer my lady and I were in Geneva and of course we had to stop at Wegman's (her favorite) and who is walking towards us but the big guy himself (Raymond). I attempted to get his attention by saying, hi coach, played Lacrosse for Hobart back in the 50's..... but what I got in return was mumble, mumble and he kept walking. Well, my lady and I looked at each other and said I guess he was in a hurry.... but not impressed. If he had any class he should have said sorry I can't talk to you now I'm running late.

Hey smain, my dad was friend with and is occasionally see at games after graduating a mid 50s graduate who played named howie farnsworth. Awesome guy, assume hes passed now as he was a young HS teacher of my dad in hs in Savona ny (bath hs). If you did I’m sure you like him as much or
More than I did.

I’m sure he’s a good guy. My sense is just not a social leader type. Head down, gruff, it’s pretty clear from the podcasts he wasn’t focused on liberal arts at Hop (nicest way I can describe it some of my best friends are Neanderthals form WNY o
Nothing wrong with it generally but for certain jobs it may fit). Maybe an elite assistant but not the same as general manager of a program. This was kind of true of DJU at GTown. Rickey and Matt were incredible and dynamic assistants (in a roll the ball out system) but managing a program hasn’t worked out too well and DJU fell off without those two. But if I stick him in a lineup with Brundage, Hirsch and a few others who haven’t worked in Geneva I’m not sure I’m making the same decision as the outgoing AD who messed up funding the bubble if not the RFP process given it deflated and collapsed first time around. He also didn’t file paperwork for 15yrs leading to NCAA violations that were inexcusable for lax and football. Didn’t file for home field in football playoffs. Originally screws up hockey before fixing it, had a basketball HC getting down with a twin on the WS team that was a grossly public “secret” for a long time before he did anything.

The ship sailed in that decision but it never hurts to be reminded that the selection was made by a guy who’s son had the pick in his wedding party right before the AD was out the door and shortly after many inexcusable massive screwup where letting him have that decision was a bad choice by the AD/BOT at the time. My bigger issue is you go in after success in the weakest conference Hobart has ever been in by far when Pton is sniffing around and jackpot bosses for a nice chunky new deal. Well guess what, that comes consequences and expectations. In most of the real world. Decisions in the overly large board that can’t figure out who should be president for 15yrs aren’t always rational, like holding folks to material consequences for their actions and results so who knows how this plays out. My worry is the lack of “pressure” of having to deliver real world results and related makes the region making diluted and why we overly focus on A10 and I dont feel like we do enough to be a complete team be over micro managing the league play aspect which got us exactly one playoff bid int eh NEC.

Problem is just a general lack of trust engendered by poor decision over the last two decades.

[Farfromgeneva]

No not all day.
Tanner John was complicated. Nice guy, unbelievably hard shot, but created much of his own situation.

Tanner was invited to come being vastly unprepared for that environment and was treated like a kid who sailed through Avon old Farms or Hotchkiss who wasted an upbringing of resources and opportunity. Raymond was a young HC and knew less but I see the same treatment of these kids today. Some get ruined early and never contribute who literally have all conference abilities. If they aren’t prepared immediately for everything they’re kind of tossed aside and given up on pretty quickly. When you have a kid like Tanner, the second you go down that path as oversee, HC, mentor you’ve lost him. Some of these kids were done before jr year, and kept for avg gpa or other reasons, that should really just be cut at that stage and I feel like the coaches know it.

Zach Reed even with injuries is another example. Constantly yanked in and out. I’ve heard podcast comments on allowing kids to play through mistakes but I don’t see it all that much universally but rather selectively to chosen kids. Not to make it sound like one of those “he plays favorites” complaints but for example I love Will delanos game and glad he was able to play through a lot of unforced errors last year. But other Sophs with a 20-21% shooting on volume and not good Gb/TO ratio as a soph is done. Same with middies. Other kids shoot liek Simas and they don’t get five years of near unlimited run. Simas was bizarre because he was as talented as any kiddie we’ve had in more than a decade imo but it never quite clicked into that “who’s this kid at Hobart?” Season

Don't remember Tanner John, but remember Zach Reed. He was a good "little" player that probably should've gone D3. We seem to land plenty of those guys--they have their moments, but overall they're good athletes without the requisite size to be a consistent contributor in D1 lacrosse.

As I stated(as did BartfromBoston), some of the shoots are beyond dumb...low angle or from too far out. I remember the Kerwick days when he would say, "we outshot them 35 - 25" despite the fact the 20 of the 35 shots had zero chance of scoring. It seemed to me that there were times yesterday when guys were determined to "get their shots" regardless of the quality of the shots. Perhaps several of them have the green light at all times?

So you are certain you know Zach Reed wasn’t a D1 player? I completely disagree and don’t think you remember or paid enough attention. But moving on since you have argued the complete opposite that side doesn’t matter it’s how you play. Reed played with a busted back. That’s playing tough.

https://hwsathletics.com/sports/mens-la ... john/11312

Fastest player in the team and reportedly hardest shot as well. Had some injuries but his issue was a tougher upbringing (think on the Rez) and had created his own situation (family) -just a kid who never was given much opportunity and didn’t know better and from people in the know obviously incredibly fragile. No doubt someone will form up with “hey life is tough” nonsense but that’s stupid and ignores the fact that the manager of the program recruited. 17yr old kid was around to know his situation and managed it horribly. We can save the tough guy schtick for real life instead of these petty boards as I’ve seen comments how tough sports 4-5x in a few days. Juvenile stuff people need to get real.

[Bartfromboston]

It's not just me and the posters on this thread. This is from the Lacrosseplayground.com website, Which is run by the Alford brothers (Maryland grads) and Adam O'Neill (journalist) . Scroll down.

https://www.lacrosseplayground.com/5-5-week-1/

Middle school shot selection - that is a little harsh. But the only way to hold kids accountable is to sit their asses down for at least a little. You cant have the decision making and lack of head game be rewarded by saying “oh well, you’re a starter so just try harder”. The message you send to the rest of the team will extend beyond this season in many ways.

[DoubleD]

I'm not up to speed on the recent Colgate games re: thuggery...But, now with Lemoyne--and we picked up UAlbany this year--there are enough local teams that playing Colgate is definitely unnecessary. Heck, could even pick up Bucknell or Army. Both relatively short trips. With regard to the long time Hobart trainer(RIP), let's just say it was a different time when he ruled the training room...

Back then I thought he was cool as heck. Now think back to guys who had broken bones who were told they needed “a can of suck it up” and shake my head. But my point was to the youngster in the post modern, post NYT world educating on toughness in sports

So true I played football too and when we got concussions we were told ha u got ur bell rung and sent back out to play. Crazy when u think about it now. I had at least 6 concussions I can remember maybe more. That's from peewee to college.

Good friend of mine. Mix of damage from high level N Jersey Football (i was also
Once in a fight with him against a couple of NJ Devils and saw him get smashed good by Scott Gomez who was a nasty hockey player back in the day) and college lacrosse (at Brown).

I saw his decline and it was tragic.

https://concussionfoundation.org/person ... -albarelli

Such a sad story and especially because I can relate some but luckily I made it thru and still alive. I broke my jaw playing flag football and got addicted to pain meds. Wasn't unti after my divorce and a few yrs of darknesss I finally got the help I needed and got my life back. My family all believe concussions have effected me later in my life. Horrible ur friend wasn't able to get the help he needed before something tragic happened. So sorry u lost and his family. Just a sad story. Thank god they have made changes to help kids today and remove them from games and practices for weeks at a time after a concussion.

[man:down]

the theme on Sunday is the same as it has been - players gripping their sticks too tight, afraid to make mistakes. Colgate was more poised, more physical, more focused and more relaxed (fresh off two big-time games) - but Hobart had the yips. Missed ground balls, missed catches, not enough off-ball movement, too many high-to-high shots and panic when dealing with a 10-man ride they knew was coming. There is massive talent on this team and when they play loose, it is a fast and sharp offense. The coaches need to figure this out - and I don't think it is an easy task at all. Their tendency is to react quickly (over react?) by benching guys who make mistakes and shortening the bench instead of throwing other guys on the field.

Up front, Patterson seems to be able to do it all - feed from X and create opportunities for himself. Barthelme, when relaxed and healthy draws a lot of attention so he should be able to draw a slide and find an open cutter. Datellas is the man (and an animal on the ride) when he doesn't feel like he needs to do it himself. Rosa can fill in any role they need, which is how they seem to be using him. Ward seems to be dealing with a knee issue but, judging from the VT scrimmage, may be the best off-ball catch and finish guy on the team - and he can feed from X.

Bach needs to get pissed off. He is a man among boys and we will see it. Herlihy and Delano both have cannons but they can't do it alone by cutting back and forth because the goalie knows what's coming (and Herlihy needs to put more shots on the ground. High-to-high didn't work Sunday). Constadine and Patterson are both game-changers but need to play as loose as possible, especially when drawing top defenders. And Cardinalli should be on the field with these guys - he has great vision and isn't afraid of contact. Get Swisher some runs too - build his experience.

But regardless, the coaches need to balance the pressure vs relax thing to get the most out of all of these guys AND the next 5 or 6 who should be getting experience.

[cooperstef]

No not all day.
Tanner John was complicated. Nice guy, unbelievably hard shot, but created much of his own situation.

Tanner was invited to come being vastly unprepared for that environment and was treated like a kid who sailed through Avon old Farms or Hotchkiss who wasted an upbringing of resources and opportunity. Raymond was a young HC and knew less but I see the same treatment of these kids today. Some get ruined early and never contribute who literally have all conference abilities. If they aren’t prepared immediately for everything they’re kind of tossed aside and given up on pretty quickly. When you have a kid like Tanner, the second you go down that path as oversee, HC, mentor you’ve lost him. Some of these kids were done before jr year, and kept for avg gpa or other reasons, that should really just be cut at that stage and I feel like the coaches know it.

Zach Reed even with injuries is another example. Constantly yanked in and out. I’ve heard podcast comments on allowing kids to play through mistakes but I don’t see it all that much universally but rather selectively to chosen kids. Not to make it sound like one of those “he plays favorites” complaints but for example I love Will delanos game and glad he was able to play through a lot of unforced errors last year. But other Sophs with a 20-21% shooting on volume and not good Gb/TO ratio as a soph is done. Same with middies. Other kids shoot liek Simas and they don’t get five years of near unlimited run. Simas was bizarre because he was as talented as any kiddie we’ve had in more than a decade imo but it never quite clicked into that “who’s this kid at Hobart?” Season

Don't remember Tanner John, but remember Zach Reed. He was a good "little" player that probably should've gone D3. We seem to land plenty of those guys--they have their moments, but overall they're good athletes without the requisite size to be a consistent contributor in D1 lacrosse.

As I stated(as did BartfromBoston), some of the shoots are beyond dumb...low angle or from too far out. I remember the Kerwick days when he would say, "we outshot them 35 - 25" despite the fact the 20 of the 35 shots had zero chance of scoring. It seemed to me that there were times yesterday when guys were determined to "get their shots" regardless of the quality of the shots. Perhaps several of them have the green light at all times?

So you are certain you know Zach Reed wasn’t a D1 player? I completely disagree and don’t think you remember or paid enough attention. But moving on since you have argued the complete opposite that side doesn’t matter it’s how you play. Reed played with a busted back. That’s playing tough.

https://hwsathletics.com/sports/mens-la ... john/11312

Fastest player in the team and reportedly hardest shot as well. Had some injuries but his issue was a tougher upbringing (think on the Rez) and had created his own situation (family) -just a kid who never was given much opportunity and didn’t know better and from people in the know obviously incredibly fragile. No doubt someone will form up with “hey life is tough” nonsense but that’s stupid and ignores the fact that the manager of the program recruited. 17yr old kid was around to know his situation and managed it horribly. We can save the tough guy schtick for real life instead of these petty boards as I’ve seen comments how tough sports 4-5x in a few days. Juvenile stuff people need to get real.

If he was the fastest player on the team at 6'4 250 lbs he wouldn't have played lacrosse. I think people that were whining before the game about big bad Colgate are the ones who need to get real. They came in and worked us on the ground. Outside of Shea, the rest of the team managed to pick up 15 loose balls. Tough to win that way.

[FMUBart]

Shot selection has been a real problem so far through the scrimmages and yesterday. Herlihy, considine, Peterkin - all with poor quality shots. Herlihy has always had that issue of shooting from midfield - when he is hot, it looks awesome, but most times, it’s just poor judgment/ball hogging. Typically one of the lowest shooting percentages in the Atlantic 10. Our answer should be to work through X and better shots on spinning and get the defense off their heals. Not try and dodge from 20-30 yards which is what is happening far too much. Patterson helps with that a ton because he makes things happen from behind the cage. Ward looks injured. Troy B looks a little too - not much mobility. Rosa started at Attack. I heard Stillwell was injured as well, although he was dressed. I expect guys like Stillwell, Envin (injured) to run through M going forward.

We haven’t had a guy feeding from x in a while. Can’t even recall after Cam stone who graduated around 2014. Then it was the Frank Brown show for a couple of years working from the GLE w the ball, 2018 was a get it together year w young kids then 19-22 was solid with a lot of iso and ball movement but initiated always from up top.

It’s harder and harder to keep rosa from starting as much as folks suggest he isn’t one right now. Kid has like 25 goals on 80 shots now over maybe 25 games. Rides harder than many. Doesn’t take many bad shots.

Not trying to isolate but I’m increasingly pressed to make the case for Delano over Rosa when we’ve got feeders from the X like Patterson and Evnin now plus we know Dattellas and Barthelme are going to hold the rock and work down low for periods of time so not sure the need is there for a kid with vision but smaller size and can’t get to 25% shooting

Rosa DID start Saturday and I'm not sure who says he shouldn't?? He is a great off-ball, catch and shoot guy and compliments Dattellas and Patterson nicely. If you want him to be a dodger, it's not his skillset. Sometimes it is hard to follow your non-sequitur rants, but I'm trying.
I saw Zach Reed play in HS(friends with another player's dad on his Haverling team). I would call Zach "scrappy" but thought he was a D3 player. He did have some moments at Hobart, but I always thought of him as more of a "relay" guy and complimentary player--sort of like Rosa!

[Laxgunea]

the theme on Sunday is the same as it has been - players gripping their sticks too tight, afraid to make mistakes. Colgate was more poised, more physical, more focused and more relaxed (fresh off two big-time games) - but Hobart had the yips. Missed ground balls, missed catches, not enough off-ball movement, too many high-to-high shots and panic when dealing with a 10-man ride they knew was coming. There is massive talent on this team and when they play loose, it is a fast and sharp offense. The coaches need to figure this out - and I don't think it is an easy task at all. Their tendency is to react quickly (over react?) by benching guys who make mistakes and shortening the bench instead of throwing other guys on the field.

Up front, Patterson seems to be able to do it all - feed from X and create opportunities for himself. Barthelme, when relaxed and healthy draws a lot of attention so he should be able to draw a slide and find an open cutter. Datellas is the man (and an animal on the ride) when he doesn't feel like he needs to do it himself. Rosa can fill in any role they need, which is how they seem to be using him. Ward seems to be dealing with a knee issue but, judging from the VT scrimmage, may be the best off-ball catch and finish guy on the team - and he can feed from X.

Bach needs to get ticked off. He is a man among boys and we will see it. Herlihy and Delano both have cannons but they can't do it alone by cutting back and forth because the goalie knows what's coming (and Herlihy needs to put more shots on the ground. High-to-high didn't work Sunday). Constadine and Patterson are both game-changers but need to play as loose as possible, especially when drawing top defenders. And Cardinalli should be on the field with these guys - he has great vision and isn't afraid of contact. Get Swisher some runs too - build his experience.

But regardless, the coaches need to balance the pressure vs relax thing to get the most out of all of these guys AND the next 5 or 6 who should be getting experience.

This is what I tried to express. I think you said it really well. This is a team that needs to be loose and not afraid to play. That goes for close D too. Once they get more confidence, they will play tighter on ball and have faith that the slide will be there. I'll say again that I thought Firth played well, but the unit as a whole needs to gel.
It was a rough day, but it's still the first half of February. No need to panic at all.

[Farfromgeneva]

I'm not up to speed on the recent Colgate games re: thuggery...But, now with Lemoyne--and we picked up UAlbany this year--there are enough local teams that playing Colgate is definitely unnecessary. Heck, could even pick up Bucknell or Army. Both relatively short trips. With regard to the long time Hobart trainer(RIP), let's just say it was a different time when he ruled the training room...

Back then I thought he was cool as heck. Now think back to guys who had broken bones who were told they needed “a can of suck it up” and shake my head. But my point was to the youngster in the post modern, post NYT world educating on toughness in sports

So true I played football too and when we got concussions we were told ha u got ur bell rung and sent back out to play. Crazy when u think about it now. I had at least 6 concussions I can remember maybe more. That's from peewee to college.

Good friend of mine. Mix of damage from high level N Jersey Football (i was also
Once in a fight with him against a couple of NJ Devils and saw him get smashed good by Scott Gomez who was a nasty hockey player back in the day) and college lacrosse (at Brown).

I saw his decline and it was tragic.

https://concussionfoundation.org/person ... -albarelli

Such a sad story and especially because I can relate some but luckily I made it thru and still alive. I broke my jaw playing flag football and got addicted to pain meds. Wasn't unti after my divorce and a few yrs of darknesss I finally got the help I needed and got my life back. My family all believe concussions have effected me later in my life. Horrible ur friend wasn't able to get the help he needed before something tragic happened. So sorry u lost and his family. Just a sad story. Thank god they have made changes to help kids today and remove them from games and practices for weeks at a time after a concussion.

I had two recognized concussions but probably was more like 6 in college in reality.

Your situation is tough as well. I’m sorry to hear it and hope things have turned around. This is why we need adults we can trust around us even in college. Why I can’t let me kids ever go to Duke even if their fallback is Arizona State community college after the lacrosse team sellout for other social purposes. I can be reckless and fine with it but having kids now it’s just not cool to hand a kid over to anyone and have them let you and your kid down.

[Farfromgeneva]

No not all day.
Tanner John was complicated. Nice guy, unbelievably hard shot, but created much of his own situation.

Tanner was invited to come being vastly unprepared for that environment and was treated like a kid who sailed through Avon old Farms or Hotchkiss who wasted an upbringing of resources and opportunity. Raymond was a young HC and knew less but I see the same treatment of these kids today. Some get ruined early and never contribute who literally have all conference abilities. If they aren’t prepared immediately for everything they’re kind of tossed aside and given up on pretty quickly. When you have a kid like Tanner, the second you go down that path as oversee, HC, mentor you’ve lost him. Some of these kids were done before jr year, and kept for avg gpa or other reasons, that should really just be cut at that stage and I feel like the coaches know it.

Zach Reed even with injuries is another example. Constantly yanked in and out. I’ve heard podcast comments on allowing kids to play through mistakes but I don’t see it all that much universally but rather selectively to chosen kids. Not to make it sound like one of those “he plays favorites” complaints but for example I love Will delanos game and glad he was able to play through a lot of unforced errors last year. But other Sophs with a 20-21% shooting on volume and not good Gb/TO ratio as a soph is done. Same with middies. Other kids shoot liek Simas and they don’t get five years of near unlimited run. Simas was bizarre because he was as talented as any kiddie we’ve had in more than a decade imo but it never quite clicked into that “who’s this kid at Hobart?” Season

Don't remember Tanner John, but remember Zach Reed. He was a good "little" player that probably should've gone D3. We seem to land plenty of those guys--they have their moments, but overall they're good athletes without the requisite size to be a consistent contributor in D1 lacrosse.

As I stated(as did BartfromBoston), some of the shoots are beyond dumb...low angle or from too far out. I remember the Kerwick days when he would say, "we outshot them 35 - 25" despite the fact the 20 of the 35 shots had zero chance of scoring. It seemed to me that there were times yesterday when guys were determined to "get their shots" regardless of the quality of the shots. Perhaps several of them have the green light at all times?

So you are certain you know Zach Reed wasn’t a D1 player? I completely disagree and don’t think you remember or paid enough attention. But moving on since you have argued the complete opposite that side doesn’t matter it’s how you play. Reed played with a busted back. That’s playing tough.

https://hwsathletics.com/sports/mens-la ... john/11312

Fastest player in the team and reportedly hardest shot as well. Had some injuries but his issue was a tougher upbringing (think on the Rez) and had created his own situation (family) -just a kid who never was given much opportunity and didn’t know better and from people in the know obviously incredibly fragile. No doubt someone will form up with “hey life is tough” nonsense but that’s stupid and ignores the fact that the manager of the program recruited. 17yr old kid was around to know his situation and managed it horribly. We can save the tough guy schtick for real life instead of these petty boards as I’ve seen comments how tough sports 4-5x in a few days. Juvenile stuff people need to get real.

If he was the fastest player on the team at 6'4 250 lbs he wouldn't have played lacrosse. I think people that were whining before the game about big bad Colgate are the ones who need to get real. They came in and worked us on the ground. Outside of Shea, the rest of the team managed to pick up 15 loose balls. Tough to win that way.

Whining? Did you finish at Bart?

That was a quote from Raymond….

[Farfromgeneva]

[quote=FMUBart post_id=518608 time=1707844460 user_id=2654]
[quote=Farfromgeneva post_id=518439 time=1707777783 user_id=1206]
[quote=Bartfromboston post_id=518230 time=1707731265 user_id=4641]
Shot selection has been a real problem so far through the scrimmages and yesterday. Herlihy, considine, Peterkin - all with poor quality shots. Herlihy has always had that issue of shooting from midfield - when he is hot, it looks awesome, but most times, it’s just poor judgment/ball hogging. Typically one of the lowest shooting percentages in the Atlantic 10. Our answer should be to work through X and better shots on spinning and get the defense off their heals. Not try and dodge from 20-30 yards which is what is happening far too much. Patterson helps with that a ton because he makes things happen from behind the cage. Ward looks injured. Troy B looks a little too - not much mobility. Rosa started at Attack. I heard Stillwell was injured as well, although he was dressed. I expect guys like Stillwell, Envin (injured) to run through M going forward.
[/quote]

We haven’t had a guy feeding from x in a while. Can’t even recall after Cam stone who graduated around 2014. Then it was the Frank Brown show for a couple of years working from the GLE w the ball, 2018 was a get it together year w young kids then 19-22 was solid with a lot of iso and ball movement but initiated always from up top.

It’s harder and harder to keep rosa from starting as much as folks suggest he isn’t one right now. Kid has like 25 goals on 80 shots now over maybe 25 games. Rides harder than many. Doesn’t take many bad shots.

Not trying to isolate but I’m increasingly pressed to make the case for Delano over Rosa when we’ve got feeders from the X like Patterson and Evnin now plus we know Dattellas and Barthelme are going to hold the rock and work down low for periods of time so not sure the need is there for a kid with vision but smaller size and can’t get to 25% shooting
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Rosa DID start Saturday and I'm not sure who says he shouldn't?? He is a great off-ball, catch and shoot guy and compliments Dattellas and Patterson nicely. If you want him to be a dodger, it's not his skillset. Sometimes it is hard to follow your non-sequitur rants, but I'm trying.
I saw Zach Reed play in HS(friends with another player's dad on his Haverling team). I would call Zach "scrappy" but thought he was a D3 player. He did have some moments at Hobart, but I always thought of him as more of a "relay" guy and complimentary player--sort of like Rosa!
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Before the season you inquire who’s starting and Rosa was said to be man up repeatedly no one suggested he should start. No one said he shouldn’t but his name was never listed among the first six-go check this thread. So how does one interpret that no one suggested he start in first six here for 9 mo as anything other than folks don’t think he should be a starter? It’s possible that omissions of evidence does not equal evidence of omission but is that the conclusion a reasonable person would come up with given what’s been written here?

Wait Rosa is a scrappy complimentary starter but Reed is D3? How do I follow that? One is a superior complimentary player but starter D1 level and the other isn’t D1? Or is it that Reed wasn’t as prepared for D1 form a tiny section/area vs a W Genny kid with it in the family and an older brother at Cuse? And the staff didn’t have the patience.

It’s silly tod debate Reed though it was a point within a larger context, I’m not the only one here who knows kids get yanked and their confidence gets crushed regularly. It’s that simple . For the guys who either didn’t graduate or took longer than reasonable and want publicly very cool to the school afterwards wait until you have to twist and manage some kids out of college at a job or have to raise some. 22-22 isn’t s**t. Most kids I manage at 25-27 are still children in a lot of ways. I was raised the in the “you’ll figure it out and survive”after being tossed in the poll by dad world - being a tough guy and thus and that isn’t managing a program that’s critical to a institutions that’s 200+ years old. It’s juvenile to talk about tough guy stuff when we’re town about a LOB that’s mission cortical to the parent enterprise (this is in revenge’s to the younger alum whos got it all
Figure out. (And by alum that assumes he got a degree which wasn’t the case initially)

[FMUBart]

I'm not up to speed on the recent Colgate games re: thuggery...But, now with Lemoyne--and we picked up UAlbany this year--there are enough local teams that playing Colgate is definitely unnecessary. Heck, could even pick up Bucknell or Army. Both relatively short trips. With regard to the long time Hobart trainer(RIP), let's just say it was a different time when he ruled the training room...

Back then I thought he was cool as heck. Now think back to guys who had broken bones who were told they needed “a can of suck it up” and shake my head. But my point was to the youngster in the post modern, post NYT world educating on toughness in sports

So true I played football too and when we got concussions we were told ha u got ur bell rung and sent back out to play. Crazy when u think about it now. I had at least 6 concussions I can remember maybe more. That's from peewee to college.

Good friend of mine. Mix of damage from high level N Jersey Football (i was also
Once in a fight with him against a couple of NJ Devils and saw him get smashed good by Scott Gomez who was a nasty hockey player back in the day) and college lacrosse (at Brown).

I saw his decline and it was tragic.

https://concussionfoundation.org/person ... -albarelli

Such a sad story and especially because I can relate some but luckily I made it thru and still alive. I broke my jaw playing flag football and got addicted to pain meds. Wasn't unti after my divorce and a few yrs of darknesss I finally got the help I needed and got my life back. My family all believe concussions have effected me later in my life. Horrible ur friend wasn't able to get the help he needed before something tragic happened. So sorry u lost and his family. Just a sad story. Thank god they have made changes to help kids today and remove them from games and practices for weeks at a time after a concussion.

I had two recognized concussions but probably was more like 6 in college in reality.

Your situation is tough as well. I’m sorry to hear it and hope things have turned around. This is why we need adults we can trust around us even in college. Why I can’t let me kids ever go to Duke even if their fallback is Arizona State community college after the lacrosse team sellout for other social purposes. I can be reckless and fine with it but having kids now it’s just not cool to hand a kid over to anyone and have them let you and your kid down.

You definitely have CTE and should get yourself checked ASAP...if you haven't noticed, you enjoy arguing--often with animosity--with numerous people on this forum if you don't agree with their opinion. This is a LACROSSE forum, not a debate competition. Seeing as you have over 22,000 forum posts, something ain't right, just saying..

[Farfromgeneva]

I'm not up to speed on the recent Colgate games re: thuggery...But, now with Lemoyne--and we picked up UAlbany this year--there are enough local teams that playing Colgate is definitely unnecessary. Heck, could even pick up Bucknell or Army. Both relatively short trips. With regard to the long time Hobart trainer(RIP), let's just say it was a different time when he ruled the training room...

Back then I thought he was cool as heck. Now think back to guys who had broken bones who were told they needed “a can of suck it up” and shake my head. But my point was to the youngster in the post modern, post NYT world educating on toughness in sports

So true I played football too and when we got concussions we were told ha u got ur bell rung and sent back out to play. Crazy when u think about it now. I had at least 6 concussions I can remember maybe more. That's from peewee to college.

Good friend of mine. Mix of damage from high level N Jersey Football (i was also
Once in a fight with him against a couple of NJ Devils and saw him get smashed good by Scott Gomez who was a nasty hockey player back in the day) and college lacrosse (at Brown).

I saw his decline and it was tragic.

https://concussionfoundation.org/person ... -albarelli

Such a sad story and especially because I can relate some but luckily I made it thru and still alive. I broke my jaw playing flag football and got addicted to pain meds. Wasn't unti after my divorce and a few yrs of darknesss I finally got the help I needed and got my life back. My family all believe concussions have effected me later in my life. Horrible ur friend wasn't able to get the help he needed before something tragic happened. So sorry u lost and his family. Just a sad story. Thank god they have made changes to help kids today and remove them from games and practices for weeks at a time after a concussion.

I had two recognized concussions but probably was more like 6 in college in reality.

Your situation is tough as well. I’m sorry to hear it and hope things have turned around. This is why we need adults we can trust around us even in college. Why I can’t let me kids ever go to Duke even if their fallback is Arizona State community college after the lacrosse team sellout for other social purposes. I can be reckless and fine with it but having kids now it’s just not cool to hand a kid over to anyone and have them let you and your kid down.

You definitely have CTE and should get yourself checked ASAP...if you haven't noticed, you enjoy arguing--often with animosity--with numerous people on this forum if you don't agree with their opinion. This is a LACROSSE forum, not a debate competition. Seeing as you have over 22,000 forum posts, something ain't right, just saying..

Straight class you Kerwick ball cradler. Go get after some more DUIs with your bot while posting about Raymond’s killing also drinking and driving after hop which we all know you did out of pettiness. Care about some people’s lives and not others we all know. Talk about following logic when you defend Raymond now after posting that when he was hired?