January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

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Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

Typical Lax Dad wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:42 pm
old salt wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:42 am
RedFromMI wrote: Fri Jan 26, 2024 11:31 pm
old salt wrote: Fri Jan 26, 2024 10:51 pm
[stuff omitted]

Yes, I understand all that. But a seditious conspiracy is not necessarily a conspiracy to conduct an insurrection -- an action to seize control of a government. Adjudication in a civil suit in a state court is a far cry from a conviction, let alone a charge, of conspiring or conducting an insurrection.
If Trump was fomenting, promoting, advocating or conducting an insurrection, Jack Smith should have charged, or even accused him of such.
No.

Trump was fomenting, promoting, and advocating for an insurrection by his actions before and during Jan. 6. But the _criminal_ code does not have that exact charge.

The Colorado judge when the lawsuit was brought to remove Trump from the Colorado primary ballot for taking part in an insurrection did in fact make a legal determination that Trump did take part in an insurrection, but punted the issue of whether the amendment specifically applied to him. The appeals process overturned the application part, but not the finding of fact (Trump did the insurrection). That is why this heads to the SC.

What Jack Smith should charge Trump with is anything he thinks he can prove beyond a reasonable doubt to a jury - and if that does not include seditious conspiracy, I am fine with that. I side with the more than one judge who has determined there was an insurrection and Trump was part of it.
No. That's what you & 5 CO state court judges think. BFD. Let's see what the Supremes think.

If Jack Smith could bring charges that include the word "insurrection", he surely would.
My Jack is going for lower hanging fruit. You should ask him.
Yeah why spend money on the bottle service and table for a unenthusiastic dead fish missionary romp if your lucky with a skinny tall beak nosed bad attitude ten at the hot new club downtown Manhattan when you can go to turtle bay and get some very active and wnergetic scratch and dent sevens who will want your approval bad enough they will teach you feelings you never knew you
Had and all it cost were four or five shots of cheap tequila?

(BTW you share this with your son and he may not say he agrees on the phone but I bet he’s nodding his head)
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Typical Lax Dad
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Typical Lax Dad »

Farfromgeneva wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:13 pm
Typical Lax Dad wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:42 pm
old salt wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:42 am
RedFromMI wrote: Fri Jan 26, 2024 11:31 pm
old salt wrote: Fri Jan 26, 2024 10:51 pm
[stuff omitted]

Yes, I understand all that. But a seditious conspiracy is not necessarily a conspiracy to conduct an insurrection -- an action to seize control of a government. Adjudication in a civil suit in a state court is a far cry from a conviction, let alone a charge, of conspiring or conducting an insurrection.
If Trump was fomenting, promoting, advocating or conducting an insurrection, Jack Smith should have charged, or even accused him of such.
No.

Trump was fomenting, promoting, and advocating for an insurrection by his actions before and during Jan. 6. But the _criminal_ code does not have that exact charge.

The Colorado judge when the lawsuit was brought to remove Trump from the Colorado primary ballot for taking part in an insurrection did in fact make a legal determination that Trump did take part in an insurrection, but punted the issue of whether the amendment specifically applied to him. The appeals process overturned the application part, but not the finding of fact (Trump did the insurrection). That is why this heads to the SC.

What Jack Smith should charge Trump with is anything he thinks he can prove beyond a reasonable doubt to a jury - and if that does not include seditious conspiracy, I am fine with that. I side with the more than one judge who has determined there was an insurrection and Trump was part of it.
No. That's what you & 5 CO state court judges think. BFD. Let's see what the Supremes think.

If Jack Smith could bring charges that include the word "insurrection", he surely would.
My Jack is going for lower hanging fruit. You should ask him.
Yeah why spend money on the bottle service and table for a unenthusiastic dead fish missionary romp if your lucky with a skinny tall beak nosed bad attitude ten at the hot new club downtown Manhattan when you can go to turtle bay and get some very active and wnergetic scratch and dent sevens who will want your approval bad enough they will teach you feelings you never knew you
Had and all it cost were four or five shots of cheap tequila?

(BTW you share this with your son and he may not say he agrees on the phone but I bet he’s nodding his head)
Isn’t Old Soldier fond of saying if you go for the King you best not miss….Maybe Jack Smith reads his posts and is taking his advice?
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Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

Typical Lax Dad wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:22 pm
Farfromgeneva wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:13 pm
Typical Lax Dad wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:42 pm
old salt wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:42 am
RedFromMI wrote: Fri Jan 26, 2024 11:31 pm
old salt wrote: Fri Jan 26, 2024 10:51 pm
[stuff omitted]

Yes, I understand all that. But a seditious conspiracy is not necessarily a conspiracy to conduct an insurrection -- an action to seize control of a government. Adjudication in a civil suit in a state court is a far cry from a conviction, let alone a charge, of conspiring or conducting an insurrection.
If Trump was fomenting, promoting, advocating or conducting an insurrection, Jack Smith should have charged, or even accused him of such.
No.

Trump was fomenting, promoting, and advocating for an insurrection by his actions before and during Jan. 6. But the _criminal_ code does not have that exact charge.

The Colorado judge when the lawsuit was brought to remove Trump from the Colorado primary ballot for taking part in an insurrection did in fact make a legal determination that Trump did take part in an insurrection, but punted the issue of whether the amendment specifically applied to him. The appeals process overturned the application part, but not the finding of fact (Trump did the insurrection). That is why this heads to the SC.

What Jack Smith should charge Trump with is anything he thinks he can prove beyond a reasonable doubt to a jury - and if that does not include seditious conspiracy, I am fine with that. I side with the more than one judge who has determined there was an insurrection and Trump was part of it.
No. That's what you & 5 CO state court judges think. BFD. Let's see what the Supremes think.

If Jack Smith could bring charges that include the word "insurrection", he surely would.
My Jack is going for lower hanging fruit. You should ask him.
Yeah why spend money on the bottle service and table for a unenthusiastic dead fish missionary romp if your lucky with a skinny tall beak nosed bad attitude ten at the hot new club downtown Manhattan when you can go to turtle bay and get some very active and wnergetic scratch and dent sevens who will want your approval bad enough they will teach you feelings you never knew you
Had and all it cost were four or five shots of cheap tequila?

(BTW you share this with your son and he may not say he agrees on the phone but I bet he’s nodding his head)
Isn’t Old Soldier fond of saying if you go for the King you best not miss….Maybe Jack Smith reads his posts and is taking his advice?
That’s case by case. If you come at me, yes I have a long memory and can be savagely petty when inertia of my position sets in. So you need a kill shot here. It’s a bad trade otherwise.

But on a weak, inferior and sensitive person playing games like this? Thousand cuts works.

But if you’re making the point of mixing and matching of codified law with morality, like he and many others play around with here as if it’s logical and fluid, is dumb nonsense then yes that works.
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Typical Lax Dad
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Typical Lax Dad »

RedFromMI wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 2:42 pm
This -^
Old Salt believes Jack Smith has no case against Trump so he is pursuing process crimes. “They” just don’t like Trump. He hasn’t done anything wrong.
“I wish you would!”
Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

You can’t cut the noise when others mix and match “law of man” with codified law as they please and that’s where your stuck with people here.
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Kismet
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Kismet »

Bill Maher last night on USA v Brazil democracy



He may very well have a point. Sadly.
Typical Lax Dad
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Typical Lax Dad »

Kismet wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 2:52 pm Bill Maher last night on USA v Brazil democracy



He may very well have a point. Sadly.
It is sad. I postulated 10 years ago if we were witnessing the fall of the American Empire. My thought was that it’s a young country and who knows what we will ultimately become…..I never imagined it would happen so fast.
“I wish you would!”
Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

Typical Lax Dad wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 3:04 pm
Kismet wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 2:52 pm Bill Maher last night on USA v Brazil democracy



He may very well have a point. Sadly.
It is sad. I postulated 10 years ago if we were witnessing the fall of the American Empire. My thought was that it’s a young country and who knows what we will ultimately become…..I never imagined it would happen so fast.
Eh not that young if we listed all The relative hegemonies in the world were probably longer in the tooth than more than half.

But I was thinking the same thing. You call it banana republic, because I spent a minute working with some of these countries on privatizations I call it sub sharan Africa.
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Seacoaster(1)
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Seacoaster(1) »

Thought some folks might like to read the Appellees'/Respondents' brief to the Supreme Court. Interesting reading. For example, have a look at pages 15-16 of the brief:

https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/ ... 0Brief.pdf

"Trump has now abandoned his argument that the January 6 attack was not an “insurrection” against “the Constitution of the United States” for purposes of Section 3. Petr. Br. 33-38. For good reason."
Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

Seacoaster(1) wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 3:11 pm Thought some folks might like to read the Appellees'/Respondents' brief to the Supreme Court. Interesting reading. For example, have a look at pages 15-16 of the brief:

https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/ ... 0Brief.pdf

"Trump has now abandoned his argument that the January 6 attack was not an “insurrection” against “the Constitution of the United States” for purposes of Section 3. Petr. Br. 33-38. For good reason."
Yeah but that was just some biased judges weaponized by Hunter Biden, George Soros and a bunch of hotties he molested for four decades. Not real people like OS and Ted Cruz.
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old salt
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by old salt »

Blah. Blah. Blah. Seditious conspiracy is not necessarily a conspiracy to commit an insurrection. That's why you haven't named anyone charged with anything that includes the word insurrection.
Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

Not necessarily. How would you describe that behavior? Hiding behind little codified pedantics demonstrates valuing winning over truth, character or any ethical considerations.

How can one hate lawyers so much (other than assuming there all
Jews and hating Jews broadly) and then behave like this?

Blah, blah, blah I’ll defend my guys because I’m so bitter towards the other side that I’ll throw out all my sense of decent or community and defend horrific behavior. To believe using a different legal term based on what some government wrote into codified law means to people the behavior, results and impact are different is at best a bad faith argument. At worst it’s monstrous towards humanity.
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a fan
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by a fan »

Farfromgeneva wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 4:13 pm Not necessarily. How would you describe that behavior? Hiding behind little codified pedantics demonstrates valuing winning over truth, character or any ethical considerations.

How can one hate lawyers so much (other than assuming there all
Jews and hating Jews broadly) and then behave like this?

Blah, blah, blah I’ll defend my guys because I’m so bitter towards the other side that I’ll throw out all my sense of decent or community and defend horrific behavior. To believe using a different legal term based on what some government wrote into codified law means to people the behavior, results and impact are different is at best a bad faith argument. At worst it’s monstrous towards humanity.
It's how it works.

Naturally, if you look at his posts on Hunter, none of his weasel-game appears. No "well, we'll see". It's: he's guilty and didn't pay his taxes...even thought there hasn't been a judgement.

We've got millions of these guys, FFG. Millions. They want to go back to the days where good ol' boys could break all the laws they wanted, and anyone who wasn't a white male Christian was guilty before they set one foot in their Southern States. And they are unable to see that's what they're doing....because they go further than "my guy is innocent'. They have NOW added: not only is my guy innocent, anyone who dares to so much as investigate, let alone prosecute my guy is corrupt, and should be hauled out back and shot.

It's pathetic, sad, and terrifying all at once.
Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

a fan wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 4:29 pm
Farfromgeneva wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 4:13 pm Not necessarily. How would you describe that behavior? Hiding behind little codified pedantics demonstrates valuing winning over truth, character or any ethical considerations.

How can one hate lawyers so much (other than assuming there all
Jews and hating Jews broadly) and then behave like this?

Blah, blah, blah I’ll defend my guys because I’m so bitter towards the other side that I’ll throw out all my sense of decent or community and defend horrific behavior. To believe using a different legal term based on what some government wrote into codified law means to people the behavior, results and impact are different is at best a bad faith argument. At worst it’s monstrous towards humanity.
It's how it works.

Naturally, if you look at his posts on Hunter, none of his weasel-game appears. No "well, we'll see". It's: he's guilty and didn't pay his taxes...even thought there hasn't been a judgement.

We've got millions of these guys, FFG. Millions. They want to go back to the days where good ol' boys could break all the laws they wanted, and anyone who wasn't a white male Christian was guilty before they set one foot in their Southern States. And they are unable to see that's what they're doing....because they go further than "my guy is innocent'. They have NOW added: not only is my guy innocent, anyone who dares to so much as investigate, let alone prosecute my guy is corrupt, and should be hauled out back and shot.

It's pathetic, sad, and terrifying all at once.
I know and they think it’s slick while railing at the Greenwich village pontificating faux intellectual crowd which does far less damage to society. It’s not elegant, intelligent or cool, it’s petty kiddie stuff. Except if you pulled
It where I grew up ages 8-18 you were subject to getting a black eye.

I’m just saying what a lot of thoughtful people think but don’t say there. That’s generally my role in society. The position he took is amoral at best.

Like I said, the noise drowns things out when folks mix and match governmental codified law with their own vision or morality. Need to get back to discrimination between positive and normative statements/descriptions.
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Typical Lax Dad
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Typical Lax Dad »

old salt wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 3:52 pm Blah. Blah. Blah. Seditious conspiracy is not necessarily a conspiracy to commit an insurrection. That's why you haven't named anyone charged with anything that includes the word insurrection.
Blah. Blah. Blah.

Al Capone, head of the most profitable crime syndicate of the Prohibition Era and mastermind of the notorious 1929 "Valentine's Day Massacre," seemed above the law. In the end, however, Capone would be brought to justice not for murder, extortion, or bootlegging, but for failing to pay his income tax. Credit for his conviction is due less to Elliot Ness and The Untouchables than to the dogged work of Bureau of Revenue investigator Frank Wilson and a clever surprise pulled by a federal judge, James Wilkerson. Al Capone once complained about the bad reputation of his criminal enterprise: "Some call it bootlegging. Some call it racketeering. I call it a business." The lesson of The People vs. Al Capone is that a profitable businessman, no matter how he earns his income, does have to pay his taxes.
“I wish you would!”
Farfromgeneva
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

Post by Farfromgeneva »

Typical Lax Dad wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 5:23 pm
old salt wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 3:52 pm Blah. Blah. Blah. Seditious conspiracy is not necessarily a conspiracy to commit an insurrection. That's why you haven't named anyone charged with anything that includes the word insurrection.
Blah. Blah. Blah.

Al Capone, head of the most profitable crime syndicate of the Prohibition Era and mastermind of the notorious 1929 "Valentine's Day Massacre," seemed above the law. In the end, however, Capone would be brought to justice not for murder, extortion, or bootlegging, but for failing to pay his income tax. Credit for his conviction is due less to Elliot Ness and The Untouchables than to the dogged work of Bureau of Revenue investigator Frank Wilson and a clever surprise pulled by a federal judge, James Wilkerson. Al Capone once complained about the bad reputation of his criminal enterprise: "Some call it bootlegging. Some call it racketeering. I call it a business." The lesson of The People vs. Al Capone is that a profitable businessman, no matter how he earns his income, does have to pay his taxes.
Playing a fire w the massive conservation easement which is a spade that’s already attracted scrutiny in the last 2-4yes for a lot of bad behavior and abuse of the deduction. I suspect he got the idea or it was planted that if he pushed for a big deduction based on an inflated valuation it might help his other cases. But conversely it opens him up to new problems again tied to inflating valuations illegally.


To a Trump’s Golf-Course Tax Break Could Reach $323 Million
Federal benefits stem from agreement not to build atop a golf course in Florida, dwarfing similar Trump deals

Richard Rubin

The move to protect the Blue Monster golf course at Trump National Doral Golf Club might have helped the former president lower the tax bill on the sale of his hotel in Washington in 2022, and it provides a glimpse into the Republican presidential front-runner’s finances since he left the White House in 2021. The transaction on the 184-acre Miami-area property is by far Trump’s largest known use of the conservation-easement tax break, which has previously prompted questions from state officials and the Internal Revenue Service. It is more than 10 times bigger than his similar deals in California and New York.

The deal could save him nearly $120 million in taxes at current rates. The tax form and related documents were obtained by The Wall Street Journal through a public-records request to the City of Doral.

“This is larger than anything I’ve seen,” said Russell Shay, a conservation consultant who has reviewed hundreds of easements.


Donald Trump played at Doral in 2020; his company called a conservation easement for some property there ‘a perfect example of a public-private partnership.’ Photo: Giorgio Viera/Agence France-Presse/Getty Images
Trump’s personal taxes have been a part of the political swirl surrounding him since his first campaign. Unlike President Biden and almost all recent major-party candidates, he has refused to release his returns, but documents have emerged showing frequent years of negative income and small payments. An IRS contractor leaked Trump tax information to the
New York Times
. Democrats on the House Ways and Means Committee went all the way to the Supreme Court to get legal access to six years of Trump tax returns and audit records, which the committee released in 2022. Those prior releases go only through 2020.

Trump’s company donated the development rights for Doral’s Blue Monster golf course to the City of Doral in December 2022, and the city council voted unanimously to accept it with a resolution that praised the “scenic view over an iconic landscape.” Under the binding contract, the golf course can remain operational but Trump and any future owner face restrictions, including a prohibition on new buildings above 25 feet in height or exceeding a total of 10,000 square feet.

Without the easement, Trump could have turned the course into a resort development. Under the easement, the course must be open to the public for free for limited hiking and bird-watching. The Blue Monster is one of four golf courses on the Doral property, which Trump bought in 2012.

A yearslong legal battle for President Trump’s tax returns has finally ended. And it’s yielded 6 years of his detailed returns. WSJ explains what we learned about Trump’s income and how the returns were made public.
“We are incredibly proud to have worked with the City of Doral, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission and Conservation Florida to preserve nearly 190 acres of open irrigated greenspace in the middle of Miami-Dade County,” the Trump Organization, the former president’s company, said in a statement. “This is a perfect example of a public-private partnership that will preserve this magnificent property now and for posterity.”

Property owners who make conservation-easement donations can claim income-tax breaks under federal law. The break must be based on an appraisal and is typically calculated as the difference between the property’s value before the donation and the value after. The average easement donation in 2019 was $1 million, according to the IRS.

At Doral, the easement shrank the property’s value to $345 million from $668 million, for a $323 million potential deduction, according to an IRS Form 8283. Federal tax forms are confidential at the IRS, but because the easement was accepted by the City of Doral and not a private land trust, the form was signed by the city manager and is a public record.

Trump made the donation in December 2022, which means he could use the deduction against his 2022 income. Earlier that year, he sold his hotel in Washington for an estimated $100 million in profit.

Under the tax code, conservation easement donations can be used to offset up to 50% of adjusted gross income each year. Any unused deductions can be carried forward for up to 15 years.

“You start the clock when you make the contribution,” said Steve Rosenthal, a senior fellow at the Tax Policy Center in Washington.


The Trump Organization sold the Trump International Hotel in Washington in 2022. Photo: mandel ngan/Agence France-Presse/Getty Images
In the past, Trump hasn’t often had much income to offset with deductions. From 2015 through 2020, he had four years where his adjusted gross income was negative, according to records released in 2022 by the House Ways and Means Committee.

Trump also has a long history of generating large deductions that he uses to limit the taxes on his profits, Rosenthal said. In the past, he has used business losses, which are more beneficial than charitable deductions.

“This could yet be another tool similar to those he’s used in the past,” Rosenthal said.

The easement, he added, shrank the value of an asset that could be in Trump’s taxable estate when he dies.

Trump has used conservation easements at least four times before—at his Mar-a-Lago complex in Florida, his Bedminster golf course in New Jersey, a golf course in California and an estate in Westchester County, New York.

“I can tell you this, I get more deductions,” Trump told The Economist in 2017. “They have deductions for birds flying across America. They have deductions for everything.” Indeed, easements can qualify for deductions if they provide migratory-bird habitats. The deed for the Doral easement notes that it provides habitat for species such as the white ibis and roseate spoonbill.

The Westchester easement for a $21.1 million deduction has come under particular scrutiny. The IRS was considering denying the deduction or imposing penalties, according to a Joint Committee on Taxation report released in 2022. And the New York state attorney general has cited the appraisal as overstated in a civil fraud case against Trump. Trump and his company have denied wrongdoing.

The same New York case also mentioned the California easement on a portion of a golf course there that would block future development on a site used as a driving range, but allow its continued use as a driving rage—prompting a warning from one of his then-lawyers that Trump might not want to publicize it. “Some could argue that as long as he is operating the golf course, he would continue to keep the driving range—effectively, the U.S. taxpayers are paying him to do what he would already do anyway,” the lawyer, Sheri Dillon, wrote in a 2015 message to a Trump Organization lawyer, according to a court filing.

The IRS regularly audits easement donations, often challenging appraisals and fighting property owners in the U.S. Tax Court. The agency typically would have three years from the filing of a return to complete its audit, and Trump could be president again before that date arrives for his 2022 return.

Congress recently tightened the laws on some easement deductions, particularly for syndicated deals in which the tax breaks are effectively packaged and sold to investors. Trump’s easements fall outside that description. The Obama administration proposed banning easements on golf courses but that idea never advanced in Congress. problem.

Trump’s Golf-Course Tax Break Could Reach $323 Million
Federal benefits stem from agreement not to build atop a golf course in Florida, dwarfing similar Trump deals

Richard Rubin

The move to protect the Blue Monster golf course at Trump National Doral Golf Club might have helped the former president lower the tax bill on the sale of his hotel in Washington in 2022, and it provides a glimpse into the Republican presidential front-runner’s finances since he left the White House in 2021. The transaction on the 184-acre Miami-area property is by far Trump’s largest known use of the conservation-easement tax break, which has previously prompted questions from state officials and the Internal Revenue Service. It is more than 10 times bigger than his similar deals in California and New York.

The deal could save him nearly $120 million in taxes at current rates. The tax form and related documents were obtained by The Wall Street Journal through a public-records request to the City of Doral.

“This is larger than anything I’ve seen,” said Russell Shay, a conservation consultant who has reviewed hundreds of easements.


Donald Trump played at Doral in 2020; his company called a conservation easement for some property there ‘a perfect example of a public-private partnership.’ Photo: Giorgio Viera/Agence France-Presse/Getty Images
Trump’s personal taxes have been a part of the political swirl surrounding him since his first campaign. Unlike President Biden and almost all recent major-party candidates, he has refused to release his returns, but documents have emerged showing frequent years of negative income and small payments. An IRS contractor leaked Trump tax information to the
New York Times
. Democrats on the House Ways and Means Committee went all the way to the Supreme Court to get legal access to six years of Trump tax returns and audit records, which the committee released in 2022. Those prior releases go only through 2020.

Trump’s company donated the development rights for Doral’s Blue Monster golf course to the City of Doral in December 2022, and the city council voted unanimously to accept it with a resolution that praised the “scenic view over an iconic landscape.” Under the binding contract, the golf course can remain operational but Trump and any future owner face restrictions, including a prohibition on new buildings above 25 feet in height or exceeding a total of 10,000 square feet.

Without the easement, Trump could have turned the course into a resort development. Under the easement, the course must be open to the public for free for limited hiking and bird-watching. The Blue Monster is one of four golf courses on the Doral property, which Trump bought in 2012.

A yearslong legal battle for President Trump’s tax returns has finally ended. And it’s yielded 6 years of his detailed returns. WSJ explains what we learned about Trump’s income and how the returns were made public.
“We are incredibly proud to have worked with the City of Doral, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission and Conservation Florida to preserve nearly 190 acres of open irrigated greenspace in the middle of Miami-Dade County,” the Trump Organization, the former president’s company, said in a statement. “This is a perfect example of a public-private partnership that will preserve this magnificent property now and for posterity.”

Property owners who make conservation-easement donations can claim income-tax breaks under federal law. The break must be based on an appraisal and is typically calculated as the difference between the property’s value before the donation and the value after. The average easement donation in 2019 was $1 million, according to the IRS.

At Doral, the easement shrank the property’s value to $345 million from $668 million, for a $323 million potential deduction, according to an IRS Form 8283. Federal tax forms are confidential at the IRS, but because the easement was accepted by the City of Doral and not a private land trust, the form was signed by the city manager and is a public record.

Trump made the donation in December 2022, which means he could use the deduction against his 2022 income. Earlier that year, he sold his hotel in Washington for an estimated $100 million in profit.

Under the tax code, conservation easement donations can be used to offset up to 50% of adjusted gross income each year. Any unused deductions can be carried forward for up to 15 years.

“You start the clock when you make the contribution,” said Steve Rosenthal, a senior fellow at the Tax Policy Center in Washington.


The Trump Organization sold the Trump International Hotel in Washington in 2022. Photo: mandel ngan/Agence France-Presse/Getty Images
In the past, Trump hasn’t often had much income to offset with deductions. From 2015 through 2020, he had four years where his adjusted gross income was negative, according to records released in 2022 by the House Ways and Means Committee.

Trump also has a long history of generating large deductions that he uses to limit the taxes on his profits, Rosenthal said. In the past, he has used business losses, which are more beneficial than charitable deductions.

“This could yet be another tool similar to those he’s used in the past,” Rosenthal said.

The easement, he added, shrank the value of an asset that could be in Trump’s taxable estate when he dies.

Trump has used conservation easements at least four times before—at his Mar-a-Lago complex in Florida, his Bedminster golf course in New Jersey, a golf course in California and an estate in Westchester County, New York.

“I can tell you this, I get more deductions,” Trump told The Economist in 2017. “They have deductions for birds flying across America. They have deductions for everything.” Indeed, easements can qualify for deductions if they provide migratory-bird habitats. The deed for the Doral easement notes that it provides habitat for species such as the white ibis and roseate spoonbill.

The Westchester easement for a $21.1 million deduction has come under particular scrutiny. The IRS was considering denying the deduction or imposing penalties, according to a Joint Committee on Taxation report released in 2022. And the New York state attorney general has cited the appraisal as overstated in a civil fraud case against Trump. Trump and his company have denied wrongdoing.

The same New York case also mentioned the California easement on a portion of a golf course there that would block future development on a site used as a driving range, but allow its continued use as a driving rage—prompting a warning from one of his then-lawyers that Trump might not want to publicize it. “Some could argue that as long as he is operating the golf course, he would continue to keep the driving range—effectively, the U.S. taxpayers are paying him to do what he would already do anyway,” the lawyer, Sheri Dillon, wrote in a 2015 message to a Trump Organization lawyer, according to a court filing.

The IRS regularly audits easement donations, often challenging appraisals and fighting property owners in the U.S. Tax Court. The agency typically would have three years from the filing of a return to complete its audit, and Trump could be president again before that date arrives for his 2022 return.

Congress recently tightened the laws on some easement deductions, particularly for syndicated deals in which the tax breaks are effectively packaged and sold to investors. Trump’s easements fall outside that description. The Obama administration proposed banning easements on golf courses but that idea never advanced in Congress.

Write to Richard Rubin at [email protected]
Harvard University, out
University of Utah, in

I am going to get a 4.0 in damage.

(Afan jealous he didn’t do this first)
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dislaxxic
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

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"The purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure poor reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog." - Calvin, to Hobbes
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Re: January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

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dislaxxic wrote: Mon Jan 29, 2024 8:15 am Image
Your in good humor this morning Dis. Was it the pancakes and sausage with real maple syrup?
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