Who is supporting the immigrant caravan?

[MDlaxfan76]

https://apnews.com/article/capitol-riot ... 7e55bedaa5

More than 1,230 people have been charged with federal crimes in the riot, ranging from misdemeanor offenses like trespassing to felonies like assaulting police officers and seditious conspiracy. Roughly 730 people have pleaded guilty to charges, while another roughly 170 have been convicted of at least one charge at a trial decided by a judge or a jury, according to an Associated Press database.

Only two defendants have been acquitted of all charges, and those were trials decided by a judge rather than a jury.

Yes, it was a large riot. What charges were convicted or pleaded to.

https://www.news-leader.com/story/opini ... 514508001/
Jan. 6 wasn't an insurrection. Stop calling it what it isn’t.

Words have meaning.

The events of Jan. 6 have been described by Senator Schumer as a date that will live in infamy — harkening back to FDR’s words after the attack on Pearl Harbor. Others have compared Jan. 6 with 9-11. Some historians declared it to be the worst act of rebellion since the nation’s founding, while others believe there’s been nothing like it since the Civil War. The news media and the Left use “insurrection” to describe Jan. 6.

They’re all wrong.

Historically, Shays’ Rebellion (1786-1787), the Whiskey Rebellion (1790), and Fries Rebellion (1799) were actual acts of insurrection.

Post-Civil War, the Wilmington Insurrection (1898) is by far worse than Jan. 6. Another one, the Battle of Athens, TN (1946), involved local armed WWII GIs taking over the town, forcing the corrupt sheriff to hide in the jail clinging to the election ballot boxes, until he finally surrendered and the GIs’ candidate won the election. There were the L.A. riots of 1992.

And the BLM riots during the summer of 2020 caused 18 deaths, over $1 billion dollars in damage, including federal and state buildings, and in some cities sovereign nations were declared.

Jan. 6. caused $1.5 million in damage and, despite what was often reported, one person was killed. An unarmed woman, Ashley Babbitt, was shot by a Capitol police officer. The officer’s interview on NBC resulted in more questions than answers about why he fired his weapon and killed Babbitt.

The word insurrection is a legal term. Under federal law it’s a crime to incite or engage in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the U.S. or its laws. Black’s Law Dictionary defines insurrection as “a violent revolt against oppressive authority.” It is to be distinguished from a mob or riot based on organization of an armed uprising. Mobs and riots can involve unlawful and violent acts, but they aren’t necessarily insurrections. A revolt is an act to overthrow the government. Insurrection, therefore, requires an organized group that plans an attack to overthrow the government.

To date, a small percentage of the approximately 725 charged have been accused of violent crimes, and no charges of rebellion or insurrection have been filed. Around 165 have pled guilty to charges — mostly to misdemeanors. Only 30 were given jail time. The FBI investigation has yielded little evidence of a coordinated and organized attack. Instead, 95 percent of the participants were acting individually.

An AP story intending to link Trump to the riot published some of the comments made by participants during court appearances. None of them stated that the event was planned. Indeed, most indicated they didn’t really know why they did it. They said they felt inspired by Trump’s comments and believed the election was fraudulent, but there was no organized or coordinated plan to attack the Capitol.

Most of the Jan. 6 participants have been charged with trespass. One local man was at the Capitol dressed as George Washington for selfies. A woman from Missouri recently admitted being at the Capitol and stealing a broken sign.

Video footage shows people walking single file past idle officers as they entered the building. Afterward, most exited on their own accord.

Very few were arrested that day. Since Jan. 6, the DOJ has used a campaign of “shock and awe” to round up and detain people, again predominantly charged with misdemeanors. Compared with the BLM riots, prosecutors do seem more zealous about Jan. 6. Yet, insurrection charges haven’t been filed.

Confrontation between officers and rioters did happen. Violence definitely occurred. But, the only shot fired was, again, by the officer who killed Babbitt.

Jan. 6 was a horrible event. People who acted violently or damaged property should be prosecuted. Those who unlawfully trespassed should also be prosecuted. But as bad as Jan. 6 actually was, it was not the worst in American history. It can’t be compared to Pearl Harbor or 9-11. It’s not even the worst this century.

Because words have meaning, Jan. 6 can’t be called an “insurrection” just to satisfy the urge to convey a particular seriousness of the event or to propagate a political narrative. This type of narrative is aimed at silencing conservatives, not describing what happened that day. Most participants were not violent people. They weren’t acting as part of a coordinated rebellion. There was no intent to topple the government. They were impassioned citizens at a rally that turned into a riot. It was shameful, but not an insurrection.

That’s his opinion. He’s wrong on the facts…

https://www.npr.org/2023/11/18/12139610 ... -on-ballot

Remember when Salty's position was that no one had been charged with sedition?

[cradleandshoot]

Biden admitting his failed policy: https://x.com/mazemoore/status/1750722706675253277?s=20

Folks here we're picking on me about my T shirt with the alleged words spoken by BHO.

Never underestimate Joes ability to f*** things up.

[cradleandshoot]

https://apnews.com/article/capitol-riot ... 7e55bedaa5

More than 1,230 people have been charged with federal crimes in the riot, ranging from misdemeanor offenses like trespassing to felonies like assaulting police officers and seditious conspiracy. Roughly 730 people have pleaded guilty to charges, while another roughly 170 have been convicted of at least one charge at a trial decided by a judge or a jury, according to an Associated Press database.

Only two defendants have been acquitted of all charges, and those were trials decided by a judge rather than a jury.

Yes, it was a large riot. What charges were convicted or pleaded to.

https://www.news-leader.com/story/opini ... 514508001/
Jan. 6 wasn't an insurrection. Stop calling it what it isn’t.

Words have meaning.

The events of Jan. 6 have been described by Senator Schumer as a date that will live in infamy — harkening back to FDR’s words after the attack on Pearl Harbor. Others have compared Jan. 6 with 9-11. Some historians declared it to be the worst act of rebellion since the nation’s founding, while others believe there’s been nothing like it since the Civil War. The news media and the Left use “insurrection” to describe Jan. 6.

They’re all wrong.

Historically, Shays’ Rebellion (1786-1787), the Whiskey Rebellion (1790), and Fries Rebellion (1799) were actual acts of insurrection.

Post-Civil War, the Wilmington Insurrection (1898) is by far worse than Jan. 6. Another one, the Battle of Athens, TN (1946), involved local armed WWII GIs taking over the town, forcing the corrupt sheriff to hide in the jail clinging to the election ballot boxes, until he finally surrendered and the GIs’ candidate won the election. There were the L.A. riots of 1992.

And the BLM riots during the summer of 2020 caused 18 deaths, over $1 billion dollars in damage, including federal and state buildings, and in some cities sovereign nations were declared.

Jan. 6. caused $1.5 million in damage and, despite what was often reported, one person was killed. An unarmed woman, Ashley Babbitt, was shot by a Capitol police officer. The officer’s interview on NBC resulted in more questions than answers about why he fired his weapon and killed Babbitt.

The word insurrection is a legal term. Under federal law it’s a crime to incite or engage in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the U.S. or its laws. Black’s Law Dictionary defines insurrection as “a violent revolt against oppressive authority.” It is to be distinguished from a mob or riot based on organization of an armed uprising. Mobs and riots can involve unlawful and violent acts, but they aren’t necessarily insurrections. A revolt is an act to overthrow the government. Insurrection, therefore, requires an organized group that plans an attack to overthrow the government.

To date, a small percentage of the approximately 725 charged have been accused of violent crimes, and no charges of rebellion or insurrection have been filed. Around 165 have pled guilty to charges — mostly to misdemeanors. Only 30 were given jail time. The FBI investigation has yielded little evidence of a coordinated and organized attack. Instead, 95 percent of the participants were acting individually.

An AP story intending to link Trump to the riot published some of the comments made by participants during court appearances. None of them stated that the event was planned. Indeed, most indicated they didn’t really know why they did it. They said they felt inspired by Trump’s comments and believed the election was fraudulent, but there was no organized or coordinated plan to attack the Capitol.

Most of the Jan. 6 participants have been charged with trespass. One local man was at the Capitol dressed as George Washington for selfies. A woman from Missouri recently admitted being at the Capitol and stealing a broken sign.

Video footage shows people walking single file past idle officers as they entered the building. Afterward, most exited on their own accord.

Very few were arrested that day. Since Jan. 6, the DOJ has used a campaign of “shock and awe” to round up and detain people, again predominantly charged with misdemeanors. Compared with the BLM riots, prosecutors do seem more zealous about Jan. 6. Yet, insurrection charges haven’t been filed.

Confrontation between officers and rioters did happen. Violence definitely occurred. But, the only shot fired was, again, by the officer who killed Babbitt.

Jan. 6 was a horrible event. People who acted violently or damaged property should be prosecuted. Those who unlawfully trespassed should also be prosecuted. But as bad as Jan. 6 actually was, it was not the worst in American history. It can’t be compared to Pearl Harbor or 9-11. It’s not even the worst this century.

Because words have meaning, Jan. 6 can’t be called an “insurrection” just to satisfy the urge to convey a particular seriousness of the event or to propagate a political narrative. This type of narrative is aimed at silencing conservatives, not describing what happened that day. Most participants were not violent people. They weren’t acting as part of a coordinated rebellion. There was no intent to topple the government. They were impassioned citizens at a rally that turned into a riot. It was shameful, but not an insurrection.

That’s his opinion. He’s wrong on the facts…

https://www.npr.org/2023/11/18/12139610 ... -on-ballot

Remember when Salty's position was that no one had been charged with sedition?

A little bit off topic. How does this relate to the southern border? I believe there is already a thread that covers this topic?

[MDlaxfan76]

https://apnews.com/article/capitol-riot ... 7e55bedaa5

More than 1,230 people have been charged with federal crimes in the riot, ranging from misdemeanor offenses like trespassing to felonies like assaulting police officers and seditious conspiracy. Roughly 730 people have pleaded guilty to charges, while another roughly 170 have been convicted of at least one charge at a trial decided by a judge or a jury, according to an Associated Press database.

Only two defendants have been acquitted of all charges, and those were trials decided by a judge rather than a jury.

Yes, it was a large riot. What charges were convicted or pleaded to.

https://www.news-leader.com/story/opini ... 514508001/
Jan. 6 wasn't an insurrection. Stop calling it what it isn’t.

Words have meaning.

The events of Jan. 6 have been described by Senator Schumer as a date that will live in infamy — harkening back to FDR’s words after the attack on Pearl Harbor. Others have compared Jan. 6 with 9-11. Some historians declared it to be the worst act of rebellion since the nation’s founding, while others believe there’s been nothing like it since the Civil War. The news media and the Left use “insurrection” to describe Jan. 6.

They’re all wrong.

Historically, Shays’ Rebellion (1786-1787), the Whiskey Rebellion (1790), and Fries Rebellion (1799) were actual acts of insurrection.

Post-Civil War, the Wilmington Insurrection (1898) is by far worse than Jan. 6. Another one, the Battle of Athens, TN (1946), involved local armed WWII GIs taking over the town, forcing the corrupt sheriff to hide in the jail clinging to the election ballot boxes, until he finally surrendered and the GIs’ candidate won the election. There were the L.A. riots of 1992.

And the BLM riots during the summer of 2020 caused 18 deaths, over $1 billion dollars in damage, including federal and state buildings, and in some cities sovereign nations were declared.

Jan. 6. caused $1.5 million in damage and, despite what was often reported, one person was killed. An unarmed woman, Ashley Babbitt, was shot by a Capitol police officer. The officer’s interview on NBC resulted in more questions than answers about why he fired his weapon and killed Babbitt.

The word insurrection is a legal term. Under federal law it’s a crime to incite or engage in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the U.S. or its laws. Black’s Law Dictionary defines insurrection as “a violent revolt against oppressive authority.” It is to be distinguished from a mob or riot based on organization of an armed uprising. Mobs and riots can involve unlawful and violent acts, but they aren’t necessarily insurrections. A revolt is an act to overthrow the government. Insurrection, therefore, requires an organized group that plans an attack to overthrow the government.

To date, a small percentage of the approximately 725 charged have been accused of violent crimes, and no charges of rebellion or insurrection have been filed. Around 165 have pled guilty to charges — mostly to misdemeanors. Only 30 were given jail time. The FBI investigation has yielded little evidence of a coordinated and organized attack. Instead, 95 percent of the participants were acting individually.

An AP story intending to link Trump to the riot published some of the comments made by participants during court appearances. None of them stated that the event was planned. Indeed, most indicated they didn’t really know why they did it. They said they felt inspired by Trump’s comments and believed the election was fraudulent, but there was no organized or coordinated plan to attack the Capitol.

Most of the Jan. 6 participants have been charged with trespass. One local man was at the Capitol dressed as George Washington for selfies. A woman from Missouri recently admitted being at the Capitol and stealing a broken sign.

Video footage shows people walking single file past idle officers as they entered the building. Afterward, most exited on their own accord.

Very few were arrested that day. Since Jan. 6, the DOJ has used a campaign of “shock and awe” to round up and detain people, again predominantly charged with misdemeanors. Compared with the BLM riots, prosecutors do seem more zealous about Jan. 6. Yet, insurrection charges haven’t been filed.

Confrontation between officers and rioters did happen. Violence definitely occurred. But, the only shot fired was, again, by the officer who killed Babbitt.

Jan. 6 was a horrible event. People who acted violently or damaged property should be prosecuted. Those who unlawfully trespassed should also be prosecuted. But as bad as Jan. 6 actually was, it was not the worst in American history. It can’t be compared to Pearl Harbor or 9-11. It’s not even the worst this century.

Because words have meaning, Jan. 6 can’t be called an “insurrection” just to satisfy the urge to convey a particular seriousness of the event or to propagate a political narrative. This type of narrative is aimed at silencing conservatives, not describing what happened that day. Most participants were not violent people. They weren’t acting as part of a coordinated rebellion. There was no intent to topple the government. They were impassioned citizens at a rally that turned into a riot. It was shameful, but not an insurrection.

That’s his opinion. He’s wrong on the facts…

https://www.npr.org/2023/11/18/12139610 ... -on-ballot

Remember when Salty's position was that no one had been charged with sedition?

A little bit off topic. How does this relate to the southern border? I believe there is already a thread that covers this topic?

Tell Salty.

[MDlaxfan76]

The quotes from some (conservative) Republican Senators about what the Senate is putting together are right on point.

Graham, Thune, Tillis, Romney, Lankford, Cornyn...

Tillis calling not doing this bill now would be "immoral"...

But Trump wants "PERFECT", meaning nothing...

As the Republican Senators are saying, they'd get zero votes from Dems a year from now on these terms if they don't get this done now.

And of course, too late for Ukraine.

But that's what the MAGA wants, led by Trump. Power not country.

[WaffleTwineFaceoff]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

[PizzaSnake]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

Young, rootless males of military age have always been challenges to societies. If you are concerned about them, how about the domestic supply? Looked at the demographics of this nation recently?

However, let's consider the thesis of the letter: a multitude of young men of military age spilling over the borders into this country represent a potential for 10/7 attacks within the nation.

So, where would these young men get the materiel and training and organization to execute said exploits? Is there evidence of those factors?

Absent any evidence of same, this seems like low-grade FUD from aspirants to angling to join the MagaReich.

[youthathletics]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

Sadly, the wheels are already in motion. And if we think 06Jan was in insurrection, I have no doubt that it could be far worse. Only this time, there are already brigades upon brigades of ready and able soldiers, not of US interest, waiting for the call to act.

Pizzasnake has his head in the sand, blindly arguing for facts before comprehending it really takes very little training to take over our US Capitol. As if 06JAN was not enough evidence right in plain sight. Had a couple dozen people arrived with a planned mission AND appropriate munitions, it could have been a war zone.

[Typical Lax Dad]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

Sadly, the wheels are already in motion. And if we think 06Jan was in insurrection, I have no doubt that it could be far worse. Only this time, there are already brigades upon brigades of ready and able soldiers, not of US interest, waiting for the call to act.

Pizzasnake has his head in the sand, blindly arguing for facts before comprehending it really takes very little training to take over our US Capitol. As if 06JAN was not enough evidence right in plain sight. Had a couple dozen people arrived with a planned mission AND appropriate munitions, it could have been a war zone.

Think of those guys scaling the walls and roaming the halls as participants in a larger mission. The government officials hatched the plot. The guy with his feet up on the desk was a useful idiot. For a guy that loves him some government conspiracy and all things lead to Obama’s desk it’s odd that you have decided not to pay much attention to this. You have CHOSEN not to pay attention like a lot of people I know…. “Not really following it”….

[a fan]

Trump did eveything the law allowed & some that it didn't. He did disincentivize & reduce the pull factors, slowing the flow. It will never be closed until the asylum law loophole is closed & there are adequate detention facilities to halt catch & release. That will reduce the pull factor & staunch the flow.

If this was anywhere close to true? We would have MILLIONS of illegal workers in the US BEFORE Trump showed up.

It's just not true. You can tell me you don't like Biden until you're blue in the face...this issue isn't ten minutes old.

The problem can no longer be denied & discounted as Faux News. Sharing the pain with the sanctuary cities broke the logjam.

Wanna bet? They can, and have, ignored our POS immigration system for DECADES. Hell, as I've pointed out, not even 9/11 could get them off their *sses in the name of security.

And Trump's about to kill reform for AT LEAST another year and a half with a couple of phone calls.

I'd be DELIGHTED to be wrong. But we're dealing with the consequences of nominating a vengeful Trump AGAIN. Cowardly R's are afraid of being on his sh(t list.

We don't even know yet what's in the Senate bi-partisan compromise bill. We don't know what Biden will agree to.
Until we see that, we can't judge if it will close the asylum loophole, stop catch & release & staunch the flow, or if it's just a way to temporarily ease the crisis by speeding up the processing & distribution throughout the country.

No. We don't. Point is, it doesn't matter one bit if Republicans play the same petty game they've been playing since Obama showed up, and stop ANY bill that looks good for a Dem POTUS. Aren't you sick of this game yet?

Sure I am, but it's not the same game. You just want to blame the (R)'s,

Nope. I have REPEATEDLY pointed out that there is no bill from the Dems. REPEATEDLY.

All Biden's been saying is that Congress won't give him more money because they know he'll just use it to enhance catch & release, doing nothing to deter or slow the flow. That's not speculation. We've seen what Biden's done the last 3 years.

And we saw what Trump, Obama, Bush, Clinton and Bush did: nothing.

You want short term fixe, and don't care about the long term. It will be a matter of MONTHS before folks forget about "the border crisis" and move on to the next flavor of the week. And we will STILL have millions and millions of people here, without the ability to work legally. You and I don't see the same problem.

[youthathletics]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

Sadly, the wheels are already in motion. And if we think 06Jan was in insurrection, I have no doubt that it could be far worse. Only this time, there are already brigades upon brigades of ready and able soldiers, not of US interest, waiting for the call to act.

Pizzasnake has his head in the sand, blindly arguing for facts before comprehending it really takes very little training to take over our US Capitol. As if 06JAN was not enough evidence right in plain sight. Had a couple dozen people arrived with a planned mission AND appropriate munitions, it could have been a war zone.

Think of those guys scaling the walls and roaming the halls as participants in a larger mission. The government officials hatched the plot. The guy with his feet up on the desk was a useful idiot. For a guy that loves him some government conspiracy and all things lead to Obama’s desk it’s odd that you have decided not to pay much attention to this. You have CHOSEN not to pay attention like a lot of people I know…. “Not really following it”….

Another instance of NOT listening, again.

[dislaxxic]

Look up the signatories to that letter. Yes, all "officials" in the FBI or other law enforcement agencies. ALL of them can be found on any given day on Fox News spouting the fear-mongering BS that drives the backbone of the far right's crock of LIES about what is happening at the border and who is to blame for it. It is absolutely a LIE that Joe Biden's border policies have caused a surreptitious "invasion" of foreign military agents. What a flaming crock. These types of people can very easily come thru any airport in our country with a 50-cent ID. These rightwing deep state types need to do the JOB that's required of them and be ready to interdict and stop whatever sends a "chill down the spine" of the sheeple that need a dictator to tell them how to live.

..

[a fan]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

Ask this FBI guy what he thought about 9/11 and our ability to track who comes and goes in America...our VISA system.

What did we do to fix it, fellas? For those who were on the Water Cooler, you'll remember that I've been complaining about our failure to act after 9/11....when EVERY American wanted secure BorderS....not just the one to the South. A real BiPartisan bill would have FLOWN through committee and been voted in with ease. Upgrade software, more money on processing, more money on Judges, more money on EVerify and turn the damn thing on and start throwing HR reps in Jail: FIX THE ACTUAL PROBLEM.

What did we do? A big fat nothing. So complaining about "border security"......as if we haven't had 23 years of opportunity to fix an GLARING problem with our country fall flat with this voter. Where the F was Bush and Congress on this matter? Out to lunch.

And Trump's ENTIRE campaign was about fixing this. What did he do? F'ing nothing. And his supporters didn't care.

Now we get a Dem in office, and R's are, right on cue, screaming bloody murder...acting like this problem "started with Joe Biden just three years ago", after being perfectly happy with a ruined VISA system with no ability to track who comes and goes in America, and who overstays VISAs when a R was POTUS.

The "security" of our Nation's borders left the barn over two decades ago, fellas.

[dislaxxic]

Nope. I have REPEATEDLY pointed out that there is no bill from the Dems. REPEATEDLY.

Not true.

Fact Sheet: President Biden Sends Immigration Bill to Congress as Part of His Commitment to Modernize our Immigration System

A start point put into play when President J'Biden first came into office.

..

[cradleandshoot]

https://apnews.com/article/capitol-riot ... 7e55bedaa5

More than 1,230 people have been charged with federal crimes in the riot, ranging from misdemeanor offenses like trespassing to felonies like assaulting police officers and seditious conspiracy. Roughly 730 people have pleaded guilty to charges, while another roughly 170 have been convicted of at least one charge at a trial decided by a judge or a jury, according to an Associated Press database.

Only two defendants have been acquitted of all charges, and those were trials decided by a judge rather than a jury.

Yes, it was a large riot. What charges were convicted or pleaded to.

https://www.news-leader.com/story/opini ... 514508001/
Jan. 6 wasn't an insurrection. Stop calling it what it isn’t.

Words have meaning.

The events of Jan. 6 have been described by Senator Schumer as a date that will live in infamy — harkening back to FDR’s words after the attack on Pearl Harbor. Others have compared Jan. 6 with 9-11. Some historians declared it to be the worst act of rebellion since the nation’s founding, while others believe there’s been nothing like it since the Civil War. The news media and the Left use “insurrection” to describe Jan. 6.

They’re all wrong.

Historically, Shays’ Rebellion (1786-1787), the Whiskey Rebellion (1790), and Fries Rebellion (1799) were actual acts of insurrection.

Post-Civil War, the Wilmington Insurrection (1898) is by far worse than Jan. 6. Another one, the Battle of Athens, TN (1946), involved local armed WWII GIs taking over the town, forcing the corrupt sheriff to hide in the jail clinging to the election ballot boxes, until he finally surrendered and the GIs’ candidate won the election. There were the L.A. riots of 1992.

And the BLM riots during the summer of 2020 caused 18 deaths, over $1 billion dollars in damage, including federal and state buildings, and in some cities sovereign nations were declared.

Jan. 6. caused $1.5 million in damage and, despite what was often reported, one person was killed. An unarmed woman, Ashley Babbitt, was shot by a Capitol police officer. The officer’s interview on NBC resulted in more questions than answers about why he fired his weapon and killed Babbitt.

The word insurrection is a legal term. Under federal law it’s a crime to incite or engage in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the U.S. or its laws. Black’s Law Dictionary defines insurrection as “a violent revolt against oppressive authority.” It is to be distinguished from a mob or riot based on organization of an armed uprising. Mobs and riots can involve unlawful and violent acts, but they aren’t necessarily insurrections. A revolt is an act to overthrow the government. Insurrection, therefore, requires an organized group that plans an attack to overthrow the government.

To date, a small percentage of the approximately 725 charged have been accused of violent crimes, and no charges of rebellion or insurrection have been filed. Around 165 have pled guilty to charges — mostly to misdemeanors. Only 30 were given jail time. The FBI investigation has yielded little evidence of a coordinated and organized attack. Instead, 95 percent of the participants were acting individually.

An AP story intending to link Trump to the riot published some of the comments made by participants during court appearances. None of them stated that the event was planned. Indeed, most indicated they didn’t really know why they did it. They said they felt inspired by Trump’s comments and believed the election was fraudulent, but there was no organized or coordinated plan to attack the Capitol.

Most of the Jan. 6 participants have been charged with trespass. One local man was at the Capitol dressed as George Washington for selfies. A woman from Missouri recently admitted being at the Capitol and stealing a broken sign.

Video footage shows people walking single file past idle officers as they entered the building. Afterward, most exited on their own accord.

Very few were arrested that day. Since Jan. 6, the DOJ has used a campaign of “shock and awe” to round up and detain people, again predominantly charged with misdemeanors. Compared with the BLM riots, prosecutors do seem more zealous about Jan. 6. Yet, insurrection charges haven’t been filed.

Confrontation between officers and rioters did happen. Violence definitely occurred. But, the only shot fired was, again, by the officer who killed Babbitt.

Jan. 6 was a horrible event. People who acted violently or damaged property should be prosecuted. Those who unlawfully trespassed should also be prosecuted. But as bad as Jan. 6 actually was, it was not the worst in American history. It can’t be compared to Pearl Harbor or 9-11. It’s not even the worst this century.

Because words have meaning, Jan. 6 can’t be called an “insurrection” just to satisfy the urge to convey a particular seriousness of the event or to propagate a political narrative. This type of narrative is aimed at silencing conservatives, not describing what happened that day. Most participants were not violent people. They weren’t acting as part of a coordinated rebellion. There was no intent to topple the government. They were impassioned citizens at a rally that turned into a riot. It was shameful, but not an insurrection.

That’s his opinion. He’s wrong on the facts…

https://www.npr.org/2023/11/18/12139610 ... -on-ballot

Remember when Salty's position was that no one had been charged with sedition?

A little bit off topic. How does this relate to the southern border? I believe there is already a thread that covers this topic?

Tell Salty.

What's the point? You could have advised him yourself. Your normally right on top of these matters. I took care of it for you.

[cradleandshoot]

So, how do we shoehorn these tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists (The retired FBI officials sounding the alarm served under seven U.S. presidents and four FBI directors. They include Kevin Brock, former assistant director of intelligence and former principal deputy director of the National Counterterrorism Center; Chris Swecker, former assistant director of the FBI’s Criminal Investigative Division; Timothy Healy, former director of the Terrorist Screening Center; Ruben Garcia, Jr., former executive assistant director of the Criminal, Cyber, Response and Services Branch; Mark Morgan, former assistant director for training at the FBI, former acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection and former U.S. Border Patrol chief; David Szady, former assistant director of counterintelligence; Jody Weiss, former special agent in charge in Philadelphia; David Mitchell, former special agent in charge in Milwaukee; William Gavin, former assistant director of the FBI’s Inspection Division and Timothy McNally, former assistant director of the FBI’s Los Angeles division) into the proscribed and party affiliated victim or villain roles our leaders get assigned and blamed for here on this thread?

https://www.thecentersquare.com/nationa ... 9929e.html

The letter:

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnew ... a8.pdf.pdf

Sincerely curious what folks here takeaway from the article/letter above. My takeaway: chills down my spine.

P.S. To the poster above suggesting Democratic voters don't have immigration on their top ten list of concerns for the upcoming election, I guess you commiserate with different Democrats than I do.

Ask this FBI guy what he thought about 9/11 and our ability to track who comes and goes in America...our VISA system.

What did we do to fix it, fellas? For those who were on the Water Cooler, you'll remember that I've been complaining about our failure to act after 9/11....when EVERY American wanted secure BorderS....not just the one to the South. A real BiPartisan bill would have FLOWN through committee and been voted in with ease. Upgrade software, more money on processing, more money on Judges, more money on EVerify and turn the damn thing on and start throwing HR reps in Jail: FIX THE ACTUAL PROBLEM.

What did we do? A big fat nothing. So complaining about "border security"......as if we haven't had 23 years of opportunity to fix an GLARING problem with our country fall flat with this voter. Where the F was Bush and Congress on this matter? Out to lunch.

And Trump's ENTIRE campaign was about fixing this. What did he do? F'ing nothing. And his supporters didn't care.

Now we get a Dem in office, and R's are, right on cue, screaming bloody murder...acting like this problem "started with Joe Biden just three years ago", after being perfectly happy with a ruined VISA system with no ability to track who comes and goes in America, and who overstays VISAs when a R was POTUS.

The "security" of our Nation's borders left the barn over two decades ago, fellas.

+1 maybe even 4 decades ago when America was promised it would be fixed.

[a fan]

Nope. I have REPEATEDLY pointed out that there is no bill from the Dems. REPEATEDLY.

Not true.

Fact Sheet: President Biden Sends Immigration Bill to Congress as Part of His Commitment to Modernize our Immigration System

A start point put into play when President J'Biden first came into office.

..

Stand corrected. 100% missed this, thank you, Diss.

Biden's off the hook, fellas. Want to blame someone? Blame the House.

Who's running the House?

[MDlaxfan76]

Nope. I have REPEATEDLY pointed out that there is no bill from the Dems. REPEATEDLY.

Not true.

Fact Sheet: President Biden Sends Immigration Bill to Congress as Part of His Commitment to Modernize our Immigration System

A start point put into play when President J'Biden first came into office.

..

Stand corrected. 100% missed this, thank you, Diss.

Biden's off the hook, fellas. Want to blame someone? Blame the House.

Who's running the House?

DJT

[cradleandshoot]

Nope. I have REPEATEDLY pointed out that there is no bill from the Dems. REPEATEDLY.

Not true.

Fact Sheet: President Biden Sends Immigration Bill to Congress as Part of His Commitment to Modernize our Immigration System

A start point put into play when President J'Biden first came into office.

..

Stand corrected. 100% missed this, thank you, Diss.

Biden's off the hook, fellas. Want to blame someone? Blame the House.

Who's running the House?

I thought the new way of correcting this is by executive order? If you start doing things the way they were meant to be done it upsets the entire political applecart. There were some good ideas submitted as a foundation to start with. I don't see one of them that would have prevented the current breakdown of any semblance of order at the border.

[a fan]

Nope. I have REPEATEDLY pointed out that there is no bill from the Dems. REPEATEDLY.

Not true.

Fact Sheet: President Biden Sends Immigration Bill to Congress as Part of His Commitment to Modernize our Immigration System

A start point put into play when President J'Biden first came into office.

..

Stand corrected. 100% missed this, thank you, Diss.

Biden's off the hook, fellas. Want to blame someone? Blame the House.

Who's running the House?

I thought the new way of correcting this is by executive order. If you start doing things the way they were meant to be done it upsets the entire political applecart. There were some good ideas submitted as a foundation to start with. I don't see one of them that would have prevented the current breakdown of any semblance of order at the border.

"Current breakdown".....is leading Congress to act, and ACTUALLY solve the problem. I'm FOR that.

There's ZERO difference between a few months of a ton of people coming, and 40 years of LOTS of people coming over our borders.

This is how Americans think: they think the number 10,000 for one year is higher than 1,000 for 40 years.