NESCAC

[Unknown Participant]

Agree on the distinction. I am also a big follower of Nescac hockey and Trinity is the clear powerhouse, presumably, because of its aility to get more B and C band kids. Can't seem to translate it to lax however.

Football as well ...

As this relates to lacrosse, I can definitely see more of a connection with football. My impression is that many schools bring in dual-sport athletes (football/lax) through the football program in order to preserve spots for the lax only kids.

Is that due to timing, in that, HS football ends 4-5 months before lacrosse in an athlete's junior year so the football offers go sooner? I know Tufts has benefitted with 1-2 recruits each year also playing football and being football commits. Some pretty good lacrosse players among them.

[smoova]

Agree on the distinction. I am also a big follower of Nescac hockey and Trinity is the clear powerhouse, presumably, because of its aility to get more B and C band kids. Can't seem to translate it to lax however.

Football as well ...

As this relates to lacrosse, I can definitely see more of a connection with football. My impression is that many schools bring in dual-sport athletes (football/lax) through the football program in order to preserve spots for the lax only kids.

Is that due to timing, in that, HS football ends 4-5 months before lacrosse in an athlete's junior year so the football offers go sooner? I know Tufts has benefitted with 1-2 recruits each year also playing football and being football commits. Some pretty good lacrosse players among them.

IIRC, football commits are generally later than lacrosse. Occasionally, you'll see a kid commit to one NESCAC for lacrosse, but later flip for a football offer at another NESCAC (e.g. https://www.insidelacrosse.com/recruiti ... commitment). I've always chalked this up to FB having significantly more admissions juice every year than lacrosse.

[BanksAndTheBeanStalk]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

[Laxxal22]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

I think 4-5 gets you pretty close assuming good health. Brower, Carpenter, Naso, O'Neil, and MacAdorey would harvest souls at the D3 level.

[DeepPocket]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

I think it’s closer to 2. To support this I would submit Matt Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history. In 2019, his last full season for Bates, he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC play, with a win over then reigning National Champion, #1 ranked Wesleyan. That year he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer.

Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch. But at 5’6” 165 lbs, he couldn’t even break the starting lineup in his grad year at Fairfield.

Great as he was, if he alone was able to tilt the field significantly in the NESCAC landscape, surely Brennan O’Neill could too. And with a significantly greater impact.

[laxdad1434]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

I think 4-5 gets you pretty close assuming good health. Brower, Carpenter, Naso, O'Neil, and MacAdorey would harvest souls at the D3 level.

Any 4 mids, any 2 attack, any 2 poles, 1 LSM and any goalie.

[sguy9]

To support this I would submit Matt Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history.

Matt was very good, but to claim the best in history? It might be more accurate to say, "one of the best players in the programs history.."

Charlie Fay
Mike Daddario
Jack Allard

[DeepPocket]

To support this I would submit Matt Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history.

Matt was very good, but to claim the best in history? It might be more accurate to say, "one of the best players in the programs history.."

Charlie Fay
Mike Daddario
Jack Allard

I kind’ve figured someone would jump on that statement without ever addressing the initial question. I even thought about editing it out, glad I didn’t.

I defer to Bates’ website which cites Chlastawa with the following-
“Career: Chlastawa graduates as the all-time leading point scorer in Bates men's lacrosse history with 284, powered by 142 goals and 142 assists.“

Chlastawa is #1 career points. None of these guys are #2.

[JBFortunato]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

I think it’s closer to 2. To support this I would submit Matt Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history. In 2019, his last full season for Bates, he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC play, with a win over then reigning National Champion, #1 ranked Wesleyan. That year he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer.

Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch. But at 5’6” 165 lbs, he couldn’t even break the starting lineup in his grad year at Fairfield.

Great as he was, if he alone was able to tilt the field significantly in the NESCAC landscape, surely Brennan O’Neill could too. And with a significantly greater impact.

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

[NNELax]

Does Matt even go to Bates if Charlie Fay never does?...probably not

[laxdad1434]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

I think it’s closer to 2. To support this I would submit Matt Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history. In 2019, his last full season for Bates, he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC play, with a win over then reigning National Champion, #1 ranked Wesleyan. That year he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer.

Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch. But at 5’6” 165 lbs, he couldn’t even break the starting lineup in his grad year at Fairfield.

Great as he was, if he alone was able to tilt the field significantly in the NESCAC landscape, surely Brennan O’Neill could too. And with a significantly greater impact.

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

D3 to D1 at that size is a difficult transition. Not many kids that size/small starting/playing in D1.

[BrickWall6969]

Settle an argument: How many Duke players would last year’s Bates team need to win the NESCAC? Assume you can pick which Duke players you need at any position…

I think you give that Bates team the whole duke roster and they still don’t win the NESCAC…

[DeepPocket]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

[laxdad1434]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

[laxobserver1]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

That would be one of the only NESCAC programs all NJIT starters would start at. While a 3-10 America East team probably trumps a 1-12 NESCAC team, it doesn't make them good.

[laxdad1434]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

That would be one of the only NESCAC programs all NJIT starters would start at. While a 3-10 America East team probably trumps a 1-12 NESCAC team, it doesn't make them good.

They're a bad team for D1, that's my point. The gap in talent between D1/D3 is huge. The kids @ D1 are bigger, stronger, faster, and every team has depth. NJIT would beat every NESCAC team with exception of Tufts, but they might beat them as well. It's nothing against D3, my son plays D3, but it's not even close. Look at rosters, the difference is very clear.

[laxobserver1]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

That would be one of the only NESCAC programs all NJIT starters would start at. While a 3-10 America East team probably trumps a 1-12 NESCAC team, it doesn't make them good.

They're a bad team for D1, that's my point. The gap in talent between D1/D3 is huge. The kids @ D1 are bigger, stronger, faster, and every team has depth. NJIT would beat every NESCAC team with exception of Tufts, but they might beat them as well. It's nothing against D3, my son plays D3, but it's not even close. Look at rosters, the difference is very clear.

I don't see NJIT making it to the NESCAC semis

[shorelax12]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

That would be one of the only NESCAC programs all NJIT starters would start at. While a 3-10 America East team probably trumps a 1-12 NESCAC team, it doesn't make them good.

They're a bad team for D1, that's my point. The gap in talent between D1/D3 is huge. The kids @ D1 are bigger, stronger, faster, and every team has depth. NJIT would beat every NESCAC team with exception of Tufts, but they might beat them as well. It's nothing against D3, my son plays D3, but it's not even close. Look at rosters, the difference is very clear.

I certainly appreciate your point, but from my personal experience, and what I know about a lot of other NESCAC players, is that most of these kids had D1 offers from places like NJIT and turned them down because they saw more a of a benefit in a NESCAC education. So while a team like NJIT may have more depth, a lot of the top NESCAC kids are as good, if not better than, a lot of the NJIT kids.

[ChopMan23]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

NJIT would lose to a majority of the top D3 teams.

[laxdad1434]

I don't know Chlastawa, so no dog in the fight, but I wouldn't take the fact that he didn't start at Fairfield as proof that he wasn't good enough to do so. He was absolutely good enough to start, the kid was great.
There are dynamics in every program that impact who starts and how much a kid plays - he was coming into a program with established rhythms, relationships and connections between players and coaches built over years. I'm guessing that if you sent any kid from that Fairfield roster up to Bates he probably wouldn't have started either, at least not right away. Not saying guys don't transfer in to places and start, that happens obviously, but the fact that a kid didn't do that has very little to do, in my opinion, with his talent level.

This is bizarre. I’m going from defending my statement that he was the best player in their history (because he was) to now having to reiterate that I think his talent level was high.
I thought I was pretty clear that he was a stud.

….Chlastawa, the best player in Bates history
…he carried them to 7-3 in NESCAC
…he lead them in points, nearly doubling the production of their next best scorer
...Fantastic talent, and a pleasure to watch.

Fact is, in this very discussion, the aforementioned Duke players would ALL likely start IMMEDIATELY, upon arrival at Bates. So, while I understand what you’re saying about transferring and starting etc, there really is on some level a reflection on ___ (insert: talent, size, fit, skill, whatever) that comes into play.

NJIT'S starters would ALL start at Bates.

NJIT would lose to a majority of the top D3 teams.

NJIT, Bucknell, Sacred Heart, Monmouth, Hofstra, Fairfield, Quinnipiac, Siena, all bottom 3rd teams will beat all NESCAC teams. Salisbury, CNU would be good games. Name me a current player in D3 that would impact a D1 team, not see time, make an impact.