media matters

[Seacoaster(1)]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

[OCanada]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Trump has seriously damaged the foundations of our system of government. He is promising to do worse. Those that support him share in the respondibility and are assisting him in his effort to destroy the Constitution.

[MDlaxfan76]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Indeed, Salty had asked a day ago what Republicans I’d associate myself with, given the MAGA takeover of the party. Heck of a lot of us RINOs. Many have left the GOP formally, but not their principles.

[Seacoaster(1)]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Indeed, Salty had asked a day ago what Republicans I’d associate myself with, given the MAGA takeover of the party. Heck of a lot of us RINOs. Many have left the GOP formally, but not their principles.

My point really is that "not being conservative enough" or being a RINO is no longer a function of policy discord; it is based on contravention of Dear Leader. This, in my view, is a symptom of a disease in whatever it is that calls itself the GOP. Today's party demands purity in respect to adulation of the Leader, and demonization of all those who diverge from adulation of the Leader. Submission is a virtue.

I think there are historical parallels to this that are pretty interesting, no?

[a fan]

I've never claimed to be anything other than a partisan Conservative Republican. I make no apologies.

Completely untrue. You arrived at the Water Cooler claiming to be a moderate that despised partisan politics.

You've changed your tune, which is why all of us long timers have been reacting the way that we have literally since Trump arrived on the scene. Any pretense of evenhandedness left the building.

You finally cop to it here. And you're more than welcome to do this. Enjoy the forum.

...I was still a staunch (R) when I joined. Recall my defense of W being called a draft dodger.
I'm still a fan of Simpson-Bowles. DACA's ok by me. I was with the Gang of 8 on immigration & still am.

Things were less polarized then. The GOP overall was more moderate then.
I still consider myself a moderate on several issues --immigration, gun control, abortion, food stamps & other public assistance.
I just trust the (R)'s more to implement them. We have to raise taxes & reduce entitlement spending.
Trump scares me less than what his enemies are willing to do to thwart him.
I still hope that DeSantis or Haley get the (R) nom.

That's all great. That doesn't change the fact that you told the forum you were a moderate, and despised the hypocrisy of both parties.

You weren't being straight then...... and now you are. Your posts are blind Republican partisan posts...party over reason. Reasoning with you is pointless...took me a long time to figure that out, fooled into thinking we were having a conversation about ideas and issues, when the reality was and is: your mind is made up before you sit down at the table any time US politics or political figures are involved.

And that's fine. As I said, enjoy the forum.

[a fan]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Indeed, Salty had asked a day ago what Republicans I’d associate myself with, given the MAGA takeover of the party. Heck of a lot of us RINOs. Many have left the GOP formally, but not their principles.

My point really is that "not being conservative enough" or being a RINO is no longer a function of policy discord; it is based on contravention of Dear Leader. This, in my view, is a symptom of a disease in whatever it is that calls itself the GOP. Today's party demands purity in respect to adulation of the Leader, and demonization of all those who diverge from adulation of the Leader. Submission is a virtue.

I think there are historical parallels to this that are pretty interesting, no?

Both Obama and Biden are to the right of Trump on nearly every issue.

And Trump's "policies", to remind everyone, changed by the tweet----leaving Generals and staffers twisting in the wind, trying to figure out what to do.

I think TrumpFans have forgotten that....although I don't know how.

[OCanada]

Which issues would they be.

[MDlaxfan76]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Indeed, Salty had asked a day ago what Republicans I’d associate myself with, given the MAGA takeover of the party. Heck of a lot of us RINOs. Many have left the GOP formally, but not their principles.

My point really is that "not being conservative enough" or being a RINO is no longer a function of policy discord; it is based on contravention of Dear Leader. This, in my view, is a symptom of a disease in whatever it is that calls itself the GOP. Today's party demands purity in respect to adulation of the Leader, and demonization of all those who diverge from adulation of the Leader. Submission is a virtue.

I think there are historical parallels to this that are pretty interesting, no?

I obviously agree.

[MDlaxfan76]

Which issues would they be.

I'm a bit puzzled as to what "to the right" means for a fan, but I would agree that Trump (and the MAGA cult that follows him) are anything but "conservative". They are populist extremists who would embrace any position if it would enhance the intensity of their support, necessary in their path to power. In this instance, I think nearly every such "issue" they take a "right" turn, but perhaps a fan is defining "right" somewhat differently.

[OCanada]

Or i might be using a different context. It why i asked. Bit they certainly are not conservatives or “liberals”. They ate authoritarians and white nationalists do not believe in the ideals behind the founding of this country

[OCanada]

The dullest knife in the drawer

Rep. Ben Cline (R-VA) accused Hunter Biden of "blocking" Rep. James Comer's (R-KY) impeachment investigation by offering to testify in public.

[Seacoaster(1)]

The dullest knife in the drawer

Rep. Ben Cline (R-VA) accused Hunter Biden of "blocking" Rep. James Comer's (R-KY) impeachment investigation by offering to testify in public.

Among a drawer that, if you rummaged around blind in it, you wouldn't break skin.

Biden offers to testify publicly only -- in order to impede the spin (which is to say, blathering lies) from Comer the Gomer and Gym. Called their bluff. The GOP House is a coalition of tiny, tiny men and women.

[a fan]

Which issues would they be.

Paying for what we get from the Government (taxes, and Obama cut spending two years in a row)

Help for the working class.

Playing Global Cop.

Investing in Infrastructure.

[Farfromgeneva]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Wait until they thrash at this song at rallies thinking its pushing back against biden or democrats....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xxgRUyzgs0

[Farfromgeneva]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Indeed, Salty had asked a day ago what Republicans I’d associate myself with, given the MAGA takeover of the party. Heck of a lot of us RINOs. Many have left the GOP formally, but not their principles.

My point really is that "not being conservative enough" or being a RINO is no longer a function of policy discord; it is based on contravention of Dear Leader. This, in my view, is a symptom of a disease in whatever it is that calls itself the GOP. Today's party demands purity in respect to adulation of the Leader, and demonization of all those who diverge from adulation of the Leader. Submission is a virtue.

I think there are historical parallels to this that are pretty interesting, no?

Both Obama and Biden are to the right of Trump on nearly every issue.

And Trump's "policies", to remind everyone, changed by the tweet----leaving Generals and staffers twisting in the wind, trying to figure out what to do.

I think TrumpFans have forgotten that....although I don't know how.

Issues not involving human rights.

[Farfromgeneva]

Which issues would they be.

I'm a bit puzzled as to what "to the right" means for a fan, but I would agree that Trump (and the MAGA cult that follows him) are anything but "conservative". They are populist extremists who would embrace any position if it would enhance the intensity of their support, necessary in their path to power. In this instance, I think nearly every such "issue" they take a "right" turn, but perhaps a fan is defining "right" somewhat differently.

What it really means is there's little room on many issues between Antifa and Proud Boys at the end of the day becuase it's a circle more than a straight line spectrum.

[Farfromgeneva]

The dullest knife in the drawer

Rep. Ben Cline (R-VA) accused Hunter Biden of "blocking" Rep. James Comer's (R-KY) impeachment investigation by offering to testify in public.

Among a drawer that, if you rummaged around blind in it, you wouldn't break skin.

Biden offers to testify publicly only -- in order to impede the spin (which is to say, blathering lies) from Comer the Gomer and Gym. Called their bluff. The GOP House is a coalition of tiny, tiny men and women.

And yet somehow still end up contracting metaphorical HIV...extending the metaphor out a little further.

[njbill]

The dullest knife in the drawer

Rep. Ben Cline (R-VA) accused Hunter Biden of "blocking" Rep. James Comer's (R-KY) impeachment investigation by offering to testify in public.

Among a drawer that, if you rummaged around blind in it, you wouldn't break skin.

Biden offers to testify publicly only -- in order to impede the spin (which is to say, blathering lies) from Comer the Gomer and Gym. Called their bluff. The GOP House is a coalition of tiny, tiny men and women.

Weiss should indict Hunter for offering to testify in public. I believe it is a capital offense.

[old salt]

When did Gen. Kelly, Gen. Mattis, Judge Luttig become not “conservative” enough?

To cradle’s question, which I have answered innumerable times before, I put country and Constitution, the rule of law not men, certainly not the minority, over Party. I will not compromise on these core values. Governance in a democracy requires compromise and persuasion and I’m fully on board with that “core value” as well.

This is the stark contrast with MAGA, with the Chinese Communist Party, with authoritarian regimes in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Hungary, Belorus, and numerous others in various parts of the world.

Kelly, Mattis and Luttig became pariahs when they contradicted Trump, who ordered the cult to call them RINOs. The cult, as ever, complied.

Indeed, Salty had asked a day ago what Republicans I’d associate myself with, given the MAGA takeover of the party. Heck of a lot of us RINOs. Many have left the GOP formally, but not their principles.

Do you still consider Kelly to be racist ? (cue the double speak)

[old salt]

I've never claimed to be anything other than a partisan Conservative Republican. I make no apologies.

Completely untrue. You arrived at the Water Cooler claiming to be a moderate that despised partisan politics.

You've changed your tune, which is why all of us long timers have been reacting the way that we have literally since Trump arrived on the scene. Any pretense of evenhandedness left the building.

You finally cop to it here. And you're more than welcome to do this. Enjoy the forum.

...I was still a staunch (R) when I joined. Recall my defense of W being called a draft dodger.
I'm still a fan of Simpson-Bowles. DACA's ok by me. I was with the Gang of 8 on immigration & still am.

Things were less polarized then. The GOP overall was more moderate then.
I still consider myself a moderate on several issues --immigration, gun control, abortion, food stamps & other public assistance.
I just trust the (R)'s more to implement them. We have to raise taxes & reduce entitlement spending.
Trump scares me less than what his enemies are willing to do to thwart him.
I still hope that DeSantis or Haley get the (R) nom.

That's all great. That doesn't change the fact that you told the forum you were a moderate, and despised the hypocrisy of both parties.

You weren't being straight then...... and now you are. Your posts are blind Republican partisan posts...party over reason. Reasoning with you is pointless...took me a long time to figure that out, fooled into thinking we were having a conversation about ideas and issues, when the reality was and is: your mind is made up before you sit down at the table any time US politics or political figures are involved.

And that's fine. As I said, enjoy the forum.

That was 15 years ago. By 2008 standards, I was a moderate...especially in the cordial discussions we had around the WC then.

Back then, there were serious attempts at compromise on the national level -- Simpson-Bowles, the Gang of 8 comp Immigration reform, ...W & Ryan even broached Soc Sec & Medicare reforms. We don't see that anymore. Now it's purely a power game, with no apology from either side. Social issues were not as divisive then. We were still somewhat united & still in shock from 9-11. I've been driven to the right, due to the dearth of choices in the middle.