Elon Musk (yet another authoritarian)

[MDlaxfan76]

Please hare your wisdom that implies we have all pivoted 180 degrees and now trust the site/Musk.....that is just innuendo and logical fallacy on your part.

Are you kidding? All your complaints about Twitter not being a Town Square are *poof* gone. You don't care any more.

We all now know Social media has biases.....duh, not sure why you are spun up again.

Because that's not what you said in the past.

Remember citing Bill Maher and his moronic take that "twitter failed", and the "reason" he gives is that (drumroll) they didn't publish everything that guys like Bill wanted them to publish? Maher has more than a few blind spots, and this is a big one.

Tell Maher that he MUST run a story. Watch what happens. How fast will he tell you that you can F right off, it's his dam show?

Or better still...tell Musk that he MUST run a story you want to run, and he's "not allowed to stop you". What do you supposed would happen?

You are doing a great job at proving my original point above.

Nope. I support companies and their ability to CHOOSE what they print and don't print...including Musk and anyone else running twitter. I'm the only American left who believes this, apparently. I honestly don't understand what it is your believe, so i'll let you speak for yourself.

I agree, I just want them to be liable for the damage they do when they recklessly or willfully do that damage.

Like any other company or person.

damage??

Not ONE bizness can be held "liable" for damages done by covid shots, mandates, mask wearing, etc.
But, let us just stick with Liable for damages from the shot.

bc of TRUMPS cares act, no one is liable for anything covid.....and you swoon in this awesomeness of liability protection for all things covid.

You gotten covid HOW many times now? 5 ?

We harken "twatter" to be like so many multi vendor "antique" or trinkette shopping venues....where you can rent a 10 by 10 space and sell what you want.

Twatter didn't allow you to post what you wanted.....that IS editorializing content. Whatever.........we love twatter. Look at all the "grownups" usining it for "journalism? fuffg

sigh...trying to parse through that gobbledygook.

First, I'm pretty sure that covid is another thread.

My comment didn't mention Covid nor did I make an argument about liability about Covid.

I agreed that companies should be able to choose to print what they want...with the caveat of liability. Liability needs to be proven in court with full due process of law, whether civilly or criminally.

Our system enables the government representing the People or private parties to hold companies and people liable for their actions. Damages need to be proven and the act needs to willful or reckless. I'm not a lawyer, but that's the process best I know.

I'm not in favor of protecting the massive social media companies from being held liable for the damage they do when they publish willfully or recklessly.

If you think it would be difficult or impossible to prove such damages related to Covid misinformation and phony remedies why are you bringing it up? Take your complaints to court.

As to my own experience, thankfully I was fully vaccinated and boosted before I got the variation of Covid the first time and while it was not fun, it didn't get close to hospitalization. This most recent time, I suspect my immunity to the new variation was low...again not fun, but a proven remedy was immediately and freely available. Short, not fun, but not hospitalization. Most of my family has had Covid at least once, all to lesser effects. My 86 year old mother who would be highly vulnerable due to prior respiratory issues as well as age has been fully boosted and not contracted. She did spend 10 days in the hospital last fall with RSV.

We will all get the new booster that apparently works well with the new variant.

Why? Because our personal doctors recommend doing so.

We will also stay up to date on flu and RSV, and have had the shingles vaccine.

Why, because that's what our doctors recommend.

And no, at least in my 65 year lifetime you never could just sell anything you wanted at the flea market; eg no heroin...maybe you're thinking of back to old westerns with some guy rolling up in a carriage and getting out his soapbox and display of pots and pans and some sort of cure-all medication in a dark bottle...? Get out of town before people realize it was all snake oil

[NattyBohChamps04]

Elon crapped the bed on the TSLA earnings call, so of course he needs a diversion. He sounds like some of the high school kids I coach.

[Farfromgeneva]

Elon crapped the bed on the TSLA earnings call, so of course he needs a diversion. He sounds like some of the high school kids I coach.

Correlation or…

You can track his rise with an inverse chart in interest rates in long term out of the money bets with explosive upside. Time is now not his friend w SpaceX, TEsla etc. he’s so personally levered and illiquid that the downside could be amplified more than folks realize.

IPO fees plus ECM/DCM wouldn’t add up to that over ten years! They greatly overvalued “earned media” which is referred to as League Tables.

[Farfromgeneva]

Thought exercise, bonds and loans value is based on rate and credit risk. So as everyone learned if you own 1% bonds in a 5% rate world even if you are paid 100 cents on the dollar at maturity they aren’t worth 100 cents to anyone else (on a 30yr bond lookout which is what makes the idea of MTM the gift balance sheet suicidally depressing-if not earlier as soon as we started sterilizing our own currency which I was against 15yrs ago)

Realistically Twitter is worth between $5-$10Bn today. Different, but are they? Verizon sold what was left of Yahoo and AOL to private equity as a run off for around $5Bn. (And think the headline includes earn outs ans other contingencies in the price)

Musks loans are 7yr term with limited amortization (1%yr in quarterly principal payments) at Libor/SOFR + mid 300s (believe 350). That same deal today not knowing what we know since takeover would be +500 so you’ve got 6yrs left so like 80 cent range (not linear math) BUT…given all that’s gone on, the going concern opinion etc, this is perceived as a different credit risk now. So more like +1000-1500 over index (sofr). 5.5yrs remaining maybe now. Ignoring the dd minimus amortization this loan would be discounted to something like 30-50 cents on the dollar. So the banks who couldn’t flip / syndicate it (mainly BofA and MS) are going to lose on the order of (absent any other hedges) $6-$10bn on Musk on this deal. And Jamie Dimon already doesn’t like him.


One Year On, Twitter Continues to Burn a Hole Through Bank Balance Sheets - WSJ

Banks have begun preparations to try to unload at least some of the $13 billion of debt they underwrote, at a steep discount


Twitter, which was renamed X, has seen investor appetite cool. Photo: Justin Sullivan/Getty Images
The banks that financed Elon Musk’s $44 billion purchase of Twitter are still struggling a year later to contain the damage to their balance sheets.

Seven banks including Morgan Stanley, Bank of America and Barclays lent Musk around $13 billion to buy Twitter a year ago this coming Friday. Under normal circumstances, they would have unloaded the debt to Wall Street investment firms soon thereafter. But investor appetite for Twitter, which Musk has since renamed X, has cooled since the billionaire took over, forcing the banks to hold the debt on their own balance sheets at a discounted value.

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://apple.news/A-6UJNz4-Ql2rCVsUYGDvKA

The site formerly known as Twitter

[OCanada]

He has taken it from a 44 billion purchase price to a 19 billion valuation in a year. A real genius that one

[MDlaxfan76]

He has taken it from a 44 billion purchase price to a 19 billion valuation in a year. A real genius that one

Is that valuation net the debt load, or before debt load?
I don't have WaPo subscription.

[cradleandshoot]

What is ironic here is Elon Musk clearly doesn't give a rats ass about anyones opinion. He made his billions and he is free to lose his billions. This is irrelevant but I remember Elon doing a cameo in an episode of The Big Bang Theory. He used to be such a beloved FLP icon. Oh where did you go wrong Elon, now the scoundrels despise you. I wonder if the criticism bothers him?

[PizzaSnake]

He has taken it from a 44 billion purchase price to a 19 billion valuation in a year. A real genius that one

Is that valuation net the debt load, or before debt load?
I don't have WaPo subscription.

Look at FFG’s post above.

[NattyBohChamps04]

Of course Musk is painfully insecure and really does care what people think of him. Easy to see the path of how he veered into the alt-right universe where he has an echo chamber of people praising him. Makes him feel better about himself.

As far as the public getting clued into his craziness? The first main inflection point was him calling the Thai Cave Rescuers pedos. All because the diving experts dismissed his submarine idea because it wouldn't work. And the public tantrums ensued. And having 11 kids with 3 different women and not being a dad to them is a bit of a red flag too.

Elon Musk reportedly forced Twitter algorithm to boost his tweets after Super Bowl flop

A tweet from Joe Biden got triple the impressions than Musk’s game time post, sending engineers scrambling to boost their boss

Clearly a guy who doesn't care. But I guess he has a metric f-ton of money from two or three great investments, so that makes him better than others in some people's eyes.

[MDlaxfan76]

He has taken it from a 44 billion purchase price to a 19 billion valuation in a year. A real genius that one

Is that valuation net the debt load, or before debt load?
I don't have WaPo subscription.

Look at FFG’s post above.

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

[NattyBohChamps04]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

[youthathletics]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

Why do you all sniff his jock so badly. You do realize Karen-esque it sounds to be complaining about someone else's money. Now go order a soy frappuccino while your at it.

You all are so quick to judge. Name someone who posses more power to reach the globe in a key stroke....that is power that can be harnessed and used for the greater good by governments. Never forget...your phone is nothing more than a wireless umbilical cord tethered to you.

[kramerica.inc]

https://techcrunch.com/2023/10/30/why-d ... -one-year/

Why did Twitter (X)’s valuation tank 56% in one year?

Amanda Silberling
@asilbwrites
5:55 PM EDT • October 30, 2023

The company formerly known as Twitter, X is valuing itself at $19 billion, per internal documents obtained by Fortune. When Elon Musk bought the company one year ago this week, he paid about $44 billion for the microblogging platform, or $54.20 per share.

This internal valuation marks about a 56% decrease in X’s value over the last 12 months, which doesn’t look too good. There are certainly many explanations as to why Twitter’s value has been halved, like how the platform has spent the last year killing global brand awareness, deplatforming journalists and aiding impersonation. Still, one number rarely tells the whole story of a company, especially when company valuations can be so arbitrary. Depending on who is calculating a company’s valuation — a venture capitalist, a government auditor or an egotistical billionaire — the resulting number can vary drastically. Fidelity, for example, has marked down its investment in X by 65%.

The company, which was taken private with Musk’s purchase, is now offering employees restricted stock units (RSUs) at a share price of $45. When private companies offer stock-like compensation options, the IRS advises companies to use a 409A valuation, an independent assessment of how much a company is worth. But these valuations tend to skew more conservative than a valuation inferred via new venture funding, for example.

Because of this, it’s not uncommon to see companies’ valuations get slashed after a new 409A appraisal. Last year, Stripe and Instacart saw their valuations cut by 28% and 38%, respectively.

EquityZen, a company that expands access to private markets investing, has observed these trends consistently among private tech companies.

“At EquityZen, we’ve seen shares trading in private pre-IPO tech companies at an average discount of 49% to the last funding round,” Phil Haslett, founder and CSO of EquityZen, told TechCrunch. Haslett doesn’t see X’s valuation drop as a surprise, though he says the velocity of this drop — just one year — “does raise some concerns.”

Haslett added that a company’s common stock (or, the kind of equity compensation offered to employees) can also be priced at a discount, since the company isn’t public.

“Since there’s no active liquid market for shares, the company can make an argument that common stock is worth less than the $44 billion price tag,” Haslett told TechCrunch. “This actually benefits employees: they’ll likely get more stock (or at least, stock options with a lower strike price).”

It can be seen as a win-win for both executives and employees when their company gets a deflated 409A valuation, because it makes it less expensive to grant employees stock options. It also makes it easier to recruit talent.

“409A valuation sets the tax basis for stock options,” Alex Ross, founder and CEO of the plant care app Greg, told TechCrunch. As the head of a private startup, he solicits a new 409A valuation about once a year. “At a $19B valuation, Twitter employees pay less in taxes when exercising options than at a $40B valuation.”

But even if this may benefit employees in the short-term, the platform will still need to recoup its lost value if its “hardcore” employees will get an eventual windfall.

So, is it worrisome that X is touting a $19 billion valuation? Yeah, but it may not be that alarming to those who work there.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

Why do you all sniff his jock so badly. You do realize Karen-esque it sounds to be complaining about someone else's money. Now go order a soy frappuccino while your at it.

You all are so quick to judge. Name someone who posses more power to reach the globe in a key stroke....that is power that can be harnessed and used for the greater good by governments. Never forget...your phone is nothing more than a wireless umbilical cord tethered to you.

You are using the term incorrectly…

[MDlaxfan76]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

Why do you all sniff his jock so badly. You do realize Karen-esque it sounds to be complaining about someone else's money. Now go order a soy frappuccino while your at it.

You all are so quick to judge. Name someone who posses more power to reach the globe in a key stroke....that is power that can be harnessed and used for the greater good by governments. Never forget...your phone is nothing more than a wireless umbilical cord tethered to you.

You are using the term incorrectly…

Quite awkward reference!

And a very strange argument, youth. On the one hand, you think no one should be commenting on Musk’s management decisions leading to immense destruction in business value, and on the other you appear to be extolling the power he wields. Do I have that correct?

If so, who is doing the jock sniffing here?

[youthathletics]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

Why do you all sniff his jock so badly. You do realize Karen-esque it sounds to be complaining about someone else's money. Now go order a soy frappuccino while your at it.

You all are so quick to judge. Name someone who posses more power to reach the globe in a key stroke....that is power that can be harnessed and used for the greater good by governments. Never forget...your phone is nothing more than a wireless umbilical cord tethered to you.

You are using the term incorrectly…

Quite awkward reference!

And a very strange argument, youth. On the one hand, you think no one should be commenting on Musk’s management decisions leading to immense destruction in business value, and on the other you appear to be extolling the power he wields. Do I have that correct?

If so, who is doing the jock sniffing here?

It is used perfectly and bigly...I am just a few steps ahead of you. I'll explain, which should give you and fellow jock sniffer TLD more to chew on to keep TLD's post count up.

It's clear you all are envious, otherwise he'd be dead to you. You've already stated on many occasions you hate him and he's a jerk....which means you secretly do envy him for his wealth and ability to spend that kind of money, frivolously as it may seem. So yes, jock sniffing fits perfectly.... as you all secretly envy/idolize him, for things you can not do, nor understand.

He does have power, he's the wealthiest person on the globe by 50b.... and trending up.

You like Apples? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqHRz6SrfiA

[Typical Lax Dad]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

Why do you all sniff his jock so badly. You do realize Karen-esque it sounds to be complaining about someone else's money. Now go order a soy frappuccino while your at it.

You all are so quick to judge. Name someone who posses more power to reach the globe in a key stroke....that is power that can be harnessed and used for the greater good by governments. Never forget...your phone is nothing more than a wireless umbilical cord tethered to you.

You are using the term incorrectly…

Quite awkward reference!

And a very strange argument, youth. On the one hand, you think no one should be commenting on Musk’s management decisions leading to immense destruction in business value, and on the other you appear to be extolling the power he wields. Do I have that correct?

If so, who is doing the jock sniffing here?

It is used perfectly and bigly...I am just a few steps ahead of you. I'll explain, which should give you and fellow jock sniffer TLD more to chew on to keep TLD's post count up.

It's clear you all are envious, otherwise he'd be dead to you. You've already stated on many occasions you hate him and he's a jerk....which means you secretly do envy him for his wealth and ability to spend that kind of money, frivolously as it may seem. So yes, jock sniffing fits perfectly.... as you all secretly envy/idolize him, for things you can not do, nor understand.

He does have power, he's the wealthiest person on the globe by 50b.... and trending up.

You like Apples? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqHRz6SrfiA

Envy is also a misuse of the word in this context….what should I do about a cold solder joint?

>> What of phrases like “fronting,” “busting,” and “jocking?” Jocking is not actually a word, but a slang term derived from the word “jock,” meaning “athlete” or “a person devoted to a single pursuit or interest.” Jock, of course, comes from “jockstrap,” making its definition both amusing and literal. But the term “jocking” refers to liking someone so much so that you are often blindly into them. <<

[MDlaxfan76]

Yes, that's what he seemed to be saying. It's $19B - $13B = $6B...and that's down from $44B.
Makes the sellers look like friggin geniuses...OR...

One of the most obvious and inadvertantly brilliant business moves in modern history by the old Twitter Board. And it's overshadowed by Musk's incompetence and crybaby-ness. Board would have been carved up if they didn't take that deal.

They made out like bandits because of one man's hubris. This is gonna go down in history in a bad way for Mr X.

Tom from MySpace with his fortune and relaxing retirement seems happier than Musk will ever be.

Why do you all sniff his jock so badly. You do realize Karen-esque it sounds to be complaining about someone else's money. Now go order a soy frappuccino while your at it.

You all are so quick to judge. Name someone who posses more power to reach the globe in a key stroke....that is power that can be harnessed and used for the greater good by governments. Never forget...your phone is nothing more than a wireless umbilical cord tethered to you.

You are using the term incorrectly…

Quite awkward reference!

And a very strange argument, youth. On the one hand, you think no one should be commenting on Musk’s management decisions leading to immense destruction in business value, and on the other you appear to be extolling the power he wields. Do I have that correct?

If so, who is doing the jock sniffing here?

It is used perfectly and bigly...I am just a few steps ahead of you. I'll explain, which should give you and fellow jock sniffer TLD more to chew on to keep TLD's post count up.

It's clear you all are envious, otherwise he'd be dead to you. You've already stated on many occasions you hate him and he's a jerk....which means you secretly do envy him for his wealth and ability to spend that kind of money, frivolously as it may seem. So yes, jock sniffing fits perfectly.... as you all secretly envy/idolize him, for things you can not do, nor understand.

He does have power, he's the wealthiest person on the globe by 50b.... and trending up.

You like Apples? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqHRz6SrfiA

mmm, seems to me that someone else in this discussion is the one who admires him to the point of unnaturally excusing his issues.

Musk is a hugely successful entrepreneur and I certainly would join your admiration in his positive qualities, but not to the point of being blind to his foibles and errors.

Do I "envy" him and his personality, his failed relationships? Nope. Not remotely. He strikes me as a very unhappy person, hurtful to others, with major self destructive qualities. To some extent, I feel sorry for him, though I do think he's responsible for his own problems.

Idolize?...I think that's getting back to...you.

But why do people care about Musk? You describe it quite correctly, his enormous wealth provides him with immense power, for good or ill. The good is worthy of applause....and in some matters, hope for further success. However, the power for ill is a very serious issue for all of us. Thus, the concern.

And with Twitter, super serious ill potential, as he's already demonstrated.
And sure, there's a bit of schadenfreude in seeing karma and hubris bite Musk specifically due to those 'ill' decisions.

But that's certainly not "hate". I just think some comeuppance for being a jerk is good thing from time to time, perhaps especially for the highly powerful.

[NattyBohChamps04]

It is used perfectly and bigly...I am just a few steps ahead of you. I'll explain, which should give you and fellow jock sniffer TLD more to chew on to keep TLD's post count up.

It's clear you all are envious, otherwise he'd be dead to you. You've already stated on many occasions you hate him and he's a jerk....which means you secretly do envy him for his wealth and ability to spend that kind of money, frivolously as it may seem. So yes, jock sniffing fits perfectly.... as you all secretly envy/idolize him, for things you can not do, nor understand.

He does have power, he's the wealthiest person on the globe by 50b.... and trending up.

You like Apples? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqHRz6SrfiA

I post because I like dunking on all the simps who love and actually like sniffing Musk's jock. All the ones who said he would be a "free speech absolutist" (he's not, he censors anything he doesn't like) and that he's some kind of uber-genius. We had a few posters here go full in on Musk love prior to the Twitter purchase.

All these tech bros and libertarians fell so hard for Musk, it's just fun rubbing their noses in his sH!t now that more peopl know who he really is. Another narcissist like Trump who was born on third thinking he hit a triple. Bright guy at times past, but he bought into his own hype.

Money doesn't change you, it just reveals who you really are.

Personally I enjoy having a lot of money and not being a public figure. Fun rolling into general aviation in jeans and a t-shirt and no one knowing what you do for a living. They treat you equally wonderful either way. I don't need to be the wealthiest person in the globe to have influence and make my and my family's life better.