Sensible Gun Safety

[kramerica.inc]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Its also a question of a mentally ill's person's access to mental healthcare.

So many of these people stopped getting care when they were told to stay home or do remote therapy during covid.

[youthathletics]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Not picking a fight here. Just exercising more futility. Is your deduction that b/c we have so many mentally ill people in the world that we do not know what to do with them, then we should abolish all firearms? It really comes down to that decision, then if you want to build back out from there, you have to pick and choose how to maintain & balance the two equations.

Identifying, treating, and following up with the mentally ill infringes on so many more personal rights, far outweighing the simple 2A infringement discussions. Follow that up with simple mental health definitions of trauma, where personal trauma is received in our brains the very same way in each of us, regardless of significance, how we respond is then uniquely different in each of us. Some want vengeance, another may simply grieve and forgive, and another may laugh it off. As an aside, I spend a great deal of time listening to podcasts on psychology, philosophy, and the life of military operators. And what I have come to learn is that there are upwards of 50 military suicides/day, compared to ~130 total for the entire US. And when you listen to many of these ex-military folks speak, there is very little mental support given to them during their time serving, and essentially none upon separation....other than written prescriptions which often exacerbates the problem. There are now many non-profits of ex-military folks offering these services on their own to support vets....as the VA just pushes pills.

Full circle, how do we help the mentally ill in our country?

[PizzaSnake]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Not picking a fight here. Just exercising more futility. Is your deduction that b/c we have so many mentally ill people in the world that we do not know what to do with them, then we should abolish all firearms? It really comes down to that decision, then if you want to build back out from there, you have to pick and choose how to maintain & balance the two equations.

Identifying, treating, and following up with the mentally ill infringes on so many more personal rights, far outweighing the simple 2A infringement discussions. Follow that up with simple mental health definitions of trauma, where personal trauma is received in our brains the very same way in each of us, regardless of significance, how we respond is then uniquely different in each of us. Some want vengeance, another may simply grieve and forgive, and another may laugh it off. As an aside, I spend a great deal of time listening to podcasts on psychology, philosophy, and the life of military operators. And what I have come to learn is that there are upwards of 50 military suicides/day, compared to ~130 total for the entire US. And when you listen to many of these ex-military folks speak, there is very little mental support given to them during their time serving, and essentially none upon separation....other than written prescriptions which often exacerbates the problem. There are now many non-profits of ex-military folks offering these services on their own to support vets....as the VA just pushes pills.

Full circle, how do we help the mentally ill in our country?

Good analysis.

So, next logical question: why do we have so many soldiers?

[Seacoaster(1)]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Its also a question of a mentally ill's person's access to mental healthcare.

So many of these people stopped getting care when they were told to stay home or do remote therapy during covid.

You are absolutely right, Kramer; I should have said that as well. Thanks.

[Kismet]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Its also a question of a mentally ill's person's access to mental healthcare.

So many of these people stopped getting care when they were told to stay home or do remote therapy during covid.

Well, this militia type was hospitalized this past summer for a TWO WEEKS with mental health issues so, in this case, not relevant.
Somehow despite that treatment nobody removed the weapon from his possession likely because its very difficult to accomplish in this country.

Everyone always yammers about the "right to bear arms" but somehow nobody ever invokes the Declaration of independence and the rights of everyone else who are not gun owners.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are LIFE, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

In this case, firearm used was legally purchased (recently) - Sniper Rifle 308 equipped with optical scope and sighting mechanism

[DMac]

How many years with this same discussion?
The only change will be that the clock begins
anew and counts down to the next bloodbath.
We love our guns and are willing to have an
occasional massacre in the name of the 2nd
amendment to keep 'em. Proof is in the pudding.
Thoughts and prayers.

[kramerica.inc]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

[a fan]

Full circle, how do we help the mentally ill in our country?

Free single payer health care for all, including dental and mental services.

[DMac]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

[PizzaSnake]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Its also a question of a mentally ill's person's access to mental healthcare.

So many of these people stopped getting care when they were told to stay home or do remote therapy during covid.

Well, this militia type was hospitalized this past summer for a week with mental health issues so, in this case, not relevant.
Somehow despite that treatment nobody removed the weapon from his possession likely because its very difficult to accomplish in this country.

Everyone always yammers about the "right to bear arms" but somehow nobody ever invokes the Declaration of independence and the rights of everyone else who are not gun owners.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are LIFE, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

D of I was the “vision” statement. Purely aspirational.

Now, the Constitution was the result of the “sausage” production.

[PizzaSnake]

Coming to a town near you, or your town. It's not a question of the size or location of the city or town; it is a question of a mentally ill person's access to weapons...in a country in which access to weapons is essentially unhindered. Lewiston is a town of about 34,000, includes Bates College. Over 20 dead and 60 injured are numbers that will reverberate in nearly every home there. The Second Amendment has been overrun any kind of balance against the right to just go bowling, go to church, the movies, Walmart, high school, college, the workplace. What on earth is wrong with us?

Its also a question of a mentally ill's person's access to mental healthcare.

So many of these people stopped getting care when they were told to stay home or do remote therapy during covid.

Well, this militia type was hospitalized this past summer for a week with mental health issues so, in this case, not relevant.
Somehow despite that treatment nobody removed the weapon from his possession likely because its very difficult to accomplish in this country.

Everyone always yammers about the "right to bear arms" but somehow nobody ever invokes the Declaration of independence and the rights of everyone else who are not gun owners.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are LIFE, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

D of I was the “vision” statement. Purely aspirational.

Now, the Constitution was the result of the “sausage” production.

[Kismet]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

[kramerica.inc]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

[Seacoaster(1)]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

I think we have to create a legal regime in which there are serious consequences for getting a gun into the hands of a mentally ill person. We need Red Flag laws. Etc. Etc. We are not disarming people.

[kramerica.inc]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

I think we have to create a legal regime in which there are serious consequences for getting a gun into the hands of a mentally ill person. We need Red Flag laws. Etc. Etc. We are not disarming people.

You've written a decent amount here about your disdain for extreme authoritarianism and "fascism" under Trump.

This sounds like it's in conflict with those thoughts. And perhaps leaning towards the "thought police."

There are a lot in place. What type of red flags do you propose could work better??

And more importantly, How do you make this work under the constitution? And who is going to enforce and do the disarming? The defunded police? A smooth-talking de-escalator or mental-health-conscious social worker? It also is highly likely to fail because it relies mostly on "see something, say something."

https://www.cbsnews.com/colorado/news/g ... g-gun-law/

[cradleandshoot]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

I think we have to create a legal regime in which there are serious consequences for getting a gun into the hands of a mentally ill person. We need Red Flag laws. Etc. Etc. We are not disarming people.

The devil is in the details. This now involves an individuals doctor and how you circumvent HIPAA laws. If an individual is found mentally unstable to own a firearm what are his/her legal remedy to prove they now possess the legal faculty to own a weapon? Are red flag laws only designed to be one directional? The government can revoke your 2nd amendment rights with no intention of giving them back.

[a fan]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

I think we have to create a legal regime in which there are serious consequences for getting a gun into the hands of a mentally ill person. We need Red Flag laws. Etc. Etc. We are not disarming people.

The devil is in the details. This now involves an individuals doctor and how you circumvent HIPAA laws. If an individual is found mentally unstable to own a firearm what are his/her legal remedy to prove they now possess the legal faculty to own a weapon? Are red flag laws only designed to be one directional? The government can revoke your 2nd amendment rights with no intention of giving them back.

As I said before-----move to single payer healthcare, and invest in mental health.

Separate the person from the guns, not the guns from the person. Easier to do, legally. We just have to have places to put these people who need help.

Right now? America doesn't have that. It's worth the spend.

Other than that? These shootings will simply get more frequent. We had 2 mass shootings a day this year. Don't know what needs to happen to get Congress do act.

[cradleandshoot]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

I think we have to create a legal regime in which there are serious consequences for getting a gun into the hands of a mentally ill person. We need Red Flag laws. Etc. Etc. We are not disarming people.

The devil is in the details. This now involves an individuals doctor and how you circumvent HIPAA laws. If an individual is found mentally unstable to own a firearm what are his/her legal remedy to prove they now possess the legal faculty to own a weapon? Are red flag laws only designed to be one directional? The government can revoke your 2nd amendment rights with no intention of giving them back.

As I said before-----move to single payer healthcare, and invest in mental health.

Separate the person from the guns, not the guns from the person. Easier to do, legally. We just have to have places to put these people who need help.

Right now? America doesn't have that. It's worth the spend.

Other than that? These shootings will simply get more frequent. We had 2 mass shootings a day this year. Don't know what needs to happen to get Congress do act.

Still doesn't address the problem with violating Federal HIPAA laws. Doctors are being put into a bad situation. Their patients expect confidentiality on what they discuss as doctor/patient.

[a fan]

The way this country is headed- with these shootings, crime up, police response down, the general civil unrest, and the forever memory/legacy of actions by BLM, proud boys, KKK, Black Panthers, and Antifa, no one is giving up their guns anytime soon.

And unless the government wants to ramp up civil unrest even more, they have no good way to confiscate.

Completely agree. As noted, the only thing that changes after each "incident" is that the clock goes back to zero and starts counting to the next one. Aint nuthin' gonna change.
Thoughts and prayers.

Some relevant facts in this case -
Suspect was institutionalized for two weeks this past summer. Claimed to be "hearing voices"
Suspect and family were known vocal 2nd amendment supporters. I'll wager authorities will find LOTS of firearms and ammo at his residence and in possession of other family members.

Police questioned suspect over recent threats to shoot up a national guard facility in Saco ME.

It should not be a surprise to anyone at the way this unfolded.

NOTHING was done (or likely possible given current state of law in this country) and now we have 18 dead people and searching locations which may include multiple adjacent states and even Canada whose border is 2 hours away.

Welcome to the USA where there are more firearms than people where we CHOOSE in this manner and keep electing people who wish to perpetuate this insanity.

How do the elected perpetuate it? Seems like there are plenty of criminal murder and firearm control laws on the books that are bent at deterring these things. Seems like an enforcement issue to me. People who commit these crimes and others are often mentally ill. Prisons are full of people who know there are serious consequences and act bad anyway. What additional laws do you propose Maine and other states add to the books that will suddenly stop this?

Federal Law
Under 18 U.S.C. § 922(d), it is unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution.”

Maine
Under 15 M.R.S. § 393, a person may not own, possess, or have under that person’s control a firearm, unless that person has obtained a permit under this section, if that person: Has been found not criminally responsible by reason of insanity of committing certain enumerated crimes.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal ... al-illness

I think we have to create a legal regime in which there are serious consequences for getting a gun into the hands of a mentally ill person. We need Red Flag laws. Etc. Etc. We are not disarming people.

The devil is in the details. This now involves an individuals doctor and how you circumvent HIPAA laws. If an individual is found mentally unstable to own a firearm what are his/her legal remedy to prove they now possess the legal faculty to own a weapon? Are red flag laws only designed to be one directional? The government can revoke your 2nd amendment rights with no intention of giving them back.

As I said before-----move to single payer healthcare, and invest in mental health.

Separate the person from the guns, not the guns from the person. Easier to do, legally. We just have to have places to put these people who need help.

Right now? America doesn't have that. It's worth the spend.

Other than that? These shootings will simply get more frequent. We had 2 mass shootings a day this year. Don't know what needs to happen to get Congress do act.

Still doesn't address the problem with violating Federal HIPAA laws. Doctors are being put into a bad situation. Their patients expect confidentiality on what they discuss as doctor/patient.

Change the laws.

This is the only viable solution at hand. The guns will go nowhere....we have to address the problem somewhere else.

[SCLaxAttack]

How many years with this same discussion?
The only change will be that the clock begins
anew and counts down to the next bloodbath.
We love our guns and are willing to have an
occasional massacre in the name of the 2nd
amendment to keep 'em. Proof is in the pudding.
Thoughts and prayers.

I'm just sick and tired of the 2A excuse. The 21st repealed the 18th. Let's have a 28th repeal, or at least revise, the 2nd.

Australia revised their gun laws and murders/suicides plummeted. We can do the same.