Israel and West Bank Settlements

[Typical Lax Dad]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

[PizzaSnake]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

We should take what they tell us about themselves at face value:

“Dr. Angelou's response became one of Oprah's favorite life lessons to date. The lesson? "When people show you who they are, believe them."

“When a person says to you, ‘I’m selfish,’ or ‘I’m mean’ or ‘I am unkind,’ believe them,” Oprah says in the clip. “They know themselves much better than you do.”

[Typical Lax Dad]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

We should take what they tell us about themselves at face value:

“Dr. Angelou's response became one of Oprah's favorite life lessons to date. The lesson? "When people show you who they are, believe them."

“When a person says to you, ‘I’m selfish,’ or ‘I’m mean’ or ‘I am unkind,’ believe them,” Oprah says in the clip. “They know themselves much better than you do.”

Trust me…it’s was filed a long time ago. Back when I was more anonymous.

[youthathletics]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

Agreed, some things are not defensible. But that does not mean there is not a gift in pain. Clearly ignoring slavery or the holocaust portion; the essence is that we can find gifts while in pain, just as Jesus did; since you want to label me pastor as a snide comment towards me. Was Jesus not persecuted as a slave was or a holocaust victim. It's easy to take shots at others when you do not exercise empathy, grace, and attempted understanding. Not a sermon, just a thought.

https://livingproof.co/finding-purpose- ... .%E2%80%9D

[Typical Lax Dad]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

Agreed, some things are not defensible, but that does not mean there is not a gift in pain....clearly ignoring our slavery or the holocaust portion; the essence is that we can find gifts while in pain, just as Jesus did, since you want to label me pastor. Was Jesus not persecuted as a slave was or a holocaust victim. It's easy to take shots at others when you do not exercise empathy, grace, and attempted understanding. Not a sermon, just a thought.

https://livingproof.co/finding-purpose- ... .%E2%80%9D

So if it’s was good enough for Jesus it was good enough for all Jews and slaves in the USA? “Shots at others”…..George Floyd was acting big and bad…..you are a fake. A great deceiver…anyone can type what you typed. You have a track record. Get down to the southern border and help those less fortunate than you are….show some empathy.

[youthathletics]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

Agreed, some things are not defensible, but that does not mean there is not a gift in pain....clearly ignoring our slavery or the holocaust portion; the essence is that we can find gifts while in pain, just as Jesus did, since you want to label me pastor. Was Jesus not persecuted as a slave was or a holocaust victim. It's easy to take shots at others when you do not exercise empathy, grace, and attempted understanding. Not a sermon, just a thought.

https://livingproof.co/finding-purpose- ... .%E2%80%9D

So if it’s was good enough for Jesus it was good enough for all Jews and slaves in the USA? “Shots at others”…..George Floyd was acting big and bad…..you are a fake. A great deceiver…anyone can type what you typed. You have a track record. Get down to the southern border and help those less fortunate than you are….show some empathy.

It may very well be that you have never had to go through or experienced real pain or trauma in your life which was the result of others brought on to you. And if you have, maybe you never truly grieved, or authentically forgiven them....its one thing to say it, quite another to truly mean it and be released from it. Anger is a step in the grieving process....there are additional steps to consider.

[Typical Lax Dad]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

Agreed, some things are not defensible, but that does not mean there is not a gift in pain....clearly ignoring our slavery or the holocaust portion; the essence is that we can find gifts while in pain, just as Jesus did, since you want to label me pastor. Was Jesus not persecuted as a slave was or a holocaust victim. It's easy to take shots at others when you do not exercise empathy, grace, and attempted understanding. Not a sermon, just a thought.

https://livingproof.co/finding-purpose- ... .%E2%80%9D

So if it’s was good enough for Jesus it was good enough for all Jews and slaves in the USA? “Shots at others”…..George Floyd was acting big and bad…..you are a fake. A great deceiver…anyone can type what you typed. You have a track record. Get down to the southern border and help those less fortunate than you are….show some empathy.

It may very well be that you have never had to go through or experienced real pain or trauma in your life which was the result of others brought on to you. And if you have, maybe you never truly grieved, or authentically forgiven them....its one thing to say it, quite another to truly mean it and be released from it. Anger is a step in the grieving process....there are additional steps to consider.

Anger is an infantile emotion….. May work for you but getting angry doesn’t work for me. I have been blessed…..nice subject chance. Subtly deceptive. You OK with defending aspects of slavery and the holocaust?

[youthathletics]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

Agreed, some things are not defensible, but that does not mean there is not a gift in pain....clearly ignoring our slavery or the holocaust portion; the essence is that we can find gifts while in pain, just as Jesus did, since you want to label me pastor. Was Jesus not persecuted as a slave was or a holocaust victim. It's easy to take shots at others when you do not exercise empathy, grace, and attempted understanding. Not a sermon, just a thought.

https://livingproof.co/finding-purpose- ... .%E2%80%9D

So if it’s was good enough for Jesus it was good enough for all Jews and slaves in the USA? “Shots at others”…..George Floyd was acting big and bad…..you are a fake. A great deceiver…anyone can type what you typed. You have a track record. Get down to the southern border and help those less fortunate than you are….show some empathy.

It may very well be that you have never had to go through or experienced real pain or trauma in your life which was the result of others brought on to you. And if you have, maybe you never truly grieved, or authentically forgiven them....its one thing to say it, quite another to truly mean it and be released from it. Anger is a step in the grieving process....there are additional steps to consider.

Anger is an infantile emotion….. May work for you but getting angry doesn’t work for me. I have been blessed…..nice subject chance. Subtly deceptive. You OK with defending aspects of slavery and the holocaust?

You likely have repassed anger, which is really anger in disguise. Your persona around here fits many of the signs in this link.

And no, I said above in bold/underline, some things are not defensible.

[MDlaxfan76]

I think there's a bit of talking past one another.

Youth, surely you understand that no one (absent a martyr/Jesus) would ever choose such "gifts" by becoming a slave or having their families sent to the gas chamber, etc. ? Nor would we ever expect someone to do so?

And slavery and the Holocaust have no justification, no moral "upside" ?

I think you agree as you say that "some things aren't defensible".
No silver lining. Not a "gift", in any sense.

And yet, yes, a victim of horror can overcome their perpetrators of that horror through finding meaning, purpose and love. And in so doing rise above the horror, the degradation, the pain.

Likewise, forgiveness is indeed a very powerful act of personal freedom and release from pain and anger and I suspect TLD fully understands that as well?

If so, maybe we ratchet it down?

[Typical Lax Dad]

I love how MD always comes in to try and clean up TLD's failed battles.

TLD failed in some way?

Yes. often takes things to a much further extreme in an attempt to win with a sucker punch, rather than conversing seeking to fully understand.

Win with a sucker punch? I call a spade a spade. Why dance around it? What is it you believe I don’t understand? A few people here routinely pick up what I allude to… so does Old Soldier.

He just said BS to your post, where you were attempting a sucker punch by not fully understanding him. Own it.

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust? That’s what you are going with? Demonstrating utility and surviving the holocaust or picking up life skills because of slavery? That’s what you believe should be taught in schools? Help me out here, pastor.

Agreed, some things are not defensible, but that does not mean there is not a gift in pain....clearly ignoring our slavery or the holocaust portion; the essence is that we can find gifts while in pain, just as Jesus did, since you want to label me pastor. Was Jesus not persecuted as a slave was or a holocaust victim. It's easy to take shots at others when you do not exercise empathy, grace, and attempted understanding. Not a sermon, just a thought.

https://livingproof.co/finding-purpose- ... .%E2%80%9D

So if it’s was good enough for Jesus it was good enough for all Jews and slaves in the USA? “Shots at others”…..George Floyd was acting big and bad…..you are a fake. A great deceiver…anyone can type what you typed. You have a track record. Get down to the southern border and help those less fortunate than you are….show some empathy.

It may very well be that you have never had to go through or experienced real pain or trauma in your life which was the result of others brought on to you. And if you have, maybe you never truly grieved, or authentically forgiven them....its one thing to say it, quite another to truly mean it and be released from it. Anger is a step in the grieving process....there are additional steps to consider.

Anger is an infantile emotion….. May work for you but getting angry doesn’t work for me. I have been blessed…..nice subject chance. Subtly deceptive. You OK with defending aspects of slavery and the holocaust?

You likely have repassed anger, which is really anger in disguise. Your persona around here fits many of the signs in this link.

And no, I said above in bold/underline, some things are not defensible.

You have issues….you feel inadequate. Perhaps bad karma explains what may have been situations that have hurt you. I don’t get angry. Anger is an emotion that you should grow out of…. You need something other than what is inside of you to make you happy and you still aren’t happy. You need something to make you feel whole….an opiate of sorts. Any, here we are because you don’t have a problem with what appears to be your commanding officer (based on your endless deference to Old Sailor) defending what most Christians would call actions that are indefensible. But I guess asking for forgiveness wipes it all clean.

[old salt]

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust?

That's real BS. Nobody's claiming a silver lining. The guidelines thoroughly teach the horrors & evils of slavery.
The one instruction being demagogued emphasizes that slaves were resourceful talented human beings, not just chattel or property.
The contributions freed slaves continued to make to the economy after emancipation are worth teaching so long as the injustices that continued are taught with it. This is a flyspecked misrepresentation of one sentence being demagogued to discredit a worthwhile teaching tool.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust?

That's real BS. Nobody's claiming a silver lining. The guidelines thoroughly teach the horrors & evils of slavery.
The one instruction being demagogued emphasizes that slaves were resourceful talented human beings, not just chattel or property.
The contributions freed slaves continued to make to the economy after emancipation are worth teaching so long as the injustices that continued are taught with it. This is a flyspecked misrepresentation of one sentence being demagogued to discredit a worthwhile teaching tool.

Like these people I learned about in elementary school?

https://www.havefunwithhistory.com/black-slaves/

[MDlaxfan76]

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust?

That's real BS. Nobody's claiming a silver lining. The guidelines thoroughly teach the horrors & evils of slavery.
The one instruction being demagogued emphasizes that slaves were resourceful talented human beings, not just chattel or property.
The contributions freed slaves continued to make to the economy after emancipation are worth teaching so long as the injustices that continued are taught with it. This is a flyspecked misrepresentation of one sentence being demagogued to discredit a worthwhile teaching tool.

Bull pucky.

No, the words definitely don't say that, nor could one reasonably infer that's what was meant.

This crap is straight 101 Lost Cause mythology. You know it and they know it.

BUT...IF the scholars meant something different, go back and change the wording to be crystal clear that there was no "benefited from" involved in the slightest. Free human being learn skills freely, slaves were beaten into submission, stripped of their families, forced to withstand every indignity. Only a very few were illegally taught to read and write by some of their subjugators. Note, illegally.

Free men, meanwhile, lived and thrived, their children went to school, learned skills, and in many cases attained prosperity. No one needs to talk about their "contributions to the economy" other than as full equals in society. Celebrating the exceptional is another matter, but learning skills and being prosperous should not be thought of as necessary to note.

Now, if you want to discuss how former slaves were subject to further repression in Jim Crow and through urban redlining, etc and yet, despite these impediments, succeeded anyway, great. And the curriculum allows for that.

But no "benefited from" slavery nor Jim Crow nor redlining nor any other form of prejudice and injustice.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust?

That's real BS. Nobody's claiming a silver lining. The guidelines thoroughly teach the horrors & evils of slavery.
The one instruction being demagogued emphasizes that slaves were resourceful talented human beings, not just chattel or property.
The contributions freed slaves continued to make to the economy after emancipation are worth teaching so long as the injustices that continued are taught with it. This is a flyspecked misrepresentation of one sentence being demagogued to discredit a worthwhile teaching tool.

Bull pucky.

No, the words definitely don't say that, nor could one reasonably infer that's what was meant.

This crap is straight 101 Lost Cause mythology. You know it and they know it.

BUT...IF the scholars meant something different, go back and change the wording to be crystal clear that there was no "benefited from" involved in the slightest. Free human being learn skills freely, slaves were beaten into submission, stripped of their families, forced to withstand every indignity. Only a very few were illegally taught to read and write by some of their subjugators. Note, illegally.

Free men, meanwhile, lived and thrived, their children went to school, learned skills, and in many cases attained prosperity. No one needs to talk about their "contributions to the economy" other than as full equals in society.

Now, if you want to discuss how former slaves were subject to further repression in Jim Crow and through urban redlining, etc and yet, despite these impediments, succeeded anyway, great. And the curriculum allows for that.

But no "benefited from" slavery nor Jim Crow nor redlining nor any other form of prejudice and injustice.

Linking success with slavery is cynical, just as linking surviving the holocaust with one’s personal utility is. Doesn’t get any simpler than that.

[old salt]

Some things aren’t defensible. You believe there is some element of a silver lining to someone experiencing slavery or the holocaust?

That's real BS. Nobody's claiming a silver lining. The guidelines thoroughly teach the horrors & evils of slavery.
The one instruction being demagogued emphasizes that slaves were resourceful talented human beings, not just chattel or property.
The contributions freed slaves continued to make to the economy after emancipation are worth teaching so long as the injustices that continued are taught with it. This is a flyspecked misrepresentation of one sentence being demagogued to discredit a worthwhile teaching tool.

Bull pucky.

No, the words definitely don't say that, nor could one reasonably infer that's what was meant.

This crap is straight 101 Lost Cause mythology. You know it and they know it.

BUT...IF the scholars meant something different, go back and change the wording to be crystal clear that there was no "benefited from" involved in the slightest. Free human being learn skills freely, slaves were beaten into submission, stripped of their families, forced to withstand every indignity. Only a very few were illegally taught to read and write by some of their subjugators. Note, illegally.

Free men, meanwhile, lived and thrived, their children went to school, learned skills, and in many cases attained prosperity. No one needs to talk about their "contributions to the economy" other than as full equals in society.

Now, if you want to discuss how former slaves were subject to further repression in Jim Crow and through urban redlining, etc and yet, despite these impediments, succeeded anyway, great. And the curriculum allows for that.

But no "benefited from" slavery nor Jim Crow nor redlining nor any other form of prejudice and injustice.

Linking success with slavery is cynical, just as linking surviving the holocaust with one’s personal utility is. Doesn’t get any simpler than that.

Yes, those accurate, factual assertions are inconvenient to your agenda.
Don't give any credit to former slaves who made their way when freed or to Holocaust survivors.

[NattyBohChamps04]

Yes, those accurate, factual assertions are inconvenient to your agenda.
Don't give any credit to former slaves who made their way when freed or to Holocaust survivors.

This is one of the stupidest assertions I've seen in recent history.

"Being a slave taught me to survive after I was a slave." Missing the point of the argument entirely. It's just plain stupid. Like, really, really, really stupid.

How many millions of resourceful, successful, capable people died in slavery and in the holocaust? Such an incredible, insane insult to all the victims.

[old salt]

Linking success with slavery is cynical, just as linking surviving the holocaust with one’s personal utility is. Doesn’t get any simpler than that.

Yes it is cynical. You should stop doing it.

[old salt]

Yes, those accurate, factual assertions are inconvenient to your agenda.
Don't give any credit to former slaves who made their way when freed or to Holocaust survivors.

This is one of the stupidest assertions I've seen in recent history.

"Being a slave taught me to survive after I was a slave." Missing the point of the argument entirely. It's just plain stupid. Like, really, really, really stupid.

How many millions of resourceful, successful, capable people died in slavery and in the holocaust? Such an incredible, insane insult to all the victims.

I agree. The whole discussion is stupid. Former slaves & Holocaust victims were talented, resourceful human beings. To deny that is stupid.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Yes, those accurate, factual assertions are inconvenient to your agenda.
Don't give any credit to former slaves who made their way when freed or to Holocaust survivors.

This is one of the stupidest assertions I've seen in recent history.

"Being a slave taught me to survive after I was a slave." Missing the point of the argument entirely. It's just plain stupid. Like, really, really, really stupid.

How many millions of resourceful, successful, capable people died in slavery and in the holocaust? Such an incredible, insane insult to all the victims.

I agree. The whole discussion is stupid. Former slaves & Holocaust victims were talented, resourceful human beings. To deny that is stupid.

One way to help migrants develop skills that we can all benefit from is through forced labor camps.

[old salt]

Yes, those accurate, factual assertions are inconvenient to your agenda.
Don't give any credit to former slaves who made their way when freed or to Holocaust survivors.

This is one of the stupidest assertions I've seen in recent history.

"Being a slave taught me to survive after I was a slave." Missing the point of the argument entirely. It's just plain stupid. Like, really, really, really stupid.

How many millions of resourceful, successful, capable people died in slavery and in the holocaust? Such an incredible, insane insult to all the victims.

I agree. The whole discussion is stupid. Former slaves & Holocaust victims were talented, resourceful human beings. To deny that is stupid.

One way to help migrants develop skills that we can all benefit from is through forced labor camps.

My experience is that migrants bring skills with them, in addition to their work ethic....but you be you.