THE 2019 Hopkins Lacrosse Fallout Shelter (44, we want more!)

[a fan]

Check your pms

[steel_hop]

Further, this demonstrates something else I've stated. Petro is an awful tournament coach. Hes won one quarterfinal game....

This is a completely ridiculous post. Look at that graphic again. Now look at your glass half empty post again. Notice anything?


As for the Harrison Rabil comment, this is straight out of the "I'm looking for anything I can think of to say something bad about this sports coach" Handbook.

Did you know that Zim never won a Championship without 5 future Hall of Famers on the field?

Know what just occurred to me? You need great players to win Division I championships.

In other shocking news, water is wet. More at 11.

No shock. Continue your defense of a coach whose team has been uncompetitive for a decade. If you want your program to continue to stink be my guest.

I never said championships. I've said Petro has made one FF without a Rabil or Harrison on the team i.e he hasn't won a quarterfinal game without them on the team. The one year he did he almost blew by overcoaching back in 2015.

Lastly, you keep defending coaches but they are the ones that recruit the players.

[a fan]

I never said championships. I've said Petro has made one FF without a Rabil or Harrison on the team i.e he hasn't won a quarterfinal game without them on the team. The one year he did he almost blew by overcoaching back in 2015.

Lastly, you keep defending coaches but they are the ones that recruit the players.

You are taking stubborn to a whole new place.

Here's my point, which escaped you, because you're too busy drawing mustaches on Petro's picture in the Hop media guide to think about what you are saying here.

Yale coach? You know the guy who just won a Championship? He's advanced to the Final Four only once out of six tries. Wow. That's some horrible tournament coaching, right? How does that guy still have a job? And of course, he only won those games because of Reeves. Did you know that Shay has no Final Four appearances without Ben Reeves on the roster?

Desko? Well, it's clear as day he's a terrible tournament coach. He's 1 for 9 chances in that graphic...worse than Petro! Boy, we really need to get a coach who's a proven winner up in Syracuse asap. Do you have any suggestions?

Shall I go on?

[tech37]

Given that Hopkins most likely has to play them 2 weeks in a row (and will know for sure by game time), how do you approach this as a staff?...

Show everything game 1? Use game 1 to prepare for game 2?

I have no idea. Hopkins needs to win both, but, if they can only win one of the two, the second game is the one to have.

Does it really matter? Winning Game 2 against UMd just sets up another shooting gallery for Penn State.

Really? Are you a Hopkins fan?

I would think that if HOP only won one game all season you would want to beat Maryland.

[Big Dog]

Really? Are you a Hopkins fan?

I would think that if HOP only won one game all season you would want to beat Maryland.

Hop grad school, so yeah. Sorry, don't care about no stinkin' Maryland and that butt-ugly trophy. I care much more about qualifying for the ncaa -- should be a birthright for Hopkins LAX -- and playing on Memorial Day. If we can only win one game a season, we should drop to d3.

[ohmilax34]

I never said championships. I've said Petro has made one FF without a Rabil or Harrison on the team i.e he hasn't won a quarterfinal game without them on the team. The one year he did he almost blew by overcoaching back in 2015.

Lastly, you keep defending coaches but they are the ones that recruit the players.

You are taking stubborn to a whole new place.

Here's my point, which escaped you, because you're too busy drawing mustaches on Petro's picture in the Hop media guide to think about what you are saying here.

Yale coach? You know the guy who just won a Championship? He's advanced to the Final Four only once out of six tries. Wow. That's some horrible tournament coaching, right? How does that guy still have a job? And of course, he only won those games because of Reeves. Did you know that Shay has no Final Four appearances without Ben Reeves on the roster?

Desko? Well, it's clear as day he's a terrible tournament coach. He's 1 for 9 chances in that graphic...worse than Petro! Boy, we really need to get a coach who's a proven winner up in Syracuse asap. Do you have any suggestions?

Shall I go on?

a fan, I've agreed with you on this for awhile, but I'm starting to lean the other way. As a Syracuse fan I've re-calibrated my expectations and what I consider to be a successful season. Generally speaking, getting to the NCAA's and winning the first round game is a pretty good season. That puts the team in the top 8. If Johns Hopkins can do that consistently, I think that's pretty darn good. In the last 5 years they've done that 3 times, so that's not bad. Of course, in the games they lost they were blown out of the water, so I can see some of the frustration there.

However, when I watch JHU play, I can't help but think that they would be better off with another coach with some new ideas. There are a few areas where I've thought the team has been deficient for awhile. 1) Playmaking defensemen - Not just starting transition, but picking off passes, causing turnovers on double teams, scooping ground balls. The best player JHU has had in recent memory in these aspects is Matt Bocklet and Petro didn't even recruit him. I thought Pellegrino would be like this, but he really wasn't. 2) Dodging attackmen - finally JHU has more than one attackman who can beat this man. If JHU gets some middies who can play next season, watch out because Epstein and WIlliams are a very good combo. 3) The grey area plays - I'm using a Danowski term to describe the smartly aggressive plays that players make to cause turnovers, generate possessions, like a defender getting a head start on a run out on a shot that misses the cage to get possession. To me it looks like JHU doesn't coach these things.

a fan, would you say that the JHU coaches are doing a good job?

[tech37]

Really? Are you a Hopkins fan?

I would think that if HOP only won one game all season you would want to beat Maryland.

Hop grad school, so yeah. Sorry, don't care about no stinkin' Maryland and that butt-ugly trophy. I care much more about qualifying for the ncaa -- should be a birthright for Hopkins LAX -- and playing on Memorial Day. If we can only win one game a season, we should drop to d3.

My bad I guess...I assumed beating Terps was Holy Grail for HOP fans.

[a fan]

a fan, would you say that the JHU coaches are doing a good job?

In terms of recruiting? No, I don't. They've missed too much to make Final Fours. If they had one hit, on say a Molloy or a Reeves? Totally different results on the field. In this day and age, you can't miss on recruits and expect to make Final Fours.

In terms of having talent that to my eye put them somewhere between 10-20, and playing the toughest schedule year in and year out....I think the staff is doing fine with the players they have. Obstinate Hop fans don't want to even consider that they have a 2nd tier roster.

That's what my eye tells me. I'm not saying I'm right. I'm saying consider that the players just aren't all that good. These posters are just full steam ahead that Petro and Benson can't call x's and o's.

X's and O's don't explain why they don't have a single middie who can beat their man. Or that their attackmen can't fall out of a boat and hit water when it comes to shooting. Or that their goalie can't stop a beach ball on high shots from 10+ yards.

That said, I think it makes perfect sense to replace Petro when his contract is over. What I've been consistent in saying is: maybe they're not the issue when it comes to recruiting.

We'll find out soon enough. I'll be here making wagers with this crew on the new coach's performance if they'll take them.

[HopFan16]

X's and O's don't explain why they don't have a single middie who can beat their man.

If we don't have a single middie who can beat their man then why is every offensive set initiated with middies trying to beat their man? If we don't have a single middie who can beat their man then why do they continue to see the field when there is at least one kid, possibly more, riding the bench who I'm pretty sure can run by his man? This is the offensive strategy right now:

Step 1: Concannon, Baskin, or one of the others isolates against a shortie. Usually bears no fruit. Good for maybe 1-2 goals per game on average.
Step 2: When that doesn't work, pass to Williams and let him dodge through a double team. Good for a couple goals maybe if he's having a good shooting day, otherwise it's a waste of a solid 20-30 seconds of shot clock.
Step 3: Pass to Epstein with 10 seconds left on the shot clock and hope he makes something out of nothing. Works more often than steps 2 and 3.

I don't even know how to sum up the defensive strategy but it would probably look something like this:

Step 1: Let them score
Step 2: See step 1
Step 3: Repeat

One thing I guess I'll never understand is why this team has never played a lick of zone defense. I don't see how it could possibly be much worse than what we're getting right now. They'd probably foul less that way too, and Darby could practice seeing more outside shots.

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

X's and O's don't explain why they don't have a single middie who can beat their man.

If we don't have a single middie who can beat their man then why is every offensive set initiated with middies trying to beat their man? If we don't have a single middie who can beat their man then why do they continue to see the field when there is at least one kid, possibly more, riding the bench who I'm pretty sure can run by his man? This is the offensive strategy right now:

Step 1: Concannon, Baskin, or one of the others isolates against a shortie. Usually bears no fruit. Good for maybe 1-2 goals per game on average.
Step 2: When that doesn't work, pass to Williams and let him dodge through a double team. Good for a couple goals maybe if he's having a good shooting day, otherwise it's a waste of a solid 20-30 seconds of shot clock.
Step 3: Pass to Epstein with 10 seconds left on the shot clock and hope he makes something out of nothing. Works more often than steps 2 and 3.

I don't even know how to sum up the defensive strategy but it would probably look something like this:

Step 1: Let them score
Step 2: See step 1
Step 3: Repeat

One thing I guess I'll never understand is why this team has never played a lick of zone defense. I don't see how it could possibly be much worse than what we're getting right now. They'd probably foul less that way too, and Darby could practice seeing more outside shots.

Chris Boland has the exact same question during the second half of a 2011 game.

Guess which game.

[Peter Brown]

a fan, would you say that the JHU coaches are doing a good job?

In terms of recruiting? No, I don't. They've missed too much to make Final Fours. If they had one hit, on say a Molloy or a Reeves? Totally different results on the field. In this day and age, you can't miss on recruits and expect to make Final Fours.

In terms of having talent that to my eye put them somewhere between 10-20, and playing the toughest schedule year in and year out....I think the staff is doing fine with the players they have. Obstinate Hop fans don't want to even consider that they have a 2nd tier roster.

That's what my eye tells me. I'm not saying I'm right. I'm saying consider that the players just aren't all that good. These posters are just full steam ahead that Petro and Benson can't call x's and o's.

X's and O's don't explain why they don't have a single middie who can beat their man. Or that their attackmen can't fall out of a boat and hit water when it comes to shooting. Or that their goalie can't stop a beach ball on high shots from 10+ yards.

That said, I think it makes perfect sense to replace Petro when his contract is over. What I've been consistent in saying is: maybe they're not the issue when it comes to recruiting.

We'll find out soon enough. I'll be here making wagers with this crew on the new coach's performance if they'll take them.

Had to chime in...

a fan: this team of 'less-gifted' lax players you're referencing beat this season (*among others): UNC, Princeton, + Rutgers (and should have beaten OSU and 'Cuse). That isn't shabby for a team where not a 'single middie can't beat their man' or 'one attackman who can't hit water falling out of a boat'. Carolina, Princeton, and Rutgers must really suck! lol.

Point is, Hopkins has enough talent to be a very good team, certainly much better than their record. The Cuse and OSU losses were because of 4th quarter meltdowns...which happens mostly because....? Coaching and leadership, not lack of talent. When you got a team on the ropes, finish them off. HOP even has a decent FOGO now.

What I think you and Doc Barrister continually overlook is a very known fact in the Bodymore lax 'hood: Petro is not the guy today who has the ability to motivate his squad when they need it most. He's lost the winner's edge, and his players reflect that at the worst times on the field, by tightening up or simply not getting to a GB. His sideline body language is deflating.

His 3 biggest problems:

1. His personality isn't great at this time for this team
2. Petro's a Long Island guy coaching in the Baltimore mecca; there are issues there which I won't get into, but people here know the deal.
3. He has historically been awful at getting freshmen time who need the time, versus freshmen whom he simply decided would play come heck or high water. The game against PSU was a perfect example.

Even Quint indicated he was flabbergasted at Petro on Sunday. When you lose Quint (fellow LI'er and HOP alum)...

[Hawkeye]

Even Quint indicated he was flabbergasted at Petro on Sunday. When you lose Quint (fellow LI'er and HOP alum)...

Quint has been notably anti-Petro for years now... maybe longer, but that's how long I've really noticed it, at least.

[a fan]

a fan: this team of 'less-gifted' lax players you're referencing beat this season (*among others): UNC, Princeton, + Rutgers (and should have beaten OSU and 'Cuse). That isn't shabby for a team where not a 'single middie can't beat their man' or 'one attackman who can't hit water falling out of a boat'. Carolina, Princeton, and Rutgers must really suck! lol.

What I just wrote was, Hop has #10-20 talent. Those teams you just listed are all #10-20. The quality of a team's players is relative, is it not?

Point is, Hopkins has enough talent to be a very good team, certainly much better than their record.

Your opinion. Based on nothing more than your opinion. And that's fine. I might point out that the scoreboard says otherwise.

The Cuse and OSU losses were because of 4th quarter meltdowns...which happens mostly because....?

This has been brought up before, and I have no idea why you and others jump straight to "coaching" as the reason.

The answer is the same in most team sports: depth. Hopkins has no depth, and the kids are tired, while the other team has fresher legs. Totally uncomplicated explanation. I'm a Syracuse fan. Saying that Syracuse has more depth than Hopkins this year is the understatement of all understatements.

What I think you and Doc Barrister continually overlook is a very known fact in the Bodymore lax 'hood: Petro is not the guy today who has the ability to motivate his squad when they need it most. He's lost the winner's edge, and his players reflect that at the worst times on the field, by tightening up or simply not getting to a GB. His sideline body language is deflating.

So is the coach of the team right down my road in Denver. So is the coach of the highly successful Fighting Irish.

[DMac]

a fan wrote
Here's my point, which escaped you, because you're too busy drawing mustaches on Petro's picture in the Hop media guide to think about what you are saying here.

This line deserves some recognition, got a laugh from me. Well done, a fan.

When I was first introduced to LaxPower (I caught the last few years) the discusiion on the Hop thread was much the same as it is now (been a long running soap opera). Maintain the same thoughts today as I said back then, Hop's tradition works for and against them. Pretty safe to say that Hop was the standard for many years, and that's the way you play lacrosse. From this fan's eyes, I've always viewed them as a disciplined, fundamenatally sound, team/program that plays a more conservative game than a Cuse team would. I think most would agree that Cuse has had a reputation of being a more wide open type team, they play a different style than Hop. The tradition there is more "roll the ball out and let 'em play" (Simmons Jr), whereas Hop's is more traditional/predictable lacrosse. I think Desko maintains a bit of that attitude and Petro maintains his Hop tradition mentality. You have to mold your game to your players strengths/capabilities, fitting them into a system/tradition aint gonna cut it. I've always thought Hop needs to play a looser game, coaches need to loosen the reigns on their boys and roll the ball out and let them play.
My 2 cents.....page count keeps rollin, rollin, rollin.

"should be a birthright for Hopkins LAX -- and playing on Memorial Day."
Got some bad news for you, Big Dog, them days is loooong gone.

[DocBarrister]

https://imgur.com/a/vyzkUqz
^ That is for the 2010s, so the last nine seasons. Judge for yourself.

Thanks. That puts into pictures what I've been saying for a long time. The program has been trending poorly for a decade.

Further, this demonstrates something else I've stated. Petro is an awful tournament coach. Hes won one quarterfinal game when Harrison or Rabil aren't on the team.

Hell, I beat you can get a bunch of UVA people to question the 2005 win and blame the lightening on stemming the UVA steam or luck boxing thier way into playing Delaware in the semis in 2007 (which also had a delayed game in the 1st round that allowed Hopkins to rally over ND) that saved them in the finals against Duke.

That is so disrespectful to the great 2005 and 2007 Hopkins teams ... and both teams were indeed GREAT.

The 2005 team beat a Virginia team that was one year away from greatness TWICE. They beat Pressler’s best Duke team TWICE. They beat Syracuse, Princeton, and Maryland for good measure. They had two future Hall of Famers at midfield. The best SSDM in the country. The best defense in the country. The deepest faceoff crew lacrosse has ever seen (FIVE top-notch faceoff men). They had two of the most clutch players in recent memory (Byrne and Schwartzman). They played the toughest schedule in the country and went undefeated. All led by a senior class that DID NOT LOSE A SINGLE GAME AT HOME. Arguably the greatest team of this century.

As for the 2007 team, they were led by a midfield of Rabil, S. Peyser, and Kimmel ... as good or better than any midfield since. They won the national championship by beating four league champions (ACC, ECAC, CAA, and GWLL). Had they played Cornell, they would have beaten them, too. The Band of Brothers recovered from four regular season losses and was the best team in the nation on Memorial Day. The quality of the 2007 team is reflected in the fact that Hopkins reached the final in 2008. The 2007 title was no fluke.

Show some respect. Coach Petro and his young men earned those two national titles.

DocBarrister

Not surprising, you didnt dispute anything I said just spouted your rankings. You can argue whatever you want.

In 2005, UVA was rallying and I think they were in the lead when the lightening delayed the game. Hopkins rallied to win it on Bensons shot.

In 2007, they were behind to ND until another lightening delay allowed them to regroup and Kimmel won the game in overtime. Hopkins did play an unseeded Delaware team in the FF because they upset UVA.

I know facts and you dont get along together but my comment had nothing to do with disrespecting the players but demonstrating Petros complete lack of tournament acumen that, one could argue, was bailed out by the weather.

Let's not even get into the fact Petro was seeded no. 1 in four straight years and only by said grace of weather and Harrison challenging the team over the summer of 2004 did he not get skunked in that time frame.

So spare me your outrage. Take to someone how cares about your histronics.

So, instead of giving Coach Pietramala the credit for leading Johns Hopkins to the NCAA National Championship in 2005 and 2007, you give credit to ...

... THE WEATHER?!?!?





DocBarrister <——— (Macallan 18 running out my nose)

[jersey shore lax]

I have not ready every post on this thread so I apologize if this has been covered. I believe with the formation of the Big 10 league, (initially everybody thought it was a free pass for Hopkins to get an AQ virtually every year), but in reality what the formation of the league did and particularly with JHU joining is it made PSU, OSU, Rutgers and Mich. all recruiting competition for Hopkins when 5 years ago the competition used to be the ACC, ND and a few Ivy's.

The big 10 football schools have a lot to offer a recruit that maybe didn't want to play in the CAA 5 years ago.Now they can go to a PSU, have the big 10 football experience and also be in a league with 4 top 20 teams year in and year out, Mich is the outlier on this but with the new coach they should also be competitive in years to come.

IMHO this is a big part of why Hopkins does not have the depth of other top 5 - 10 talent that used to be an automatic for them - when you are signing 8-10 of the top 100 in a class you only have to be correct half the time to be really good (Ask Duke) . Kids used to de-commit from other schools to go to Hopkins now kids are de-committing from Hopkins.

[HopFan16]

I have not ready every post on this thread so I apologize if this has been covered. I believe with the formation of the Big 10 league, (initially everybody thought it was a free pass for Hopkins to get an AQ virtually every year), but in reality what the formation of the league did and particularly with JHU joining is it made PSU, OSU, Rutgers and Mich. all recruiting competition for Hopkins when 5 years ago the competition used to be the ACC, ND and a few Ivy's.

The big 10 football schools have a lot to offer a recruit that maybe didn't want to play in the CAA 5 years ago.Now they can go to a PSU, have the big 10 football experience and also be in a league with 4 top 20 teams year in and year out, Mich is the outlier on this but with the new coach they should also be competitive in years to come.

IMHO this is a big part of why Hopkins does not have the depth of other top 5 - 10 talent that used to be an automatic for them - when you are signing 8-10 of the top 100 in a class you only have to be correct half the time to be really good (Ask Duke) . Kids used to de-commit from other schools to go to Hopkins now kids are de-committing from Hopkins.

I don't really think Hopkins is losing recruits to OSU or PSU. Different academic stratospheres. Hop's main competition was and remains Duke, UVA, UNC, Notre Dame, and the Ivies. (Case in point: Virtually all of our "big name" recruits who have switched commitments—Shellenberger, Robertson, Westlin, etc.—end up at one of the schools I just mentioned.) Now your point about being big D1 sports schools still stands. Obviously that's something the ACC schools will always have over Hopkins. You can't get a Notre Dame football or Duke basketball experience at Hopkins. Certainly that's a plus in their favor for kids who want that.

[Big Dog]

"should be a birthright for Hopkins LAX -- and playing on Memorial Day."
Got some bad news for you, Big Dog, them days is loooong gone.

Doc tells me that we're coming back, dmac.

All Hail Doc's Columbia Blue eyeglasses!

[DougELax]

Peter Brown wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:50 pm
The Cuse and OSU losses were because of 4th quarter meltdowns...which happens mostly because....?
This has been brought up before, and I have no idea why you and others jump straight to "coaching" as the reason.

The answer is the same in most team sports: depth. Hopkins has no depth, and the kids are tired, while the other team has fresher legs. Totally uncomplicated explanation. I'm a Syracuse fan. Saying that Syracuse has more depth than Hopkins this year is the understatement of all understatements.

Several on this discussion think that there is enough talent (at least as good as what is being used) on the bench to keep all the legs fresh enough. Giving the second FOGO a few runs in the first half would help Prouty have more energy in the second half and it would help Narewski gain experience (didn't Narewski perform pretty well anyway?) Waiting until the last two minutes of blowouts (either way) to use the bench doesn't engage them and doesn't allow that experience growth either. The coaches picked these players - they ought to play them.

[a fan]

You won't get any argument from me on this point.