Sensible Gun Safety

[cradleandshoot]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

I don't say this to make light of the serious problem with illegal weapons but... I wanna know where and how these people are buying ammo. It took me weeks to find shells for my 410. I know if your 16 and try and walk in to a gun shop to buy bullets you ain't getting any.

[Farfromgeneva]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

I don't say this to make light of the serious problem with illegal weapons but... I wanna know where and how these people are buying ammo. It took me weeks to find shells for my 410. I know if your 16 and try and walk in to a gun shop to buy bullets you ain't getting any.

Just watch this 1:30 ish clip. Chris Rock has had the answer to gun control for two decades.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VZrFVtmRXrw

[cradleandshoot]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

And those laws exist because of the “downstate” big city folk he blames for crushing.

I think your referring to the SAFE ACT. You may be right for a change in misinterpreting what I say. The SAFE ACT was a knee jerk cluster f*ck law that caused more confusion than anything else. So explain to me why SOME AR-15 type weapons are bad, some are okay and the Ruger mini 14 is good to go all day long??? If the desired result of the SAFE ACT was to saves lives it was and continues to be a miserable failure concocted by those downstaters you refer to. It is irrelevant to me because no matter what law those downstaters come up with, I will abide buy it.

[Farfromgeneva]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

And those laws exist because of the “downstate” big city folk he blames for crushing.

I think your referring to the SAFE ACT. You may be right for a change in misinterpreting what I say. The SAFE ACT was a knee jerk cluster f*ck law that caused more confusion than anything else. So explain to me why SOME AR-15 type weapons are bad, some are okay and the Ruger mini 14 is good to go all day long??? If the desired result of the SAFE ACT was to saves lives it was and continues to be a miserable failure concocted by those downstaters you refer to. It is irrelevant to me because no matter what law those downstaters come up with, I will abide buy it. I can't say as much for those hillbillies that live around Binghamton.

If you feel misinterpreted often the responsibility isn’t always on the other side…non responses like this and rants may have something to do with how you feel.

Two sides of mouth again. Rochester is horrible crime ridden area but Binghamton is potentially more criminal? And you stand above all else yet are so angry and feel so cheated by so many folks. When does your sainthood get instituted on this planet?

Funny you call Binghamton hillbillies since I haven’t lived there in 20+ years but rather inside three of the largest cities on the east coast…maybe you should step out of your comfort zone occasionally and learn something.

[cradleandshoot]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

And those laws exist because of the “downstate” big city folk he blames for crushing.

I think your referring to the SAFE ACT. You may be right for a change in misinterpreting what I say. The SAFE ACT was a knee jerk cluster f*ck law that caused more confusion than anything else. So explain to me why SOME AR-15 type weapons are bad, some are okay and the Ruger mini 14 is good to go all day long??? If the desired result of the SAFE ACT was to saves lives it was and continues to be a miserable failure concocted by those downstaters you refer to. It is irrelevant to me because no matter what law those downstaters come up with, I will abide buy it. I can't say as much for those hillbillies that live around Binghamton.

If you feel misinterpreted often the responsibility isn’t always on the other side…non responses like this and rants may have something to do with how you feel.

Two sides of mouth again. Rochester is horrible crime ridden area but Binghamton is potentially more criminal? And you stand above all else yet are so angry and feel so cheated by so many folks. When does your sainthood get instituted on this planet?

Funny you call Binghamton hillbillies since I haven’t lived there in 20+ years but rather inside three of the largest cities on the east coast…maybe you should step out of your comfort zone occasionally and learn something.

I was making a joke. With all your education and knowledge I thought you might have figured it out. I guess I overestimated your thought process yet again.

[Farfromgeneva]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

And those laws exist because of the “downstate” big city folk he blames for crushing.

I think your referring to the SAFE ACT. You may be right for a change in misinterpreting what I say. The SAFE ACT was a knee jerk cluster f*ck law that caused more confusion than anything else. So explain to me why SOME AR-15 type weapons are bad, some are okay and the Ruger mini 14 is good to go all day long??? If the desired result of the SAFE ACT was to saves lives it was and continues to be a miserable failure concocted by those downstaters you refer to. It is irrelevant to me because no matter what law those downstaters come up with, I will abide buy it. I can't say as much for those hillbillies that live around Binghamton.

If you feel misinterpreted often the responsibility isn’t always on the other side…non responses like this and rants may have something to do with how you feel.

Two sides of mouth again. Rochester is horrible crime ridden area but Binghamton is potentially more criminal? And you stand above all else yet are so angry and feel so cheated by so many folks. When does your sainthood get instituted on this planet?

Funny you call Binghamton hillbillies since I haven’t lived there in 20+ years but rather inside three of the largest cities on the east coast…maybe you should step out of your comfort zone occasionally and learn something.

I was making a joke. With all your education and knowledge I thought you might have figured it out. I guess I overestimated your thought process yet again.

Oh Binghamton sucks. No doubt about that despite what my friends who remain there try to sell me.

There’s some bucolic parts of CNY/WNY, even in Section IV territory, I love and miss and have memories. But my upstate N.Y. pride seems to disappear once I cross back over those borders for me the last 15+ years. I.e. all the scumbaggery I grew up with is cool and funny then I get back there and remember all the depressing aspects of it and why most my friends who had any choices in life got away.

[MDlaxfan76]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

I don't say this to make light of the serious problem with illegal weapons but... I wanna know where and how these people are buying ammo. It took me weeks to find shells for my 410. I know if your 16 and try and walk in to a gun shop to buy bullets you ain't getting any.

https://www.silencercentral.com/blog/ev ... -for-2022/

[cradleandshoot]

Back to equating gun ownership with murder.

Here are few inconvenient facts:

US gun ownership per capita: #1 in the world (and over 2x that of the second place country)

US Murder rate per capita: #89 in the world in the low single digits per 100,000 as compared to the worst 10 that average over 45)

Interestingly enough not one of the top ten per-capita gun owning countries shows up in the top ten per-capita murder rate list!

Gee, maybe it isn't the guns!?

edit to add this link (which you can match up to TLD's link) https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/mur ... untry.html

Yup, there are worse places in the world...but we're multiples worse than all other peer developed economically countries...as I stated in my post above with specifics. And, yes, it's the guns, not the poverty that's the difference.

Be glad you ain't in some of those worst places.

I have to make an observation on your comments in red above. I don't think any gun shop owner with a lick of common sense not dulled by greed is going to sell a weapon outside the guidelines prescribed by their FFL. You want to risk your livelihood by selling weapons out the back door at midnight is something only an idiot would do. Those weapons have serial numbers that point back directly to you. If one of these weapons is used in a crime and is traced back to your shop.. your done, kiss your FFL goodbye. I'm sure that some dealers will take the chance. The risk is just not worth the benefit. When I purchased my 410 it was shipped to a store near my house that specializes in police gear. I went to pick it up, the owner made sure I filled out all the paper work correctly and then he called the FBI people who do back ground checks over the phone. For what it is worth the serial number on my shotgun goes right back to his store. I'm fairly certain if a weapon can be traced back to your shop and you don't have the proper paperwork for the transaction your in deep doo doo. It reminds me of so many of those corner bodegas that sell cases of beer out their back door at 3am. I guess greed can over rule common sense for many store owners. It is no secret that people who possess illegal weapons tick me off to end. IMO law enforcement should leave no stone unturned to trace these weapons back to where they came from and who sold them. I do know if the transaction involves the weapon crossing state lines that is a green light for the feds and the BATF to investigate and charge people with a crime on the federal level. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

you live in a state with strong gun laws, and serious enforcement.

I specifically was discussing how easy it is to get guns in regions where that's not the case, including the gun dealers who are quite willing to deal black market as well as the front of store legit business.

But don't need to go to them at the store, the gun shows are easy peasy to buy as many weapons as you like.

And gotta remember, when there's a buck to be made, people will find ways to make it...and where the gun culture doesn't give a cr-p about guns moving around, that's where the hustlers making a buck go to acquire the weapons to take back to the regions where it's 'harder'. That's why there are so many guns in Rochester...a lot of demand to protect those street corners, to be as armed as the next cat.

I don't say this to make light of the serious problem with illegal weapons but... I wanna know where and how these people are buying ammo. It took me weeks to find shells for my 410. I know if your 16 and try and walk in to a gun shop to buy bullets you ain't getting any.

https://www.silencercentral.com/blog/ev ... -for-2022/

Thank you for that link MD. I did notice in my travels looking for 410 shells that there was one shotgun shell available in large #s. 12 gauge rifled slugs, favorite of many deer hunters were readily available. I found the 410 shells I was looking for on line. I've have never fired my shotgun. I purchased it knowing my wife could use it in a pinch. She is scared to death of the weapon or any weapon for that matter. I hope I never need the weapon. I have it only as a last line of defense in the unlikely event someone breaks into our house. My wife asked me why I don't keep it loaded. I told her I would never keep a loaded weapon in the house. If it ever comes to it, I can load it very quickly. I talked to my oldest son the other day. He is going to happily take my M1 Carbine off of my my hands. I told him why I had it in the first place. He is a federal law enforcement agent who owns a bunch of weapons. He can keep it in his collection. I have always been a hardcore 2nd amendment supporter and I still am. I don't think that enough owners of 5.56 weapons understand that outside of a rifle range designed for safely firing these weapons that they are NOT the right weapon for home defense. I think that many of them have no idea what the term maximum effective range means. The maximum effective range of a 5.56 weapon is 300 meters. That is more than 3 football fields. If you miss the bad guy you have no idea where that round is going. The wrong weapon for the job if you ask me. I understand the fascination many people have with these rifles. I have put more 5.56 rounds downrange than most of them will in a lifetime. I qualified expert on the M16 rifle. The hardest shot ever is firing at a silhouette target at 250 meters with iron sites. The target looks like the very tip of your pinky finger. That was why so much time was spent on us young soldiers to zero your weapon. That is why we could hit a target at 250 meters away. If anybody has ever tried to hit a target at that range you understand how difficult it is with iron sites. That skill in shooting is long gone. With laser sites today you just look for the red dot and fire away.

[Seacoaster(1)]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

[MDlaxfan76]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

[PizzaSnake]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

[MDlaxfan76]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

[Typical Lax Dad]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I read recently here that guns are not a problem in this country.

[Seacoaster(1)]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

[cradleandshoot]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

Does his " permitless carry " proposal mean no background checks?? I'm not sure what the nuts and bolts of what the governor wants do and not do to restrict gun ownership. No one is looking at the other side of the pendulum in NYS. Gov. Hochul is complying with the recent SCOTUS decision by doing and end run around the decision. In NYS you have the right to concealed carry. You just can't carry a concealed weapon pretty much anywhere. There is an interesting FLP manufactured phrase that Gov. Hochul used.... SENSITIVE LOCATIONS are off limits to concealed carry. Okay then how does Gov. Hochul grant herself the power to determine what these SENSITIVE LOCATIONS are? This is the kind of stuff lawyers really love. No matter what side of the argument you are on..... BILLABLE HOURS BABY. The lawsuits are already piling up. I just read an article about the gun laws in California. They are without a doubt the strictest in the land. California should be Shangri La by now. What went wrong on the road to Nirvana??? Maybe the folks that live in San Francisco can answer that one? This is like the FLP version of the old shell game. Look at Florida, don't look at our states.

[MDlaxfan76]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

yes, that's the motivation of 'worst of the worst ideas'.

[cradleandshoot]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

yes, that's the motivation of 'worst of the worst ideas'.

Isn't that the exact same motivation NYS Gov Hochul is using??? They are on different ends of the spectrum mind you but the objective is the same. One Governor wants no handgun restrictions. The other governor wants to ignore the rights of those with concealed carry permits who have jumped through every hurdle put in front of them.

[MDlaxfan76]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

yes, that's the motivation of 'worst of the worst ideas'.

Isn't that the exact same motivation NYS Gov Hochul is using??? They are on different ends of the spectrum mind you but the objective is the same. One Governor wants no handgun restrictions. The other governor wants to ignore the rights of those with concealed carry permits who have jumped through every hurdle put in front of them.

I don't think you are characterizing Hochul's objectives the way I would.

I know you are understandably concerned about criminals carrying guns, people with bad intentions carrying guns, and understand that they would want to "conceal" that until they use them...right?

And that you are concerned about public safety in general, right?

Would you not agree that there are places, especially places with high density, that are particularly vulnerable targets for a mass attack? So, where "public safety" is at highest risk?

grocery stores, places of worship, stadiums, schools, airports...or are potential political targets, eg government buildings?

Are these not places where citizens would be understandably alarmed to see someone surreptitiously carrying a gun, not knowing whether it was a permitted concealed carry or someone with bad intent?

Is this really an intent by Hochul to restrict "rights" or this just an emphasis on maintaining public safety in vulnerable spaces?

I think the latter.

I don't think she's trying to pander to a base primary voter, I think she's just trying to combat rampant gun violence. Are there better things to do? Open to debate. But I think that's her intent, well within her responsibility as Governor to maintain public safety.

I think DeSantis' eyes are not on public safety nor "rights" but rather on a national primary voting base which is demanding demonstrations of extremism. The uglier the better in the eyes of these extremists.

In contrast, Hochul does not appear to have national ambitions, nor does she appear to be worried about the primary base of her party as an incumbent.

[cradleandshoot]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

yes, that's the motivation of 'worst of the worst ideas'.

Isn't that the exact same motivation NYS Gov Hochul is using??? They are on different ends of the spectrum mind you but the objective is the same. One Governor wants no handgun restrictions. The other governor wants to ignore the rights of those with concealed carry permits who have jumped through every hurdle put in front of them.

I don't think you are characterizing Hochul's objectives the way I would.

I know you are understandably concerned about criminals carrying guns, people with bad intentions carrying guns, and understand that they would want to "conceal" that until they use them...right?

And that you are concerned about public safety in general, right?

Would you not agree that there are places, especially places with high density, that are particularly vulnerable targets for a mass attack? So, where "public safety" is at highest risk?

grocery stores, places of worship, stadiums, schools, airports...or are potential political targets, eg government buildings?

Are these not places where citizens would be understandably alarmed to see someone surreptitiously carrying a gun, not knowing whether it was a permitted concealed carry or someone with bad intent?

Is this really an intent by Hochul to restrict "rights" or this just an emphasis on maintaining public safety in vulnerable spaces?

I think the latter.

I don't think she's trying to pander to a base primary voter, I think she's just trying to combat rampant gun violence. Are there better things to do? Open to debate. But I think that's her intent, well within her responsibility as Governor to maintain public safety.

I think DeSantis' eyes are not on public safety nor "rights" but rather on a national primary voting base which is demanding demonstrations of extremism. The uglier the better in the eyes of these extremists.

In contrast, Hochul does not appear to have national ambitions, nor does she appear to be worried about the primary base of her party as an incumbent.

Then what is the point in jumping through all the hoops to get a concealed carry permit?? With all do respect your feeding me a huge line of bullchit. All of the places Gov Hochul names as " sensitive locations" surprisingly happen to be the same places the bad guys with guns show up to shoot people. Isn't the entire god damn point for carrying a concealed weapon ... WITH A PERMIT is to defend yourself if you happen to be in one of those "sensitive locations" where the bad guy/gal with a gun knows you can't bring your legally obtained and understands being a law abiding citizen you will respect the law. What the eff is the point MD??? You jump through all of the hoops so you won't be a defenseless victim. You now are advocating screw your concealed carry permit... WELL THEN... WHY ARE YOU JUMPING THROUGH ALL OF THE HOOPS in the first place. Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

My advice to ANYONE with a concealed carry permit... Screw the Gov. Hochuls of the world. Carry your handgun wherever you go. Let the 12 judge you before the 6 carry you to your grave. It ain't like the MDs of the world will shed a tear for you.

[MDlaxfan76]

What could go wrong? Another reason to avoid Florida:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/politic ... story.html

“Calling the right to bear arms “central to our freedom,” House Speaker Paul Renner on Monday unveiled a bill removing Florida requirements for a permit and training to carry concealed guns, an idea endorsed by Gov. Ron DeSantis.

“Florida led the nation in concealed carry,” said Renner, surrounded by the bill’s House and Senate sponsors and Florida sheriffs, and now it is time for the state to remove that “government permission slip to carry.”

The legislation, which supporters call “constitutional carry,” would eliminate the need to get a license to carry a concealed weapon as well as the required weapons training that goes with it. If signed into law, as expected, Florida would become the 26th state to allow permitless carry.

Newly reelected by a landslide to a second term, DeSantis has said he wants to see permitless carry the law of Florida before he leaves office.“

The stupidity knows no bounds...

But will this include concealed carry be allowed everywhere, including, say, courts and legislative assemblies? How about in front of the governor's residence? Oh, and how about on Federal installations? That could be fun. Or say, felons?

I have a bad feeling about things as the insanity rises. And to be fair, it's everywhere, although some areas (FL) seem to be particularly afflicted.

It truly is weird.

It's as if there's this race to the bottom of the barrel, the worst of the worst ideas.

I think the only lesson here is that Desantis is advocating legislation that appeals to a base for a future primary. There is nothing quite like permitless carry to burnish that Second Amendment resume for the ardent crazies who effectively run the GOP primaries. This is about politics, not public safety.

yes, that's the motivation of 'worst of the worst ideas'.

Isn't that the exact same motivation NYS Gov Hochul is using??? They are on different ends of the spectrum mind you but the objective is the same. One Governor wants no handgun restrictions. The other governor wants to ignore the rights of those with concealed carry permits who have jumped through every hurdle put in front of them.

I don't think you are characterizing Hochul's objectives the way I would.

I know you are understandably concerned about criminals carrying guns, people with bad intentions carrying guns, and understand that they would want to "conceal" that until they use them...right?

And that you are concerned about public safety in general, right?

Would you not agree that there are places, especially places with high density, that are particularly vulnerable targets for a mass attack? So, where "public safety" is at highest risk?

grocery stores, places of worship, stadiums, schools, airports...or are potential political targets, eg government buildings?

Are these not places where citizens would be understandably alarmed to see someone surreptitiously carrying a gun, not knowing whether it was a permitted concealed carry or someone with bad intent?

Is this really an intent by Hochul to restrict "rights" or this just an emphasis on maintaining public safety in vulnerable spaces?

I think the latter.

I don't think she's trying to pander to a base primary voter, I think she's just trying to combat rampant gun violence. Are there better things to do? Open to debate. But I think that's her intent, well within her responsibility as Governor to maintain public safety.

I think DeSantis' eyes are not on public safety nor "rights" but rather on a national primary voting base which is demanding demonstrations of extremism. The uglier the better in the eyes of these extremists.

In contrast, Hochul does not appear to have national ambitions, nor does she appear to be worried about the primary base of her party as an incumbent.

Then what is the point in jumping through all the hoops to get a concealed carry permit?? With all do respect your feeding me a huge line of bullchit. All of the places Gov Hochul names as " sensitive locations" surprisingly happen to be the same places the bad guys with guns show up to shoot people. Isn't the entire god damn point for carrying a concealed weapon ... WITH A PERMIT is to defend yourself if you happen to be in one of those "sensitive locations" where the bad guy/gal with a gun knows you can't bring your legally obtained and understands being a law abiding citizen you will respect the law. What the eff is the point MD??? You jump through all of the hoops so you won't be a defenseless victim. You now are advocating screw your concealed carry permit... WELL THEN... WHY ARE YOU JUMPING THROUGH ALL OF THE HOOPS in the first place. Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

Ohh, I understand why someone could want to carry a concealed weapon, lawfully, any place they want...but as a fellow citizen I darn well don't want them to do so. I want only law enforcement carrying weapons in those places. I want trained, managed, law enforcement to handle it, not some wannabe.

I want it to be automatically illegal to have a weapon in those places, not a question mark as to whether the 'carry' was going to be lawful, no improper usage....or something else.

Got a gun in those situations, you've committed a crime. It's an additional crime if the gun is illegally held as well.

Frankly, I don't have much truck with the notion that everyone should be able to carry a gun, wherever, whenever... 'cause it's in the Constitution, man'. I think there's reasonable times and places for gun usage and storage, and I've outlined those views numerous times. My views, IMO, are entirely consistent with both the words and the actual intent of the 2nd Amendment.

Now, if the 'carry permit' process is indeed super rigorous, only for those with truly legitimate need and purpose, with plenty of analysis of mental status on an ongoing basis, one could at least make an argument for less restriction on where and when...but that just ain't the case, even in NY. Too easy.

Better to just say, no, there are places where you can't 'carry'. That's for law enforcement.