Johns Hopkins 2023

[molo]

Like most of us, I have no personal knowledge about the hazing and certainly don’t have any reason to believe it was life threatening. I do think, however, that hazing of any sort reflects at least a hidebound mentality and at worst a potential danger. It’s indefensible. Defenders might say it builds team unity. I can recall going to games where you could tell the freshmen during the national anthem because their hair had not yet grown out. I haven’t noticed this recently, but failure to humiliate the “rats” doesn’t seem to have ruined esprit de corps.

[DocBarrister]

Like most of us, I have no personal knowledge about the hazing and certainly don’t have any reason to believe it was life threatening. I do think, however, that hazing of any sort reflects at least a hidebound mentality and at worst a potential danger. It’s indefensible. Defenders might say it builds team unity. I can recall going to games where you could tell the freshmen during the national anthem because their hair had not yet grown out. I haven’t noticed this recently, but failure to humiliate the “rats” doesn’t seem to have ruined esprit de corps.

I agree.

Hazing is absolutely inexcusable in this day and age.

It was already considered a serious issue in 2013.

In 2022 … I would consider it a firing offense, even if the coach never condoned such acts and even if no one got injured. Today, coaches need to make it clear to players that hazing is completely impermissible. If a coach fails to make that message stick, they should be replaced by someone who can.

That’s not even a personal opinion. Increasingly, that’s the position of university general counsel and insurers … and what they say goes.

https://www.wkyc.com/amp/article/news/l ... d894352172

DocBarrister

[primitiveskills]

Is it February yet?

[OCanada]

While i agree with no hazing as policy i would not have that opinion back then but times change. The comments about life threatening or danger etc are way out of bounds re rhe incident which was part of a tradition stretching back to at least the 1950s. The student involved had a great time that evening, His dad knew what was going snd one complaint was lodged by the mom. That is the sum total of complaints i am aware of over its history. Scolds with no knowledge building strawmen. The reaction by some have been way out of proportion. Militaries and societies around the globe use hazing/rite of passage. Hopkins fraternities were known for the hazing they used. The two ate not in the same universe

Rites of passage have been cultural benchmark for millenia to become full members in a society or sub-set of a society.

[MDlaxfan76]

While i agree with no hazing as policy the comments about life threatening or danger etc are way out of bounds re rhe incident which was part of a tradition stretching back to at least the 1950s. The student involved had a great time that evening, his dad knew what was going snd one complaint was lodged by the mom. That is the sum total of complaints i am aware of over its history. Scolds with no knowledge building strawmen.

As whatever practice/tradition is presumably forbidden now, and not continuing, how about telling us exactly what the practice was that you are referring to?

I'm an old guy, went through hazing for my fraternity, so I doubt anything you describe will shock me. My sports teams didn't haze, but the frat hazing was certainly "creative".

Don't sugar coat it, tell us exactly...including whatever you think would be most objectionable to, say, "mom".

[OCanada]

The shock to your system would be how innocuous the whole thing was in my view. I wouldn’t want to stress your mental health with that kind of shock.

It has been interesting how absurd narratives gain traction here and no one questions them. Believe whatever you like. Your choice.

Were you the poster who said you talked with a number of coaches at one point. I asked who they were. You declined to say who they were.

[HopFan16]

Why are we still talking about something that happened a decade ago? Who cares

Quint gives shoutouts to Mazzone, Smith, Degnon, and Narewski in these columns:
https://laxallstars.com/snubs-from-the- ... -for-2023/
https://laxallstars.com/2023-college-la ... r-players/

The team lacks a Tewaaraton level offensive playmaker (unless Melendez surprises in a major, major way) but it feels like the overall depth of talent on the roster is better than it's been in awhile with a good mix of returning players, transfers, and freshmen. Two big question marks remain as we head into 2023: 1) goalie play 2) does the offense improve in a meaningful way under Crawley and with a couple new toys to play with. Health is always the great unknown but on paper, faceoffs and defense should be serviceable if not better. In this era of lacrosse however you've got to be able to score goals.

[1766]

Agreed; nice locker rooms, fancy weight rooms, etc, girls waving pom moms...they impress the sophomore in HS, less so the serious student-athlete as he matures (ok, geneva, the pom moms can still impress).

That said, it's good to know that the school pays attention to your program, is supportive of the time you need in the weight room, with the trainers, on the field, working with your academic schedule. But it's not the flash paid for by the football program that tells you that. It's the sweat you see coming off the guys training, the attention you see from staff, etc...

The factors that do matter to the serious student-athlete are far, far more about the guys he's going to be playing with, the coaches who are going to be mentoring and guiding him, the sense of the dynamic of the program being on the rise or already an elite competitor...and the off-field opportunities to grow, learn, have fun.

Have you seen the girls of the SEC?

Then there’s Rutgers

https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2019/ ... ontent=amp

Girls at Rutgers are smoking. Compared to Hopkins and Hobart and Mary or whatever that 13th grade school is called? Otherworldly.

I hope that at least made you laugh! My wife did her post doc at Rutgers so I have a fondness for the school.

It fell a little flat tbh. I'd have more respect for the post if an actual alum of the school was used. Like Becky Quick or Natalie Morales. Natalie Morales is pretty hot though.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Agreed; nice locker rooms, fancy weight rooms, etc, girls waving pom moms...they impress the sophomore in HS, less so the serious student-athlete as he matures (ok, geneva, the pom moms can still impress).

That said, it's good to know that the school pays attention to your program, is supportive of the time you need in the weight room, with the trainers, on the field, working with your academic schedule. But it's not the flash paid for by the football program that tells you that. It's the sweat you see coming off the guys training, the attention you see from staff, etc...

The factors that do matter to the serious student-athlete are far, far more about the guys he's going to be playing with, the coaches who are going to be mentoring and guiding him, the sense of the dynamic of the program being on the rise or already an elite competitor...and the off-field opportunities to grow, learn, have fun.

Have you seen the girls of the SEC?

Then there’s Rutgers

https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2019/ ... ontent=amp

Girls at Rutgers are smoking. Compared to Hopkins and Hobart and Mary or whatever that 13th grade school is called? Otherworldly.

I hope that at least made you laugh! My wife did her post doc at Rutgers so I have a fondness for the school.

It fell a little flat tbh. I'd have more respect for the post if an actual alum of the school was used. Like Becky Quick or Natalie Morales. Natalie Morales is pretty hot though.

I wasn’t expecting Snookie! If you think about or if I do the same, I will try to see you at the game this year. Will try to connect ahead of time.

[1766]

Agreed; nice locker rooms, fancy weight rooms, etc, girls waving pom moms...they impress the sophomore in HS, less so the serious student-athlete as he matures (ok, geneva, the pom moms can still impress).

That said, it's good to know that the school pays attention to your program, is supportive of the time you need in the weight room, with the trainers, on the field, working with your academic schedule. But it's not the flash paid for by the football program that tells you that. It's the sweat you see coming off the guys training, the attention you see from staff, etc...

The factors that do matter to the serious student-athlete are far, far more about the guys he's going to be playing with, the coaches who are going to be mentoring and guiding him, the sense of the dynamic of the program being on the rise or already an elite competitor...and the off-field opportunities to grow, learn, have fun.

Have you seen the girls of the SEC?

Then there’s Rutgers

https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2019/ ... ontent=amp

Girls at Rutgers are smoking. Compared to Hopkins and Hobart and Mary or whatever that 13th grade school is called? Otherworldly.

I hope that at least made you laugh! My wife did her post doc at Rutgers so I have a fondness for the school.

It fell a little flat tbh. I'd have more respect for the post if an actual alum of the school was used. Like Becky Quick or Natalie Morales. Natalie Morales is pretty hot though.

I wasn’t expecting Snookie! If you think about or if I do the same, I will try to see you at the game this year. Will try to connect ahead of time.

Sounds good.

[MDlaxfan76]

The shock to your system would be how innocuous the whole thing was in my view. I wouldn’t want to stress your mental health with that kind of shock.

It has been interesting how absurd narratives gain traction here and no one questions them. Believe whatever you like. Your choice.

Were you the poster who said you talked with a number of coaches at one point. I asked who they were. You declined to say who they were.

Yes, I said multiple DIII coaches. I told, to the best of my recollection, how they were concerned about the increasing pressure on academic #'s in their recruiting process...they already had pretty darn outstanding #'s for their teams, but were feeling the pressure in getting others. Frankly, I don't recall anyone's name other than my host, who is the winningest coach in Hopkins history if I have that correct. Family friend. The others I was meeting for the first time. This is about a decade ago, so I have no idea if they're even at Hopkins still. I don't think I declined" anything.

Seriously, what was the hazing tradition/practice exactly?
It's not as if it's still going on, right?

I'm fine with describing (if you'd like) what my fraternity at Dartmouth put us through, some quite creative, some actually dangerous in retrospect, though I don't recall anyone ever complaining, nor seriously hurt...it ain't a big secret, though that's part of the whole scenario.

From your comments, I'd be surprised if the hazing with the Hop lax team was worse than my frat's...so, be specific, please.

[MDlaxfan76]

Why are we still talking about something that happened a decade ago? Who cares

Quint gives shoutouts to Mazzone, Smith, Degnon, and Narewski in these columns:
https://laxallstars.com/snubs-from-the- ... -for-2023/
https://laxallstars.com/2023-college-la ... r-players/

The team lacks a Tewaaraton level offensive playmaker (unless Melendez surprises in a major, major way) but it feels like the overall depth of talent on the roster is better than it's been in awhile with a good mix of returning players, transfers, and freshmen. Two big question marks remain as we head into 2023: 1) goalie play 2) does the offense improve in a meaningful way under Crawley and with a couple new toys to play with. Health is always the great unknown but on paper, faceoffs and defense should be serviceable if not better. In this era of lacrosse however you've got to be able to score goals.

It's December ...I'd really like to know what caused the hullabaloo (don't need/want individual's names) and why some think the penalties applied were too much or too little. Do they still think so in retrospect? And I think understanding what this 'tradition' was exactly would provide us with better context...I understood keeping this stuff close to the vest in real time, but nearly all of the participants involved have grown up, moved on, etc...but there's obviously ongoing ill will from some alums towards the President...so, still an 'alive' topic...at least for December!

yes, because it's now a decade ago, totally new set of players and coaches, it doesn't reflect on anything re the program today.

It's important to differentiate.

[flalax22]

Check in on the forum for the first time today and we are back to a naked freshman from 10 years ago singing a song and a mortified mom that felt the need to file a complaint.

I’m caught up. See you all tomorrow.

[wgdsr]

Check in on the forum for the first time today and we are back to a naked freshman from 10 years ago singing a song and a mortified mom that felt the need to file a complaint.

I’m caught up. See you all tomorrow.

thanks, flalax. it's been killing us.

[10stone5]

That’s a winner right there.
Keep ‘em coming.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Check in on the forum for the first time today and we are back to a naked freshman from 10 years ago singing a song and a mortified mom that felt the need to file a complaint.

I’m caught up. See you all tomorrow.

thanks, flalax. it's been killing us.

Anyone know how many instances before that the coach had to straighten out? Would be shocked if the very first hazing incident was met with the possibility of canceling the season. This could have be the result of “if I hear anything else, someone is paying a heavy price” type thing. But anything is possible.

[wgdsr]

Check in on the forum for the first time today and we are back to a naked freshman from 10 years ago singing a song and a mortified mom that felt the need to file a complaint.

I’m caught up. See you all tomorrow.

thanks, flalax. it's been killing us.

Anyone know how many instances before that the coach had to straighten out? Would be shocked if the very first hazing incident was met with the possibility of canceling the season. This could have be the result of “if I hear anything else, someone is paying a heavy price” type thing. But anything is possible.

years ago, they used to force the players listen to a ragamuffin band of old timers celebrate every goal with an off key rendition. when they found out they were no longer needed, they disbanded.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Check in on the forum for the first time today and we are back to a naked freshman from 10 years ago singing a song and a mortified mom that felt the need to file a complaint.

I’m caught up. See you all tomorrow.

thanks, flalax. it's been killing us.

Anyone know how many instances before that the coach had to straighten out? Would be shocked if the very first hazing incident was met with the possibility of canceling the season. This could have be the result of “if I hear anything else, someone is paying a heavy price” type thing. But anything is possible.

years ago, they used to force the players listen to a ragamuffin band of old timers celebrate every goal with an off key rendition. when they found out they were no longer needed, they disbanded.

[MDlaxfan76]

Check in on the forum for the first time today and we are back to a naked freshman from 10 years ago singing a song and a mortified mom that felt the need to file a complaint.

I’m caught up. See you all tomorrow.

thanks, flalax. it's been killing us.

Anyone know how many instances before that the coach had to straighten out? Would be shocked if the very first hazing incident was met with the possibility of canceling the season. This could have be the result of “if I hear anything else, someone is paying a heavy price” type thing. But anything is possible.

years ago, they used to force the players listen to a ragamuffin band of old timers celebrate every goal with an off key rendition. when they found out they were no longer needed, they disbanded.

I miss the cannon, though.

Irritating as heck to opponents, but quite the tradition. Then that darn chant.

Cornell had an issue with their lax team and hazing about the same time as Hop, I think.
Following September.

I had no idea what the issue was for the hazing; if no alcohol, sounds like merely embarrassment; really, no alcohol?...of course, if the word had already come down that no hazing would be tolerated, not sure what choice there would be but to come down hard on it. If Coach had been clear, Admin had been clear to Coach...

It was about then that there was a big awakening nationally about how badly hazing could go wrong...something that had been brushed under the rug by colleges for years...

Naked is a bit weird, right? singing a silly song is typical...we had to sing/act 'tea pot' at the base of the frat stairs after announcing our maggot selves...dumb, but probably the least of the stuff. The most creative was making us think we had to memorize the history of the national fraternity from a book on the topic, and then take a test to be admitted...administered by very serious fellow from national, except that it was actually a local alum playing the role...the "Brew" was disgusting, brother's feet in the mix...puke.....typical frat stuff...in retrospect the pressured heavy drinking was dangerous...I thought the whole process was pretty ridiculous, but expected.

None of my teams expected that kind of nonsense...I don't think hazing actually creates any kind of esprit d'coeur, brotherhood, etc that working hard together toward a common objective doesn't do better...

[Sagittarius A*]

2023 team

Strengths:

Faceoffs
Defense

Weaknesses:

Clearing
Offense - I honestly don't know who's going to score for this team. The only proven goal scorer we've got is Degnon. If Defenses shut him off, not sure where the goals are coming from. This could negate any advantages we have at the X.

Questions

Who starts in goal?
Will Narewski be healthy and stay healthy?