All Things Russia & Ukraine

[old salt]

from behind the WP paywall for non-subscribers.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... otiations/

U.S. privately asks Ukraine to show it’s open to negotiate with Russia

The encouragement is aimed not at pushing Ukraine to the negotiating table, but ensuring it maintains a moral high ground in the eyes of its international backers

President Volodymyr Zelensky’s refusal to talk with Russia's leader, Vladimir Putin, has fueled concern in parts of Europe, Africa and Latin America, where the war’s disruptive effects have been severe.

The Biden administration is privately encouraging Ukraine’s leaders to signal an openness to negotiate with Russia and drop their public refusal to engage in peace talks unless President Vladimir Putin is removed from power, according to people familiar with the discussions.

The request by American officials is not aimed at pushing Ukraine to the negotiating table, these people said. Rather, they called it a calculated attempt to ensure the government in Kyiv maintains the support of other nations facing constituencies wary of fueling a war for many years to come.

The discussions illustrate how complex the Biden administration’s position on Ukraine has become, as U.S. officials publicly vow to support Kyiv with massive sums of aid “for as long as it takes” while hoping for a resolution to the conflict that over the past eight months has taken a punishing toll on the world economy and triggered fears of nuclear war.

While U.S. officials share their Ukrainian counterparts’ assessment that Putin, for now, isn’t serious about negotiations, they acknowledge that President Volodymyr Zelensky’s ban on talks with him has generated concern in parts of Europe, Africa and Latin America, where the war’s disruptive effects on the availability and cost of food and fuel are felt most sharply.

“Ukraine fatigue is a real thing for some of our partners,” said one U.S. official who, like others interviewed for this report, spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive conversations between Washington and Kyiv.

Serhiy Nikiforov, a spokesman for Zelensky, did not respond to a request for comment.

In the United States, polls show eroding support among Republicans for continuing to finance Ukraine’s military at current levels, suggesting the White House may face resistance following Tuesday’s midterm elections as it seeks to continue a security assistance program that has delivered Ukraine the largest such annual sum since the end of the Cold War.

In a trip to Kyiv on Friday, White House national security adviser Jake Sullivan said the United States supported a just and lasting peace for Ukraine and said U.S. support would continue regardless of domestic politics. “We fully intend to ensure that the resources are there as necessary and that we’ll get votes from both sides of the aisle to make that happen,” he said during a briefing.

Inside the growing Republican fissure on Ukraine aid

Eagerness for a potential resolution to the war has intensified as Ukrainian forces recapture occupied territory, pushing closer to areas prized by Putin. Those begin with Crimea, which Russia illegally annexed in 2014, and include cities along the Azov Sea that now provide him a “land bridge” to the Ukrainian peninsula. Zelensky has vowed to fight for every inch of Ukrainian territory.

Veteran diplomat Alexander Vershbow, who served as U.S. ambassador to Russia and deputy secretary general of NATO, said the United States could not afford to be completely “agnostic” about how and when the war is concluded, given the U.S. interest in ensuring European security and deterring further Kremlin aggression beyond Russia’s borders.

“If the conditions become more propitious for negotiations, I don’t think the administration is going to be passive,” Vershbow said. “But it is ultimately the Ukrainians doing the fighting, so we’ve got to be careful not to second-guess them.”

While Zelensky laid out proposals for a negotiated peace in the weeks following Putin’s Feb. 24 invasion, including Ukrainian neutrality and a return of areas occupied by Russia since that date, Ukrainian officials have hardened their stance in recent months.

In late September, following Putin’s annexation of four additional Ukrainian regions in the east and in the south, Zelensky issued a decree declaring it “impossible” to negotiate with the Russian leader. “We will negotiate with the new president,” he said in a video address.

That shift has been fueled by systematic atrocities in areas under Russian control, including rape and torture, along with regular airstrikes on Kyiv and other cities, and the Kremlin’s annexation decree.

Ukrainians have responded with outrage when foreigners have suggested they yield areas of their country as part of a peace deal, as they did last month when billionaire Elon Musk, who has helped supply Ukraine’s military with satellite communication devices, announced a proposal on Twitter that could allow Russia to cement its control of parts of Ukraine via referendum and give the Kremlin Crimea.

In recent weeks Ukrainian criticism of proposed concessions has grown more pointed, as officials decry “useful idiots” in the West whom they’ve accused of serving Kremlin interests.

“If Russia wins, we will get a period of chaos: flowering of tyranny, wars, genocides, nuclear races,” presidential adviser Mykhailo Podolyak said Friday. “Any ‘concessions’ to Putin today — a deal with the Devil. You won’t like its price.”

Ukrainian officials point out that a 2015 peace deal in the country’s eastern Donbas region — where Moscow backed a separatist campaign — only provided Russia time before Putin launched his full-scale invasion this year. They question why any new peace deal would be different, arguing that the only way Russia will be prevented from returning for further attacks is vanquishing its military on the battlefield.

Russia, facing a poor position on the battlefield, has proposed negotiations but in the past has proved unwilling to accept much other than Ukrainian capitulation.

“Cynically, Russia and its Western supporters are holding out an olive branch. Please do not be fooled: An aggressor cannot be a peacemaker,” Andriy Yermak, head of the Ukrainian presidential administration, wrote in a recent op-ed published by The Washington Post.

Ukrainian officials also question how they can conduct negotiations with Russian leaders who fundamentally believe in Moscow’s right to hegemony over Kyiv.

Putin has continued to undermine the notion of a sovereign and independent Ukraine, including in remarks last month when he once again asserted that Russians and Ukrainians were one people, and argued that Russia could be “the only real and serious guarantor of Ukraine’s statehood, sovereignty and territorial integrity.”

While Western officials also hold profound skepticism of Russia’s aims, they have chafed at Ukraine’s harsh public rebukes as Kyiv remains entirely dependent on Western assistance. Swiping at donors and ruling out talks could hurt Kyiv in the long run, officials say.

The maximalist remarks on both sides have increased global fears of a years-long conflict spanning the life of Russia’s 70-year-old leader, whose grip on power has only tightened in recent years. Already the war has deepened global economic woes, helping to send energy prices soaring for European consumers and causing a surge in commodity prices that worsened hunger in nations including Somalia, Yemen and Afghanistan.

Ukrainians say Democrats pressing for peace talks don’t get Putin

In the United States, rising inflation partially linked to the war has stiffened head winds for President Biden and his party ahead of the Nov. 8 midterms and raised new questions about the future of U.S. security assistance, which has amounted to $18.2 billion since the war began. According to a poll published Nov. 3 by the Wall Street Journal, 48 percent of Republicans said the United States was doing “too much” to support Ukraine, up from 6 percent in March.

Progressives within the Democratic Party are calling for diplomacy to avoid a protracted war, releasing but later retracting a letter calling on Biden to redouble efforts to seek “a realistic framework” for a halt to the fighting.

Speaking in Kyiv, Sullivan said the war could end easily. “Russia chose to start it,” he said. “Russia could choose to end it by ceasing its attack on Ukraine, ceasing its occupation of Ukraine, and that’s precisely what it should do from our perspective.”

The concerns about a longer conflict are particularly salient in nations that were already hesitant to throw their weight behind the U.S.-led coalition in support of Ukraine, either because of ties with Moscow or reluctance to fall in line behind Washington.

South Africa abstained from a recent U.N. vote that condemned Russia’s annexation decrees, saying the world must instead focus on facilitating a cease-fire and political resolution. Brazil’s new president-elect, Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva, has said Zelensky is as responsible for the war as Putin.

Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi, who has tried to maintain good relations with Moscow and Kyiv, offered assistance on peace talks in a call with Zelensky last month. He was spurned by the Ukrainian leader.

Zelensky told him Ukraine would not conduct any negotiations with Putin but said Ukraine was “committed to peaceful settlement through dialogue,” according to a statement released by Zelensky’s office. The statement noted that Russia had deliberately undermined efforts at dialogue.

Ukraine lays out peace-talk demands as the West braces for escalation

Despite Ukrainian leaders’ refusal to talk to Putin and their vow to fight to retake all of Ukraine, U.S. officials say they believe that Zelensky would probably endorse negotiations and eventually accept concessions, as he suggested he would early in the war. They believe that Kyiv is attempting to lock in as many military gains as it can before winter sets in, when there might be a window for diplomacy.

Zelensky faces the challenge of appealing both to a domestic constituency that has suffered immensely at the hands of Russian invaders and a foreign audience providing his forces with the weapons they need to fight. To motivate Ukrainians domestically, Zelensky has promoted victory rather than settlement and become a symbol of defiance that has motivated Ukrainian forces on the battlefield.

While members of the Group of Seven industrialized bloc of nations seemingly threw their weight behind a Ukrainian vision of victory last month, endorsing a plan for a “just peace” including potential Russian reparation payments and security guarantees for Ukraine, some of those same countries see a potential turning point if Ukrainian forces approach Crimea.

Flames and smoke rise from the bridge connecting the Russian mainland with Crimea in early October. (AP)
Reports of a Russian withdrawal from the southern city of Kherson have raised the question of whether Ukrainian forces could eventually march on the strategic peninsula, which U.S. and NATO officials believe Putin views differently than other areas of Ukraine under Russian control, and what a likely all-out fight for Crimea would mean for Kyiv’s backers in the West.

Not only has Crimea been under direct Russian control for longer than areas seized since February, but it has long been the site of a Russian naval base and is home to many retired Russian military personnel.

Illustrating Russia’s elevation of Crimea, the Kremlin responded to an explosion last month on a bridge linking the region to mainland Russia — a symbol of Moscow’s grip of the peninsula — by launching a barrage of missiles on Ukrainian cities, including Kyiv, ending a long period of peace in the capital.

In the meantime, Ukrainian leaders continue to telegraph their intention to pursue total victory, not only to their beleaguered citizens but also to Moscow.

Zelensky told an interviewer on Wednesday that the first thing he would do after Ukraine prevails in the war would be to visit a recaptured Crimea. “I really want to see the sea,” he said.

[Brooklyn]

Remember when right wingers used to hate draft dodgers who fled to Canada? That used to rile up the delusional right wing. Of course, when the right wing chickenhawks like tRump avoided the draft it was perfectly ok. Today, in Russia Putin is having trouble filling up the ranks of the Russian army as many are fleeing the draft:


Russia's 'catastrophic' missing men problem
"Where have all the flowers gone?" asks the famous 1960s antiwar song. In Moscow today, The New York Times reports, the question is: Where have all the men gone?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/ ... r-AA13LeJM

The answer to both questions is, in part, the same: To the graveyards of soldiers. But a lot of the missing men of Moscow have also fled Russian President Vladimir Putin's draft for his war in Ukraine. In fact, demographers say Russia may not recover for generations, if ever.

"Putin spent years racing against Russia's demographic clock, only to order an invasion of Ukraine that's consigning his country's population to a historic decline," Bloomberg News reports. Here's a look at what demographer Alexei Raksha calls Russia's "perfect storm" of demographic decline:

So where have all the young men gone?

Putin says his recent mobilization drafted about 300,000 men, 82,000 of whom are already in Ukraine. Another 300,000 Russians are believed to have fled to other countries to avoid the draft. The Pentagon estimated in August, before Kyiv's autumn counteroffensive, that Russia had incurred about 80,000 casualties in Ukraine, including wounded troops. "I feel like we are a country of women now," Moscow resident Stanislava, 33, told the Times. "I was searching for male friends to help me move some furniture, and I realized almost all of them had left.



The draft did not work in the USA and it doesn't work in Russia. Like the old song in the 1960s asked: when will they ever learn?

[MDlaxfan76]

Their demographic problem is indeed important; such a huge strategic mistake…and tragedy.

[old salt]

Fiona Hill on how the war might end.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... r-00061894

Hill: Ukraine has already had a great moral, political and military victory. Russia has not achieved the aims of its special military operation. But I think Putin is obviously hoping that now, with all of the nuclear saber-rattling, threats of nuclear Armageddon, deploying Elon Musk and others to convey his messages, that basically he can take the territory that he’s got and get recognition of that...

Reynolds: It is striking to me that of all the conflicts that Russia has been engaged in since Putin became president, that none of them have been resolved with any kind of a peace settlement. They just have been fought to stalemate.

Hill: There’s not any good outcome I can see come out of this. What’s incumbent upon us is to figure out is how to constrain Russia’s ability to put Ukraine under pressure again in the future or invade again. If there’s any interim freezing of battle lines, make sure that they’re not recognized as official. Maybe we can contemplate some international receivership. We’ve had many of these different formulations in the past for disputed territory. We have to ensure, again, that Ukraine can always defend itself and make it impossible for Putin to break out of constraints and do this again.

[Kismet]

Fiona Hill on how the war might end.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... r-00061894

Hill: Ukraine has already had a great moral, political and military victory. Russia has not achieved the aims of its special military operation. But I think Putin is obviously hoping that now, with all of the nuclear saber-rattling, threats of nuclear Armageddon, deploying Elon Musk and others to convey his messages, that basically he can take the territory that he’s got and get recognition of that...

Reynolds: It is striking to me that of all the conflicts that Russia has been engaged in since Putin became president, that none of them have been resolved with any kind of a peace settlement. They just have been fought to stalemate.

Hill: There’s not any good outcome I can see come out of this. What’s incumbent upon us is to figure out is how to constrain Russia’s ability to put Ukraine under pressure again in the future or invade again. If there’s any interim freezing of battle lines, make sure that they’re not recognized as official. Maybe we can contemplate some international receivership. We’ve had many of these different formulations in the past for disputed territory. We have to ensure, again, that Ukraine can always defend itself and make it impossible for Putin to break out of constraints and do this again.

Good luck wit dis.

Ironic that your source is Fiona Hill who you been dissing here for years - now you quote her opinions? How exactly does that work?

[old salt]

Fiona Hill on how the war might end.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... r-00061894

Hill: Ukraine has already had a great moral, political and military victory. Russia has not achieved the aims of its special military operation. But I think Putin is obviously hoping that now, with all of the nuclear saber-rattling, threats of nuclear Armageddon, deploying Elon Musk and others to convey his messages, that basically he can take the territory that he’s got and get recognition of that...

Reynolds: It is striking to me that of all the conflicts that Russia has been engaged in since Putin became president, that none of them have been resolved with any kind of a peace settlement. They just have been fought to stalemate.

Hill: There’s not any good outcome I can see come out of this. What’s incumbent upon us is to figure out is how to constrain Russia’s ability to put Ukraine under pressure again in the future or invade again. If there’s any interim freezing of battle lines, make sure that they’re not recognized as official. Maybe we can contemplate some international receivership. We’ve had many of these different formulations in the past for disputed territory. We have to ensure, again, that Ukraine can always defend itself and make it impossible for Putin to break out of constraints and do this again.

Good luck wit dis.

Ironic that your source is Fiona Hill who you been dissing here for years - now you quote her opinions? How exactly does that work?

It's for the benefit of all her fans here. She's an expert on Russia & was a cheerleader for Ukraine. If she's that pessimistic about UkraIne achieving total victory & regaining all their lost territory, it should be a reality check for the maximalists here.

[MDlaxfan76]

Fiona Hill on how the war might end.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... r-00061894

Hill: Ukraine has already had a great moral, political and military victory. Russia has not achieved the aims of its special military operation. But I think Putin is obviously hoping that now, with all of the nuclear saber-rattling, threats of nuclear Armageddon, deploying Elon Musk and others to convey his messages, that basically he can take the territory that he’s got and get recognition of that...

Reynolds: It is striking to me that of all the conflicts that Russia has been engaged in since Putin became president, that none of them have been resolved with any kind of a peace settlement. They just have been fought to stalemate.

Hill: There’s not any good outcome I can see come out of this. What’s incumbent upon us is to figure out is how to constrain Russia’s ability to put Ukraine under pressure again in the future or invade again. If there’s any interim freezing of battle lines, make sure that they’re not recognized as official. Maybe we can contemplate some international receivership. We’ve had many of these different formulations in the past for disputed territory. We have to ensure, again, that Ukraine can always defend itself and make it impossible for Putin to break out of constraints and do this again.

Good luck wit dis.

Ironic that your source is Fiona Hill who you been dissing here for years - now you quote her opinions? How exactly does that work?

It's for the benefit of all her fans here. She's an expert on Russia & was a cheerleader for Ukraine. If she's that pessimistic about UkraIne achieving total victory & regaining all their lost territory, it should be a reality check for the maximalists here.

She's extremely clear that all of the apologists and message bearers for Putin, those questioning The West's and the US' support for Ukraine, the appeasers, are helping him, not the US or the West. She's clear that Putin will never be satisfied, nor will the hard liners, with just some territory. They will not stop until they have dismembered Ukraine, battered Ukraine and its people to a pulp. There is no end with Putin.

She's also clear that this third great power conflict must not be lost to Russia.

Anyone think the UN is going to enforce an "international receivership" of Donbas and Kherson and...I don't.

I think she's putting forth the only way a stalemate could be achieved with Putin still in power (and it's a stalemate that would require Zelensky to not be in power, given that he'd lose credibility with the Ukraine people). But it has no realistic chance of happening. Nor holding.

so, buckle up, Russia will need to be thoroughly defeated.

I do think there's a scenario in which Russia's military in Ukraine, including Crimea, is routed...and Putin falls. At that point, the defenses can be established, the diplomacy could actually have a chance of positive construction.

And it would be much, much better for the Russian people as well.

[old salt]

Fiona Hill on how the war might end.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... r-00061894

Hill: Ukraine has already had a great moral, political and military victory. Russia has not achieved the aims of its special military operation. But I think Putin is obviously hoping that now, with all of the nuclear saber-rattling, threats of nuclear Armageddon, deploying Elon Musk and others to convey his messages, that basically he can take the territory that he’s got and get recognition of that...

Reynolds: It is striking to me that of all the conflicts that Russia has been engaged in since Putin became president, that none of them have been resolved with any kind of a peace settlement. They just have been fought to stalemate.

Hill: There’s not any good outcome I can see come out of this. What’s incumbent upon us is to figure out is how to constrain Russia’s ability to put Ukraine under pressure again in the future or invade again. If there’s any interim freezing of battle lines, make sure that they’re not recognized as official. Maybe we can contemplate some international receivership. We’ve had many of these different formulations in the past for disputed territory. We have to ensure, again, that Ukraine can always defend itself and make it impossible for Putin to break out of constraints and do this again.

Good luck wit dis.

Ironic that your source is Fiona Hill who you been dissing here for years - now you quote her opinions? How exactly does that work?

It's for the benefit of all her fans here. She's an expert on Russia & was a cheerleader for Ukraine. If she's that pessimistic about UkraIne achieving total victory & regaining all their lost territory, it should be a reality check for the maximalists here.

She's extremely clear that all of the apologists and message bearers for Putin, those questioning The West's and the US' support for Ukraine, the appeasers, are helping him, not the US or the West. She's clear that Putin will never be satisfied, nor will the hard liners, with just some territory. They will not stop until they have dismembered Ukraine, battered Ukraine and its people to a pulp. There is no end with Putin.

She's also clear that this third great power conflict must not be lost to Russia.

Anyone think the UN is going to enforce an "international receivership" of Donbas and Kherson and...I don't.

I think she's putting forth the only way a stalemate could be achieved with Putin still in power (and it's a stalemate that would require Zelensky to not be in power, given that he'd lose credibility with the Ukraine people). But it has no realistic chance of happening. Nor holding.

so, buckle up, Russia will need to be thoroughly defeated.

I do think there's a scenario in which Russia's military in Ukraine, including Crimea, is routed...and Putin falls. At that point, the defenses can be established, the diplomacy could actually have a chance of positive construction.

And it would be much, much better for the Russian people as well.

It will not matter what Putin & the hardliners want.
What matters is the capabilities of the Russian vs Ukrainian military, & their will to fight.

[MDlaxfan76]

Fiona Hill on how the war might end.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... r-00061894

Hill: Ukraine has already had a great moral, political and military victory. Russia has not achieved the aims of its special military operation. But I think Putin is obviously hoping that now, with all of the nuclear saber-rattling, threats of nuclear Armageddon, deploying Elon Musk and others to convey his messages, that basically he can take the territory that he’s got and get recognition of that...

Reynolds: It is striking to me that of all the conflicts that Russia has been engaged in since Putin became president, that none of them have been resolved with any kind of a peace settlement. They just have been fought to stalemate.

Hill: There’s not any good outcome I can see come out of this. What’s incumbent upon us is to figure out is how to constrain Russia’s ability to put Ukraine under pressure again in the future or invade again. If there’s any interim freezing of battle lines, make sure that they’re not recognized as official. Maybe we can contemplate some international receivership. We’ve had many of these different formulations in the past for disputed territory. We have to ensure, again, that Ukraine can always defend itself and make it impossible for Putin to break out of constraints and do this again.

Good luck wit dis.

Ironic that your source is Fiona Hill who you been dissing here for years - now you quote her opinions? How exactly does that work?

It's for the benefit of all her fans here. She's an expert on Russia & was a cheerleader for Ukraine. If she's that pessimistic about UkraIne achieving total victory & regaining all their lost territory, it should be a reality check for the maximalists here.

She's extremely clear that all of the apologists and message bearers for Putin, those questioning The West's and the US' support for Ukraine, the appeasers, are helping him, not the US or the West. She's clear that Putin will never be satisfied, nor will the hard liners, with just some territory. They will not stop until they have dismembered Ukraine, battered Ukraine and its people to a pulp. There is no end with Putin.

She's also clear that this third great power conflict must not be lost to Russia.

Anyone think the UN is going to enforce an "international receivership" of Donbas and Kherson and...I don't.

I think she's putting forth the only way a stalemate could be achieved with Putin still in power (and it's a stalemate that would require Zelensky to not be in power, given that he'd lose credibility with the Ukraine people). But it has no realistic chance of happening. Nor holding.

so, buckle up, Russia will need to be thoroughly defeated.

I do think there's a scenario in which Russia's military in Ukraine, including Crimea, is routed...and Putin falls. At that point, the defenses can be established, the diplomacy could actually have a chance of positive construction.

And it would be much, much better for the Russian people as well.

It will not matter what Putin & the hardliners want.
What matters is the capabilities of the Russian vs Ukrainian military, & their will to fight.

Ohh, I agree, the key is to demoralize the Russian military.
The Ukrainian military wants revenge for war crimes committed, mass civilian terror.
They'll fight.
Doesn't look like the Russian military, at least those on the ground, have the same sort of resolve.
And the key to breaking them is continued precision strikes of their capabilities and encirclement of positions, forcing rapid retreats.

Unfortunately, there are also military, standing back from the direct fight, who are willing to send ballistic missiles and suicide drones to create more mass terror and deprivation. It's not clear how Ukraine ends that other than complete defeat of all they can reach.

But if the West strikes an appeasement strategy, forcing Ukraine to accept the war crimes, accept the loss of territory, accept the hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian civilians, including children, deported to the bowels of Russia...the Russian military will rebuild as victors...to come again.

Need to break their resolve.

[old salt]

Russians evacuating the family jewels from Kherson.
From the WSJ :
It has already sent away the collections of the local museums and disinterred and hauled away the body of Count Grigory Potemkin, the 18th-century Russian commander who founded the city.

[MDlaxfan76]

Russians evacuating the family jewels from Kherson.
From the WSJ :
It has already sent away the collections of the local museums and disinterred and hauled away the body of Count Grigory Potemkin, the 18th-century Russian commander who founded the city.

Famous for "Potemkin villages".

[old salt]

Russians evacuating the family jewels from Kherson.
From the WSJ :
It has already sent away the collections of the local museums and disinterred and hauled away the body of Count Grigory Potemkin, the 18th-century Russian commander who founded the city.

Famous for "Potemkin villages".

& Catherine the Great's favorite lover.

[PizzaSnake]

Russians evacuating the family jewels from Kherson.
From the WSJ :
It has already sent away the collections of the local museums and disinterred and hauled away the body of Count Grigory Potemkin, the 18th-century Russian commander who founded the city.

Famous for "Potemkin villages".

& Catherine the Great's favorite lover.

She conferred a title on a horse?

[MDlaxfan76]

Russians evacuating the family jewels from Kherson.
From the WSJ :
It has already sent away the collections of the local museums and disinterred and hauled away the body of Count Grigory Potemkin, the 18th-century Russian commander who founded the city.

Famous for "Potemkin villages".

& Catherine the Great's favorite lover.

one of...

[PizzaSnake]

Russians evacuating the family jewels from Kherson.
From the WSJ :
It has already sent away the collections of the local museums and disinterred and hauled away the body of Count Grigory Potemkin, the 18th-century Russian commander who founded the city.

Famous for "Potemkin villages".

& Catherine the Great's favorite lover.

one of...

Touché.

[Kismet]

Not a good week for Vlad

In another major retreat, Russian military announces withdrawal from western bank of Dnieper River in Kherson region.

No red wave in US elections means no help in stemming aid for Ukraine.

Not many options except announcing they are sending Brittany Griner to a penal colony in Siberia.

Perhaps Salty can come up with some optimistic material.

[youthathletics]

Maybe he is retreating to do more damage with tactical weaponry.

[Kismet]

Maybe he is retreating to do more damage with tactical weaponry.

Perhaps, but not a strategy for winning IMHO.

Interesting report on CNN

https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/10/politics ... index.html

"US observed Russian navy preparing for possible test of nuclear-powered torpedo

The US observed Russian naval vessels preparing for a possible test of a new nuclear-powered torpedo in recent weeks, a senior US official with direct knowledge told CNN.

Among the vessels which took part in the preparations was the Belgorod, a cruise missile submarine modified for special operations that is able to launch unmanned underwater vehicles including the Poseidon torpedo.

In the last week, the vessels were observed leaving the testing area in the Arctic Sea and heading back to port without carrying out a test. The US believes the Russians may have encountered technical difficulties.

“This can be seen as part of the bigger picture and Russia’s recent military practice, sending ill-trained and under-equipped troops to Ukraine,” a Western diplomat told CNN. “Russia’s military industry is going through difficult times, and we can also see that Western sanctions on high-tech military goods are having an effect and must continue.”

US officials said Russia could attempt to test the torpedo again but note the waters in the testing area will soon begin to ice over, limiting the window for operations."

[old salt]

Not a good week for Vlad

In another major retreat, Russian military announces withdrawal from western bank of Dnieper River in Kherson region.

No red wave in US elections means no help in stemming aid for Ukraine.

Not many options except announcing they are sending Brittany Griner to a penal colony in Siberia.

Perhaps Salty can come up with some optimistic material.

I've been talking about the coming retreat from Kherson, across the Dnipro River, for weeks.
It looks like it may be unopposed, if so, that benefits the civilian population & both military sides.
That makes the river the natural, defensible boundary, which sets the stage for a stalemate & possible cease fire/frozen conflict,
as both sides hunker down for the winter.'
This (a tactical retreat) is what I have been hoping for, so I see it as a positive step toward ending the fighting.

[MDlaxfan76]

mmmm, it's definitely a natural boundary, but I think we'll see crossing elsewhere, if not pre XMAs, certainly in the spring. Eventual encirclement.

Meanwhile, it'll be all about precision strikes. Gonna be pretty miserable for Russian soldiers within reach.