LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
Regarding DeSantis, see the post below from his personal account:
A federal judge (institution), requiring a showing of probable cause from the Department of Justice (institution), allows a search apparently for classified documents taken by Trump and Trump functionaries when they departed the White House. And DeSantis's response is rank division for the purpose of currying fanboys to his candidacy.
In the short statement, we have "weaponization" without regard to the process required to obtain a warrant and the discretion involved in seeking it. We have "Hunter Biden," 'nuff said. And we have "IRS agents." The plan is plainly authoritarian, and the effort is to curry favor at the expense of both important institutions and reality. "Not even remotely"? Please.
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
No need to personalize this as you being a "bad person" simply because you haven't focused on why DeSantis is a fascist threat yet. You have plenty of time!
Feel free to engage on what does keep you up at night and why...we can all learn from one another, but only if we explain ourselves fully.
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
Regarding DeSantis, see the post below from his personal account:
A federal judge (institution), requiring a showing of probable cause from the Department of Justice (institution), allows a search apparently for classified documents taken by Trump and Trump functionaries when they departed the White House. And DeSantis's response is rank division for the purpose of currying fanboys to his candidacy.
In the short statement, we have "weaponization" without regard to the process required to obtain a warrant and the discretion involved in seeking it. We have "Hunter Biden," 'nuff said. And we have "IRS agents." The plan is plainly authoritarian, and the effort is to curry favor at the expense of both important institutions and reality. "Not even remotely"? Please.
Agreed. But just one of many, many such clear indications from DeSantis.
I'd add that my sensitivity to any particular GOP candidate's predilections towards authoritarianism is greatly heightened by the context of the current GOP base overwhelmingly accepting and embracing such ideology. It's what they actually want and applaud.
And, as much as Trump was a gross threat and remains so, he was incompetent; so, my even greater concern is a "competent fascist" being successful.
CU88 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:45 am
Absolutely incredible watching the “back the blue” party suddenly shift to calling to defund law enforcement now.
C'mon man. If a Republican can be investigated for crating up and taking home highly classified documents, well, none of us is safe.
CU88 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:45 am
Absolutely incredible watching the “back the blue” party suddenly shift to calling to defund law enforcement now.
C'mon man. If a Republican can be investigated for crating up and taking home highly classified documents, well, none of us is safe.
We'd be in worse shape if Republicans can steal government records and violate the law with impunity.
It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.
CU88 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:45 am
Absolutely incredible watching the “back the blue” party suddenly shift to calling to defund law enforcement now.
C'mon man. If a Republican can be investigated for crating up and taking home highly classified documents, well, none of us is safe.
Who was the Clinton guy who walked out of the building with classified info stuffed in his pants?? Sandy Berger if memory serves correct...
I believe those were also classified documents good ole Sandy disposed of. Maybe trump should have had Flynn sneak the documents out of the WH in his clown pants. FTR, doesn't the WH have a working wood burning fireplace?
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
Regarding DeSantis, see the post below from his personal account:
A federal judge (institution), requiring a showing of probable cause from the Department of Justice (institution), allows a search apparently for classified documents taken by Trump and Trump functionaries when they departed the White House. And DeSantis's response is rank division for the purpose of currying fanboys to his candidacy.
In the short statement, we have "weaponization" without regard to the process required to obtain a warrant and the discretion involved in seeking it. We have "Hunter Biden," 'nuff said. And we have "IRS agents." The plan is plainly authoritarian, and the effort is to curry favor at the expense of both important institutions and reality. "Not even remotely"? Please.
You heard me, not even remotely. Doesn't mean that you have to accept it. Didn't you get taught a long time ago that you can't control what or how others think in life? That doesn't mean discount their opinion because you don't like the political candidate that they do. If you like Joe Biden, that's your choice and I can/will respect that. Does not mean I am going to discount your opinion because it doesn't sit well with my political narrative. That's a silly way to go through life if that's your MO...
CU88 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:45 am
Absolutely incredible watching the “back the blue” party suddenly shift to calling to defund law enforcement now.
C'mon man. If a Republican can be investigated for crating up and taking home highly classified documents, well, none of us is safe.
Who was the Clinton guy who walked out of the building with classified info stuffed in his pants?? Sandy Berger if memory serves correct...
I believe those were also classified documents good ole Sandy disposed of. Maybe trump should have had Flynn sneak the documents out of the WH in his clown pants. FTR, doesn't the WH have a working wood burning fireplace?
Right; Berger was the NSA for Clinton, and was fined some amount of money and sentenced to two years of probation plus community service for unauthorized removal of classified material from the National Archives. He also gave up his license to practice law.
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
Regarding DeSantis, see the post below from his personal account:
A federal judge (institution), requiring a showing of probable cause from the Department of Justice (institution), allows a search apparently for classified documents taken by Trump and Trump functionaries when they departed the White House. And DeSantis's response is rank division for the purpose of currying fanboys to his candidacy.
In the short statement, we have "weaponization" without regard to the process required to obtain a warrant and the discretion involved in seeking it. We have "Hunter Biden," 'nuff said. And we have "IRS agents." The plan is plainly authoritarian, and the effort is to curry favor at the expense of both important institutions and reality. "Not even remotely"? Please.
You heard me, not even remotely. Doesn't mean that you have to accept it. Didn't you get taught a long time ago that you can't control what or how others think in life? That doesn't mean discount their opinion because you don't like the political candidate that they do. If you like Joe Biden, that's your choice and I can/will respect that. Does not mean I am going to discount your opinion because it doesn't sit well with my political narrative. That's a silly way to go through life if that's your MO...
You heard me: "Please." And I get that you don't accept that, the f*cking mountain of accumulating evidence to the contrary. I got taught long ago that it was OK to disagree with people, even people I like and consider friends. I only discount opinions when I believe them to be ill-founded on the facts.
So, let me ask you: what do you think of DeSantis's tweet about the FBI search of the former President's home in Florida?
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
No need to personalize this as you being a "bad person" simply because you haven't focused on why DeSantis is a fascist threat yet. You have plenty of time!
Feel free to engage on what does keep you up at night and why...we can all learn from one another, but only if we explain ourselves fully.
Why do I have to prove to you he is not a Facist Threat? Because you say he is? That's laughable. You are not the authority on Ron DeSantis. Your opinion is in the minority in many, many places. This site not being one of them. Because you say he is, you won't take my opinions on him seriously until I prove to you that he is not a Facist threat? That's 3rd grade logic right there. There is nothing in the world I can say to you that will change your mind. Why bother? That's not discussion, that's you attempting to control the narrative. Not how it works in life. Maybe in FanLax Forums, but not in reality. Why do you attempt to do this? It's disingenuous behavior...
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:48 pmThanks for clearing up where you stand politically. Sounds like you identify more with the Democratic Party these days...
Do you identify with the current Republican Party, or any party in particular? What are your political ideologies?
I am a republican. You knew the answer to that, why even ask?
Was simply curious, no need to get upset over a simple question. I was also interested in what you believe in, and not just a label. Because Republicans have a wide range of ideologies and beliefs, and a ton of them have changed drastically over the past 6 years and past 60 years respectively. Democrats too, but their ideologies have changed more in the long term and less in the short term..
I am not a MAGA type. Fair-weather Republican.
So as a Fair-weather Republican, by definition, you change your fundamental beliefs simply by who is winning in the Republican party?
That's the MAGA types for the past 6+ years.
You're saying you don't have any solid foundational beliefs in how government should be run or what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country? You just rely on what the winning dude says we should do?
I, too, am interested in what 2000 means by "fair-weather Republican"...your interpretation certainly seems likely on the mark, but 2000 what say you?
Please explain your actual views. Fully.
To be helpful, I suggested a bunch of prompts, and Natty Boh has as well.
I like his add "and what freedoms and responsibilities Citizens should have in our country?"
I vote for the person in the Republican Party that I think can best do the job and lead our country. I don't blindly follow what they do or so if it turns out that I was wrong and they weren't the best person for the job. Then I start look within my party to find who I think will be the best person to put forward in the next election. Despite what has been said on this forum, I happen to like a lot of the things DeSantis has done and the energy and ideas he brings to the table. Doesn't mean that he is who I am voting for, I just happen to like a lot of what he does. Is he perfect? Far from it. Is he the threat to society that you have claimed he is? Far from it. This answer was not intended for you to lecture me on DeSantis, FYI. I don't need your opinion on him, I have seen it enough in my first few months here...
Correct, I've been clear about my view about DeSantis, which have only hardened the more I've watched him make decisions in office.
But, "I just happen to like a lot of what he does." seems quite reminiscent of folks' excuse about Trump "I like his policies", "I like his strength"...
Which policies and why?
In your case, what does he do that you like so much that you'd consider voting for him over, say a moderate Democrat?
Or are you GOP all the time, no matter what?
I asked a number of prompts...plenty of opportunity to fully explain your views.
This is a discussion site, you are being invited to discuss.
Expect pushback where people disagree. Again, discussion.
First, is anything I see going to change your mind about him? At all? He can relate to all different types of voters, especially the Latinx. He doesn't back down from a good fight, has strong conviction and plays well to his base. Are you going to vote for Biden? Or Kamala Harris?
I'd vote for either over DeSantis, and neither would be my preferred candidate in 2024. I don't like Harris, and Biden is too old IMO to be as sound in 2024-28 as he is in this stretch.
However, I see DeSantis as a competent fascist, but a fascist nevertheless and the GOP is primed to back anything he does in the interest of power.
So, it's back to voting for a piece of wood over the fascist, same calculation as I had in 2020.
I do agree that DeSantis can appeal to some hispanic voters, particularly those for whom "socialist" is really scary, for good reason...but what's scary IMO is an authoritarian, and right wing such are just as bad as left wing ones.
I don't see DeSantis as simply someone who doesn't back down from a fight, rather he's picking unnecessary ones for political gain, and worse, he's using powers of government as. bully that definitely signal the fascist tendencies...gotta remember, that's exactly what the "base" thinks they want, a "Christian nationalist".
So, no, I'm extremely unlikely to change my mind about DeSantis and the stakes at hand.
Give me Hogan or Cheney or...but not a fascist.
Thanks, guess we will agree to disagree here. I just don't see DeSantis as the same threat that you do. Doesn't make me a bad person. Just have other things that keep me up at night, Ron DeSantis not even remotely being one of them...
Regarding DeSantis, see the post below from his personal account:
A federal judge (institution), requiring a showing of probable cause from the Department of Justice (institution), allows a search apparently for classified documents taken by Trump and Trump functionaries when they departed the White House. And DeSantis's response is rank division for the purpose of currying fanboys to his candidacy.
In the short statement, we have "weaponization" without regard to the process required to obtain a warrant and the discretion involved in seeking it. We have "Hunter Biden," 'nuff said. And we have "IRS agents." The plan is plainly authoritarian, and the effort is to curry favor at the expense of both important institutions and reality. "Not even remotely"? Please.
You heard me, not even remotely. Doesn't mean that you have to accept it. Didn't you get taught a long time ago that you can't control what or how others think in life? That doesn't mean discount their opinion because you don't like the political candidate that they do. If you like Joe Biden, that's your choice and I can/will respect that. Does not mean I am going to discount your opinion because it doesn't sit well with my political narrative. That's a silly way to go through life if that's your MO...
You heard me: "Please." And I get that you don't accept that, the f*cking mountain of accumulating evidence to the contrary. I got taught long ago that it was OK to disagree with people, even people I like and consider friends. I only discount opinions when I believe them to be ill-founded on the facts.
So, let me ask you: what do you think of DeSantis's tweet about the FBI search of the former President's home in Florida?
There's some truth to it, some of it is little but too much. You honestly think that the Biden investigation got handled correctly? You live in alternate reality if you do? He's not wrong about a lot of it. Cradle is right, you think way too much like a lawyer. You are not going to see it any other way. What is the point of asking, you need to observe my confirmation bias?
CU88 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:45 am
Absolutely incredible watching the “back the blue” party suddenly shift to calling to defund law enforcement now.
C'mon man. If a Republican can be investigated for crating up and taking home highly classified documents, well, none of us is safe.
Who was the Clinton guy who walked out of the building with classified info stuffed in his pants?? Sandy Berger if memory serves correct...
I believe those were also classified documents good ole Sandy disposed of. Maybe trump should have had Flynn sneak the documents out of the WH in his clown pants. FTR, doesn't the WH have a working wood burning fireplace?
Right; Berger was the NSA for Clinton, and was fined some amount of money and sentenced to two years of probation plus community service for unauthorized removal of classified material from the National Archives. He also gave up his license to practice law.
Basing the punishment on the crime was it appropriate? Why was it necessary for Sandy to have to use his security clearance to have access to it in the first place. What was so important in compromising information he threw his career away for the Clintons?? Stupid question on my part.. trump had to know these documents were a big problem, why didn't he just give them up? By the time this legal nightmare is sorted out trump will probably be pushing up daisies.
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
I am confused by people who can't look past Trump to see the far larger potential implications of what just happened in FL. People like Putin send the federal police to raid their former political adversaries after they knocked them out of power, not US Presidents. Believe me, I firmly believe that no one, not even and perhaps especially not POTUS, is above the law. Heck, you could convince me that part of the price of having the honor of being POTUS is you should have a nice federally funded retirement - but put away where you can't have any more influence over policy.
With that said, if you are going to deploy federal law enforcement to raid the home of a former US president - particularly one that can (and is expected to) run for office again - you better be REALLY certain that what you are after is unprecedented. Short of treason, you should be aiming for something a lot less dramatic, if for no other reason than you need to be extremely prudent with the use of government power over your political opponents.
Appearances here matter. But, I suspect that they got the exact appearance they wanted - and now have their sound bite of the feds raiding Trump as "proof" of his guilt of something.
I don't care what your party of choice might be - this use of Presidential power should concern you. And yes it is Presidential power that was deployed - "notified" or not, the FBI is part of the Executive Branch and therefore reports to the POTUS. They are HIS cops.
STILL somewhere back in the day....
...and waiting/hoping for a tinfoil hat emoji......
LaxFan2000 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:13 amWhy do I have to prove to you he is not a Facist Threat? Because you say he is? That's laughable. You are not the authority on Ron DeSantis. Your opinion is in the minority in many, many places. This site not being one of them. Because you say he is, you won't take my opinions on him seriously until I prove to you that he is not a Facist threat? That's 3rd grade logic right there. There is nothing in the world I can say to you that will change your mind. Why bother? That's not discussion, that's you attempting to control the narrative. Not how it works in life. Maybe in FanLax Forums, but not in reality. Why do you attempt to do this? It's disingenuous behavior...
Accusations of fascism is the new - "shut up, he explained" of our political discourse.
They are served up nicely with a side dishes like: "threat to democracy", "liberal fool", "racist/anti-[ ]" or "communist".
STILL somewhere back in the day....
...and waiting/hoping for a tinfoil hat emoji......
HooDat wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:22 am
I am confused by people who can't look past Trump to see the far larger potential implications of what just happened in FL. People like Putin send the federal police to raid their former political adversaries after they knocked them out of power, not US Presidents. Believe me, I firmly believe that no one, not even and perhaps especially not POTUS, is above the law. Heck, you could convince me that part of the price of having the honor of being POTUS is you should have a nice federally funded retirement - but put away where you can't have any more influence over policy.
With that said, if you are going to deploy federal law enforcement to raid the home of a former US president - particularly one that can (and is expected to) run for office again - you better be REALLY certain that what you are after is unprecedented. Short of treason, you should be aiming for something a lot less dramatic, if for no other reason than you need to be extremely prudent with the use of government power over your political opponents.
Appearances here matter. But, I suspect that they got the exact appearance they wanted - and now have their sound bite of the feds raiding Trump as "proof" of his guilt of something.
I don't care what your party of choice might be - this use of Presidential power should concern you. And yes it is Presidential power that was deployed - "notified" or not, the FBI is part of the Executive Branch and therefore reports to the POTUS. They are HIS cops.
I have to think that they agree 100%= sure and that this was signed off by the top of DoJ - Garland and his deputy Monaco plus FBI head and that they will release this at the appropriate time and place. A federal magistrate signed off on the search warrant.
This isn't the DOPUS crowd at DoJ. Garland is a former and long standing appellate court federal judge who knows his way around. He is in this job because he knows the deal here.
He is on the record that NOBODY is above the law
Last edited by Kismet on Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
Kismet wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:27 am
I have to think that they agree 100%= sure and that this was signed off by the top of DoJ - Garland and his deputy Monaco plus FBI head and that they will release this at the appropriate time and place. A federal magistrate signed off on the search warrant.
you are more optimistic than I am.....
STILL somewhere back in the day....
...and waiting/hoping for a tinfoil hat emoji......
