NCAA reorg imminent

[Farfromgeneva]

i see you're coming around to things potentially not only having one outcome. congrats, it takes a big man to mea culpa.

+1

That post of mine took six minutes for me to write. That will be $150 please.

DocBarrister

You want to bill some FL clients $3mm/annum? Most I’ve ever paid out to a firm in a year was maybe $1.5 to Alston and Bird or King and Spalding.

[wgdsr]

sorry for the paywall. an article and a link to the grant of rights for 3 conferences:
https://theathletic.com/3396108/2022/07 ... ed-article
interesting thing about any acc >>> sec arrangement is espn is the main media partner for each. only skimmed the acc gor, my question revolves around what the potential value is to a jilted conference? if espn films a game at clemson, how much does the acc get? what they would've gotten/per game if it was an acc game, or sec?

maybe it's not that complicated, and if it went to full end-of-the-line result, imagine the acc would argue they were entitled to all of clemson's annual payout take from the sec media deal.

[wgdsr]

Big 10 new tv contact about to exceed one billion dollars, ACC Tv contract locked in at 240 million per year. I would shocked if ACC schools don’t make a jump to either the b10 or SEC.

Rumbles of Miami, FSU, UNC, and Clemson to the SEC.

let's say they go and notre dame to the b1g.
there are 10 teams left in the acc, and espn will be the ones threatening to rip up the present day contract.

spitballing, let's guesstimate those school media rights are conservatively $70 million annually for 13 years. that's $900 million per school times 5. what is the best move for jim phillips?

given that if the conference blows up if it's not held together by something, isn't the prospect of holding your ground worthwhile? that's an additional $35 million per school, the likes of which many of these schools may never see. plus, any leftover thinking it'd be an easy negotiation out (looking at you, louisville) would want to see that legal tussle play out. if it's a legal winner, you've legit locked up your conference with $70-90 million per payouts for 13 years, and the schools that left (or at least incoming conferences) are holding a very large bag.

[44WeWantMore]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

[wgdsr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

[DocBarrister]

i see you're coming around to things potentially not only having one outcome. congrats, it takes a big man to mea culpa.

+1

That post of mine took six minutes for me to write. That will be $150 please.

DocBarrister

You want to bill some FL clients $3mm/annum? Most I’ve ever paid out to a firm in a year was maybe $1.5 to Alston and Bird or King and Spalding.

Reputable, affordable firms.

DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

https://twitter.com/lamikeblack/status/ ... vFTPOMKXUQ

Oregon and Univ of Washington apply for Big 10 too.

Way to leave your little brothers hanging! I'd imagine some wacky state politics could kill some of these moves, ie Ducks don't go with out Beavers, and/or UW without Wazzu. Even Cal/UCLA....

The B1G doesn’t want those “little brother” schools. Dilutes the brand. I think the B1G will eventually take in Oregon, Washington, Cal, and Stanford. Notre Dame will probably come in (maybe if the B1G agrees to handle the ACC exit fees). If the B1G wants to be at 20 schools, an underperforming school (maybe Purdue?) may get kicked out.

Then you have two B1G divisions of ten schools. Top four in each make the B1G playoffs. Three rounds to crown the B1G champion. Then the B1G champion takes on the SEC champion in a “College Super Bowl” (alternating broadcast on Fox and ESPN) for the “national” championship. Or something like that.

That’s where this is all headed, it seems.

DocBarrister

The Big Ten will NEVER, I mean NEVER kick Purdue out. That is utter nonsensical speculation on your part. It's a founding member of the Big Ten.

It’s not me. The Indy Star and others have been doing the speculating.

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/c ... 784416001/

Nothing is sacred anymore in college football.

DocBarrister

As we trend toward survival of the richest and fittest, how secure should the less marketable and successful schools feel within the Big Ten and SEC? If everything is negotiable and every agreement is breakable, is the Big Ten really committed to keeping Purdue and Minnesota for the long term? What about Vanderbilt and the Mississippi schools in the SEC? Watch your backs, Boilermakers and Gophers and Commodores and Rebels and Bulldogs.

That is all that is mentioned by Pat Forde. Baseless speculation at this point. Let's see how it plays out before we prognosticate all this craziness. It's not the exit fee. Conferences just don't brush aside CHARTER member's because they underperform athletically. If that was the case, Northwestern would have been gone AGES ago. But they will never kick them out because of the academic boost that the school provides to the conference. It's the equivalent of having an Ivy-League level academic school in the Big Ten. Purdue is not going anywhere.

It won’t matter a bit that Purdue was a founding member of the B1G. It’s a matter of what value Purdue can bring to the conference if it’s going to get $100 million a year.

Purdue may be deemed to have sufficient value to stay in the conference. If Notre Dame joins the B1G, some will wonder why the B1G needs two Indiana teams.

Is keeping Purdue worth giving them $100 million a year (a billion dollars over a decade)? That is literally the billion dollar question that the conference will need to ask themselves if Notre Dame comes on board.

DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

Conferences can be worth more than the sum of their parts, especially if (as everyone expects) the B1G becomes just one of two major college football conferences. That’s a lot of leverage for the conference. Going from Power 5 to Power 2 is not some sort of magical play … the B1G and SEC are basically forming a monopoly of major college football.

With monopoly power, the B1G and SEC will both get a “premium” that ends up in a massive payday that none of the schools can leverage on their own.

DocBarrister

[wgdsr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

Conferences can be worth more than the sum of their parts, especially if (as everyone expects) the B1G becomes just one of two major college football conferences. That’s a lot of leverage for the conference. Going from Power 5 to Power 2 is not some sort of magical play … the B1G and SEC are basically forming a monopoly of major college football.

With monopoly power, the B1G and SEC will both get a “premium” that ends up in a massive payday that none of the schools can leverage on their own.

DocBarrister

the certain prediction machine is back!

lemme try... notre dame will command a premium going on their own that they can leverage, something they'll never get thru the dilution that schools like purdue would tamp down.

you're right, this is fun!

[wgdsr]

indiana already has 2 b1g teams, champ.
any examples of a conference kicking any member out? i mean, for anything?
sounds like you have the purdue prez on speed dial for action and a 1/3 cut. you a settle guy?

[DocBarrister]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

Conferences can be worth more than the sum of their parts, especially if (as everyone expects) the B1G becomes just one of two major college football conferences. That’s a lot of leverage for the conference. Going from Power 5 to Power 2 is not some sort of magical play … the B1G and SEC are basically forming a monopoly of major college football.

With monopoly power, the B1G and SEC will both get a “premium” that ends up in a massive payday that none of the schools can leverage on their own.

DocBarrister

the certain prediction machine is back!

lemme try... notre dame will command a premium going on their own that they can leverage, something they'll never get thru the dilution that schools like purdue would tamp down.

you're right, this is fun!

You know, there are folks who know a lot more about the economics and finances of college football who have been trying for decades to bring Notre Dame into the B1G. Those folks haven’t been working at the effort because they are Notre Dame fans. They’re doing it because they think adding Notre Dame is going to add a whole lot of value to the conference.

You might want to stop and ask yourself whether they know and understand some things that you obviously do not.

Just a suggestion ….

DocBarrister

[wgdsr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

Conferences can be worth more than the sum of their parts, especially if (as everyone expects) the B1G becomes just one of two major college football conferences. That’s a lot of leverage for the conference. Going from Power 5 to Power 2 is not some sort of magical play … the B1G and SEC are basically forming a monopoly of major college football.

With monopoly power, the B1G and SEC will both get a “premium” that ends up in a massive payday that none of the schools can leverage on their own.

DocBarrister

the certain prediction machine is back!

lemme try... notre dame will command a premium going on their own that they can leverage, something they'll never get thru the dilution that schools like purdue would tamp down.

you're right, this is fun!

You know, there are folks who know a lot more about the economics and finances of college football who have been trying for decades to bring Notre Dame into the B1G. Those folks haven’t been working at the effort because they are Notre Dame fans. They’re doing it because they think adding Notre Dame is going to add a whole lot of value to the conference.

You might want to stop and ask yourself whether they know and understand some things that you obviously do not.

Just a suggestion ….

DocBarrister

so you're saying notre dame doesn't know what they're doing? or i don't know what i'm saying?

[DocBarrister]

indiana already has 2 b1g teams, champ.
any examples of a conference kicking any member out? i mean, for anything?
sounds like you have the purdue prez on speed dial for action and a 1/3 cut. you a settle guy?

So it does … which begs the question … why would the B1G need three?

Don’t blame me for the Purdue speculation … that’s coming from professional sports writers (including the IndyStar). Take up your whining with them.

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/c ... 784416001/

Oh, and everyone from Philadelphia knows of the saga of Temple football, which got kicked out of the Big East in 2004 for “underperformance.” It happens. I’m sure there are other examples.

https://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2013/ ... rence/?amp


DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

Conferences can be worth more than the sum of their parts, especially if (as everyone expects) the B1G becomes just one of two major college football conferences. That’s a lot of leverage for the conference. Going from Power 5 to Power 2 is not some sort of magical play … the B1G and SEC are basically forming a monopoly of major college football.

With monopoly power, the B1G and SEC will both get a “premium” that ends up in a massive payday that none of the schools can leverage on their own.

DocBarrister

the certain prediction machine is back!

lemme try... notre dame will command a premium going on their own that they can leverage, something they'll never get thru the dilution that schools like purdue would tamp down.

you're right, this is fun!

You know, there are folks who know a lot more about the economics and finances of college football who have been trying for decades to bring Notre Dame into the B1G. Those folks haven’t been working at the effort because they are Notre Dame fans. They’re doing it because they think adding Notre Dame is going to add a whole lot of value to the conference.

You might want to stop and ask yourself whether they know and understand some things that you obviously do not.

Just a suggestion ….

DocBarrister

so you're saying notre dame doesn't know what they're doing? or i don't know what i'm saying?

Notre Dame knows what it’s doing.

And no, you don’t know what you’re saying.

DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

Article on how the ACC’s grant of rights ploy isn’t working because ACC schools have done the math.

https://bamahammer.com/2022/07/01/alaba ... teams/amp/

DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

It’s inescapable that the next moves in conference realignment could potentially sink the ACC, or even strand Virginia and Virginia Tech without a viable home.

Could the ACC’s most attractive schools — Clemson, Florida State and possibly Miami — be targeted by one of the two emerging mega-conferences? Would snagging Duke and North Carolina for basketball cachet be an appealing move for another league?

The ACC has a grant-of-rights deal in place through the 2035-36 season that guarantees, essentially, that even if a school jumps ship for another league, its television revenue still goes to the ACC.

That could be enough to keep it afloat. But with the money involved in the SEC’s television contract — and the one the Big Ten is reportedly finalizing with Fox — that might be a drop in the bucket long-term, hardly a deterrent.

… Losing that money may now be viewed like the million dollar buyouts that were supposed to keep college coaches from jumping from program to program (they didn’t) or Major League Baseball’s luxury tax, which was supposed to drive parity (it didn’t).

https://richmond.com/sports/college/bar ... ed5b5.html

A dose of reality for the grant-of-rights fetishists around here.

I suspect UVA is looking for a safe harbor right about now.

DocBarrister

[wgdsr]

https://www.reddit.com/r/notredame/comm ... dependent/

First image gives an overview of the order of magnitude economic benefit to ND of moving to the B1G (note I did not check any of the numbers).
Second image highlights why the B1G is a better fit for ND than the SEC would be.

the numbers are hilarious in their minimizing an independent route and maximizing a b1g one.

example -- expects notre dame to do no better than their $15 mill nbc deal for years 2025-2036. but if they go to the b1g, the rumored $1b annual deal(s) will magically jump to $1.8 to 2.0 billion per year. so notre dame is only competent enough to get past money ($15 mill) from a broadcast partner in 2025, but if they go to the b1g, someone will pay another $900 million per year for the league.
makes sense!!

Conferences can be worth more than the sum of their parts, especially if (as everyone expects) the B1G becomes just one of two major college football conferences. That’s a lot of leverage for the conference. Going from Power 5 to Power 2 is not some sort of magical play … the B1G and SEC are basically forming a monopoly of major college football.

With monopoly power, the B1G and SEC will both get a “premium” that ends up in a massive payday that none of the schools can leverage on their own.

DocBarrister

the certain prediction machine is back!

lemme try... notre dame will command a premium going on their own that they can leverage, something they'll never get thru the dilution that schools like purdue would tamp down.

you're right, this is fun!

You know, there are folks who know a lot more about the economics and finances of college football who have been trying for decades to bring Notre Dame into the B1G. Those folks haven’t been working at the effort because they are Notre Dame fans. They’re doing it because they think adding Notre Dame is going to add a whole lot of value to the conference.

You might want to stop and ask yourself whether they know and understand some things that you obviously do not.

Just a suggestion ….

DocBarrister

so you're saying notre dame doesn't know what they're doing? or i don't know what i'm saying?

Notre Dame knows what it’s doing.

And no, you don’t know what you’re saying.

DocBarrister

so you love your cake and to eat it, too. as a domer homer! they've been doing this for 100? years? i've been commenting on it for a couple days. but they know what they're doing even tho other guys are smarter that have been telling the to do the exact opposite!

i love how you run into your own self-made traps. that's the good stuff, counselor!!

[wgdsr]

It’s inescapable that the next moves in conference realignment could potentially sink the ACC, or even strand Virginia and Virginia Tech without a viable home.

Could the ACC’s most attractive schools — Clemson, Florida State and possibly Miami — be targeted by one of the two emerging mega-conferences? Would snagging Duke and North Carolina for basketball cachet be an appealing move for another league?

The ACC has a grant-of-rights deal in place through the 2035-36 season that guarantees, essentially, that even if a school jumps ship for another league, its television revenue still goes to the ACC.

That could be enough to keep it afloat. But with the money involved in the SEC’s television contract — and the one the Big Ten is reportedly finalizing with Fox — that might be a drop in the bucket long-term, hardly a deterrent.

… Losing that money may now be viewed like the million dollar buyouts that were supposed to keep college coaches from jumping from program to program (they didn’t) or Major League Baseball’s luxury tax, which was supposed to drive parity (it didn’t).

https://richmond.com/sports/college/bar ... ed5b5.html

A dose of reality for the grant-of-rights fetishists around here.

I suspect UVA is looking for a safe harbor right about now.

DocBarrister

explain this to me like i'm a 2 year old. it's possible the sec could say eff it, we'll pay for 4 new teams and the other 14 teams will be good with that.

but the acc as of now until proven otherwise... gets all 4 of those teams' $$ for this mega deal. so those 4 teams get nothing on this proposed megadeal. how is that good for them? so they'll make $$ in 2037?

[wgdsr]

indiana already has 2 b1g teams, champ.
any examples of a conference kicking any member out? i mean, for anything?
sounds like you have the purdue prez on speed dial for action and a 1/3 cut. you a settle guy?

So it does … which begs the question … why would the B1G need three?

Don’t blame me for the Purdue speculation … that’s coming from professional sports writers (including the IndyStar). Take up your whining with them.

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/c ... 784416001/

Oh, and everyone from Philadelphia knows of the saga of Temple football, which got kicked out of the Big East in 2004 for “underperformance.” It happens. I’m sure there are other examples.

https://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2013/ ... rence/?amp


DocBarrister

i'm whining now? lemme ask... would u just like to throw up unwarranted speculation as fact with no one engaging? or do u want a like button?

temple?!?!? the big east had like a 1 or 2 million dollar payout. they'd lose more $$ to sheisters like you.

[Farfromgeneva]

indiana already has 2 b1g teams, champ.
any examples of a conference kicking any member out? i mean, for anything?
sounds like you have the purdue prez on speed dial for action and a 1/3 cut. you a settle guy?

Mitch Daniels still has a lot of stroke nationally…