2022 D1 Selection Committee

[Hoxwurth]

The committee's approach was bizarre. First, the committee did not use RPI as a direct variable. Second, the committee only used RPI for the "best" wins and "worst" losses. In a sport with few games, making the sample size even smaller is bound to create bad outcomes. Third, the committee apparently used a new piece of data of wins against other tournament teams.

The Ivy League was the beneficiary of the broken process. To the extent the committee wanted to reward meaningful wins and losses, it should have been directed to use strength of record. In that case, Army and Jacksonville would have gotten bids.

The committee failed to select the best teams, the teams its own criteria suggested, or the most deserving teams.

[johnnyonthegunpowder]

Woodruff and company are absolutely ridiculous, and most of them have no business being on that committee. "Data" without actual interpretation is why higher education is such a absolutely disaster and Woodruff epitomizes that thoughtlessness to a perfection while chairing this committee.

Breschi, wow, very, very disappointed in him. Weird year. Not much to like about 2022's Tarheels and then add to to the equation.

I agree with Typical Lax Dad, give it to ESPN and PLL guys. Though they can be impossible to listen to, at least they know how to watch a game and they understand competition and aesthetics.

What a joke.

I was joking.

I'm not. Higher ed administrators are clueless about most things. This needs to change. It's about entertainment, so bring entertainers into the discussion.

[PizzaSnake]

The committee's approach was bizarre. First, the committee did not use RPI as a direct variable. Second, the committee only used RPI for the "best" wins and "worst" losses. In a sport with few games, making the sample size even smaller is bound to create bad outcomes. Third, the committee apparently used a new piece of data of wins against other tournament teams.

The Ivy League was the beneficiary of the broken process. To the extent the committee wanted to reward meaningful wins and losses, it should have been directed to use strength of record. In that case, Army and Jacksonville would have gotten bids.

The committee failed to select the best teams, the teams its own criteria suggested, or the most deserving teams.

“To the extent the committee wanted to reward meaningful wins and losses, it should have been directed to use strength of record. ”

Directed? By whom? Maybe ND can check with the SC and see if they can get an injunction.

[1766]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

THIS! Quality OCC foes will want home-and-home agreements. The sport will benefit if one clan no longer treats itself as royalty and everyone else as peasants.

The Acc really needs to get another associate member besides ND. Have a tournament, and gain an AQ. I agree about scheduling home and homes. Other conference schools aren't going to continuously play the away game. They are going to have to travel. Unc left the state of North Carolina twice this season. That's preposterous.

[ICGrad]

Everyone talking about how we need to completely overhaul the selection process. I’m not going to say it’s without its flaws, but how about we need to seriously reevaluate how polling is done. People taking 10 mins to fill out a survey about teams they haven’t actually watched creates major disconnect for your average fan. The bigger question isn’t “why isn’t Notre Dame in the tournament”. It’s “why were they ranked as high as #4 in the polls”?

Yup

[Antonio114]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

But those years that Rutgers was left out there was no one to blame but the committee right?

[TheBigIguana]

Everyone talking about how we need to completely overhaul the selection process. I’m not going to say it’s without its flaws, but how about we need to seriously reevaluate how polling is done. People taking 10 mins to fill out a survey about teams they haven’t actually watched creates major disconnect for your average fan. The bigger question isn’t “why isn’t Notre Dame in the tournament”. It’s “why were they ranked as high as #4 in the polls”?

Because the polls always overrate based on expectation and value newer results more. The selection process does neither of these things and it makes it very different sometimes.

[lorin]

Analysis of Harvard and Notre Dame using NCAA's stated criteria:

Strength of schedule: ND 16, H 21

RPI results
Overall: ND 11, H 15
vs grouping of opponents' RPIs: 1-5 6-10 11-15 16-20 21+
Harvard 1-1 1-2 1-1 0-0 5-0
Notre Dame 0-2 2-1 0-1 1-0 5-0
Avg opponent RPI of wins: ND 31, H 34
Avg opponent RPI of losses: ND 7, H 8

Head-to-head and common opponents: both beat Michigan and lost to OSU

Significant wins vs teams with better RPIs: Harvard 3 (Princeton, Brown, BU)
ND 2 (Duke x2)
Significant losses vs teams with worse RPIs: Harvard 0
ND 1 (OSU)

In my view, edge goes to ND. The only way to justify Harvard in is to start discounting the Duke wins. That's a slippery slope.

Result of putting Harvard in is to have 6 Ivies and 1 ACC team in an 18 team tournament. Does not pass the eye test or the small test.

I am sure the ACC coaches have a special shout out for Joe Breschi, who had their back as a member of the selection committee.

Duke was another over rated team.

[1766]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

But those years that Rutgers was left out there was no one to blame but the committee right?

As Rutgers was flippantly told by people like Quint and Anish specifically (and some on this board), too bad. Your RPI was too low. Having beaten Hopkins twice who made the tournament or number 2 OSU in the last game of the season while going to an OT game with number 1 Maryland was passing an eye test, but that doesn't matter. That's what they said then.

Now they have a huge problem and want an eye test. Comical to say the least.

[10 10 2]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

THIS! Quality OCC foes will want home-and-home agreements. The sport will benefit if one clan no longer treats itself as royalty and everyone else as peasants.

The Acc really needs to get another associate member besides ND. Have a tournament, and gain an AQ. I agree about scheduling home and homes. Other conference schools aren't going to continuously play the away game. They are going to have to travel. Unc left the state of North Carolina twice this season. That's preposterous.

UNC not getting into the tournament had nothing to do with them playing a bunch of home games.

[1766]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

THIS! Quality OCC foes will want home-and-home agreements. The sport will benefit if one clan no longer treats itself as royalty and everyone else as peasants.

The Acc really needs to get another associate member besides ND. Have a tournament, and gain an AQ. I agree about scheduling home and homes. Other conference schools aren't going to continuously play the away game. They are going to have to travel. Unc left the state of North Carolina twice this season. That's preposterous.

UNC not getting into the tournament had nothing to do with them playing a bunch of home games.

No, losing did. But playing a bunch of home games puts them at an unfair advantage. Imagine if they actually had to travel like other teams.

Personally speaking, I'd like to see more of a balanced scheduling alliance with the Ivy teams. Could be a weekend of match ups of conference vs conference like they do in basketball with the B1G and Acc.

[10 10 2]

No, losing did. But playing a bunch of home games puts them at an unfair advantage. Imagine if they actually had to travel like other teams.

Personally speaking, I'd like to see more of a balanced scheduling alliance with the Ivy teams. Could be a weekend of match ups of conference vs conference like they do in basketball with the B1G and Acc.

Have you considered that teams want to come to North Carolina in February and that it has nothing to do with an unfair ACC conspiracy to play only home games?

[PizzaSnake]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

But those years that Rutgers was left out there was no one to blame but the committee right?

As Rutgers was flippantly told by people like Quint and Anish specifically (and some on this board), too bad. Your RPI was too low. Having beaten Hopkins twice who made the tournament or number 2 OSU in the last game of the season while going to an OT game with number 1 Maryland was passing an eye test, but that doesn't matter. That's what they said then.

Now they have a huge problem and want an eye test. Comical to say the least.

To Crac and Squint I say this: be careful what you wish for. As it is they ended up with double-shiners due to their omphaloscepsis. And Danish. Wouldn’t want to exclude him from this cavalcade of erudition.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Woodruff and company are absolutely ridiculous, and most of them have no business being on that committee. "Data" without actual interpretation is why higher education is such a absolutely disaster and Woodruff epitomizes that thoughtlessness to a perfection while chairing this committee.

Breschi, wow, very, very disappointed in him. Weird year. Not much to like about 2022's Tarheels and then add to to the equation.

I agree with Typical Lax Dad, give it to ESPN and PLL guys. Though they can be impossible to listen to, at least they know how to watch a game and they understand competition and aesthetics.

What a joke.

I was joking.

I'm not. Higher ed administrators are clueless about most things. This needs to change. It's about entertainment, so bring entertainers into the discussion.

So let the cronies do it?

[Typical Lax Dad]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

But those years that Rutgers was left out there was no one to blame but the committee right?

As Rutgers was flippantly told by people like Quint and Anish specifically (and some on this board), too bad. Your RPI was too low. Having beaten Hopkins twice who made the tournament or number 2 OSU in the last game of the season while going to an OT game with number 1 Maryland was passing an eye test, but that doesn't matter. That's what they said then.

Now they have a huge problem and want an eye test. Comical to say the least.

To Crac and Squint I say this: be careful what you wish for. As it is they ended up with double-shiners due to their omphaloscepsis. And Danish. Wouldn’t want to exclude him from this cavalcade of erudition.

Maybe they will start their own tournament? Folks start their own lax clubs and lax camps when Johnny gets cut or doesn’t get a showcase invite….it’s how the sport rolls.

[Kismet]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

But those years that Rutgers was left out there was no one to blame but the committee right?

As Rutgers was flippantly told by people like Quint and Anish specifically (and some on this board), too bad. Your RPI was too low. Having beaten Hopkins twice who made the tournament or number 2 OSU in the last game of the season while going to an OT game with number 1 Maryland was passing an eye test, but that doesn't matter. That's what they said then.

Now they have a huge problem and want an eye test. Comical to say the least.

To Crac and Squint I say this: be careful what you wish for. As it is they ended up with double-shiners due to their omphaloscepsis. And Danish. Wouldn’t want to exclude him from this cavalcade of erudition.

Maybe they will start their own tournament? Folks start their own lax clubs and lax camps when Johnny gets cuts or doesn’t get a showcase invite….it’s how the sport rolls.

Frankly, their behavior is exactly prima facie evidence why the powers that be would NEVER involve them in the process.

Come to think of it, neither would they as it would deprive them of all the material they now have to complain ad infinitum.

[Chousnake]

It is hilarious and satisfying to see the same group of posters who defended teams like JHU getting in the tourney in the past with 8-6 records because of RPI and SOS and good losses etc now complaining when the same criteria benefiting another conference. Karma is a b*itch sometimes.

For years, the ACC teams fed off intra conference games building up RPIs. For years, the ACC tournament raised those RPIs and played into the selection criteria. That is why other conferences added post season tourneys - to compete with the monopoly on NCAA at large selections the ACC had built.

In past years, the ACC/JHU crowd told the fans of those schools on the wrong side of the bubble to play a tougher schedule, that wins against low rated teams mean nothing, that head to head was not important, that late season surges mean nothing, that the eye test meant less than the "criteria"

Now you know how it feels to be on the wrong side of the rules of the game created by ACC.

I hope this brings about some changes. For example, as some have mentioned, more OOC games in locations outside of the ACC/Baltimore region. Until then, you'll just have to live with the results that came from the rule book you wrote. It backfired on the ACC - for once - in 2022 and the whining is incessant. It is not flattering for those that are whining. In the past, you told us to shut up. Maybe it's time to listen to your own advice from past years.

[nyjay]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

THIS! Quality OCC foes will want home-and-home agreements. The sport will benefit if one clan no longer treats itself as royalty and everyone else as peasants.

The Acc really needs to get another associate member besides ND. Have a tournament, and gain an AQ. I agree about scheduling home and homes. Other conference schools aren't going to continuously play the away game. They are going to have to travel. Unc left the state of North Carolina twice this season. That's preposterous.

It would be helpful to the ACC's scheduling if Hopkins became relevant again. The 2-1 record of the ACC vs. Hop wasn't valuable this year - people might have thought it would have been when those games were scheduled.

[Wheels]

2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

But those years that Rutgers was left out there was no one to blame but the committee right?

As Rutgers was flippantly told by people like Quint and Anish specifically (and some on this board), too bad. Your RPI was too low. Having beaten Hopkins twice who made the tournament or number 2 OSU in the last game of the season while going to an OT game with number 1 Maryland was passing an eye test, but that doesn't matter. That's what they said then.

Now they have a huge problem and want an eye test. Comical to say the least.

Let's be specific about what "eye test" means here, too. If you read Patrick Stevens's article this morning, he interviewed Lars Tiffany, who said that a subjective, human element needs to be put back into the selection process. As if what the committee did last night didn't include that. They literally DIDN'T follow the RPI as an inclusion criterion. They used it as a comparative criterion for wins and losses. What is really meant by most of these people by "eye test" is actually "name on the front of the jersey." I'd at least respect it more if they just came out and said it. There are several teams over the years that have been excluded by the RPI, and the ACC people didn't cry for them. WHAT ABOUT THE KIDS?!!! That's what you're hearing now. Since it didn't happen to them for years, they didn't think it existed. Now that it's happened to them, they're demanding change.

Kevin Corrigan shouldn't be mad at the selection committee. He should be mad at Syracuse and Duke. Duke has to stop dropping early season games the way they do to lesser teams. Anish, Quint, and Carc need to stop telling the same story about "Duke gets better as the season goes....Dino is all about learning...you don't want to play them in May." I think Dino and his team did learn something this year. Stop losing to mid-majors when you have one of the most talented rosters in the nation.

And if anyone can figure out what's going on at Syracuse, god bless them.

But that's who cost Corrigan's Irish a bid. Duke and Cuse devalued Notre Dame's wins. And obviously, if ND wins one of those early games, they're getting ready to play next weekend. IMO, they clearly deserve to be in over Harvard.

It's also funny that no one is crying for Duke. Had they not imploded in the 2nd half on Saturday, they'd be getting ready to host a first round game. For those who think the committee didn't watch games (as Anish said on Twitter), I bet they watched that ND-Duke game and immediately removed Duke from consideration. That vomitous second half showed they didn't belong.

[Typical Lax Dad]

It is hilarious and satisfying to see the same group of posters who defended teams like JHU getting in the tourney in the past with 8-6 records because of RPI and SOS and good losses etc now complaining when the same criteria benefiting another conference. Karma is a b*itch sometimes.

For years, the ACC teams fed off intra conference games building up RPIs. For years, the ACC tournament raised those RPIs and played into the selection criteria. That is why other conferences added post season tourneys - to compete with the monopoly on NCAA at large selections the ACC had built.

In past years, the ACC/JHU crowd told the fans of those schools on the wrong side of the bubble to play a tougher schedule, that wins against low rated teams mean nothing, that head to head was not important, that late season surges mean nothing, that the eye test meant less than the "criteria"

Now you know how it feels to be on the wrong side of the rules of the game created by ACC.

I hope this brings about some changes. For example, as some have mentioned, more OOC games in locations outside of the ACC/Baltimore region. Until then, you'll just have to live with the results that came from the rule book you wrote. It backfired on the ACC - for once - in 2022 and the whining is incessant. It is not flattering for those that are whining. In the past, you told us to shut up. Maybe it's time to listen to your own advice from past years.

ND purposely constructs it’s schedule with an high RPI ACC conference in mind.