Ivy League 2022

[PizzaSnake]

I'd hope the committee goes on merit per their established rules. Eye test (Quintism) and history should not even be in the picture.

Squint-ism?

[MDlaxfan76]

Kinda fun though that instead of talking about how Covid policies and transfers, much less administrations and professors who hate athletes..etc etc, we're talking about whether 4, 5 or 6 Ivies should get into the tourney.

Anyone still think the Ivies won't find recruits in the coming years?

[rolldodge]

I'd hope the committee goes on merit per their established rules. Eye test (Quintism) and history should not even be in the picture.

Squint-ism?

[Chousnake]

Can opener supports the IVY league stating that since 2018 the almighty ACC is 10-8 against the IVY but two of those wins were against Dartmouth. No disrespect to Dartmouth as they are improving but they have not won an Ivy league lacrosse game since 2015! Dartmouth’s promising freshman class were in sixth grade the last time Dartmouth won an IL game.
This year the ACC is 1-2 against the IL. Anyone who is questioning whether or not the IL is having a special year is fooling themselves. Georgetown is number two at 13-1. Who did they lose to? Princeton. Rutgers is ranked #4 with two losses. Who did they lose to? Maryland and Princeton. Princeton is a great team yet despite beating RU and GT they did not make the ILT.
Patriot League leading BU is 0-3 against the IL.
There is a fair amount of anti IL trolling because of the IL success this year. It is my sincere hope that as many of the IL teams as possible make the NCAA tournament and may they all do well! The concern is the historical ACC bias and the tradition of teams such as Cornell and Rutgers getting screwed in prior years when objectively their on field performance deserved an NCAA bid that was not granted because of eye-test nonsense and historical bias.

how far back are we going? we are only talking about potential bias in years 2016 and before, correct?

??
I don't know what 2016 has to do with anything. Cornell got screwed in 2019. Rutgers got screwed twice and it was definitely after 2016. Meanwhile, in recent years when discussing at large bids, the dialogue was always "the 5 ACC teams will take 5 at large bids"

[wgdsr]

Can opener supports the IVY league stating that since 2018 the almighty ACC is 10-8 against the IVY but two of those wins were against Dartmouth. No disrespect to Dartmouth as they are improving but they have not won an Ivy league lacrosse game since 2015! Dartmouth’s promising freshman class were in sixth grade the last time Dartmouth won an IL game.
This year the ACC is 1-2 against the IL. Anyone who is questioning whether or not the IL is having a special year is fooling themselves. Georgetown is number two at 13-1. Who did they lose to? Princeton. Rutgers is ranked #4 with two losses. Who did they lose to? Maryland and Princeton. Princeton is a great team yet despite beating RU and GT they did not make the ILT.
Patriot League leading BU is 0-3 against the IL.
There is a fair amount of anti IL trolling because of the IL success this year. It is my sincere hope that as many of the IL teams as possible make the NCAA tournament and may they all do well! The concern is the historical ACC bias and the tradition of teams such as Cornell and Rutgers getting screwed in prior years when objectively their on field performance deserved an NCAA bid that was not granted because of eye-test nonsense and historical bias.

how far back are we going? we are only talking about potential bias in years 2016 and before, correct?

??
I don't know what 2016 has to do with anything. Cornell got screwed in 2019. Rutgers got screwed twice and it was definitely after 2016. Meanwhile, in recent years when discussing at large bids, the dialogue was always "the 5 ACC teams will take 5 at large bids"

chousnake, there are dozens of takes on this, it's impossible to have a quorum. one was "all we want is consistency and no subjective bias".

well, from 2017 to 2019, 2019 being the last of those years, we had it. selection was straight rpi. that's it. and it's just numbers, 0s and 1s. there was no discussion, there was no dialogue. it was rpi. ipso facto, under those metrics, cornell did not get screwed. nor did rutgers in that time.

given the vagaries of 2021, that was changed. maybe for just that year. you know who got the biggest bump ever for inclusion of eye test given the 3 previous years' selections? rutgers!!!

everybody needs to pick a lane. given we're all driving our own cars, i doubt that'll happen.

[GSP]

GSP, what a joker. ACC will get what it deserves. One team, maybe two. My, how the winds have changed. Better be on the lookout for freshmen stars in the Ivy League. I expect they will quickly flip flop your ACC arrogance.

The fact that you refused to answer, let alone address, my question, is an answer in itself.

UVA, Duke, and ND would beat any of the Ivy's 7 or 8 games out of 10. Why else would you guys be so adamant that they do not get in?

I orchestrated the greatest sports upset in history and changed the most important sport in America forever. I had the greatest release of a football known to mankind, and could read defenses like Hawkins reads derivative equations.
I now reside in Ithaca where the 2022 National Champion D1 Lacrosse team calls home.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

... and to think that you got into the HOF after you threw 220 interceptions against only 173 TDs. Quite a feat.

[joewillie78]

GSP, what a joker. ACC will get what it deserves. One team, maybe two. My, how the winds have changed. Better be on the lookout for freshmen stars in the Ivy League. I expect they will quickly flip flop your ACC arrogance.

The fact that you refused to answer, let alone address, my question, is an answer in itself.

UVA, Duke, and ND would beat any of the Ivy's 7 or 8 games out of 10. Why else would you guys be so adamant that they do not get in?

I orchestrated the greatest sports upset in history and changed the most important sport in America forever. I had the greatest release of a football known to mankind, and could read defenses like Hawkins reads derivative equations.
I now reside in Ithaca where the 2022 National Champion D1 Lacrosse team calls home.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

... and to think that you got into the HOF after you threw 220 interceptions against only 173 TDs. Quite a feat.

What Joewillie wants, Joewillie gets.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

[Chousnake]

GSP, what a joker. ACC will get what it deserves. One team, maybe two. My, how the winds have changed. Better be on the lookout for freshmen stars in the Ivy League. I expect they will quickly flip flop your ACC arrogance.

The fact that you refused to answer, let alone address, my question, is an answer in itself.

UVA, Duke, and ND would beat any of the Ivy's 7 or 8 games out of 10. Why else would you guys be so adamant that they do not get in?

I orchestrated the greatest sports upset in history and changed the most important sport in America forever. I had the greatest release of a football known to mankind, and could read defenses like Hawkins reads derivative equations.
I now reside in Ithaca where the 2022 National Champion D1 Lacrosse team calls home.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

... and to think that you got into the HOF after you threw 220 interceptions against only 173 TDs. Quite a feat.

That's a debate for another forum, but if you understand the era Namath played in, there is no question he is a HOF QB

[faircornell]

Possible Ivy Honorees this week:

As a note, if last week was the Week of the Goalie, this week was the Week of the Rookie:

POW:

Gavin Adler, Cornell: 8GB, 5CT vs Princeton
John Piateli, Cornell: 6 points (5,1) vs Princeton
Michael Long, Cornell: 7 points (3,4) vs Princeton
Matt Bradau, Yale: 6 points (4,2) vs Harvard, 11 points (7,4) vs Quinnipiac
Ryan Aughavin, Brown: 5 points (4,1) vs Dartmouth, 3 points (1,2) vs Bryant

ROW:

Chris Lyons, Yale: 5 points vs Harvard (5,0), 6 points (3,3) vs Quinnipiac
Brad Sharp, Yale: 5 points vs Harvard (1,4), 2 points (2,0) vs Quinnipiac
CJ Kirst, Cornell: 4 points (4,0) vs Princeton
Leo Johnson, Yale: 4 points (2,2) vs Harvard, 6 points (1,5) vs Quinnipiac
Connor Theriault, Brown: 8 saves (62%) vs Dartmouth

Rookies for Honor Roll:

Coulter Mackesy, Princeton: 6 points (5,1) vs Cornell
Joe Dowling, Harvard: 4 points (3,1) vs Yale
Andrew Perry, Harvard: 4 points (2,2) vs Yale
Sam King, Harvard: 3 points (1,2) vs Yale

Other Honor Roll:

Sam English, Princeton : 6 points (5,1) vs Cornell

Five of the top six scorers in the Harvard/Yale game were rookies. Coulter Mackesy was tied for leading scorer for Princeton, and was one of the most dangerous players on the field today.

POW: Matt Brandau

ROW: Chris Lyons

[FannOLax]

POW: Matt Brandau

ROW: Chris Lyons

USILA has a completely different take, naming Cornell's Gavin Adler and Yale's Thomas Bragg to the Team of the Week, with Brandau and Lyons not included. https://usila.org/news/2022/5/3/mens-la ... may-2.aspx

[faircornell]

POW: Matt Brandau

ROW: Chris Lyons

USILA has a completely different take, naming Cornell's Gavin Adler and Yale's Thomas Bragg to the Team of the Week, with Brandau and Lyons not included. https://usila.org/news/2022/5/3/mens-la ... may-2.aspx

The Ivies seem to be more formulaic than the USILA. Bragg's GWG was an amazing shot. A Crimson SSDM bent his shaft over his thigh in frustration after the shot. Bragg's post-shot dramatics were fantastic. I did, however feel bad for both Harvard and Princeton for not making the ILT after such generally great seasons. I've been looking and, aside from a few OOC games, I cannot find any defenders stats in the Ivies that come close to matching Adler's performance against Princeton.

[Can Opener]

POW: Matt Brandau

ROW: Chris Lyons

USILA has a completely different take, naming Cornell's Gavin Adler and Yale's Thomas Bragg to the Team of the Week, with Brandau and Lyons not included. https://usila.org/news/2022/5/3/mens-la ... may-2.aspx

The Ivies seem to be more formulaic than the USILA. Bragg's GWG was an amazing shot. A Crimson SSDM bent his shaft over his thigh in frustration after the shot. Bragg's post-shot dramatics were fantastic. I did, however feel bad for both Harvard and Princeton for not making the ILT after such generally great seasons. I've been looking and, aside from a few OOC games, I cannot find any defenders stats in the Ivies that come close to matching Adler's performance against Princeton.

Adler deserved POW. Not even close.

[Typical Lax Dad]

POW: Matt Brandau

ROW: Chris Lyons

USILA has a completely different take, naming Cornell's Gavin Adler and Yale's Thomas Bragg to the Team of the Week, with Brandau and Lyons not included. https://usila.org/news/2022/5/3/mens-la ... may-2.aspx

The Ivies seem to be more formulaic than the USILA. Bragg's GWG was an amazing shot. A Crimson SSDM bent his shaft over his thigh in frustration after the shot. Bragg's post-shot dramatics were fantastic. I did, however feel bad for both Harvard and Princeton for not making the ILT after such generally great seasons. I've been looking and, aside from a few OOC games, I cannot find any defenders stats in the Ivies that come close to matching Adler's performance against Princeton.

Adler was something else. I sent a Cornell guy a note about him.

[ICGrad]

Anyone else underwhelmed by Georgetown? They started the season with 3 tough games (if you count Hopkins as a tough game), and since then...meh.

They seem to be universally considered the second-best team in the country, and they might be...but personally, I wouldn't be surprised if they had an early exit and didn't make the Final 4.

[FannOLax]

Anyone else underwhelmed by Georgetown? They started the season with 3 tough games (if you count Hopkins as a tough game), and since then...meh.

They seem to be universally considered the second-best team in the country, and they might be...but personally, I wouldn't be surprised if they had an early exit and didn't make the Final 4.

I thought Georgetown looked good against Loyola recently. The Hoyas have only one loss, to Princeton in early March... their other Ivy contest was a win over Penn in Philly. Since that Princeton loss, their wins look pretty comfortable, nothing closer than a 14-11 road win over Lehigh. They haven't been battle-tested the way Ivy teams have, haven't played Maryland or UVa or Yale or Rutgers, but they look pretty darn good. If they get an Ivy in the first round or quarterfinals, I'll be hoping that you're right and they get knocked out before the Final 4. Georgetown could certainly provide an interesting case study on the value of having a great record playing a so-so schedule in a so-so conference versus having a good but not great record playing in a terrific conference.

[random observer]

Anyone else underwhelmed by Georgetown? They started the season with 3 tough games (if you count Hopkins as a tough game), and since then...meh.

They seem to be universally considered the second-best team in the country, and they might be...but personally, I wouldn't be surprised if they had an early exit and didn't make the Final 4.

Maybe their opponents have been "meh", but the performances haven't been. They haven't had any let up performances in games they should win which is more than you can say for almost any team not named Maryland. None of Denver, Villanova, Loyola, Richmond, or Lehigh are AQ caliber this year but they're all solid; Georgetown toyed with each and every one of them.

[ICGrad]

If they get an Ivy in the first round or quarterfinals, I'll be hoping that you're right and they get knocked out before the Final 4.

With a likely 2 or 3 seed, they won't be playing an at-large team in the first round. But they well could face a Cornell or Brown in round 2, which might be interesting. Even a Penn rematch.

Maybe their opponents have been "meh", but the performances haven't been. They haven't had any let up performances in games they should win which is more than you can say for almost any team not named Maryland. None of Denver, Villanova, Loyola, Richmond, or Lehigh are AQ caliber this year but they're all solid; Georgetown toyed with each and every one of them.

Fair enough. I haven't really seen them play; their results back your "convincing wins against good (not great) teams" assessment. And your point about not having letdowns in games they should win is a good one.

Interested to see how they fare once the competition level ratchets up a notch or two.

[MoralTerpitude]

Anyone else underwhelmed by Georgetown? They started the season with 3 tough games (if you count Hopkins as a tough game), and since then...meh.

They seem to be universally considered the second-best team in the country, and they might be...but personally, I wouldn't be surprised if they had an early exit and didn't make the Final 4.

I brought this topic up in another thread. I personally haven’t gotten to see them play much after Notre Dame, but the Hoyas looked great in crushing Loyola. They’ve taken care of business in impressive fashion.

I’m not sure if there’s much separation between them and the Ivies; not alot of data points. Obviously teams evolve over the course of the season, which is why it would have been nice if one of Georgetown’s late season games was against a top ten team. Unfortunately the rest of the Big East didn’t oblige.

They will be a bit of a mystery going into the NCAA’s.

[rolldodge]

Georgetown’s strength of schedule is 11. For comparison, Maryland is 21.

http://college.laxpower2.com/menx/sos01.php

[ICGrad]

Georgetown’s strength of schedule is 11. For comparison, Maryland is 21.

http://college.laxpower2.com/menx/sos01.php

Interesting. I was looking at LacrosseReference, which has them @ 14 and Maryland @ 18.

https://lacrossereference.com/stats/rpi-d1-men/