Johns Hopkins 2022

[HopFan16]

He gave these kids jerseys for these last two seasons and put them on the field.

Yes, because otherwise he wouldn't have been able to field a team, you mouth breather. How do you not realize how dumb "he had two years to overhaul this roster" sounds as you're typing it? You actually clicked "submit" on that post?

[51percentcorn]

The difference between this year's team and last year's team offensively is simple - Cole Williams - I know I have said it before but it is true. No matter what criticisms you want to put on him - when he turned the corner or down the alley the defense reacted - it caused a slide - now Degnon in certain situations - if a two man game gets him a shortstick - maybe draws a slide but otherwise defenses are very comfortable with any one on one match-up. The Maryland game being an aberration - defensively they have been better this year - the goalie position is still a huge hole.

I would argue the 22 class was also likely dramatically affected by the pandemic and the coaching switch. Even though the kids in that class could not publicly commit until September of 2020 - much of the recruiting was done. Cornell is typically a smaller geographic recruiting area than Hopkins is now. Cornell is alot of the NE and Canada - with fewer kids from Maryland and other locales so Milliman - pre-pandemic and pre Hopkins - might not have targeted some kids that Hopkins would. Now he'e the coach at Hopkins in May - just 3.5 months before '22 kids can verbal - he can't even meet his current team - his '21 class is decimated by the coaching change and he also has to focus on these guys. Of course he was never going to get Petro's kid but maybe one of the other star attackmen would have listened in different circumstances - I don't know. But it seemed like this low EQ guy did as well as he could under fairly challenging times.

+1 to excoriating '06 - some of his worst takes

[jhu06]

He gave these kids jerseys for these last two seasons and put them on the field.

Yes, because otherwise he wouldn't have been able to field a team, you mouth breather. How do you not realize how dumb "he had two years to overhaul this roster" sounds as you're typing it? You actually clicked "submit" on that post?

Rutgers lacrosse roster lists 15 kids with prior college experience and only the goalie and fogos on that list are listed at sub 6'0. Our roster lists keogh hawley krampf bauer raposo angelus mcdermott chauvette as 5'10 or under.

[HopFan16]

The difference between this year's team and last year's team offensively is simple - Cole Williams - I know I have said it before but it is true. No matter what criticisms you want to put on him - when he turned the corner or down the alley the defense reacted - it caused a slide

Don't forget 06 wanted to bench him

He gave these kids jerseys for these last two seasons and put them on the field.

Yes, because otherwise he wouldn't have been able to field a team, you mouth breather. How do you not realize how dumb "he had two years to overhaul this roster" sounds as you're typing it? You actually clicked "submit" on that post?

Rutgers lacrosse roster lists 15 kids with prior college experience and only the goalie and fogos on that list are listed at sub 6'0. Our roster lists keogh hawley krampf bauer raposo angelus mcdermott chauvette as 5'10 or under.

Yes, and every single one of those guys was a Petro recruit. PM cut a lot of others! Those were the best of the rest. If he cut those guys too, the team would be 0-14 and you'd be committing seppuku

What do you think happens to Rutgers when extra Covid eligibility runs out and they have to go back to relying on homegrown players. If you think their current strategy is sustainable longterm I have a bridge to sell you.

[51percentcorn]

Rutgers lacrosse roster lists 15 kids with prior college experience and only the goalie and fogos on that list are listed at sub 6'0. Our roster lists keogh hawley krampf bauer raposo angelus mcdermott chauvette as 5'10 or under.

Soooooo? Look, I am the poster child for thinking early recruiting was one of the over-riding factors in the decline. And one problem with recruiting kids that just finished the 8th or 9th grade is they may not grow to what you hope or think and your team is undersized with 30 converted attackmen. That. IMO, is a valid concern. What is not valid - however - is thinking it can be reversed with a snap of the fingers. You have to play those guys because you can't get any other guys. This is also not a good recruiting story - good luck going to Hopkins - he'll cut you in 2 years. HE HAD TO PLAY THE HAND HE WAS DEALT - he did cut 6 or more kids - Murphy and Zinn went elsewhere - didn't renew some COVID seniors - took in a couple transfers and still ended up with a 50+ roster. Get a grip.

[jhu06]

The difference between this year's team and last year's team offensively is simple - Cole Williams - I know I have said it before but it is true. No matter what criticisms you want to put on him - when he turned the corner or down the alley the defense reacted - it caused a slide

Don't forget 06 wanted to bench him

He gave these kids jerseys for these last two seasons and put them on the field.

Yes, because otherwise he wouldn't have been able to field a team, you mouth breather. How do you not realize how dumb "he had two years to overhaul this roster" sounds as you're typing it? You actually clicked "submit" on that post?

Rutgers lacrosse roster lists 15 kids with prior college experience and only the goalie and fogos on that list are listed at sub 6'0. Our roster lists keogh hawley krampf bauer raposo angelus mcdermott chauvette as 5'10 or under.

Yes, and every single one of those guys was a Petro recruit. PM cut a lot of others! Those were the best of the rest. If he cut those guys too, the team would be 0-14 and you'd be committing seppuku

What do you think happens to Rutgers when extra Covid eligibility runs out and they have to go back to relying on homegrown players. If you think their current strategy is sustainable longterm I have a bridge to sell you.

williams was a vinnie testaverde. accumulated playing time, headlines and stats but was not a consistent winner. I also didn't care for all the offensive penalties he and marr took because they had no self control.

yes and PM Grant jr JK and the amherst kid came from 4 different conferences and 4 different recruiting backgrounds and had probably seen hundreds/thousands of kids over the past 5 years and couldn't find anyone better to throw out there than a bunch of sub 6'0 attackmen.

[Big Dog]

small nit, but BU is not in the same academic class as Georgetown and Hopkins. Moreover, you are cherry-picking FBS football, as Georgetown is D1 in the 23 sports that they offer, but football is FCS, just like the Ivies.

I agree with all this, but I'm honestly trying not to cherry-pick. I'm trying to create a reasonable reference class, with the understanding that no two schools are identical. If we accept both your caveats, Hopkins ends up with no comparators at all, because the only other school with D1 mlax and D3 football is Hobart, and Hobart is (ducks to avoid eggs) "not in the same academic class as Georgetown and Hopkins."

I guess my underlying assumption here is that schools with FCS football have more in common with schools with D3 football, at least as far as the resources they have available for D1 lacrosse, than either has in common with a school like Maryland or Ohio State. If you prefer, we could look only at non-football schools, and relax the academic requirement such that the reference group is BU, Denver, Loyola, and (Lord help us) Drexel.

My point is, let's not cherry-pick in the other direction and create a class of "schools that can't succeed in D1 lacrosse" that's gerrymandered to only include Hopkins.

Agree, homer, but I also think Hop is unique. Yes, athletes are attracted first and foremost for the coach (just like a research wannabe heads for the PI that is the best fit), playing time, and a chance to win. That said, campus culture has to factor in somewhere. (With no disrespect to Hobart), all of Hopkins competitors for lacrosse talent are D1 (and/or 1AA football). And when visiting a campus, that difference can be palpable. I've toured a bunch of colleges with my kids, and after spending 3-4 hours wandering around and talking to current students & faculty, one can get an inkling of how much sports is valued (or tolerated, or barely condoned). How much that factors into a lax recruit's decision-making, I have no idea, but I do think it is not zero. Then the question becomes, other than great coaching, what else can Hop offer to be more attractive to 18-year old athletes to make a Research (capital 'R', as founded by Johns) university a top destination?

[jhu06]

small nit, but BU is not in the same academic class as Georgetown and Hopkins. Moreover, you are cherry-picking FBS football, as Georgetown is D1 in the 23 sports that they offer, but football is FCS, just like the Ivies.

I agree with all this, but I'm honestly trying not to cherry-pick. I'm trying to create a reasonable reference class, with the understanding that no two schools are identical. If we accept both your caveats, Hopkins ends up with no comparators at all, because the only other school with D1 mlax and D3 football is Hobart, and Hobart is (ducks to avoid eggs) "not in the same academic class as Georgetown and Hopkins."

I guess my underlying assumption here is that schools with FCS football have more in common with schools with D3 football, at least as far as the resources they have available for D1 lacrosse, than either has in common with a school like Maryland or Ohio State. If you prefer, we could look only at non-football schools, and relax the academic requirement such that the reference group is BU, Denver, Loyola, and (Lord help us) Drexel.

My point is, let's not cherry-pick in the other direction and create a class of "schools that can't succeed in D1 lacrosse" that's gerrymandered to only include Hopkins.

Agree, homer, but I also think Hop is unique. Yes, athletes are attracted first and foremost for the coach (just like a research wannabe heads for the PI that is the best fit), playing time, and a chance to win. That said, campus culture has to factor in somewhere. (With no disrespect to Hobart), all of Hopkins competitors for lacrosse talent are D1 (and/or 1AA football). And when visiting a campus, that difference can be palpable. I've toured a bunch of colleges with my kids, and after spending 3-4 hours wandering around and talking to current students & faculty, one can get an inkling of how much sports is valued (or tolerated, or barely condoned). How much that factors into a lax recruit's decision-making, I have no idea, but I do think it is not zero. Then the question becomes, other than great coaching, what else can Hop offer to be more attractive to 18-year old athletes to make a Research (capital 'R', as founded by Johns) university a top destination?

what did toomey have to offer kids when he put together loyolas title team? Galloway at jacksonville?

[Farfromgeneva]

small nit, but BU is not in the same academic class as Georgetown and Hopkins. Moreover, you are cherry-picking FBS football, as Georgetown is D1 in the 23 sports that they offer, but football is FCS, just like the Ivies.

I agree with all this, but I'm honestly trying not to cherry-pick. I'm trying to create a reasonable reference class, with the understanding that no two schools are identical. If we accept both your caveats, Hopkins ends up with no comparators at all, because the only other school with D1 mlax and D3 football is Hobart, and Hobart is (ducks to avoid eggs) "not in the same academic class as Georgetown and Hopkins."

I guess my underlying assumption here is that schools with FCS football have more in common with schools with D3 football, at least as far as the resources they have available for D1 lacrosse, than either has in common with a school like Maryland or Ohio State. If you prefer, we could look only at non-football schools, and relax the academic requirement such that the reference group is BU, Denver, Loyola, and (Lord help us) Drexel.

My point is, let's not cherry-pick in the other direction and create a class of "schools that can't succeed in D1 lacrosse" that's gerrymandered to only include Hopkins.

Agree, homer, but I also think Hop is unique. Yes, athletes are attracted first and foremost for the coach (just like a research wannabe heads for the PI that is the best fit), playing time, and a chance to win. That said, campus culture has to factor in somewhere. (With no disrespect to Hobart), all of Hopkins competitors for lacrosse talent are D1 (and/or 1AA football). And when visiting a campus, that difference can be palpable. I've toured a bunch of colleges with my kids, and after spending 3-4 hours wandering around and talking to current students & faculty, one can get an inkling of how much sports is valued (or tolerated, or barely condoned). How much that factors into a lax recruit's decision-making, I have no idea, but I do think it is not zero. Then the question becomes, other than great coaching, what else can Hop offer to be more attractive to 18-year old athletes to make a Research (capital 'R', as founded by Johns) university a top destination?

Should check out the football facilities at James Madison U

[flalax22]

I don’t think that’s entirely fair. They may have met him because they played with Kyle but every player I know that went up to Albany or has interacted with him at a camp or recruiting event has described him as the ultimate players coach.

Except if you're TD Ierlan or Tehoka Nanticoke apparently, their two best players since the Thompsons graduated.

One went from a SUNY to Yale and the other, well according to many coaches I know has been a bit of a handful on every team he has ever been on.

I have no idea if Marr would have been a greater success to this point but at least the off field traditions that make Hopkins what it is would have been respected.

[hmmm]

& Charm City's fading national image as a safe place to reside is not helping recruiting.

I spent the weekend in Baltimore and had the complete opposite takeaway. Charles Village has never been better, there is a state-of-the-art student center opening in 2024 and Fed Hill & Fell's Point neighborhoods are a college student's dream. Just bar after bar after bar, so much to eat and drink. The harbor area also has a ton more restaurants and such now than it did just 10 years ago. I would love to go to school there now and if I had college-aged kids I'd be thrilled for them if they got to spend four years there. It's not difficult for an undergrad student to stay out of the bad areas.

Campus was really lively this weekend, a lot going on. FIJI Islander was on Saturday and walking past it looked the same as ever. Ronny D doesn't seem too concerned about a bunch of rowdy college kids drinking in his literal backyard.

One other thing — they have clearly invested in the video board, pregame presentation, programs, overall gameday experience, etc. compared to when I was a student not that long ago. Go to a game and it becomes instantly clear that the conspiracy talk that this president and AD for some reason want to neglect the program into irrelevance is hilariously stupid. I also visited the new athletic center and it is one million times nicer and more "D1" than ever.

They also just renovated and expanded the Varsity Weight Room and are renovating the Women's locker room this year. Complete joke that anyone thinks that the school is not supporting the lacrosse programs.

[Wheels]

I was surprised when Hop named Milliman as head coach. One, he relatively has little experience, as his rise through the ranks has been quite rapid. But, two, and relatedly, his inexperience shows up during game-planning and in-game adjustments. I don't need to revisit the "shut-off Teat" adjustments, or lack thereof, that he made in 2019. Who knows what his 2020 Cornell team might have been, but it did look like his best team. I think his relative lack of experience led him to do what he did for senior day, and you hope he learned from that because it was brutal to see.

That said, as an outsider, what I think Milliman does well is build a culture and identity. You could clearly see that at Cornell. Koesterer is a legit defensive coordinator, and that's probably why the defense is ahead of the offense. You can see that Milliman is trying to build a hard-nosed, blue collar, hard work ethic culture.

With regards to the talent issue, yes, Milliman inherited what he inherited. However, good coaches put players in positions to succeed. Again, it's about his game plans and adjustments. It's hard to say that he's put those offensive players in position to succeed. Defense, yes. Offense, er...um...no.

Given the skill and athletes on defense, I'm surprised that Hop hasn't tried to push more in transition. If your size and athleticism limits you in the half-field, why keep trying to bang you head against that? Why not look for other ways to score or at least be different? Can you say that Hop is really taking its best swing on offense? That this is all they can do or should do? I'd be playing more like Hobart right now if I was Milliman.

[masondixonlax]

"these aren't PM's kids" has to be one of the worst takes on this forum (and there's a lot of competition). He had two years to overhaul this roster. Rutgers, maryland all sorts of more established staffs took knives to their rosters and kids they'd recruited. He gave these kids jerseys for these last two seasons and put them on the field.

You keep complaining about this but offer no insight, alternative, or solution. Point me to the standout freshman on another team you wanted the staff to poach? Direct us all to the people in the transfer portal you would have convinced to come play here?

If you were the coach what does your 2022 Blue Jays roster look like?

The only freshman I can think of that has been a standout and Hopkins could/ should have gotten (if he was academically eligible) is Connor Davis at Bucknell. He's local and has been dominating but I am not sure anyone could have predicted how good he has been.

[jhu06]

I was surprised when Hop named Milliman as head coach. One, he relatively has little experience, as his rise through the ranks has been quite rapid. But, two, and relatedly, his inexperience shows up during game-planning and in-game adjustments. I don't need to revisit the "shut-off Teat" adjustments, or lack thereof, that he made in 2019. Who knows what his 2020 Cornell team might have been, but it did look like his best team. I think his relative lack of experience led him to do what he did for senior day, and you hope he learned from that because it was brutal to see.

That said, as an outsider, what I think Milliman does well is build a culture and identity. You could clearly see that at Cornell. Koesterer is a legit defensive coordinator, and that's probably why the defense is ahead of the offense. You can see that Milliman is trying to build a hard-nosed, blue collar, hard work ethic culture.

With regards to the talent issue, yes, Milliman inherited what he inherited. However, good coaches put players in positions to succeed. Again, it's about his game plans and adjustments. It's hard to say that he's put those offensive players in position to succeed. Defense, yes. Offense, er...um...no.

Given the skill and athletes on defense, I'm surprised that Hop hasn't tried to push more in transition. If your size and athleticism limits you in the half-field, why keep trying to bang you head against that? Why not look for other ways to score or at least be different? Can you say that Hop is really taking its best swing on offense? That this is all they can do or should do? I'd be playing more like Hobart right now if I was Milliman.

He came from a top 5 program, ivy league school, hired an elite background oc, a young 2 time national champion rising star blue jay and managed to keep most of the top players we all thought were at homewood. He just hasn't had the results-yet.

[flalax22]

Not all can be thrown on the Pietramala crew.
Are Epstein and DeSimone having the type of seasons we expected? Is that on them or the current coaches. You need your best players to be your best players and that isn’t happening for us. Has Peshko improved over last year? Really the only players I see getting better are Degnon and Angelus. Kirson, McManus, Lyne have all regressed. Now to be fair I’ve heard Lyne is really banged up.

[masondixonlax]

PM needs more time to be fully evaluated. I think in due time he will turn out to be a good coach. Now the only two weird and unexplainable things to me about PM which did make me question him some was

A. The Epstein situation. Just weird how he handled it but then again I am not on the inside and don't know any details but from an outsider prospective it's been well... weird
B. The senior day post game celebration. I am 99% positive he learned from his mistake but won't know until next seasons final.

Other than that, I think he did the best he could with his roster. Takes time for culture to build

[Sagittarius A*]

I was surprised when Hop named Milliman as head coach. One, he relatively has little experience, as his rise through the ranks has been quite rapid. But, two, and relatedly, his inexperience shows up during game-planning and in-game adjustments. I don't need to revisit the "shut-off Teat" adjustments, or lack thereof, that he made in 2019. Who knows what his 2020 Cornell team might have been, but it did look like his best team. I think his relative lack of experience led him to do what he did for senior day, and you hope he learned from that because it was brutal to see.

That said, as an outsider, what I think Milliman does well is build a culture and identity. You could clearly see that at Cornell. Koesterer is a legit defensive coordinator, and that's probably why the defense is ahead of the offense. You can see that Milliman is trying to build a hard-nosed, blue collar, hard work ethic culture.

With regards to the talent issue, yes, Milliman inherited what he inherited. However, good coaches put players in positions to succeed. Again, it's about his game plans and adjustments. It's hard to say that he's put those offensive players in position to succeed. Defense, yes. Offense, er...um...no.

He seems to lack judgement and awareness on a number of levels.
22-4 on your home field? His team quit on him. Sugar coat that any way you want.
I'm sorry, but this does not bode well for the future.
These days a hard nosed work ethic culture just isn't enough. I'm not sure it was enough in the old days either.

[Sagittarius A*]

Not all can be thrown on the Pietramala crew.
Are Epstein and DeSimone having the type of seasons we expected? Is that on them or the current coaches. You need your best players to be your best players and that isn’t happening for us. Has Peshko improved over last year? Really the only players I see getting better are Degnon and Angelus. Kirson, McManus, Lyne have all regressed. Now to be fair I’ve heard Lyne is really banged up.

Indeed.

[hmmm]

The difference between this year's team and last year's team offensively is simple - Cole Williams - I know I have said it before but it is true. No matter what criticisms you want to put on him - when he turned the corner or down the alley the defense reacted - it caused a slide - now Degnon in certain situations - if a two man game gets him a shortstick - maybe draws a slide but otherwise defenses are very comfortable with any one on one match-up. The Maryland game being an aberration - defensively they have been better this year - the goalie position is still a huge hole.

I would argue the 22 class was also likely dramatically affected by the pandemic and the coaching switch. Even though the kids in that class could not publicly commit until September of 2020 - much of the recruiting was done. Cornell is typically a smaller geographic recruiting area than Hopkins is now. Cornell is alot of the NE and Canada - with fewer kids from Maryland and other locales so Milliman - pre-pandemic and pre Hopkins - might not have targeted some kids that Hopkins would. Now he'e the coach at Hopkins in May - just 3.5 months before '22 kids can verbal - he can't even meet his current team - his '21 class is decimated by the coaching change and he also has to focus on these guys. Of course he was never going to get Petro's kid but maybe one of the other star attackmen would have listened in different circumstances - I don't know. But it seemed like this low EQ guy did as well as he could under fairly challenging times.

+1 to excoriating '06 - some of his worst takes

Great point on the 22s. While it's true he had a "normal" recruiting timeline, kids weren't allowed to visit. I know several players in the 2022 class that didn't even visit the school the committed to until this fall or spring. No in person meetings either. Nothing was "normal" about the 2022 class recruiting cycle.

[51percentcorn]

Are Epstein and DeSimone having the type of seasons we expected? Is that on them or the current coaches. You need your best players to be your best players and that isn’t happening for us. Has Peshko improved over last year? Really the only players I see getting better are Degnon and Angelus. Kirson, McManus, Lyne have all regressed. Now to be fair I’ve heard Lyne is really banged up.

Wait a second - aren't you the one arguing that Epstein and DeSimone get away with figurative murder on the team - especially as compared to Murphy - so maybe their decline has more to do with them than Milliman?
Why is McManus on your list? 3 goals - more gbs - 1 more CT in same number of games (OK one more game this year)
Kirson - isn't his save percentage - 46% - which is not great - but isn't it factors better than last year??
Hasn't Peshko been banged up all year? ANd I still think the Rutgers game from last year put unrealistic expectations in our heads
Epstein has the same number of points as last year
DeSimone - who I have posted before does not appear to have the same burst as last year - could be dealing with an injury as well