All Things Russia & Ukraine

[old salt]

Vlad is righteous..... Old Soviet.

Be nice. We need Vlad to do the deal for us to give Iran their billion$ back.

[Farfromgeneva]

...& nuance is a concept beyond your grasp.

No. That's not it. It's your constant game of: The libs are doing it wrong. Putin is always winning....unless you mention Trump. Then you change gears, and tell us that Trump is being hard on Putin. Yet at the exact same time....Putin is still winning. And then you bring up the Deep State, insisting that they are in the way of Trump flawlessly dealing with Putin. And no matter what happens in the world, Putin is winning, America is doing it wrong and losing......right up until you mention Trump. It's just ridiculous.

You don't want to admit that your worldview starts with a conclusion, and works its way back to a premise.

Nordstream makes Germany overdependent on Russia for energy & puts NATO & other EU nations at risk. Putin already showed his willingness to use this as a weapon when he turned off the gas transiting to & thru the Ukraine to the EU in winter.

And if Germany shuts it down, your ridiculous logic says

Russia's building Nordstream 2 to divide the EU/NATO.

There it is again. You just got done telling me that Trump made NATO stronger than ever. What happened?

Putin has plenty of money to rebuild his military & use it for his adventurism abroad, which you continue to fail to acknowledge.

To what end? Again: NATO is stronger than ever, remember? He doesn't have anywhere near enough money to compete with the US, let alone NATO.

As for his adventurism----he's in Syria. What did he get for that? A rookie Cal Ripken card?

It's checkers masquerading as chess.

Here's a better example, because we can look back on it, decades later: what did invading Afghanistan do for the Soviets?

A bunch of pointless dead Russians. All this "project of power" nonsense is neat-o to discuss in think tanks and Grad school seminars. But in the end, does it move the football?

Nope.

You make no distinction between Putin & the USSR in the Cold War.
What does the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan have to do with what Putin's doing now ?

Putin is spending very little, relative to what he's causing NATO to expend to counter him.
He got a warm water port in the E Med, at a bargain price, without having to rebuild Syria, while the US destroyed IS for him.
He just had his 2 old transport planes stop in Syria, pick up his S-300 missile techs there, & fly them into Venezuela to set up the S-300's he sold Maduro months ago, greatly limiting our military options there, for very little investment. He might have just saved Maduro, just like he saved Assad.
He's getting a lot of bang for his buck.

You clearly don't understand Nordstream. It gives Putin the ability to cut off gas transiting Ukraine & supplyin E EU, without disrupting supply to Germany & W EU. A method he has already used to starve Ukraine & divide E vs W EU.

...& you can't acknowledge that Putin has played a weak hand skillfully, while we've played a strong hand badly.
I keep waiting for signs of Russia's economic collapse which you predict.

turn on your TV

That was 3 years ago & Europe is still buying their energy,
while you're paying for it at the pump & the checkout counter.
Well done.

This doesn’t address the point that Russia’s economy has collapsed. Not at all. Go buy a hybrid.

[Andersen]

Different and useful perspective:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/puti ... -3c996k3c7

[seacoaster]

Different and useful perspective:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/puti ... -3c996k3c7

Thanks for this. Very interesting.

[Typical Lax Dad]

...the War in Ukraine is the United States of America's fault. Like any employee, you attitude changes once the paychecks stop.... It don't matter.

I never liked stupid, unnecessary wars. I'm grateful I was never dragged into one.

The folks in The Ukraine need to lay down. It's a stupid war. deh Russian.

They have no choice but to fight. The men were stopped from leaving at the border.
They were told the Russians would not attack. It was western media hysteria.

Zelensky is holding them hostage and forcing conscripts to fight? Vlad is righteous..... Old Soviet.

Imagine Nixon closing the border to draft age young men.

Imagine it.

[Typical Lax Dad]

...& nuance is a concept beyond your grasp.

No. That's not it. It's your constant game of: The libs are doing it wrong. Putin is always winning....unless you mention Trump. Then you change gears, and tell us that Trump is being hard on Putin. Yet at the exact same time....Putin is still winning. And then you bring up the Deep State, insisting that they are in the way of Trump flawlessly dealing with Putin. And no matter what happens in the world, Putin is winning, America is doing it wrong and losing......right up until you mention Trump. It's just ridiculous.

You don't want to admit that your worldview starts with a conclusion, and works its way back to a premise.

Nordstream makes Germany overdependent on Russia for energy & puts NATO & other EU nations at risk. Putin already showed his willingness to use this as a weapon when he turned off the gas transiting to & thru the Ukraine to the EU in winter.

And if Germany shuts it down, your ridiculous logic says

Russia's building Nordstream 2 to divide the EU/NATO.

There it is again. You just got done telling me that Trump made NATO stronger than ever. What happened?

Putin has plenty of money to rebuild his military & use it for his adventurism abroad, which you continue to fail to acknowledge.

To what end? Again: NATO is stronger than ever, remember? He doesn't have anywhere near enough money to compete with the US, let alone NATO.

As for his adventurism----he's in Syria. What did he get for that? A rookie Cal Ripken card?

It's checkers masquerading as chess.

Here's a better example, because we can look back on it, decades later: what did invading Afghanistan do for the Soviets?

A bunch of pointless dead Russians. All this "project of power" nonsense is neat-o to discuss in think tanks and Grad school seminars. But in the end, does it move the football?

Nope.

You make no distinction between Putin & the USSR in the Cold War.
What does the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan have to do with what Putin's doing now ?

Putin is spending very little, relative to what he's causing NATO to expend to counter him.
He got a warm water port in the E Med, at a bargain price, without having to rebuild Syria, while the US destroyed IS for him.
He just had his 2 old transport planes stop in Syria, pick up his S-300 missile techs there, & fly them into Venezuela to set up the S-300's he sold Maduro months ago, greatly limiting our military options there, for very little investment. He might have just saved Maduro, just like he saved Assad.
He's getting a lot of bang for his buck.

You clearly don't understand Nordstream. It gives Putin the ability to cut off gas transiting Ukraine & supplyin E EU, without disrupting supply to Germany & W EU. A method he has already used to starve Ukraine & divide E vs W EU.

...& you can't acknowledge that Putin has played a weak hand skillfully, while we've played a strong hand badly.
I keep waiting for signs of Russia's economic collapse which you predict.

turn on your TV

That was 3 years ago & Europe is still buying their energy,
while you're paying for it at the pump & the checkout counter.
Well done.

This doesn’t address the point that Russia’s economy has collapsed. Not at all. Go buy a hybrid.

It was “predicted” 3 years ago….didn’t have to wait long either….That’s foresight. Old Soviet believes our gas price is up because all the gas that we all put in our cars contains gasoline refined from Russia….

[Peter Brown]

A US journalist, Brent Renaud, killed by Russians near Kyiv, - Kyiv region police.

Shot in the neck, in a car labeled “PRESS”.

"We are not seeking direct confrontation with Russia, though I have been clear that if Russia targets Americans in Ukraine, we will respond forcefully", Pres. Joe Biden, Feb. 15

Your move, Joe.

[CU88]

...& nuance is a concept beyond your grasp.

No. That's not it. It's your constant game of: The libs are doing it wrong. Putin is always winning....unless you mention Trump. Then you change gears, and tell us that Trump is being hard on Putin. Yet at the exact same time....Putin is still winning. And then you bring up the Deep State, insisting that they are in the way of Trump flawlessly dealing with Putin. And no matter what happens in the world, Putin is winning, America is doing it wrong and losing......right up until you mention Trump. It's just ridiculous.

You don't want to admit that your worldview starts with a conclusion, and works its way back to a premise.

Nordstream makes Germany overdependent on Russia for energy & puts NATO & other EU nations at risk. Putin already showed his willingness to use this as a weapon when he turned off the gas transiting to & thru the Ukraine to the EU in winter.

And if Germany shuts it down, your ridiculous logic says

Russia's building Nordstream 2 to divide the EU/NATO.

There it is again. You just got done telling me that Trump made NATO stronger than ever. What happened?

Putin has plenty of money to rebuild his military & use it for his adventurism abroad, which you continue to fail to acknowledge.

To what end? Again: NATO is stronger than ever, remember? He doesn't have anywhere near enough money to compete with the US, let alone NATO.

As for his adventurism----he's in Syria. What did he get for that? A rookie Cal Ripken card?

It's checkers masquerading as chess.

Here's a better example, because we can look back on it, decades later: what did invading Afghanistan do for the Soviets?

A bunch of pointless dead Russians. All this "project of power" nonsense is neat-o to discuss in think tanks and Grad school seminars. But in the end, does it move the football?

Nope.

You make no distinction between Putin & the USSR in the Cold War.
What does the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan have to do with what Putin's doing now ?

Putin is spending very little, relative to what he's causing NATO to expend to counter him.
He got a warm water port in the E Med, at a bargain price, without having to rebuild Syria, while the US destroyed IS for him.
He just had his 2 old transport planes stop in Syria, pick up his S-300 missile techs there, & fly them into Venezuela to set up the S-300's he sold Maduro months ago, greatly limiting our military options there, for very little investment. He might have just saved Maduro, just like he saved Assad.
He's getting a lot of bang for his buck.

You clearly don't understand Nordstream. It gives Putin the ability to cut off gas transiting Ukraine & supplyin E EU, without disrupting supply to Germany & W EU. A method he has already used to starve Ukraine & divide E vs W EU.

...& you can't acknowledge that Putin has played a weak hand skillfully, while we've played a strong hand badly.
I keep waiting for signs of Russia's economic collapse which you predict.

turn on your TV

That was 3 years ago & Europe is still buying their energy,
while you're paying for it at the pump & the checkout counter.
Well done.

This doesn’t address the point that Russia’s economy has collapsed. Not at all. Go buy a hybrid.

It was “predicted” 3 years ago….didn’t have to wait long either….That’s foresight. Old Soviet believes our gas price is up because all the gas that we all put in our cars contains gasoline refined from Russia….

[seacoaster]

Russian directive to deploy America’s cancer within:

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... rlson-fox/

[a fan]

Russian directive to deploy America’s cancer within:

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... rlson-fox/

Example #325 as to how far the Republican Party has fallen. Up is down. Down is up.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Russian directive to deploy America’s cancer within:

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... rlson-fox/

I wonder if they can get an Old Soviet on?

[DocBarrister]

Different and useful perspective:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/puti ... -3c996k3c7

Thanks for this. Very interesting.

China is also facing this demographic crisis of a shrinking population, and more crucially, a reduction in the working-age population.

The United States and other nations have dealt with this problem through immigration … which argues for a less restrictive immigration policy that further opens our borders. The aging white rural population must be replaced by a more diverse, younger immigrant population eager to pursue the American dream.

That is not as much an option for Russia and China, two totalitarian regimes that are reluctant to open their borders to new people and new ideas. Much of the Republican Party wants the U.S. to follow suit.

This malignant invasion of Ukraine is a sign of Russia’s weakness … on many fronts.

DocBarrister

[Peter Brown]

Russian directive to deploy America’s cancer within:

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... rlson-fox/

Example #325 as to how far the Republican Party has fallen. Up is down. Down is up.

An unconfirmed ‘BUT WRITTEN IN RUSSIAN’ memo, remarkably sourced by none other than David Corn himself (the golden showers source), is enough for a fan and Mother Jones to know it’s absolutely from Putin himself, who clearly watches Tucker Carlson nightly.

Anyone want to know Corn’s story?!?!

I am falling off my chair laughing.

[Brooklyn]

A US journalist, Brent Renaud, killed by Russians near Kyiv, - Kyiv region police.

Shot in the neck, in a car labeled “PRESS”.

"We are not seeking direct confrontation with Russia, though I have been clear that if Russia targets Americans in Ukraine, we will respond forcefully", Pres. Joe Biden, Feb. 15

Your move, Joe.

These things happen Petey.

When the Israeli imperialists murdered a British reporter nobody blinked rather than call for WW III in retaliation:

https://www.voanews.com/a/a-13-a-2003-0 ... 89958.html

Remember?

[a fan]

An unconfirmed ‘BUT WRITTEN IN RUSSIAN’ memo, remarkably sourced by none other than David Corn himself (the golden showers source), is enough for a fan and Mother Jones to know it’s absolutely from Putin himself, who clearly watches Tucker Carlson nightly.

Anyone want to know Corn’s story?!?!

I am falling off my chair laughing.

Dude. It is 10000% irrelevant if the Russians use it as a talking point.

But you're head is so far up anyone's *ss that has a R by it, as usual, you missed the problem.

There's a term for what you're doing, and it's, oh, about 60 years old: Russian Sympathizer.

It USED to mean far left Americans, who believe in more collective governance.


What does it mean now? Republicans who sympathize with Putin's ridiculous claims of tangential and historical "ownership" of Ukraine.

It's a problem, because it encourages Putin if he thinks there's a faction in America, like Trump, who are cool with what's he's doing.

Get it? Sense the problem?

Probably not. Vote Republican Pete! That fixes everything for you and your merry band of morons who think that when you reach the pearly gates, G*d is only going to let straight white male Republicans into heaven.

[Peter Brown]

An unconfirmed ‘BUT WRITTEN IN RUSSIAN’ memo, remarkably sourced by none other than David Corn himself (the golden showers source), is enough for a fan and Mother Jones to know it’s absolutely from Putin himself, who clearly watches Tucker Carlson nightly.

Anyone want to know Corn’s story?!?!

I am falling off my chair laughing.

Dude. It is 10000% irrelevant if the Russians use it as a talking point.

But you're head is so far up anyone's *ss that has a R by it, as usual, you missed the problem.

There's a term for what you're doing, and it's, oh, about 60 years old: Russian Sympathizer.

It USED to mean far left Americans, who believe in more collective governance.


What does it mean now? Republicans who sympathize with Putin's ridiculous claims of tangential and historical "ownership" of Ukraine.

It's a problem, because it encourages Putin if he thinks there's a faction in America, like Trump, who are cool with what's he's doing.

Get it? Sense the problem?

Probably not. Vote Republican Pete! That fixes everything for you and your merry band of morons who think that when you reach the pearly gates, G*d is only going to let straight white male Republicans into heaven.

That’s weird that I’m a ‘Russian sympathizer’ when I’ve been crystal clear that I’m pro-Ukrainian and want the West to provide everything we can to Ukrainian forces, and would love nothing more than someone close to Putin putting a bullet in his head.

But whatever floats your boat.

(a fan: just don’t swallow the garbage of a guy like Corn….he’s so biased it hurts, and his reporting has been debunked so often, he makes Aaron Rupar blush. You might also want to know that Dave miraculously skated after multiple allegations of sexual abuse by his female colleagues…you Dan Google that too)

[a fan]

That’s weird that I’m a ‘Russian sympathizer’ when I’ve been crystal clear that I’m pro-Ukrainian and want the West to provide everything we can to Ukrainian forces, and would love nothing more than someone close to Putin putting a bullet in his head.

But whatever floats your boat.

Holy F, you've got the stupid turned up to 11 today.

Tucker Carlson. If you're going to troll, at least keep up with the context.

(a fan: just don’t swallow the garbage of a guy like Corn….he’s so biased it hurts

For the second time, I don't care about him, or what he's claiming. What I care about is what comes out of Carlson's mouth. Or Trump's. Anything that signals to a Putin that's backed into a corner now that there's a faction of Americans that are on his side.

But sure Pete, Republicans rule over the school, dude! Stay cool this summer, Pete!

[Typical Lax Dad]

An unconfirmed ‘BUT WRITTEN IN RUSSIAN’ memo, remarkably sourced by none other than David Corn himself (the golden showers source), is enough for a fan and Mother Jones to know it’s absolutely from Putin himself, who clearly watches Tucker Carlson nightly.

Anyone want to know Corn’s story?!?!

I am falling off my chair laughing.

Dude. It is 10000% irrelevant if the Russians use it as a talking point.

But you're head is so far up anyone's *ss that has a R by it, as usual, you missed the problem.

There's a term for what you're doing, and it's, oh, about 60 years old: Russian Sympathizer.

It USED to mean far left Americans, who believe in more collective governance.


What does it mean now? Republicans who sympathize with Putin's ridiculous claims of tangential and historical "ownership" of Ukraine.

It's a problem, because it encourages Putin if he thinks there's a faction in America, like Trump, who are cool with what's he's doing.

Get it? Sense the problem?

Probably not. Vote Republican Pete! That fixes everything for you and your merry band of morons who think that when you reach the pearly gates, G*d is only going to let straight white male Republicans into heaven.

Yep. Sympathizers….Old ones at that.

[a fan]

His f*cking nation and freedom is at stake; he is speaking and lobbying for generations. I can't blame him for playing every card, every Zimmerman Telegram, he finds lying around:

https://twitter.com/olliecarroll/status ... 5327253504

I can’t either!

My point is—-he has to know what it takes to get Putin to stop. Bravery won’t do it, as admirable as it is.

What’s best for his people. If he keeps that at the front of his mind, he’ll find a way to get Putin out

... I don't think people here are considering what Zelensky's people will think of him if he surrenders to the Russians. He doesn't have the ability to surrender to Putin.

I never said a word about surrendering. We all know that Ukraine won't fall.....Russia simply can't hold the entire country. That's not an option for Putin.

What I'm talking about is: is Zelensky smart enough to give Putin his BS face saving nonsense he can take to his people and say "see, I made this happen".

I'm back to my suggestion of Ukraine pledging to remain neutral. Pretty obvious to Putin and the rest of us that Ukraine doesn't NEED NATO. They'll get along just fine with with armaments from the US et. al.

So that's the deal-----pledge neutrality, Putin leaves. I have NO IDEA what else would get Putin to back off. Death?

As much as it pains me to admit a fan is right on this one. BTW, he's most likely not overjoyed to have me in agreement.

A couple weeks ago I suggested a stick and carrot approach, simply put, slam Putin with sanctions but then provide assurances that would allow for his "face-saving" exit. IMHO, the only practical solution to avoid escalation and WW3. The time for that is now. That window of opportunity may be quickly closing though.

Say NO to a No Fly Zone!

It's always nice to have common ground, Tech.

I agree with you, too....about a no fly zone. MUCH better to give Ukrainians stingers and things that make Russia think twice about using planes.

We can't get suckered into a war...we meaning the US or NATO. We need to buy time, and pressure Zelensky to go neutral BEFORE Putin has land that he wants to keep.

Then everyone gets what they want----NO ONE will invade Ukraine in the future, having seen what a mess Putin made of it. Ukraine gets their independence and land. WIn-win, if you ask me.

[old salt]

Old Soviet believes our gas price is up because all the gas that we all put in our cars contains gasoline refined from Russia….

Gotta direct your venom somewhere. Nobody likes to be proven wrong.

Good job. Way to punish Putin for meddling in our election (on both sides).