All things CoronaVirus

[cradleandshoot]

This morning on our local news at 5 am there was an interesting report regarding concerts for the RPO at the Eastman Theatre. The masks we have been wearing since this Covid outbreak began are no longer acceptable for folks wanting to attend concerts for the RPO. Only N95 masks will now be an acceptable form of protection for concert goers. Your masks will be "inspected" before admittance to the theatre. Compliance for wearing them while in the theatre will be mandatory. The mask police will be monitoring all audience members to assure compliance takes place. Thank goodness I despise music from philharmonic orchestras. The take on this by me.. the masks we are wearing are no longer satisfactory.. REALLY??

[youthathletics]

I's be interested in seeing this economist be in a serious discussion with a public health, infectious disease expert from his own institution or from Harvard, etc. That would indeed be interesting. I'd also like to see a behavioral science expert in that roundtable discussion...something akin to the discussions Charlie Rose used to host.
No reason why we can't have both. Options are good...

Civil, in-depth, not partisan.

Rogan's incapable of hosting such a discussion.
MILLIONS of people disagree with you.

I would love to see MD and Rogan sit down. I am willing to wager MD would walk away quite satisfied. Whether he'd then stab in the back is a different story once he came back on fanlax.

[cradleandshoot]

I's be interested in seeing this economist be in a serious discussion with a public health, infectious disease expert from his own institution or from Harvard, etc. That would indeed be interesting. I'd also like to see a behavioral science expert in that roundtable discussion...something akin to the discussions Charlie Rose used to host.
No reason why we can't have both. Options are good...

Civil, in-depth, not partisan.

Rogan's incapable of hosting such a discussion.
MILLIONS of people disagree with you.

I would love to see MD and Rogan sit down. I am willing to wager MD would walk away quite satisfied. Whether he'd then stab in the back is a different story once he came back on fanlax.

I must be the only person on this forum who pays no attention to Joe Rogan. I know jack chit about his podcast, what he says or who listens to him. I feel the same way about him right now... I don't give a flying flipping pancake about who he is or what he thinks. Why should I care about his opinion on anything? I'm more fascinated by how he can convince a group of young people to eat a bucket full of cockroaches.

[MDlaxfan76]

I's be interested in seeing this economist be in a serious discussion with a public health, infectious disease expert from his own institution or from Harvard, etc. That would indeed be interesting. I'd also like to see a behavioral science expert in that roundtable discussion...something akin to the discussions Charlie Rose used to host.
No reason why we can't have both. Options are good...

Civil, in-depth, not partisan.

Rogan's incapable of hosting such a discussion.
MILLIONS of people disagree with you.

Yup, and those millions were unlikely to be those who watched Rose's discussions. Different audience. Maybe a small overlap, but very small.

I'm unaware of Rogan ever having hosted the sort of in-depth discussion with multiple guests, bringing complementary perspectives if not conclusions to the table in a civil way.

Frankly, Rogan isn't remotely smart enough to handle such discussions effectively. Very few people are, so it's not an insult to say that of Rogan. Charlie Rose, David Frost...very few...

[MDlaxfan76]

I's be interested in seeing this economist be in a serious discussion with a public health, infectious disease expert from his own institution or from Harvard, etc. That would indeed be interesting. I'd also like to see a behavioral science expert in that roundtable discussion...something akin to the discussions Charlie Rose used to host.
No reason why we can't have both. Options are good...

Civil, in-depth, not partisan.

Rogan's incapable of hosting such a discussion.
MILLIONS of people disagree with you.

I would love to see MD and Rogan sit down. I am willing to wager MD would walk away quite satisfied. Whether he'd then stab in the back is a different story once he came back on fanlax.

I suspect I'd enjoy the discussion; he seems like quite the entertaining cat, with a wide range of interests.

My issue with Rogan isn't whether he's a fun, entertaining guy...a guy you'd love to tell stories with over a beer and a good meal, but whether he sufficiently recognizes the responsibility he has with the platform that's been created...I'm not sure he's up to the challenge of discerning.

We'll see whether he improves on that front or not...but out of the gate, he seems to be making the same mistakes again.

[Farfromgeneva]

Hanke is indeed a prominent "respected" economist, and has done a ton of very interesting work over the past 40 years, though very much a "conservative" or "libertarian"...a supply sider, Cato Institute.

My issue is not the work he's done, the topics he's tackled, but rather that ideology seems to infuse it so thoroughly, making his conclusions predictable.

He's made his money primarily advising Eastern European and Balkan countries and other lesser developed economies:

Hanke has advised five presidents (Bulgaria, Indonesia, Kazakhstan, Venezuela, and Montenegro); five cabinet ministers (Albania, Argentina, Ecuador, Yugoslavia, and the United Arab Emirates); and has held two cabinet-level positions (Lithuania and Montenegro).[5]

To me, this "meta-analysis", what it chose to measure and how, predetermined what the outcome of the 'analysis' would be.

The key difference between what I’m pasting below and this situation is the network effect and speed of contagion vs time for an efficient market theory to take place. And the “opportunity cost” which is frequently life itself. Same reason even Taleb often caveats his “life and social systems need regular stressors…up until the point of existential failure”. Point being applying efficient market theory to an airborne contagious and fatal condition is classic failure of think tank driven economist:

The old story about the economist who finds a $20 bill lying on the ground and refuses to believe it.

There is an old story about a financial economist and passionate defender of the efficient markets hypothesis (EMH) who was walking down the street with a friend.

The friend stops and says, "Look, there is a $20 bill on the ground!"

The economist turns and coolly replies, "Can't be. If there was a $20 bill on the ground, somebody would have already picked it up."

This "joke," told by those that believe that the markets are inefficient and that investors can thus outperform the market by exploiting mispricings, is actually a very misleading analogy to the EMH. The following is a much better analogy:

A financial economist and passionate defender of the efficient markets hypothesis (EMH) was walking down the street with a friend. The friend stops and says, "Look, there's a $20 bill on the ground."

The economist turns and says, "Boy, this must be our lucky day! Better pick that up quick because the market is so efficient it won't be there for very long. Finding a $20 bill lying around happens so infrequently that it would be foolish to spend our time searching for more of them. Certainly, after assigning a value to the time spent in the effort, an 'investment' in trying to find money lying on the street just waiting to be picked up would be a poor one. I am also certainly not aware of lots of people, if any, getting rich mining beaches with metal detectors."

When he had finished they both look down and the $20 bill was gone!

What those who tell the first version of the story fail to understand is that an efficient market does not mean that there cannot be a $20 bill lying around. Instead, it is so unlikely to find one that it does not pay to go looking for them-the costs of the effort are highly likely to exceed the benefits. Also note that if it became known that there were lots of $20 bills to be found in a certain area, then everyone would be there to compete to find them, reducing the likelihood of achieving an appropriate "return on investment."

The analogy to the EMH is that it's not impossible to uncover an anomaly (that $20 bill lying on the floor) that can be exploited. Instead, one of the fundamental tenets of the EMH is that in a competitive financial environment, successful trading strategies self-destruct because they are self-limiting. When they are discovered they are eliminated by the very act of exploiting the strategy. Economics professors Dwight Lee and James Verbrugge of the University of Georgia explain the power of the efficient markets theory in the following manner:

'The efficient markets theory is practically alone among theories in that it becomes more powerful when people discover serious inconsistencies between it and the real world. If a clear efficient market anomaly is discovered, the behavior (or lack of behavior) that gives rise to it will tend to be eliminated by competition among investors for higher returns. (For example) If stock prices are found to follow predictable seasonal patterns this knowledge will elicit responses that have the effect of eliminating the very patterns that they were designed exploit. The implication is striking. The more empirical flaws that are discovered in the efficient markets theory the more robust the theory becomes. (In effect) Those who do the most to ensure that the efficient market theory remains fundamental to our understanding of financial economics are not its intellectual defenders, but those mounting the most serious empirical assault against it." (1)

In summary, while the markets may not be perfectly efficient (it is possible to find a $20 bill waiting to be picked up), the prudent investment strategy is to behave as if they were. Investors that accept the EMH as fundamental to their investment strategy don't have to spend their time searching for the very few $20 bills lying on the ground. Instead they earn market returns, less very low costs, based on the amount of risk (their asset allocation) they are willing to accept. They also get to spend their time on much more productive and important things like their family, community service, reading a good book, or whatever other "big rocks" there are in their lives.

[runrussellrun]

These people won't get the HPV for their daughters.

you left out this part, gee wonder why
They can't die off fast enough

You and I just want different people to die, but make no mistake, we are the same. We are choosing who it is.

fittin IS easy.....

Did you already take your "unvaccinated" vitamin, along with all your other daily pills in the "who to hate"

you and tld want young woman to die.....and do it fast. Or, do you only "judge" certain posters

[Farfromgeneva]

I's be interested in seeing this economist be in a serious discussion with a public health, infectious disease expert from his own institution or from Harvard, etc. That would indeed be interesting. I'd also like to see a behavioral science expert in that roundtable discussion...something akin to the discussions Charlie Rose used to host.
No reason why we can't have both. Options are good...

Civil, in-depth, not partisan.

Rogan's incapable of hosting such a discussion.
MILLIONS of people disagree with you.

I would love to see MD and Rogan sit down. I am willing to wager MD would walk away quite satisfied. Whether he'd then stab in the back is a different story once he came back on fanlax.

Come on you can disagree with a position or 100 of his or think he’s too polite but you’re really questioning his character?

I mean you want to question mine fine. I’ve had many personal failures some well documented here, but that guy is one I’m not worried about bending me over.

[runrussellrun]

ok

[jhu72]

How is it unnecessary for a SICK person, so sick they have to be admitted, taking up hospitol beds ? Think about what you are thinking, here.

If they were vaccinated, they would have a much better chance at staying home with mild to no symptoms vs. having to go to the hospital.

Simple stuff to understand my man.

just like me, and over 100 million US residents. (remember the covid count, last year )

Same results....mild symptoms, no hospital visits.

Are you seriously denying that we were told, last year, that the vaccines would PREVENT, not reduce ? That is wrong. We were told that.

Tell us why we should take a shot that clearly doesn't prevent you from getting it, or prevent spreading it. Especially after already contracting the virus ? To only placate you and your "anger" ? Dude....focus your anger at the medical community, where it belongs.

LMAO you're immune to properly interpreting medical information. Wonder what kind of vaccination that took...

You don't understand how the vaccines work, and you demonstrate it time and time again. The vaccines are indeed preventing a lot of people from getting sick, and a lot of people from getting severely sick and taking up much needed hospital beds. That is a simple fact that has been proved many times over.

I'll let you go back to tilting at windmills in the ether Don.

These people won't get the HPV for their daughters. They can't die off fast enough.

Speaking of facts….

“A new study out of Johns Hopkins University is claiming that worldwide pandemic lockdowns only prevented 0.2 per cent of COVID-19 deaths and were “not an effective way of reducing mortality rates during a pandemic.”

https://nationalpost.com/news/world/joh ... -lockdowns

Interestingly, certain media outlets refuse to cover this study:

“CNN, MSNBC, NYT, WaPo completely avoid Johns Hopkins study finding COVID lockdowns ineffective”

https://www.foxnews.com/media/johns-hop ... a-blackout


Maybe hysteria wasn’t and isn’t the best choice? I wouldn’t know since we’ve never worn masks or mandated vaccines. It seems worth some self reflection if we are arrogant in our Covid declarations? I don’t know.

You lie Goebbels!, nothing new.

Johns Hopkins does not endorse the Hanke paper.

CNN, MSNBC, NYT, WaPo are not fish wrappers like the garbage you reference. They didn't give it any space because it is not news worthy. The right wing fish wrappers did publish it and gave it lots of space. Academics at Imperial College and Oxford called BS on the paper yesterday morning before Goebbels woke up, hours after it "was leaked".

Hanke has done this before (I was not aware of this) and got called on it. This is a right wing dirty trick. It was not funded by the government! It was not funded by Johns Hopkins! It is not peer reviewed, it is claimed to be "a leaked working paper". MY ASS! Hanke allowed it to be leaked because it fits his politics. Hanke is at the end of his career, 79 years old. I guess he figured he had nothing to lose.

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://nationalpost.com/health/johns-h ... ea4fd/amp/

Staying away from people doesn’t impact the spread of a contagion. It’s perfectly sensible.

[runrussellrun]

How is it unnecessary for a SICK person, so sick they have to be admitted, taking up hospitol beds ? Think about what you are thinking, here.

If they were vaccinated, they would have a much better chance at staying home with mild to no symptoms vs. having to go to the hospital.

Simple stuff to understand my man.

just like me, and over 100 million US residents. (remember the covid count, last year )

Same results....mild symptoms, no hospital visits.

Are you seriously denying that we were told, last year, that the vaccines would PREVENT, not reduce ? That is wrong. We were told that.

Tell us why we should take a shot that clearly doesn't prevent you from getting it, or prevent spreading it. Especially after already contracting the virus ? To only placate you and your "anger" ? Dude....focus your anger at the medical community, where it belongs.

LMAO you're immune to properly interpreting medical information. Wonder what kind of vaccination that took...

You don't understand how the vaccines work, and you demonstrate it time and time again. The vaccines are indeed preventing a lot of people from getting sick, and a lot of people from getting severely sick and taking up much needed hospital beds. That is a simple fact that has been proved many times over.

I'll let you go back to tilting at windmills in the ether Don.

These people won't get the HPV for their daughters. They can't die off fast enough.

Speaking of facts….

“A new study out of Johns Hopkins University is claiming that worldwide pandemic lockdowns only prevented 0.2 per cent of COVID-19 deaths and were “not an effective way of reducing mortality rates during a pandemic.”

https://nationalpost.com/news/world/joh ... -lockdowns

Interestingly, certain media outlets refuse to cover this study:

“CNN, MSNBC, NYT, WaPo completely avoid Johns Hopkins study finding COVID lockdowns ineffective”

https://www.foxnews.com/media/johns-hop ... a-blackout


Maybe hysteria wasn’t and isn’t the best choice? I wouldn’t know since we’ve never worn masks or mandated vaccines. It seems worth some self reflection if we are arrogant in our Covid declarations? I don’t know.

You lie Goebbels!, nothing new.

Johns Hopkins does not endorse the Hanke paper.

CNN, MSNBC, NYT, WaPo are not fish wrappers like the garbage you reference. They didn't give it any space because it is not news worthy. The right wing fish wrappers did publish it and gave it lots of space. Academics at Imperial College and Oxford called BS on the paper yesterday morning before Goebbels woke up, hours after it "was leaked".

Hanke has done this before (I was not aware of this) and got called on it. This is a right wing dirty trick. It was not funded by the government! It was not funded by Johns Hopkins! It is not peer reviewed, it is claimed to be "a leaked working paper". MY ASS! Hanke allowed it to be leaked because it fits his politics. Hanke is at the end of his career, 79 years old. I guess he figured he had nothing to lose.

Just wondering when trumpU's fake "vaccine" will start "preventing", like the frauds claimed. You got sick, just like me. Mild.

Keep on using the standard "pharma" spin of "reduced" , "less severe" garbage. YOU........got sick. The only lie was via trumps FDA and the admitted fraudsters at pfizer.

....end of his career.....a year younger than the Prince of frauds, Fauci.....



Calling someone the namesake of one of the 20th centuries most horrible people, is a personnel attack. you'll be ok....

"snopes"

[runrussellrun]

https://nationalpost.com/health/johns-h ... ea4fd/amp/

Staying away from people doesn’t impact the spread of a contagion. It’s perfectly sensible.

"they can't die fast enough"

thanks, tld, have been twatting this all morning.

[a fan]

Hanke has done this before (I was not aware of this) and got called on it. This is a right wing dirty trick. It was not funded by the government! It was not funded by Johns Hopkins! It is not peer reviewed, it is claimed to be "a leaked working paper". MY ASS! Hanke allowed it to be leaked because it fits his politics. Hanke is at the end of his career, 79 years old. I guess he figured he had nothing to lose.

This is just stupid out of the gate.

What control country are they using? There isn't one.

This is what I said earlier: next pandemic, what will happen is that relatively rich families like mine will have a full array of options. All the medical care, vaccines, etc. available. I haven't been in a grocery store in years. I can afford delivery.

And the poor and working class, living check to check? They'll get a steady diet disinformation, TeamTinFoil hat stories like this one where it is accepted by the team IMMEDIATELY, simply because they LOVE the headline. They won't dissect it like they do with anything coming from the medical community. They won't say "follow the money". It's like watching a monkey screw a football (thank you Herb Brooks).

The poor will refuse care, and die in droves. Shut up and get back to work. Meanwhile, all the TinFoilHat media, pushing the buffalo bagels? Oh, they'll be fully vaccinated, distanced from the rabble, and have access to the very best care.

Oh, the pride that TeamTinFoil will enjoy. Meanwhile, I'm trying to relax, and get rid of my anger as friends and colleagues get sucked up by TeamTinFoil.....and die.

[runrussellrun]

Hanke has done this before (I was not aware of this) and got called on it. This is a right wing dirty trick. It was not funded by the government! It was not funded by Johns Hopkins! It is not peer reviewed, it is claimed to be "a leaked working paper". MY ASS! Hanke allowed it to be leaked because it fits his politics. Hanke is at the end of his career, 79 years old. I guess he figured he had nothing to lose.

This is just stupid out of the gate.

What control country are they using? There isn't one.

This is what I said earlier: next pandemic, what will happen is that relatively rich families like mine will have a full array of options. All the medical care, vaccines, etc. available. I haven't been in a grocery store in years. I can afford delivery.

And the poor and working class, living check to check? They'll get a steady diet disinformation, TeamTinFoil hat stories like this one where it is accepted by the team IMMEDIATELY, simply because they LOVE the headline. They won't dissect it like they do with anything coming from the medical community. They won't say "follow the money". It's like watching a monkey screw a football (thank you Herb Brooks).

The poor will refuse care, and die in droves. Shut up and get back to work. Meanwhile, all the TinFoilHat media, pushing the buffalo bagels? Oh, they'll be fully vaccinated, distanced from the rabble, and have access to the very best care.

Oh, the pride that TeamTinFoil will enjoy. Meanwhile, I'm trying to relax, and get rid of my anger as friends and colleagues get sucked up by TeamTinFoil.....and die.

Why can't it just be information? not right, or wrong, just information? The full report was posted recently, why comment if one hasn't actually read it?

Yup.....Hopkins is now the stupid ones..

Your dogma is "listen to the Doc'' " Just only when you agree ....geez.

Information, why go "tinfoil" hat on Hopkins research ?

[cradleandshoot]

Simple question.. why can't a profound disagreement end with someone not being accused of being a Nazi propaganda minister? That is all..

[jhu72]

https://nationalpost.com/health/johns-h ... ea4fd/amp/

Staying away from people doesn’t impact the spread of a contagion. It’s perfectly sensible.

... this could be a much bigger story, depends on how Hopkins wants to handle it. At minimum Hanke is done, they will make his life miserable and force him to retire. They could conceivably sue him for using their name in an unauthorized fashion. This of course was the whole point of the exercise. Hopkins brand has grown during the pandemic, the right wing wanted to trade on that name / brand. What better way? That's why I call it a dirty trick. Hopkins like all universities hold their brand dear. All the right wing rags will get hit with a cease and desist I would guess. They will want Hanke to make a helpful statement.

[Bart]

Simple question.. why can't a profound disagreement end with someone not being accused of being a Nazi propaganda minister? That is all..

Godwin's law.

[Peter Brown]

Hanke has done this before (I was not aware of this) and got called on it. This is a right wing dirty trick. It was not funded by the government! It was not funded by Johns Hopkins! It is not peer reviewed, it is claimed to be "a leaked working paper". MY ASS! Hanke allowed it to be leaked because it fits his politics. Hanke is at the end of his career, 79 years old. I guess he figured he had nothing to lose.

This is just stupid out of the gate.

What control country are they using? There isn't one.

This is what I said earlier: next pandemic, what will happen is that relatively rich families like mine will have a full array of options. All the medical care, vaccines, etc. available. I haven't been in a grocery store in years. I can afford delivery.

And the poor and working class, living check to check? They'll get a steady diet disinformation, TeamTinFoil hat stories like this one where it is accepted by the team IMMEDIATELY, simply because they LOVE the headline. They won't dissect it like they do with anything coming from the medical community. They won't say "follow the money". It's like watching a monkey screw a football (thank you Herb Brooks).

The poor will refuse care, and die in droves. Shut up and get back to work. Meanwhile, all the TinFoilHat media, pushing the buffalo bagels? Oh, they'll be fully vaccinated, distanced from the rabble, and have access to the very best care.

Oh, the pride that TeamTinFoil will enjoy. Meanwhile, I'm trying to relax, and get rid of my anger as friends and colleagues get sucked up by TeamTinFoil.....and die.

Why can't it just be information? not right, or wrong, just information? The full report was posted recently, why comment if one hasn't actually read it?

Yup.....Hopkins is now the stupid ones..

Your dogma is "listen to the Doc'' " Just only when you agree ....geez.

Information, why go "tinfoil" hat on Hopkins research ?

I go to the grocery store once a week. No masks. a fan implies only poor people go to the grocery store? I’m not so sure about that. I like to select my own fruit and vegetables, breads, dessert. Go to my butcher too. Also go to my wine store. No masks.

Why is the left so bananas over the Hopkins report? And now Hanke is, what, a far right QAnon guy?! It’s a report. Read it. To me it describes Florida’s successful model.

[runrussellrun]

Simple question.. why can't a profound disagreement end with someone not being accused of being a Nazi propaganda minister? That is all..

remember when the Princeton attackman did a hockey celebration when scoring at Homewood.....BAM.......think he got a 3 minute non realeaseable.

fresh out of the box......to boot. bizarre.