All things CoronaVirus

[jhu72]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

... dissidents.. More like propagandists.

[Kismet]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

Well, Tech, the Inquisition people had problems with Copernicus and Galileo, too. Which side ended up being correct?

Much of science is data and observation but when certain folks start mucking with the data and observations that's when we all get into trouble.

If you have time and Netflix watch the new release Don't Look Up
It's satire so the theme/situation is exaggerated but is designed to show what happens when you cannot believe your eyes.

Ha! The so-called data is already mucked with. That's the gist of the article.

Sure. The Inquisition claimed to have their own and correct data, too. Divinely inspired, as well. Didn't make them any less WRONG about Copernicus and Galileo.

[tech37]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

Well, Tech, the Inquisition people had problems with Copernicus and Galileo, too. Which side ended up being correct?

Much of science is data and observation but when certain folks start mucking with the data and observations that's when we all get into trouble.

If you have time and Netflix watch the new release Don't Look Up
It's satire so the theme/situation is exaggerated but is designed to show what happens when you cannot believe your eyes.

Ha! The so-called data is already mucked with. That's the gist of the article.

Sure. The Inquisition claimed to have their own and correct data, too. Divinely inspired, as well. Didn't make them any less WRONG about Copernicus and Galileo.

The Inquisition

So is it your opinion, the CDC, NIH, WHO, Biden Admin/Fauci have done everything correctly?

Do you automatically disagree with or label "wrong" anyone who has dared/dares question the medical establishment competence throughout the pandemic and/or suggest other ideas or methods (based on science)?

From the article:
"In the face of censorship, undermining, and mockery driven by authoritarian bureaucrats and tech platforms that increasingly function as private arms of the state, a smaller group of scientists, many of whom are also medical doctors, have continually spoken up to question the scientific consensus on whatever platforms they could find. We’re calling them “The Dissidents,” merely because they have spoken up against official policy. The term’s connotation of rebellion or revolution has nothing to do with what these thinkers represent: In their Talmudic approach to the pandemic, posing questions of questions and questions of other questioners, they are instead voices that have sought to uphold the past 400 years of scientific tradition and practice, rather than overturn it.
Some of their questions have been prescient and vindicated; others might appear conspiratorial or extreme. But the main point is that they have asked and continue to ask questions, while a majority of their peers have done away with the scientific method or have been cowed into silence."

[Farfromgeneva]

Who carries the position that trust can only be allocated to perfect human beings? That’s brilliant. Explains a lot.

[Kismet]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

Well, Tech, the Inquisition people had problems with Copernicus and Galileo, too. Which side ended up being correct?

Much of science is data and observation but when certain folks start mucking with the data and observations that's when we all get into trouble.

If you have time and Netflix watch the new release Don't Look Up
It's satire so the theme/situation is exaggerated but is designed to show what happens when you cannot believe your eyes.

Ha! The so-called data is already mucked with. That's the gist of the article.

Sure. The Inquisition claimed to have their own and correct data, too. Divinely inspired, as well. Didn't make them any less WRONG about Copernicus and Galileo.

The Inquisition

So is it your opinion, the CDC, NIH, WHO, Biden Admin/Fauci have done everything correctly?

Do you automatically disagree with or label "wrong" anyone who has dared/dares question the medical establishment competence throughout the pandemic and/or suggest other ideas or methods (based on science)?

From the article:
"Some of their questions have been prescient and vindicated; others might appear conspiratorial or extreme. But the main point is that they have asked and continue to ask questions, while a majority of their peers have done away with the scientific method or have been cowed into silence."

No they haven't. For the most part, they have course corrected as data and information have come in. They are not perfect but they aren't evil bureaucrats either. I'm willing to listen to informed views of people who may disagree with some of the science. I don't listen to Joe Rogan, a self-described comedian/entertainer and many of the people who chooses to showcase on the topic. Ditto for Bill Maher.

Nobody has ditched the scientific method except perhaps some of the folks you appear to want to listen to.

I'm all for asking questions, but when people don't like the answers they write off the bureaucrats/scientists as evil or incompetent is just plain silly to me.

We have almost a million dead people and our hospitals, doctors and nurses are on the edge of collapse. Despite having multiple safe and effective vaccines that have been dosed in the billions, which are designed to keep people alive and out of the hospital. Yet far too many people make medical/vaccine decisions based upon their political persuasions rather than the facts.

IMHO there is a difference between credible information and propaganda.

[Farfromgeneva]

Most of the people who challenge this area don’t have much respect or understanding for the concept of scientific inquiry. Challenging in isolation is sophomoric not advanced. Literally what late teen to early 20s people do.

[jhu72]

Reality, no happy feet.

[tech37]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

Well, Tech, the Inquisition people had problems with Copernicus and Galileo, too. Which side ended up being correct?

Much of science is data and observation but when certain folks start mucking with the data and observations that's when we all get into trouble.

If you have time and Netflix watch the new release Don't Look Up
It's satire so the theme/situation is exaggerated but is designed to show what happens when you cannot believe your eyes.

Ha! The so-called data is already mucked with. That's the gist of the article.

Sure. The Inquisition claimed to have their own and correct data, too. Divinely inspired, as well. Didn't make them any less WRONG about Copernicus and Galileo.

The Inquisition

So is it your opinion, the CDC, NIH, WHO, Biden Admin/Fauci have done everything correctly?

Do you automatically disagree with or label "wrong" anyone who has dared/dares question the medical establishment competence throughout the pandemic and/or suggest other ideas or methods (based on science)?

From the article:
"Some of their questions have been prescient and vindicated; others might appear conspiratorial or extreme. But the main point is that they have asked and continue to ask questions, while a majority of their peers have done away with the scientific method or have been cowed into silence."

No they haven't. For the most part, they have course corrected as data and information have come in. They are not perfect but they aren't evil bureaucrats either. I'm willing to listen to informed views of people who may disagree with some of the science. I don't listen to Joe Rogan, a self-described comedian/entertainer and many of the people who chooses to showcase on the topic. Ditto for Bill Maher.

Nobody has ditched the scientific method except perhaps some of the folks you appear to want to listen to.
You're speaking from ignorance again, unless you've actually listened to doctors/scientists considered "fringe" by the establishment.

I'm all for asking questions, but when people don't like the answers they write off the bureaucrats/scientists as evil or incompetent is just plain silly to me.
And you think that is what the author and scientists the article is about are doing?

We have almost a million dead people and our hospitals, doctors and nurses are on the edge of collapse. Despite having multiple safe and effective vaccines that have been dosed in the billions, which are designed to keep people alive and out of the hospital. Yet far too many people make medical/vaccine decisions based upon their political persuasions rather than the facts.
I agree. Different people making better decisions/better messaging the past two years could have mitigated much of that.

[Farfromgeneva]

Reality, no happy feet.

F you for pointing this out. I’ll personally vaccinate everyone if I need to go let me kids have some sense of normalcy in their lives. There’s zero chance we go to the Asian model of wearing masks all the time everywhere .

[Kismet]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

Well, Tech, the Inquisition people had problems with Copernicus and Galileo, too. Which side ended up being correct?

Much of science is data and observation but when certain folks start mucking with the data and observations that's when we all get into trouble.

If you have time and Netflix watch the new release Don't Look Up
It's satire so the theme/situation is exaggerated but is designed to show what happens when you cannot believe your eyes.

Ha! The so-called data is already mucked with. That's the gist of the article.

Sure. The Inquisition claimed to have their own and correct data, too. Divinely inspired, as well. Didn't make them any less WRONG about Copernicus and Galileo.

The Inquisition

So is it your opinion, the CDC, NIH, WHO, Biden Admin/Fauci have done everything correctly?

Do you automatically disagree with or label "wrong" anyone who has dared/dares question the medical establishment competence throughout the pandemic and/or suggest other ideas or methods (based on science)?

From the article:
"Some of their questions have been prescient and vindicated; others might appear conspiratorial or extreme. But the main point is that they have asked and continue to ask questions, while a majority of their peers have done away with the scientific method or have been cowed into silence."

No they haven't. For the most part, they have course corrected as data and information have come in. They are not perfect but they aren't evil bureaucrats either. I'm willing to listen to informed views of people who may disagree with some of the science. I don't listen to Joe Rogan, a self-described comedian/entertainer and many of the people who chooses to showcase on the topic. Ditto for Bill Maher.

Nobody has ditched the scientific method except perhaps some of the folks you appear to want to listen to.
You're speaking from ignorance again, unless you've actually listened to doctors/scientists considered "fringe" by the establishment.

I'm all for asking questions, but when people don't like the answers they write off the bureaucrats/scientists as evil or incompetent is just plain silly to me.
And you think that is what the author and scientists the article is about are doing?

We have almost a million dead people and our hospitals, doctors and nurses are on the edge of collapse. Despite having multiple safe and effective vaccines that have been dosed in the billions, which are designed to keep people alive and out of the hospital. Yet far too many people make medical/vaccine decisions based upon their political persuasions rather than the facts.
I agree. Different people making better decisions/better messaging the past two years could have mitigated much of that.

You laugh at he Inquisition reference. At the time, they were considered the source of all knowledge which they claimed to have received directly from the Almighty. Of course, this was their fantasy designed specifically to keep the church in charge of things.

I have listened to some of the people you reference but have not ditched them all entirely. The few that appear credible to me I have attempted to discover more about them and their views. So far, I have not discovered any breakthroughs of any kind. Amazed that you claim to know in advance that I didn't or haven't. Perhaps change your username from TECH to KRESKIN

No doubt that actions taken over that time could have mitigated some of it but IMHO no amount of action could move the vast majority of those who won't get vaccinated.

If I'm not mistaken you yourself have taken and benefited from the vaccines, yet you continue to defend those who make outrageous and false claims about them.

Lastly, scientific method is not a function of who you are listening to. So why do you consider some credible and other not simply because they came to a different conclusions?

[Typical Lax Dad]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

... dissidents.. More like propagandists.

We have zoomed past 906,000 dead Americans in under two years. A hands off approach would have resulted in less COVID-19 deaths.

[tech37]

You laugh at he Inquisition reference. At the time, they were considered the source of all knowledge which they claimed to have received directly from the Almighty. Of course, this was their fantasy designed specifically to keep the church in charge of things.
You're correct, I do laugh at your Inquisition reference.

I have listened to some of the people you reference but have not ditched them all entirely. The few that appear credible to me I have attempted to discover more about them and their views. So far, I have not discovered any breakthroughs of any kind. Amazed that you claim to know in advance that I didn't or haven't. Perhaps change your username from TECH to KRESKIN
Maybe so. Perhaps if you had been more transparent/honest discourse, I wouldn't need to resort to Kreskin. That's your prerogative of course.

No doubt that actions taken over that time could have mitigated some of it but IMHO no amount of action could move the vast majority of those who won't get vaccinated.
Vaccines plus early treatment would have saved thousands. We were only allowed the vaccine part.

If I'm not mistaken you yourself have taken and benefited from the vaccines, yet you continue to defend those who make outrageous and false claims about them.
I assume I've benefitted from the vaccine, I don't know for certain. Other factors could be involved. I haven't been infected yet and I know for a fact I've been exposed, more than once.

As for the rest of your sentence, that's disingenuous. It seems you have spent time at the a fan school of debate. I don't defend anyone who "make outrageous claims," I do defend anyone's right to make their personal healthcare decision(s).

Lastly, scientific method is not a function of who you are listening to. Silly. So why do you consider some credible and other not simply because they came to a different conclusions?
As the article suggests, there hasn't been any scientific method. It has been suppressed. I'd say that seems accurate based on what I've gleaned from multiple sources over the past two years.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Doing nothing would have been better.

[jhu72]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

... dissidents.. More like propagandists.

We have zoomed past 906,000 dead Americans in under two years. A hands off approach would have resulted less COVID-19 deaths.

... I'm sure it would have.

[Typical Lax Dad]

The Dissidents

A handful of scientists and doctors have spent the past two years defending mainstream public health approaches and scientific rigor against the pandemic response bureaucracy

"There is no scientific truth, only replicable science. Then it becomes theory, but not law. And not truth. There are fundamental laws of physics that have been overturned. Law is not truth, law is law, and in science, law can be overturned."

"Somehow, in the madness, fear, confusion, and paranoia of our two-year sojourn through COVID-19, that basic definition of scientific truth—that it is ever-evolving, and inimical to dogmatism—has been largely mocked, denigrated, and ignored, if not met with slogans like “believe science.”

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/scie ... dissidents

... dissidents.. More like propagandists.

We have zoomed past 906,000 dead Americans in under two years. A hands off approach would have resulted less COVID-19 deaths.

... I'm sure it would have.

Letting the people decide how to combat Covid makes more sense. Their lives, their choice!

[jhu72]

... in other bad news Omicron 2.0 is 1.5 times more contagious than the original omicron. Coming to billions of people near you.

F me for calling attention to this.

Don't worry though, it is just a democrat hoax. It will only affect sinners in the big cities who don't drink bleach and don't take ivermectin. Don't worry, if you are turning blue, that only means you are doing it right. MAGA

[Farfromgeneva]

... in other bad news Omicron 2.0 is 1.5 times more contagious than the original omicron. Coming to billions of people near you.

F me for calling attention to this.

Don't worry though, it is just a democrat hoax. It will only affect sinners in the big cities who don't drink bleach and don't take ivermectin. Don't worry, if you are turning blue, that only means you are doing it right. MAGA

Never had a bleach cocktail but does it count that my friend and I once drank a bottle of anbesol before our respective sports practices? Back when trying out different stuff seemed like a good idea.

[Bart]

You laugh at he Inquisition reference. At the time, they were considered the source of all knowledge which they claimed to have received directly from the Almighty. Of course, this was their fantasy designed specifically to keep the church in charge of things.
You're correct, I do laugh at your Inquisition reference.

I have listened to some of the people you reference but have not ditched them all entirely. The few that appear credible to me I have attempted to discover more about them and their views. So far, I have not discovered any breakthroughs of any kind. Amazed that you claim to know in advance that I didn't or haven't. Perhaps change your username from TECH to KRESKIN
Maybe so. Perhaps if you had been more transparent/honest discourse, I wouldn't need to resort to Kreskin. That's your prerogative of course.

No doubt that actions taken over that time could have mitigated some of it but IMHO no amount of action could move the vast majority of those who won't get vaccinated.
Vaccines plus early treatment would have saved thousands. We were only allowed the vaccine part.

If I'm not mistaken you yourself have taken and benefited from the vaccines, yet you continue to defend those who make outrageous and false claims about them.
I assume I've benefitted from the vaccine, I don't know for certain. Other factors could be involved. I haven't been infected yet and I know for a fact I've been exposed, more than once.

As for the rest of your sentence, that's disingenuous. It seems you have spent time at the a fan school of debate. I don't defend anyone who "make outrageous claims," I do defend anyone's right to make their personal healthcare decision(s).

Lastly, scientific method is not a function of who you are listening to. Silly. So why do you consider some credible and other not simply because they came to a different conclusions?
As the article suggests, there hasn't been any scientific method. It has been suppressed. I'd say that seems accurate based on what I've gleaned from multiple sources over the past two years.

Tech, you have said it several times....what early treatments are you focusing on that have not been utilized?

[Kismet]

You laugh at he Inquisition reference. At the time, they were considered the source of all knowledge which they claimed to have received directly from the Almighty. Of course, this was their fantasy designed specifically to keep the church in charge of things.
You're correct, I do laugh at your Inquisition reference.

I have listened to some of the people you reference but have not ditched them all entirely. The few that appear credible to me I have attempted to discover more about them and their views. So far, I have not discovered any breakthroughs of any kind. Amazed that you claim to know in advance that I didn't or haven't. Perhaps change your username from TECH to KRESKIN
Maybe so. Perhaps if you had been more transparent/honest discourse, I wouldn't need to resort to Kreskin. That's your prerogative of course.

No doubt that actions taken over that time could have mitigated some of it but IMHO no amount of action could move the vast majority of those who won't get vaccinated.
Vaccines plus early treatment would have saved thousands. We were only allowed the vaccine part.

If I'm not mistaken you yourself have taken and benefited from the vaccines, yet you continue to defend those who make outrageous and false claims about them.
I assume I've benefitted from the vaccine, I don't know for certain. Other factors could be involved. I haven't been infected yet and I know for a fact I've been exposed, more than once.

As for the rest of your sentence, that's disingenuous. It seems you have spent time at the a fan school of debate. I don't defend anyone who "make outrageous claims," I do defend anyone's right to make their personal healthcare decision(s).

Lastly, scientific method is not a function of who you are listening to. Silly. So why do you consider some credible and other not simply because they came to a different conclusions?
As the article suggests, there hasn't been any scientific method. It has been suppressed. I'd say that seems accurate based on what I've gleaned from multiple sources over the past two years.

Tech, you have said it several times....what early treatments are you focusing on that have not been utilized?

Feel free to laugh at my Inquisition reference. I might suggest you do a bit more research before dismissing it out of hand. Quite ironic that you appear to be doing what you rail at others here for doing similar things.

​“Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”–George Santayana, The Life of Reason, 1905.

I disagree that there has not been ANY scientific method applied. That said, plenty of pseudo-method flying about on both sides.

If that's the way you feel about vaccines why did you even get one in the first place if there's is no evidence that it works?
Seem incredible to me but happy to listen to you elaborate further.

[jhu72]

... happy feet vs likely reality.