All Things Environment

[Farfromgeneva]

For those interested in doing something that is within your control that would help tremendously.

How to beat climate change.

My wife and I are largely already there. Every appliance is electric. Primary power is wind turbine supplied by utility company. No gas, no wood, no oil for heating, cooking, etc. Backup generator is tri-fuel, non-renewable energy whole house, but is hardly ever used. Our sole deficiency is our cars. Both are fuel efficient, well maintained decade+ old. I hardly ever use mine, my wife's is our primary auto, a RAV 4 with a quarter million miles on it. Next auto will be electric to replace the RAV 4, will probably never replace mine.

This is not virtue signaling, it is just an illustration of how straight forward it is to do something that makes sense for the planet. You are participating in a workable plan that will help the planet.

Wind isn’t that easy everywhere. Read an interview w CEO of Southern Co and they have to import wind generated power from the Midwest. Solar panels have a near 20yr payback just not worth it for the upfront cost now that subsidies have shrunk to very little. My office is less than 2mi from my house, getting rid of it end of year anyway, but I can ride a bike at my laptops in a backpack to driving is only for road trips at this point. Got nest thermostats. That’s the extent of me doing my part for now.

- no question availability and prices will vary by region and power company at this time. The key point is that renewable will be coming into the house at a good price as we move forward. Timing will vary, but the network will deliver it with declining prices. Tie-ing in homeowner owned power generation of all types will be handled by the distribution grid with sell back to the grid. Biden's plan is aligned to support this type of go forward plan. If you stick with electric appliances for heating, cooking, hot water, etc., you should have no problem. Driving down energy usage will be the job of industry making more efficient electrical appliances. It is a sustainable design. Fossil fuel delivery (pipes) to the home will ultimately go away most likely.

I can't use a electric stovetop, sorry. Thought the solar panel prices would get more market competitive by now but they haven't.

CEO of BofA made a statement that the public sector can't handle the transformation away from fossil fuels and hes probably right. Has to come from private capital.

I pitched to my sister for her very modest retirement account that she look at Nextera, formerly Florida Power and Light. They were an early adopter of renewables in their generation portfolio as a consolidated energy provider (as you've noted there's been largely a separation of the highly regulated T&D and generation in many areas of the country, mostly in the 90s and early 2000s I believe). I still think there's an appropriate place for Nuclear in the overall portfolio.

Have you tried induction? Skeptical at first, but now sold on it. You may have to buy some new pans, but it heats fast and has quite a bit of temperature control. Used just a cast iron skillet and dutch oven for w few months when we first got it. Added other pans as needed.

Seeing the same on pricing for residential solar here in PA.

I'll look into it but no I haven't. Have been using my dormant cast iron a lot more lately just hate constant hand cleaning and re-seasoning them but they cook better for most stuff for sure.

[jhu72]

For those interested in doing something that is within your control that would help tremendously.

How to beat climate change.

My wife and I are largely already there. Every appliance is electric. Primary power is wind turbine supplied by utility company. No gas, no wood, no oil for heating, cooking, etc. Backup generator is tri-fuel, non-renewable energy whole house, but is hardly ever used. Our sole deficiency is our cars. Both are fuel efficient, well maintained decade+ old. I hardly ever use mine, my wife's is our primary auto, a RAV 4 with a quarter million miles on it. Next auto will be electric to replace the RAV 4, will probably never replace mine.

This is not virtue signaling, it is just an illustration of how straight forward it is to do something that makes sense for the planet. You are participating in a workable plan that will help the planet.

Wind isn’t that easy everywhere. Read an interview w CEO of Southern Co and they have to import wind generated power from the Midwest. Solar panels have a near 20yr payback just not worth it for the upfront cost now that subsidies have shrunk to very little. My office is less than 2mi from my house, getting rid of it end of year anyway, but I can ride a bike at my laptops in a backpack to driving is only for road trips at this point. Got nest thermostats. That’s the extent of me doing my part for now.

- no question availability and prices will vary by region and power company at this time. The key point is that renewable will be coming into the house at a good price as we move forward. Timing will vary, but the network will deliver it with declining prices. Tie-ing in homeowner owned power generation of all types will be handled by the distribution grid with sell back to the grid. Biden's plan is aligned to support this type of go forward plan. If you stick with electric appliances for heating, cooking, hot water, etc., you should have no problem. Driving down energy usage will be the job of industry making more efficient electrical appliances. It is a sustainable design. Fossil fuel delivery (pipes) to the home will ultimately go away most likely.

I can't use a electric stovetop, sorry. Thought the solar panel prices would get more market competitive by now but they haven't.

CEO of BofA made a statement that the public sector can't handle the transformation away from fossil fuels and hes probably right. Has to come from private capital.

I pitched to my sister for her very modest retirement account that she look at Nextera, formerly Florida Power and Light. They were an early adopter of renewables in their generation portfolio as a consolidated energy provider (as you've noted there's been largely a separation of the highly regulated T&D and generation in many areas of the country, mostly in the 90s and early 2000s I believe). I still think there's an appropriate place for Nuclear in the overall portfolio.

... I agree on the nuclear. Nuclear doesn't have to be the scary option it is made out to be, even with today's mildly problematic technology. But you will never convince a majority of the US population that it has a place. Another market where fossil fuel companies have executed an effective but fraudulent marketing campaign.

[Farfromgeneva]

I knew playing risk a bunch as a kid would pay off

Climate shuffles superpowers
Zachary Basu
Zachary Basu
Map of areas with potential for climate hazards
Data: Department of Defense Risk Analysis Oct. 2021; Map: Jacque Schrag/Axios
Drought, rising sea levels and melting ice caps are transforming the geopolitical map at the same time China's rise and revanchist Russia are testing the limits of American power.

Driving the news: These dynamics, outlined in the first-ever National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) on climate change, released last month, played out this past week at the COP26 climate summit in Glasgow. President Biden rebuked China's Xi Jinping for failing to show up or present new commitments.

Why it matters: U.S. intelligence assessments show climate change is threatening military assets and opening new fronts in the great-power competition defining the 21st century.

Biden has sought to place the "existential threat" of climate change squarely at the center of his national security policy, while at the same time casting China as the "biggest geopolitical challenge" facing the U.S.
Those two priorities are inextricably linked: China is the world's largest source of carbon emissions, and its cooperation is critical to preventing some of the worst effects of global warming.
Details: The NIE, which was mandated in Biden's first week in office, lays out three main risks to U.S. national security interests through 2040.

1. Geopolitical tensions will intensify as countries debate who bears responsibility to act — and who is not doing enough to combat climate change.

Chinese officials have refused to agree to U.S. requests on climate until the Biden administration drops its rhetoric on Beijing's human rights abuses and aggression toward Taiwan.
Some Chinese officials also point to the fact that industrialized countries have far higher cumulative emissions, and have accused the U.S. of politicizing the climate agenda to depress China's economic growth.
2. The global map itself is physically changing, establishing new frontiers for competition and exacerbating cross-border flashpoints.

Melting sea ice in the Arctic will create new shipping routes, free up oil and mineral resources, and pave the way for greater economic competition.
The risk of military confrontation or miscalculation will also grow, as the U.S. and China seek to bolster their presence in a region dominated by Russia.
In the Indo-Pacific, which the Biden administration has identified as the new global center of strategic rivalry, sea-level rise and more frequent extreme events will put key military assets at risk, the Pentagon said in a new climate risk analysis.
Growing water and resource scarcity could turn China's simmering tensions with India — another burgeoning global power and a key partner to the U.S. — into an outright conflict.
3. The effects of the climate crisis will be felt most acutely in developing countries, which will depend on humanitarian assistance and foreign investment to bolster their resilience.

China already has a strong foothold in many sub-Saharan African and Asian countries, and continues to grow its influence through the Belt and Road infrastructure initiative.
The bottom line: Addressing climate change while staying competitive with strategic rivals is not a zero-sum game, says John Conger, a former senior Pentagon official who oversaw energy installations and the environment during the Obama administration.

He equated it to a chess match in which players sitting across from each other must navigate a changing board.
"If you start losing or gaining squares, that is part of the whole picture," Conger told Axios. "And they're not immune from any of this."

[jhu72]

... the world is looking for and needs a leader. Perfect endeavor to show how exceptional America is, after showing what bozos we can be for past 50 years.

[Farfromgeneva]

... the world is looking for and needs a leader. Perfect endeavor to show how exceptional America is, after showing what bozos we can be for past 50 years.

A reimagining of geopolitics would be in order for sure. But I’m not sure we’re flipping the paradigm so much as just moving along the spectrum (meaning anyone who pays attention to this issue) while maintaining the same organizational framework.

It also looks like this summit has turned into “Davos light” (effectively paraphrased from something else I had read recently). In that regard it’s hard to demonstrate leadership under a false agenda to begin with. My point being is that it’s hard to separate the reality of the issues from the PR Bs of it these days.

[Peter Brown]

... the world is looking for and needs a leader. Perfect endeavor to show how exceptional America is, after showing what bozos we can be for past 50 years.

Any American political party that promotes critical race theory, preferred pronouns, ‘kneeling’, two national anthems, teacher unions as priority, defunding the police, rampant high crime, high inflation, mask and vaccine mandates, founders’ statue topplings, Antifa, burning cities, and a full stripping of our civil rights might be applauded by our enemies abroad, but even they won’t look at us as ‘leaders’….they’re laughing at us behind our backs.

The American people, gratefully, registered their feelings about that party last Tuesday night. More to come next fall.

[MDlaxfan76]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

[cradleandshoot]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

[youthathletics]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

In my Greata voice... "How darrre youuu"

Some people lack the ability to walk and chew gum. Not one person in this world believes we should treat mother earth like mother earth like shyt....well maybe a handful of corporate douchebags. It is no different than their messaging on damned near everything else....which is borderline sci-fi...'we have to save you from yourself, and we need your money to do it, and never mind what I do or how wealthy I get in the process'.

The US has been going green for damned near 3 decades.....just look up USGBC, and we have rocked it here on our turf and only getting better. But the sky is falling message is played out.

[Peter Brown]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

In my Greata voice... "How darrre youuu"

Some people lack the ability to walk and chew gum. Not one person in this world believes we should treat mother earth like mother earth like shyt....well maybe a handful of corporate douchebags. It is no different than their messaging on damned near everything else....which is borderline sci-fi...'we have to save you from yourself, and we need your money to do it, and never mind what I do or how wealthy I get in the process'.

The US has been going green for damned near 3 decades.....just look up USGBC, and we have rocked it here on our turf and only getting better. But the sky is falling message is played out.

The excessive histrionics of the left are indeed their Achilles heel. If you read or listen to their speeches, you’d think the world is dead already.

Total clowns.

I have no doubt that climate has changed. It will always change. But what these numbskulls want is not for climate to revert to mean (as if!), they simply want an excuse to tax corporations and individuals more, all the while promoting some kind of bizarre one world government. So the left latches on to a partially correct theory, but need to blow it completely out of proportion. So normal people tune them out…so they get more hysterically woke. The cycle continues.

Nothing would delight a Democrat more than stealing 95% of Elon Musks stock, which would of course crater the stock, hurting every shareholder. But as the saying goes, the left simply wants everyone to be equally miserable…they abhor success.

Normal people reject this idiocy. Normal people like opportunity and excellence. Normal people win in the end. Be a normal person.

[cradleandshoot]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

In my Greata voice... "How darrre youuu"

Some people lack the ability to walk and chew gum. Not one person in this world believes we should treat mother earth like mother earth like shyt....well maybe a handful of corporate douchebags. It is no different than their messaging on damned near everything else....which is borderline sci-fi...'we have to save you from yourself, and we need your money to do it, and never mind what I do or how wealthy I get in the process'.

The US has been going green for damned near 3 decades.....just look up USGBC, and we have rocked it here on our turf and only getting better. But the sky is falling message is played out.

Especially when it involves $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. We are now talking about trillions of dollars. i walked Roxy this morning and we just walked in the door. I only picked up a half a bag of trash thrown on the side of the road. So who exactly are we saving the planet for? If you have lived at least 18 years and you can't grasp the concept of a trash can then maybe the planet doesn't need to be saved. How many trillions of dollars will it take to educate people to throw your effing trash in the proper place? I suggest we start there.

[cradleandshoot]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

In my Greata voice... "How darrre youuu"

Some people lack the ability to walk and chew gum. Not one person in this world believes we should treat mother earth like mother earth like shyt....well maybe a handful of corporate douchebags. It is no different than their messaging on damned near everything else....which is borderline sci-fi...'we have to save you from yourself, and we need your money to do it, and never mind what I do or how wealthy I get in the process'.

The US has been going green for damned near 3 decades.....just look up USGBC, and we have rocked it here on our turf and only getting better. But the sky is falling message is played out.

The excessive histrionics of the left are indeed their Achilles heel. If you read or listen to their speeches, you’d think the world is dead already.

Total clowns.

I have no doubt that climate has changed. It will always change. But what these numbskulls want is not for climate to revert to mean (as if!), they simply want an excuse to tax corporations and individuals more, all the while promoting some kind of bizarre one world government. So the left latches on to a partially correct theory, but need to blow it completely out of proportion. So normal people tune them out…so they get more hysterically woke. The cycle continues.

Nothing would delight a Democrat more than stealing 95% of Elon Musks stock, which would of course crater the stock, hurting every shareholder. But as the saying goes, the left simply wants everyone to be equally miserable…they abhor success.

Normal people reject this idiocy. Normal people like opportunity and excellence. Normal people win in the end. Be a normal person.

+1 Pete. Your post is the reason why some folks on this forum are scared to death of people like Dr Roy Spencer. It takes balls to go against the mainstream environmental terrorists. When a young girl like Greta has been granted expert status as an environmentalist activist... say no more.

[jhu72]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

... bullsh*t! It is too late for that. We now have a methane problem, putting that back in the ground is infinitely more difficult than the CO2 problem. Exactly what was predicted by the scientists has happened. We warmed the planet enough with CO2, that we are freeing naturally sequestered methane now, more and more. The methane is more potent than the CO2 (as a greenhouse gas). Cutting CO2 is required, but it doesn't solve the problem by itself any longer. The longer we take to significantly cut CO2, the more methane we release and the more quickly it grows hotter still.

Don't worry thought, its just another democrat hoax. Just like coronavirus it won't effect non-democrats.

[jhu72]

Is the "All things Environment" thread?
Or the dumb Petey rant thread?

IMO Pete's opinion probably makes more sense than the fear mongering that is perpetuated on this thread. There are times where a tangent can be refreshing indeed. I do know that if we " invest" trillions of dollars mother earth will show her gratitude and save us from global warming. There is a huge difference between being good stewards of our planet and thinking we can change what mother earth will do. What exactly is the mechanism that reverses global warming? All we have to do is lower our CO2 emissions and we are out of the woods. Too bad the Chicoms don't give two figs about saving the planet. They would prefer to become the worlds next global super power... damn the planet in the process. Why is it that I bet if we looked at the investment portfolios of the environmental fear mongers we would see where they are investing their money...

In my Greata voice... "How darrre youuu"

Some people lack the ability to walk and chew gum. Not one person in this world believes we should treat mother earth like mother earth like shyt....well maybe a handful of corporate douchebags. It is no different than their messaging on damned near everything else....which is borderline sci-fi...'we have to save you from yourself, and we need your money to do it, and never mind what I do or how wealthy I get in the process'.

The US has been going green for damned near 3 decades.....just look up USGBC, and we have rocked it here on our turf and only getting better. But the sky is falling message is played out.

The excessive histrionics of the left are indeed their Achilles heel. If you read or listen to their speeches, you’d think the world is dead already.

Total clowns.

I have no doubt that climate has changed. It will always change. But what these numbskulls want is not for climate to revert to mean (as if!), they simply want an excuse to tax corporations and individuals more, all the while promoting some kind of bizarre one world government. So the left latches on to a partially correct theory, but need to blow it completely out of proportion. So normal people tune them out…so they get more hysterically woke. The cycle continues.

Nothing would delight a Democrat more than stealing 95% of Elon Musks stock, which would of course crater the stock, hurting every shareholder. But as the saying goes, the left simply wants everyone to be equally miserable…they abhor success.

Normal people reject this idiocy. Normal people like opportunity and excellence. Normal people win in the end. Be a normal person.

+1 Pete. Your post is the reason why some folks on this forum are scared to death of people like Dr Roy Spencer. It takes balls to go against the mainstream environmental terrorists. When a young girl like Greta has been granted expert status as an environmentalist activist... say no more.

Spencer has already been proven wrong.

[MDlaxfan76]

Well, the positive is that the idiocy is at least focused on the actual thread topic.

But it's such stupid hyperbole from the right. The denial of reality is truly ridiculous.

There's a legitimate discussion to be had about how best to address the issues, including how to get other countries to do so, but the denial stuff is ridiculous.

[Peter Brown]

Well, the positive is that the idiocy is at least focused on the actual thread topic.

But it's such stupid hyperbole from the right. The denial of reality is truly ridiculous.

There's a legitimate discussion to be had about how best to address the issues, including how to get other countries to do so, but the denial stuff is ridiculous.

When policymakers are informed primarily by unrealistic worst-case scenarios, to the exclusion of any data that challenges them, you end up with panicked, unworkable, unrealistic and financially infeasible proposals. They’re really good at generating debates and political stalemates, but terrible at solving problems. This kind of unmitigated alarm has far more influence over policy making than those who believe climate change is a hoax, which is simply not true, and so it’s really the alarmists who are preventing us from finding real solutions to the problem.

[MDlaxfan76]

Nonsense. Total obstructionism is the issue. Fueled by the carbon lobby.

Finally, finally, there's policy progress. But only over enormous obstruction.

And I don't see any aspect of those policies that don't make sound economic sense.

I'm open to smarter, better policies but the notion that private enterprise, unregulated, un-incentivized by government policy, will consistently or even mostly do the right thing in any such 'tragedy of the commons' matter is ridiculous on its face.

[jhu72]

Well, the positive is that the idiocy is at least focused on the actual thread topic.

But it's such stupid hyperbole from the right. The denial of reality is truly ridiculous.

There's a legitimate discussion to be had about how best to address the issues, including how to get other countries to do so, but the denial stuff is ridiculous.

When policymakers are informed primarily by unrealistic worst-case scenarios, to the exclusion of any data that challenges them, you end up with panicked, unworkable, unrealistic and financially infeasible proposals. They’re really good at generating debates and political stalemates, but terrible at solving problems. This kind of unmitigated alarm has far more influence over policy making than those who believe climate change is a hoax, which is simply not true, and so it’s really the alarmists who are preventing us from finding real solutions to the problem.

-- trying to get on the right side of the lord.

[Peter Brown]

Well, the positive is that the idiocy is at least focused on the actual thread topic.

But it's such stupid hyperbole from the right. The denial of reality is truly ridiculous.

There's a legitimate discussion to be had about how best to address the issues, including how to get other countries to do so, but the denial stuff is ridiculous.

When policymakers are informed primarily by unrealistic worst-case scenarios, to the exclusion of any data that challenges them, you end up with panicked, unworkable, unrealistic and financially infeasible proposals. They’re really good at generating debates and political stalemates, but terrible at solving problems. This kind of unmitigated alarm has far more influence over policy making than those who believe climate change is a hoax, which is simply not true, and so it’s really the alarmists who are preventing us from finding real solutions to the problem.

-- trying to get on the right side of the lord.

I’ll receive that as a compliment jhu.

Most people will not undertake the search for God wholeheartedly unless driven thereto by trouble of some kind.

(meanwhile, enjoy your life; the earth will stick around a couple billion more years)

[jhu72]

Well, the positive is that the idiocy is at least focused on the actual thread topic.

But it's such stupid hyperbole from the right. The denial of reality is truly ridiculous.

There's a legitimate discussion to be had about how best to address the issues, including how to get other countries to do so, but the denial stuff is ridiculous.

When policymakers are informed primarily by unrealistic worst-case scenarios, to the exclusion of any data that challenges them, you end up with panicked, unworkable, unrealistic and financially infeasible proposals. They’re really good at generating debates and political stalemates, but terrible at solving problems. This kind of unmitigated alarm has far more influence over policy making than those who believe climate change is a hoax, which is simply not true, and so it’s really the alarmists who are preventing us from finding real solutions to the problem.

-- trying to get on the right side of the lord.

I’ll receive that as a compliment jhu.

Most people will not undertake the search for God wholeheartedly unless driven thereto by trouble of some kind.

(meanwhile, enjoy your life; the earth will stick around a couple billion more years)

... which is exactly your position in your post I referenced.