January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

[youthathletics]

Talk about tin foil hats....these so called published 'opinion' journalists writing these stories are quite telling. Interesting, why these stories are selected for the NYT, of all papers. They all enf up sounding like a group of Broney's at a sleepover, telling stories, where they all agree with each other just so they can continue their make-believe lives. Probably afraid of the dark, shadows, and the sun.

[seacoaster]

Talk about tin foil hats....these so called published 'opinion' journalists writing these stories are quite telling. Interesting, why these stories are selected for the NYT, of all papers. They all enf up sounding like a group of Broney's at a sleepover, telling stories, where they all agree with each other just so they can continue their make-believe lives. Probably afraid of the dark, shadows, and the sun.

The author seems to be your kind of guy:

https://www.nationalreview.com/author/k ... illiamson/

You laughing this off is, of course, completely on brand. You seem to have ardently resisted the idea that your preferred party is made up of astonishingly anti-democratic people in Congress, and perhaps worse still at the state level.

[MDlaxfan76]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

[runrussellrun]

Top general was so fearful Trump might spark war that he made secret calls to his Chinese counterpart, new book says
‘Peril,’ by Bob Woodward and Robert Costa, reveals that Gen. Mark A. Milley called his Chinese counterpart before the election and after Jan. 6 in a bid to avert armed conflict.

Is this normal, or even legal ? Sergeant Majors and Master Chiefs making diplomatic policy ?

And, as if we had never heard ANYONE worried about Trump....nuclear codes.....and having them, prior to this bizarre event.

"Top" general ? sayz who.

Joint chiefs is corrupt. NCO's can clean the local public HS rest rooms, we've got Board meetings and stock options to figure out.


"mahnn.....I hate officers" oddball

[cradleandshoot]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

I disagree with you strongly. My own sister back in 1970 was cheering on the attempts of these people to overthrow our government. They did it for years and a piece of chit like Bill Ayers may or may not have been idolized by a former president. The redneck yahoos that stormed our nation's capital were no different than what the weather underground wanted in 1970. Fortunately the dumbasses blew themselves up before they could achieve their goals. An anarchist is an anarchist no matter what side of the political spectrum they fall on. The fact a low life murdering scumbag like Bill Ayers didn't spend the rest of his life in a jail cell. In a freak circus world he becomes a respected college professor adored by every FLP on this forum. How many of those rednecks from Jan. 6 will gain such respectable status?

[cradleandshoot]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

[MDlaxfan76]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

[Kismet]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

If you are in the present - here is the current incarnation of Weather Underground

https://www.wunderground.com/

It's part of the WEATHER CHANNEL.
I'm sure we can all get behind that!

[cradleandshoot]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

I would not be mad at the weather underground if the leaders of them had not gone on to become respected members of society. How did that happen and why does it not bother you? Does the passing of time allow your memory to fade? These people were actively involved in the bombing of various federal government buildings. Your lame excuse is they were small in numbers. They also had very large support from the many thousands of people that agreed with their tactics. My sister was one of those people who had no problem with the tactics being used. In a perfect world MD Bill Ayers should be rotting in a jail cell. Depending on who you believe he had a future POTUS at his house for a political event. I don't forget what happened in 1970 MD. My sister was on the front lines supporting it. The same reason a few years later my sister was at my throat when I joined the army. I will never forget it. It was a huge part of my life during that time. My sister and I still talk about it today. Make no mistakes, my sister and I love each other to no end. I didn't learn about this from Fox news my friend. I have lived this debate for more than 50 years. Those Fox news people are neewbies to the party IMO.

[cradleandshoot]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

If you are in the present - here is the current incarnation of Weather Underground

https://www.wunderground.com/

It's part of the WEATHER CHANNEL.
I'm sure we can all get behind that!

I'm glad you think people dying is funny. It was 50 years ago. Who remembers back that far anyways. I always love it when there is no logical point of view that FLP folks venture over into stupidville taking a detour down dumbass street.

[youthathletics]

Talk about tin foil hats....these so called published 'opinion' journalists writing these stories are quite telling. Interesting, why these stories are selected for the NYT, of all papers. They all enf up sounding like a group of Broney's at a sleepover, telling stories, where they all agree with each other just so they can continue their make-believe lives. Probably afraid of the dark, shadows, and the sun.

The author seems to be your kind of guy:

https://www.nationalreview.com/author/k ... illiamson/

You laughing this off is, of course, completely on brand. You seem to have ardently resisted the idea that your preferred party is made up of astonishingly anti-democratic people in Congress, and perhaps worse still at the state level.

Get over yourself, seacoaster. These fringe knuckleheads are just that. You just keep doing what you do best, by putting everyone in a nice little box, whilst telling everyone 'they' are partisan.

[seacoaster]

Talk about tin foil hats....these so called published 'opinion' journalists writing these stories are quite telling. Interesting, why these stories are selected for the NYT, of all papers. They all enf up sounding like a group of Broney's at a sleepover, telling stories, where they all agree with each other just so they can continue their make-believe lives. Probably afraid of the dark, shadows, and the sun.

The author seems to be your kind of guy:

https://www.nationalreview.com/author/k ... illiamson/

You laughing this off is, of course, completely on brand. You seem to have ardently resisted the idea that your preferred party is made up of astonishingly anti-democratic people in Congress, and perhaps worse still at the state level.

Get over yourself, seacoaster. These fringe knuckleheads are just that. You just keep doing what you do best, by putting everyone in a nice little box, whilst telling everyone 'they' are partisan.

Are you saying that Williamson is a "fringe knucklehead"? Or someone else? If you look at what is happening across the country in GOP-controlled statehouses, Williamson's canary call seems pretty much on the money.

And to be clear: I have never said I wasn't partisan. I am. I'm not calling "everyone" else partisan; I'm calling today's GOP in Congress and in statehouses anti-democratic would-be authoritarians.

[Kismet]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

I disagree with you strongly. My own sister back in 1970 was cheering on the attempts of these people to overthrow our government. They did it for years and a piece of chit like Bill Ayers may or may not have been idolized by a former president. The redneck yahoos that stormed our nation's capital were no different than what the weather underground wanted in 1970. Fortunately the dumbasses blew themselves up before they could achieve their goals. An anarchist is an anarchist no matter what side of the political spectrum they fall on. The fact a low life murdering scumbag like Bill Ayers didn't spend the rest of his life in a jail cell. In a freak circus world he becomes a respected college professor adored by every FLP on this forum. How many of those rednecks from Jan. 6 will gain such respectable status?

Interesting to know that an anarchist is who brought the USA Theodore Roosevelt after shooting President William McKinley in 1901 in Buffalo NY.

The reason Ayers never served a jail term is because the FBI screwed up its investigation and prosecution of not only Ayers but many other radicals of the time. Google COINTELPRO....and thank J. Edgar Hoover for its formation in the 1950s.

[cradleandshoot]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

I disagree with you strongly. My own sister back in 1970 was cheering on the attempts of these people to overthrow our government. They did it for years and a piece of chit like Bill Ayers may or may not have been idolized by a former president. The redneck yahoos that stormed our nation's capital were no different than what the weather underground wanted in 1970. Fortunately the dumbasses blew themselves up before they could achieve their goals. An anarchist is an anarchist no matter what side of the political spectrum they fall on. The fact a low life murdering scumbag like Bill Ayers didn't spend the rest of his life in a jail cell. In a freak circus world he becomes a respected college professor adored by every FLP on this forum. How many of those rednecks from Jan. 6 will gain such respectable status?

Interesting to know that an anarchist is who brought the USA Theodore Roosevelt after shooting President William McKinley in 1901 in Buffalo NY.

The reason Ayers never served a jail term is because the FBI screwed up its investigation and prosecution of not only Ayers but many other radicals of the time. Google COINTELPRO....and thank J. Edgar Hoover for its formation in the 1950s.

I have known that info about Bill Ayers for a long time. What you are telling me is that he got away with murder. What you have not explained is why and how he became such a beloved FLP icon that our former POTUS had no problem rubbing elbows with him? Is that Hoover's fault?
BTW, what happens if the feds eff up the prosecution of the 1/6ers? You gots a problem if some of them become beloved FRC college professors? You gots a problem if some future FRC presidential candidate goes to their house to rub elbows with other FRC types?

[Farfromgeneva]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

I disagree with you strongly. My own sister back in 1970 was cheering on the attempts of these people to overthrow our government. They did it for years and a piece of chit like Bill Ayers may or may not have been idolized by a former president. The redneck yahoos that stormed our nation's capital were no different than what the weather underground wanted in 1970. Fortunately the dumbasses blew themselves up before they could achieve their goals. An anarchist is an anarchist no matter what side of the political spectrum they fall on. The fact a low life murdering scumbag like Bill Ayers didn't spend the rest of his life in a jail cell. In a freak circus world he becomes a respected college professor adored by every FLP on this forum. How many of those rednecks from Jan. 6 will gain such respectable status?

Interesting to know that an anarchist is who brought the USA Theodore Roosevelt after shooting President William McKinley in 1901 in Buffalo NY.

The reason Ayers never served a jail term is because the FBI screwed up its investigation and prosecution of not only Ayers but many other radicals of the time. Google COINTELPRO....and thank J. Edgar Hoover for its formation in the 1950s.

I think Fred Hampton was familiar with Cointelpro.

[MDlaxfan76]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

I would not be mad at the weather underground if the leaders of them had not gone on to become respected members of society. How did that happen and why does it not bother you? Does the passing of time allow your memory to fade? These people were actively involved in the bombing of various federal government buildings. Your lame excuse is they were small in numbers. They also had very large support from the many thousands of people that agreed with their tactics. My sister was one of those people who had no problem with the tactics being used. In a perfect world MD Bill Ayers should be rotting in a jail cell. Depending on who you believe he had a future POTUS at his house for a political event. I don't forget what happened in 1970 MD. My sister was on the front lines supporting it. The same reason a few years later my sister was at my throat when I joined the army. I will never forget it. It was a huge part of my life during that time. My sister and I still talk about it today. Make no mistakes, my sister and I love each other to no end. I didn't learn about this from Fox news my friend. I have lived this debate for more than 50 years. Those Fox news people are neewbies to the party IMO.

As usual you are choosing to personalize this conversation down ratholes I don't want to travel. It's your family, not mine. I have enough issues in my own!

You seem to think I'd be agreeing with the Weather Underground's tactics, which is a rather preposterous assumption about me, and it's entirely off the topic we were discussing in response to someone who made, IMO, an offensive post on Twitter that compared 9-11 to Jan 6...on 9-11. Gross, regardless of the underlying merit or lack thereof of the comment.

As to Bill Ayers and any of these violent bozos in the insurrection and their supporters, I don't recall Ayers getting re-accepted into normal society, becoming a professor etc, until after he was quite repentant about those tactics, but it's not something I followed deeply.

Meanwhile, you may have missed it but a bunch of Congress men and women and Senators have been quite vocal in their support of the Jan 6 insurrectionists, several egged them on before, during and after, and of course we have the twice-impeached, authoritarian egomaniac former POTUS weighing heavily on the GOP and positioning to be the Party's nominee for 2024...all while getting a large portion of Americans to actually believe they can't trust in our election process, courts, and rule of law...all that matters is power. I don't know how many of the seditionists will occupy positions of power and influence over the coming years, including some becoming college professors or even college Presidents, but I bet a bunch will.

Without being repentant for their sedition.

[cradleandshoot]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

I would not be mad at the weather underground if the leaders of them had not gone on to become respected members of society. How did that happen and why does it not bother you? Does the passing of time allow your memory to fade? These people were actively involved in the bombing of various federal government buildings. Your lame excuse is they were small in numbers. They also had very large support from the many thousands of people that agreed with their tactics. My sister was one of those people who had no problem with the tactics being used. In a perfect world MD Bill Ayers should be rotting in a jail cell. Depending on who you believe he had a future POTUS at his house for a political event. I don't forget what happened in 1970 MD. My sister was on the front lines supporting it. The same reason a few years later my sister was at my throat when I joined the army. I will never forget it. It was a huge part of my life during that time. My sister and I still talk about it today. Make no mistakes, my sister and I love each other to no end. I didn't learn about this from Fox news my friend. I have lived this debate for more than 50 years. Those Fox news people are neewbies to the party IMO.

As usual you are choosing to personalize this conversation down ratholes I don't want to travel. It's your family, not mine. I have enough issues in my own!

You seem to think I'd be agreeing with the Weather Underground's tactics, which is a rather preposterous assumption about me, and it's entirely off the topic we were discussing in response to someone who made, IMO, an offensive post on Twitter that compared 9-11 to Jan 6...on 9-11. Gross, regardless of the underlying merit or lack thereof of the comment.

As to Bill Ayers and any of these violent bozos in the insurrection and their supporters, I don't recall Ayers getting re-accepted into normal society, becoming a professor etc, until after he was quite repentant about those tactics, but it's not something I followed deeply.

Meanwhile, you may have missed it but a bunch of Congress men and women and Senators have been quite vocal in their support of the Jan 6 insurrectionists, several egged them on before, during and after, and of course we have the twice-impeached, authoritarian egomaniac former POTUS weighing heavily on the GOP and positioning to be the Party's nominee for 2024...all while getting a large portion of Americans to actually believe they can't trust in our election process, courts, and rule of law...all that matters is power. I don't know how many of the seditionists will occupy positions of power and influence over the coming years, including some becoming college professors or even college Presidents, but I bet a bunch will.

Without being repentant for their sedition.

I was trying to make a comparison to the radicals of the 60s/70s to the radicals of today. I apologize for doing such a poor job of it. The ultimate goals of the people involved then and now were not any different. Both groups of people despised the US government for different reasons. It was personal for me back then as a newly minted teenager. You know how I feel about those people that stormed the capital on January 6. As an American who has always loved this country watching people waving the American flag while busting out capital windows and breaking down doors was the most repugnant sight I have ever seen. Any republican sitting in office defending these people should be voted out of office. I have the same sentiment as to why a guy like Bill Ayers and his crew were never repudiated by the Democrat party. I guess that validates a point I have made here many times. Way too many people from both parties will almost stand by their own and defend them until the end. I hope you have a better understanding of my dislike for both parties. Make no mistake, both parties have good people in them. I respect Liz Cheney for taking the stand that she did. I wonder how many other Republicans despise the Trumpists in the party but just will never admit it?

[seacoaster]

"I wonder how many other Republicans despise the Trumpists in the party but just will never admit it?"

I think the number in the party is big. Which only shows that there are a huge number of cowardly little people holding onto their offices and importance in every way they can, even if it means a real threat to the republic.

I think it goes like this: "I know the country is in danger because of Trumpism, but I really don't want to blow my stash on being primaried by some Marjorie-like MOFO."

How's the foot C&S? Can you walk Roxy yet??

[MDlaxfan76]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

The other "difference" you conveniently skipped over is how Bill Ayers became a beloved icon. How many of the 1/6 ers will ever achieve that status? How many college professors come out of that unruly mob?

Yeah, I doubt there were many in that crowd with the potential to be a professor. My brother-in-law, who was on the steps, has taught many a college course but never finished his PhD, so there certainly could have been other.

No, I'm not saying that the Weather Underground sorts were in way ok; thankfully, they were a tiny group and fortunately did less damage than they might have...I'm saying that the Democratic Party didn't support them and their bombing efforts. Big difference from what's happened with Jan 6. Huge group and GOP is full throat supporting their actions and the "justifications" behind it, the Big Lie. Moreover, they are actively engaged in clearly anti-democracy moves to be better positioned for "next time" they have an election they want to simply over turn, not by actually garnering more votes but but fiat.

And that's the majority of the GOP today, its apparatus and top officials. Big difference.

But you stay angry at the Weather Underground...I'll stay in the present.

I would not be mad at the weather underground if the leaders of them had not gone on to become respected members of society. How did that happen and why does it not bother you? Does the passing of time allow your memory to fade? These people were actively involved in the bombing of various federal government buildings. Your lame excuse is they were small in numbers. They also had very large support from the many thousands of people that agreed with their tactics. My sister was one of those people who had no problem with the tactics being used. In a perfect world MD Bill Ayers should be rotting in a jail cell. Depending on who you believe he had a future POTUS at his house for a political event. I don't forget what happened in 1970 MD. My sister was on the front lines supporting it. The same reason a few years later my sister was at my throat when I joined the army. I will never forget it. It was a huge part of my life during that time. My sister and I still talk about it today. Make no mistakes, my sister and I love each other to no end. I didn't learn about this from Fox news my friend. I have lived this debate for more than 50 years. Those Fox news people are neewbies to the party IMO.

As usual you are choosing to personalize this conversation down ratholes I don't want to travel. It's your family, not mine. I have enough issues in my own!

You seem to think I'd be agreeing with the Weather Underground's tactics, which is a rather preposterous assumption about me, and it's entirely off the topic we were discussing in response to someone who made, IMO, an offensive post on Twitter that compared 9-11 to Jan 6...on 9-11. Gross, regardless of the underlying merit or lack thereof of the comment.

As to Bill Ayers and any of these violent bozos in the insurrection and their supporters, I don't recall Ayers getting re-accepted into normal society, becoming a professor etc, until after he was quite repentant about those tactics, but it's not something I followed deeply.

Meanwhile, you may have missed it but a bunch of Congress men and women and Senators have been quite vocal in their support of the Jan 6 insurrectionists, several egged them on before, during and after, and of course we have the twice-impeached, authoritarian egomaniac former POTUS weighing heavily on the GOP and positioning to be the Party's nominee for 2024...all while getting a large portion of Americans to actually believe they can't trust in our election process, courts, and rule of law...all that matters is power. I don't know how many of the seditionists will occupy positions of power and influence over the coming years, including some becoming college professors or even college Presidents, but I bet a bunch will.

Without being repentant for their sedition.

I was trying to make a comparison to the radicals of the 60s/70s to the radicals of today. I apologize for doing such a poor job of it. The ultimate goals of the people involved then and now were not any different. Both groups of people despised the US government for different reasons. It was personal for me back then as a newly minted teenager. You know how I feel about those people that stormed the capital on January 6. As an American who has always loved this country watching people waving the American flag while busting out capital windows and breaking down doors was the most repugnant sight I have ever seen. Any republican sitting in office defending these people should be voted out of office. I have the same sentiment as to why a guy like Bill Ayers and his crew were never repudiated by the Democrat party. I guess that validates a point I have made here many times. Way too many people from both parties will almost stand by their own and defend them until the end. I hope you have a better understanding of my dislike for both parties. Make no mistake, both parties have good people in them. I respect Liz Cheney for taking the stand that she did. I wonder how many other Republicans despise the Trumpists in the party but just will never admit it?

Well, that's the more reasonable cradle with whom I prefer conversing!

As you know, I'm a Republican not a Democrat. But really I'm simply not a partisan, I like to think about issues, listen to various points of view, occasionally change my mind when I hear a new argument, see new data, facts, or logic. Generally pretty 'progressive' on social issues, but prefer a bit of caution over rush to fix all through government, but do think government has an important role to play...just want it to be smart and well considered, rather than ideologically dumb and unbending. Fiscally I tend conservative, as I want tax dollars spent thoughtfully and carefully to optimize return on those expenditures. I prefer investments with an ROI over temporary bandaids. Internationally I want us to be a leader, but careful in our expenditure of lives, whether our own or others.

I don't know how many of us Republicans despise Trumpism the way I do, but I have seen a sea change in my personal friends who are Republicans, by and large. Many are embarrassed by their prior support, find him detestable now whereas he was acceptable prior to say two years ago. Not all, but many.

Others in my world though are so caught up in hating Democrats they'd sell their soul to the devil rather than for Biden to succeed at anything at all. These are the types who cheered when it was announced that the US hadn't quite reached 70% adults vaccinated as of the target set by Biden of July 4.

[Kismet]

Hopefully we can get a Memorial at "Ground Zero" in the Capital for the most tragic event in US history.

https://twitter.com/PamKeithFL/status/1 ... 7463097345

That sort of hyperbole, while probably meant sincerely and maybe even justifiably in a particular sense, IMO was egregiously offensive to make on that day. Gross.

On the actual sentiment that it is more shocking to learn that a large portion of America is actually willing to dump democracy, including violently, in some sort of fever swamp delusional insurrection than it is that there are Islamist terrorists seeking to kill Americans and they can indeed do so on our own soil, I guess I'd say that I found both shocking and awful, though I was less surprised (but not less horrified) by the latter revelation of 9-11.

We'd known for quite awhile that there were Islamist/fascist terrorists that wanted to kill us, they'd struck many times, and had even almost succeeded previously in attacking the World Trade Center. Enemies from abroad was understood.

But though we knew for decades that there are lots of potential lone wolf right wing nutcases, and even some small groups of such, and they'd proven enormously dangerous as terrorists, whether antisemitic or antimuslim or racist or anti-government, the notion that the danger of actually losing our democracy was real was really brand new.

But not ok to make such a statement on a day of remembrance for 9-11. Gross.

I remember in the late 60s/early 70s a radical left wing group that wanted to overthrow the government. That is an era when bombing federal buildings was all the rage in America. Time was very kind to these terrorists. They found real jobs becoming college professors. I bet more than one is "outraged" over the mob actions of January 6. I'm guessing they are mad they never thought about storming the capital back in the day. Maybe time will be just as kind to these protesters. I wonder how many will become college professors? That seems to be the path of least resistance. I wonder if Bill Ayers was upset by these people? One fortunate thing about the Weather underground.. they were not very smart when it came to making bombs.

The difference, cradle, between this example and where we are right now is that the majority of a political Party's members and nearly all of it's apparatus and highest elected leaders believe that Jan 6 was justified, that Trump actually won, that it is fundamental to believe that in order to be a member of that Party...and that Party controls the governments of many of the States.

Back in the '60's and '70's, while there were many in the Dem Party who were anti-war, etc, only a small fringe thought that violence should be used to overthrow the government.

Jan 6, and the Party's reaction to it, has shown us something new and dangerous.

I disagree with you strongly. My own sister back in 1970 was cheering on the attempts of these people to overthrow our government. They did it for years and a piece of chit like Bill Ayers may or may not have been idolized by a former president. The redneck yahoos that stormed our nation's capital were no different than what the weather underground wanted in 1970. Fortunately the dumbasses blew themselves up before they could achieve their goals. An anarchist is an anarchist no matter what side of the political spectrum they fall on. The fact a low life murdering scumbag like Bill Ayers didn't spend the rest of his life in a jail cell. In a freak circus world he becomes a respected college professor adored by every FLP on this forum. How many of those rednecks from Jan. 6 will gain such respectable status?

Interesting to know that an anarchist is who brought the USA Theodore Roosevelt after shooting President William McKinley in 1901 in Buffalo NY.

The reason Ayers never served a jail term is because the FBI screwed up its investigation and prosecution of not only Ayers but many other radicals of the time. Google COINTELPRO....and thank J. Edgar Hoover for its formation in the 1950s.

I have known that info about Bill Ayers for a long time. What you are telling me is that he got away with murder. What you have not explained is why and how he became such a beloved FLP icon that our former POTUS had no problem rubbing elbows with him? Is that Hoover's fault?
BTW, what happens if the feds eff up the prosecution of the 1/6ers? You gots a problem if some of them become beloved FRC college professors? You gots a problem if some future FRC presidential candidate goes to their house to rub elbows with other FRC types?

The Feds screwed up BIG TIME although it remains to be seen if they could ever link him (or his wife) to any specific criminal activity let alone
murder. He subsequently took up another career in education which was and is totally legitimate. Kindly point out any praise of him by anyone here or anywhere FLP or otherwise.

If you want to make a point about them and the organization you'd be better served with Kathy Boudin and David Gilbert who were both convicted of murder in the Brinks robbery case in New York. Boudin served 20+ years before being paroled in 2003 and, as you may know, is currently an adjunct professor at Columbia. Husband Gilbert was just granted clemency by your hero King Andy Cuomo before he resigned. He is now up for parole after serving 40+ years for felony murder.

His rubbing elbows with former President was also significantly exaggerated (by the McCain campaign) and largely occurred well before Obama ever became involved in national politics but rather when he was involved in local city community organizing in Chicago.