All things CoronaVirus

[Typical Lax Dad]

well, take heart that a very large cohort that says that will soon be pondering whether how they live matters, too.
very sorry about your friend.

Died of a mystery illness. Saw him back in May. It was fun. Friends since we were 9. Many a hoop game in his alley. Working on stepping into his shoes for a project he has been working on. Sort his last thing he wanted to get done before he checked out.

[a fan]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

[Farfromgeneva]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

Some folks conflate (perceived or real) intelligence with domain knowledge. I prefer some skew in domain with a healthy dose of metaphysics from the people I learn from but one can learn from anybody of course just not necessarily what they want you to learn from them.

[runrussellrun]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

Sorry, to long a summation as to why myself, and millions of others, take Doctors advice. Really. At any time, has a doctor recommended we lose weight. Has yours ? Or limit salts ? Or , stop drinking, because it does so much damage to your body.....and on and on and on.

Great, you worship your Doc. THIS....is the point. Why do you disdain those that do not? And, more specifically, since the hate vs hate cause duh joir is "idiotic mouthbreather Trumpist antivaxx NONvaccinated"

whatever, dudes. AFAN, ask your doctors about that other posters wifes symptoms, and get back to us. Remember, the side effects list grows........but , that's right, you don't care about the corruption , possible, at the FDA and Pfeizer full approval, and Trumps FDA yadda yadds.

nope...not interested........JUST comply.


AFAN, are you a covid survivor ?

[runrussellrun]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

Some folks conflate (perceived or real) intelligence with domain knowledge. I prefer some skew in domain with a healthy dose of metaphysics from the people I learn from but one can learn from anybody of course just not necessarily what they want you to learn from them.

So, the only tyme you log on is to pile on.

Yes....it's me , that umm....sets the "tone". And yet, we go away and the hate persists in our absence. Funny, that .

I'm going to cut a growth off of my heal. I will video tape it pass it along. Wonder what the Doc would charge for removing it ? Covid, not essentional, growth removal. cosmetic.

[Farfromgeneva]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

Some folks conflate (perceived or real) intelligence with domain knowledge. I prefer some skew in domain with a healthy dose of metaphysics from the people I learn from but one can learn from anybody of course just not necessarily what they want you to learn from them.

So, the only tyme you log on is to pile on.

Yes....it's me , that umm....sets the "tone". And yet, we go away and the hate persists in our absence. Funny, that .

I'm going to cut a growth off of my heal. I will video tape it pass it along. Wonder what the Doc would charge for removing it ? Covid, not essentional, growth removal. cosmetic.

I’m tired of your behavior so you get what you give. I may resort to “they did it first” which is your entire justification for your behavior, but at least try to contribute to everyone on both sides that are attempting to participate honestly.

[runrussellrun]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

Some folks conflate (perceived or real) intelligence with domain knowledge. I prefer some skew in domain with a healthy dose of metaphysics from the people I learn from but one can learn from anybody of course just not necessarily what they want you to learn from them.

So, the only tyme you log on is to pile on.

Yes....it's me , that umm....sets the "tone". And yet, we go away and the hate persists in our absence. Funny, that .

I'm going to cut a growth off of my heal. I will video tape it pass it along. Wonder what the Doc would charge for removing it ? Covid, not essentional, growth removal. cosmetic.

I’m tired of your behavior so you get what you give. I may resort to “they did it first” which is your entire justification for your behavior, but at least try to contribute to everyone on both sides that are attempting to participate honestly.

Pretty sure the "tone" table is always set by you and yours (umm, your "TAATS " comment, unwarranted, yes )

Nah, pretty juvinille to ignore peoples responses to my posts. Offering attempts at participating honestly. That what you read when you and they type your tripe.

I mean, if were being honest here. F ind it comical that anyone could actually "dislike" someone, online, who they have no idea about, enough to reply the ways you guys do. Comical and bizzarre.

[Farfromgeneva]

No, you're a sheep because you want others to listen to your doctor, as well.

You keep saying you want an honest discussion. Then you come back with cr*p like this.

I want you to listen to YOUR doctor. You did. I"m happy. I hope you have a long and healthy life.

But this is the second time you've insulted me now. Don't expect a kind reply if you do it again.

Why think, at all, when we have your doctors advice ?

Because I don't have a PhD, and I'm not an idiot. I go to my doctor for all things medical. I pay her thousands and thousand of dollars for her advice. I follow it to the letter, every time. In fact, I just got a flu shot and a tetanus booster yesterday on her advice....no fake internet research. And I didn't pick up the latest issue of JAMA, and pretend like I understand what's in it. I did what I was told. I always do.

And when you have a life threatening problem? You run straight to your doctor or the ER. Every time. Without exception. You don't run to the internet to "do research". You go to someone who knows what the hell they're talking about. Just like the rest of the sheep.

Some folks conflate (perceived or real) intelligence with domain knowledge. I prefer some skew in domain with a healthy dose of metaphysics from the people I learn from but one can learn from anybody of course just not necessarily what they want you to learn from them.

So, the only tyme you log on is to pile on.

Yes....it's me , that umm....sets the "tone". And yet, we go away and the hate persists in our absence. Funny, that .

I'm going to cut a growth off of my heal. I will video tape it pass it along. Wonder what the Doc would charge for removing it ? Covid, not essentional, growth removal. cosmetic.

I’m tired of your behavior so you get what you give. I may resort to “they did it first” which is your entire justification for your behavior, but at least try to contribute to everyone on both sides that are attempting to participate honestly.

Pretty sure the "tone" table is always set by you and yours (umm, your "TAATS " comment, unwarranted, yes )

Nah, pretty juvinille to ignore peoples responses to my posts. Offering attempts at participating honestly. That what you read when you and they type your tripe.

I mean, if were being honest here. F ind it comical that anyone could actually "dislike" someone, online, who they have no idea about, enough to reply the ways you guys do. Comical and bizzarre.

I’m quoting you so am I ignoring you? Me and mine? Dude you need a lot more help than I do but I promise that help Cole’s when we help ourselves first. Rising tide is a cool concept but don’t give away all your agency it’ll only lead to a further spiral of the negative feedback loop you are on.

[Typical Lax Dad]

[a fan]

Sorry, to long a summation as to why myself, and millions of others, take Doctors advice. Really. At any time, has a doctor recommended we lose weight. Has yours ? Or limit salts ? Or , stop drinking, because it does so much damage to your body.....and on and on and on.

Great, you worship your Doc. THIS....is the point. Why do you disdain those that do not?

Simple. Because they are ONLY playing this stupid game of not listening to their Doctor when it comes to Covid vaccines.

They "forget" to play this stupid game with all the State government mandated vaccines, like for polio or hepatitis. Or when they get really sick---they run right these same Doctors, and gulp down pills that are approved by the FDA that you seem to think is ONLY corrupt when it comes to Covid vaccines. It's total logic fail.

I asked this before: what is the vaccination rate for every other American vaccine?

90%+. Measles, mumps, Hepatitis, etc. 90%+ Americans take them without question, every freaking year.

So go right ahead and explain to me why they trust their doctors and the FDA with those vaccines----but suddenly come up with this "free thinker" nonsense when it only comes to Covid? Go ahead and explain to me why Alabamans, for example, aren't refusing to take vaccines for everything from Hepatitis to Polio to Meningitis?

You know exactly why. It's because it's been turned into virtue signaling....signaling you JUST DID to me, calling me a sheep.

They think it makes them smart, and "in the know", just like every other stupid conspiracy theory that makes zero logical sense.

whatever, dudes. AFAN, ask your doctors about that other posters wifes symptoms, and get back to us.

That's fine. The problem is, you're forgetting that all drugs have side effects, and demanding that these three vaccines have none. This is an impossible bar, and you know it.

AFAN, are you a covid survivor ?

No.

[Farfromgeneva]

Alright -1000000000 for putting that gross a** ish up. I’m going to need to find some hotty pics to offset this assault on my eyes.

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/249175791870261140/

https://lwlies.com/articles/natalie-por ... nco-belle/

https://www.delish.com/food/a54508/minka-kelly-diet/

https://mobile.twitter.com/mollyamcgrath

http://www.athleisuremag.com/the-latest/tag/Seema+Mody

https://informationcradle.com/deirdre-bosa/

https://www.gettyimages.com/photos/ali-larter

Much much better now

[Farfromgeneva]

Sorry, to long a summation as to why myself, and millions of others, take Doctors advice. Really. At any time, has a doctor recommended we lose weight. Has yours ? Or limit salts ? Or , stop drinking, because it does so much damage to your body.....and on and on and on.

Great, you worship your Doc. THIS....is the point. Why do you disdain those that do not?

Simple. Because they are ONLY playing this stupid game of not listening to their Doctor when it comes to Covid vaccines.

They "forget" to play this stupid game with all the State government mandated vaccines, like for polio or hepatitis. Or when they get really sick---they run right these same Doctors, and gulp down pills that are approved by the FDA that you seem to think is ONLY corrupt when it comes to Covid vaccines. It's total logic fail.

I asked this before: what is the vaccination rate for every other American vaccine?

90%+. Measles, mumps, Hepatitis, etc. 90%+ Americans take them without question, every freaking year.

So go right ahead and explain to me why they trust their doctors and the FDA with those vaccines----but suddenly come up with this "free thinker" nonsense when it only comes to Covid? Go ahead and explain to me why Alabamans, for example, aren't refusing to take vaccines for everything from Hepatitis to Polio to Meningitis?

You know exactly why. It's because it's been turned into virtue signaling....signaling you JUST DID to me, calling me a sheep.

They think it makes them smart, and "in the know", just like every other stupid conspiracy theory that makes zero logical sense.

whatever, dudes. AFAN, ask your doctors about that other posters wifes symptoms, and get back to us.

That's fine. The problem is, you're forgetting that all drugs have side effects, and demanding that these three vaccines have none. This is an impossible bar, and you know it.

AFAN, are you a covid survivor ?

No.

To the last one, he argued one doesn’t need firsthand experience relating to another topic just within the last 48 hours...

[Typical Lax Dad]

Alright -1000000000 for putting that gross a** ish up. I’m going to need to find some hotty pics to offset this assault on my eyes.

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/249175791870261140/

https://lwlies.com/articles/natalie-por ... nco-belle/

https://www.delish.com/food/a54508/minka-kelly-diet/

https://mobile.twitter.com/mollyamcgrath

http://www.athleisuremag.com/the-latest/tag/Seema+Mody

https://informationcradle.com/deirdre-bosa/

https://www.gettyimages.com/photos/ali-larter

Much much better now

Just cosmetic. Its a D.I.Y job.

Minka Kelly….

[DMac]

Good to hear they will be studying this.

My wife experienced some odd side effects after the Pfizer. Heard a few anecdotal stories of others as well.

https://covid19.nih.gov/news-and-storie ... rual-cycle

... I assume these passed after a period of time?

No. Been weird and unpredictable since March.

... interesting.

This is the reason many are leery of getting the shot. They're quickly labeled anti vaxers or conspiracy theorists but that's not necessarily the case at all. There are still a lot of unknowns here and time will tell whether there was anything to be concerned about or not, but as of right now we don't know that.
Sincerely hope all turns out well, kram...and for everyone else too.

Respectfully,
"leery" would apply to most of us who did get vaccinated.
Most of us weren't entirely unconcerned, much less apprehensive.
Okay, then leery can be used for those who have and have not.
But we weighed the trade-offs, listened to the best available experts, and came to the conclusion, way back in December/January for some most at risk, that the trade off was obvious in favor of being vaccinated.
Okay, the best available experts in your opinion. I know a nurse who has until the 18th to get her shot or she loses her job. The 18th will be her last day either when she reports for her shift or when she leaves that day. She, one who is in the profession, doesn't come to the same conclusion that you do and I don't think the girl is an idiot.
But it didn't mean we weren't "leery".

Those who are still stuck in that place, after mountains of further data and analysis, deserve the label "anti-vax". They may not be rabid conspiracy theorist nut jobs, but they're not adequately weighing the public health aspects in their equation, our responsibility to others.
No, they do not as anti-vaxers is going to group them in with the, your child is going to be autistic if get him/her vaccinated. There is a big difference between being an anti-vaxer and being leery of a new/experimental drug/vaccination (how can it be anything other than experimental with no history to judge its effects by?), IMO.


I'm differentiating this from the very specific to the individual contraindications to the vaccine regimen; but the general person who refuses, not because their physician is telling them to not do it for reasons specific to them, is an impediment to our entire society being at full humming 'normal'.
In your opinion. Promise you this from experience, if I get a flu shot, I will get the flu...every time and not just mild case, it kicks my asz. If I don't get the shot (which I don't anymore) I might well get the flu but it won't be as bad as when I do. I did not get the swine flu shot when I was in the service despite being pretty much ordered to as I wasn't going to be a guinea pig for that shot, I just didn't like the idea one little bit. I had to talk to some brass about this but ultimately I never got the shot. I feel the same way about this one. Now here's the kicker, I'd be a whole lot more surprised if I hadn't had covid than if I have. I've gone through days when I've felt not right, cold/flu like symptoms, the whole works. Maybe it wasn't but I'd bet it was, and my system dealt with it pretty much the same as it always has. Given its contagiousness and my being of prime age, it's harder for me to imagine that I've just slipped through the whole thing unaffected, given that I haven't changed my habits a whole lot, than if I have had it. I don't believe I'm doing anything to keep our entire society from being at full humming normal.

I had a rough reaction to the second shot. It clearly caused a big immune response. I'm not looking forward to another such reaction with a third shot, plenty "leery". But on the other hand, I'm going to boost when told that's appropriate for my age/risk group.

I wish they had more refinement, more fine tuning, of who needs a boost and when, perhaps based on antibodies and mix of such applicable to variants, community spread of a new variant etc, but I realize they're running hard on getting the best answers they can in the timeframe they have. Won't be perfect.
Nope, not perfect. Hence, many are leery. There's no agreed upon standard behavior/practices either. Here you wear a mask, there you don't...depends on what state you live in. Makes no sense.
My two cents and I'm out of this discussion as fast as I got in it.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Good to hear they will be studying this.

My wife experienced some odd side effects after the Pfizer. Heard a few anecdotal stories of others as well.

https://covid19.nih.gov/news-and-storie ... rual-cycle

... I assume these passed after a period of time?

No. Been weird and unpredictable since March.

... interesting.

This is the reason many are leery of getting the shot. They're quickly labeled anti vaxers or conspiracy theorists but that's not necessarily the case at all. There are still a lot of unknowns here and time will tell whether there was anything to be concerned about or not, but as of right now we don't know that.
Sincerely hope all turns out well, kram...and for everyone else too.

Respectfully,
"leery" would apply to most of us who did get vaccinated.
Most of us weren't entirely unconcerned, much less apprehensive.
Okay, then leery can be used for those who have and have not.
But we weighed the trade-offs, listened to the best available experts, and came to the conclusion, way back in December/January for some most at risk, that the trade off was obvious in favor of being vaccinated.
Okay, the best available experts in your opinion. I know a nurse who has until the 18th to get her shot or she loses her job. The 18th will be her last day either when she reports for her shift or when she leaves that day. She, one who is in the profession, doesn't come to the same conclusion that you do and I don't think the girl is an idiot.
But it didn't mean we weren't "leery".

Those who are still stuck in that place, after mountains of further data and analysis, deserve the label "anti-vax". They may not be rabid conspiracy theorist nut jobs, but they're not adequately weighing the public health aspects in their equation, our responsibility to others.
No, they do not as anti-vaxers is going to group them in with the, your child is going to be autistic if get him/her vaccinated. There is a big difference between being an anti-vaxer and being leery of a new/experimental drug/vaccination (how can it be anything other than experimental with no history to judge its effects by?), IMO.


I'm differentiating this from the very specific to the individual contraindications to the vaccine regimen; but the general person who refuses, not because their physician is telling them to not do it for reasons specific to them, is an impediment to our entire society being at full humming 'normal'.
In your opinion. Promise you this from experience, if I get a flu shot, I will get the flu...every time and not just mild case, it kicks my asz. If I don't get the shot (which I don't anymore) I might well get the flu but it won't be as bad as when I do. I did not get the swine flu shot when I was in the service despite being pretty much ordered to as I wasn't going to be a guinea pig for that shot, I just didn't like the idea one little bit. I had to talk to some brass about this but ultimately I never got the shot. I feel the same way about this one. Now here's the kicker, I'd be a whole lot more surprised if I hadn't had covid than if I have. I've gone through days when I've felt not right, cold/flu like symptoms, the whole works. Maybe it wasn't but I'd bet it was and my system dealt with it pretty much the same as it always has. Given its contagiousness and my being of prime age, it's harder for me to imagine that I've just slipped through the whole thing unaffected given that I haven't changed my habits a whole lot than I have had it. I don't believe I'm doing anything to keep our entire society from being at full humming normal.

I had a rough reaction to the second shot. It clearly caused a big immune response. I'm not looking forward to another such reaction with a third shot, plenty "leery". But on the other hand, I'm going to boost when told that's appropriate for my age/risk group.

I wish they had more refinement, more fine tuning, of who needs a boost and when, perhaps based on antibodies and mix of such applicable to variants, community spread of a new variant etc, but I realize they're running hard on getting the best answers they can in the timeframe they have. Won't be perfect.
Nope, not perfect. Hence, many are leery. There's no agreed upon standard behavior/practices either. Here you wear a mask, there you don't...depends on what state you live in. Makes sense.
My two cents and I'm out of this discussion as fast as I got in it.

My niece and sister are nurses. They are vaccinated. There are lawyers and cops that are crooks. Just because you are in a profession, it doesn’t mean you will make a reasonable decision.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/judystone/ ... e6cd46589e

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7030a2.htm

[wgdsr]

it's impossible to not have seen these discussions coming a mile away.
you should listen to our authorities and see the numbers.
if you don't, you're a mouth breather.
put them in the pen, they don't care about society and don't belong in mine.
forget about any and all nuance vs. what we're commanding.

in any event, commandments already thrown down and more coming.

[Bart]

it's impossible to not have seen these discussions coming a mile away.
you should listen to our authorities and see the numbers.
if you don't, you're a mouth breather.
put them in the pen, they don't care about society and don't belong in mine.
forget about any and all nuance vs. what we're commanding.

in any event, commandments already thrown down and more coming.

There seems to be a lack of any nuance in any of this

[seacoaster]

it's impossible to not have seen these discussions coming a mile away.
you should listen to our authorities and see the numbers.
if you don't, you're a mouth breather.
put them in the pen, they don't care about society and don't belong in mine.
forget about any and all nuance vs. what we're commanding.

in any event, commandments already thrown down and more coming.

Serious question: what is the nuance you’re looking for? Can you give me an example?

[MDlaxfan76]

it's impossible to not have seen these discussions coming a mile away.
you should listen to our authorities and see the numbers.
if you don't, you're a mouth breather.
put them in the pen, they don't care about society and don't belong in mine.
forget about any and all nuance vs. what we're commanding.

in any event, commandments already thrown down and more coming.

Yes, some are making such extreme statements, but generally not so extreme as that sort of hyperbole.

Here's the thing, we're in a public health crisis...some expect perfection, I don't. There will be things that in retrospect we may come to agree were the wrong, or not as good as, approaches.

And we'll certainly get 'smarter', or at least have the opportunity to do so, as more time and data rolls along. There may well be refinement of approaches, etc.

But we actually do have a ton of data including demonstrating that the vaccines available now reduces infection, both getting it and then, maybe most importantly, the effects. We have sound information that not being vaccinated is dry tinder for the virus. We also have good information that the vaccines have very low rates of troubling side effect, though not zero.

So, odds are very strong that if we have very high vaccination rates, as we achieve with other vaccines (which also have low but not non-existent side effects), we'll do far, far better as a society. Docs and nurses needn't be overwhelmed, emergency services don't need to be curtailed for other acute problems, and for the most part we can work and play close to normal...a lot sooner than otherwise.

Now we get to the 'mouth breather' problem. There's a ton of misinformation out there and some people are simply more susceptible than others. I'm sure Kram's girl nurse is not an idiot. And she's not alone. There's indeed many more nurses as a % not vaccinated than doctors, but there's definitely a correlation with job/education with vaccination rates, so forgive us if we suggest that she's substituting whatever biases she has, disinformation influences she may get, for the advice she'd surely get from the infectious disease experts at her own hospital.

At this point, anyone not listening to the counsel of their doctor specific to their circumstance, and the infectious disease experts more generally, is going to need 'persuasion' of a different sort than has been done so far. And that means removal of privileges enjoyed by those who are vaccinated. Behavioral science.

The good news is that very high compliance occurs when mandates are instituted. This particular gal may nevertheless choose to not comply and will lose her job, but she'll be in a very tiny subset of those who choose to do so.

[Typical Lax Dad]

it's impossible to not have seen these discussions coming a mile away.
you should listen to our authorities and see the numbers.
if you don't, you're a mouth breather.
put them in the pen, they don't care about society and don't belong in mine.
forget about any and all nuance vs. what we're commanding.

in any event, commandments already thrown down and more coming.

Yes, some are making such extreme statements, but generally not so extreme as that sort of hyperbole.

Here's the thing, we're in a public health crisis...some expect perfection, I don't. There will be things that in retrospect we may come to agree were the wrong, or not as good as, approaches.

And we'll certainly get 'smarter', or at least have the opportunity to do so, as more time and data rolls along. There may well be refinement of approaches, etc.

But we actually do have a ton of data including demonstrating that the vaccines available now reduces infection, both getting it and then, maybe most importantly, the effects. We have sound information that not being vaccinated is dry tinder for the virus. We also have good information that the vaccines have very low rates of troubling side effect, though not zero.

So, odds are very strong that if we have very high vaccination rates, as we achieve with other vaccines (which also have low but not non-existent side effects), we'll do far, far better as a society. Docs and nurses needn't be overwhelmed, emergency services don't need to be curtailed for other acute problems, and for the most part we can work and play close to normal...a lot sooner than otherwise.

Now we get to the 'mouth breather' problem. There's a ton of misinformation out there and some people are simply more susceptible than others. I'm sure Kram's girl nurse is not an idiot. And she's not alone. There's indeed many more nurses as a % not vaccinated than doctors, but there's definitely a correlation with job/education with vaccination rates, so forgive us if we suggest that she's substituting whatever biases she has, disinformation influences she may get, for the advice she'd surely get from the infectious disease experts at her own hospital.

At this point, anyone not listening to the counsel of their doctor specific to their circumstance, and the infectious disease experts more generally, is going to need 'persuasion' of a different sort than has been done so far. And that means removal of privileges enjoyed by those who are vaccinated. Behavioral science.

The good news is that very high compliance occurs when mandates are instituted. This particular gal may nevertheless choose to not comply and will lose her job, but she'll be in a very tiny subset of those who choose to do so.

Wife just mentioned she had to talk to her department head today. Found out woman who sets up her bio lab isn’t vaccinated and walking in and out of lab without a mask. Department head had her in her office talking and the woman wasn’t wearing mask. This is what you get when you leave it up to the people. Wife going to get tested and believes risk is low but unlike other schools in area, her spot is forgoing vaccine mandate. Last weekend kids had 1,000-2,000 student party off campus. Made the newspaper. We will see if fall ball gets off there.

I bet someone is using her as an example as someone who works in a university biology lab and isn’t vaccinated…..