Miscellaneous questions, thoughts, impressions, etc.

[seacoaster]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

[howdyyall]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

I applaud Ericka Leslie and any official who helps facilitate the game of lacrosse. Without them we wouldn't have a game of any order or structure. It's not easy being an official. Most of the time it's an utterly thankless job. They get it from the fans, coaches and players...and how could I forget--the media. Nice to see former players still in the game as officials.

In addition, there is a shortage of officials in some places due to harassment from certain fans (read: parents of players). Hopefully the Boston Globe article is still live in this topic:

viewtopic.php?f=129&t=1573

[seacoaster]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

[howdyyall]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

I know this forum isn’t a referendum on officiating but did anyone see the Md-UNC championship game a few years back where it was at least 6-7 possessions where an offensive player went into the goal circle, it was not called, and a goal was scored on that same possession after the fact.

This individual may be the best of the bunch, but the overall status of wlax officiating is as poor as it gets at the college sports level.hard to understand why the sport allows such poor officiating.maybe get the senior citizens who can’t run up and down the field out of the sport as start….

[LarryGamLax]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

I know this forum isn’t a referendum on officiating but did anyone see the Md-UNC championship game a few years back where it was at least 6-7 possessions where an offensive player went into the goal circle, it was not called, and a goal was scored on that same possession after the fact.

This individual may be the best of the bunch, but the overall status of wlax officiating is as poor as it gets at the college sports level.hard to understand why the sport allows such poor officiating.maybe get the senior citizens who can’t run up and down the field out of the sport as start….

That's really harsh dude!

[Bart]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

This individual may be the best of the bunch, but the overall status of wlax officiating is as poor as it gets at the college sports level.hard to understand why the sport allows such poor officiating.maybe get the senior citizens who can’t run up and down the field out of the sport as start….

Here you go. I am certain they will welcome you with open arms: https://www.usalacrosse.com/become-official

[wlaxphan20]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

This individual may be the best of the bunch, but the overall status of wlax officiating is as poor as it gets at the college sports level.hard to understand why the sport allows such poor officiating.maybe get the senior citizens who can’t run up and down the field out of the sport as start….

Here you go. I am certain they will welcome you with open arms: https://www.usalacrosse.com/become-official

[seacoaster]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

I know this forum isn’t a referendum on officiating but did anyone see the Md-UNC championship game a few years back where it was at least 6-7 possessions where an offensive player went into the goal circle, it was not called, and a goal was scored on that same possession after the fact.

This individual may be the best of the bunch, but the overall status of wlax officiating is as poor as it gets at the college sports level.hard to understand why the sport allows such poor officiating.maybe get the senior citizens who can’t run up and down the field out of the sport as start….

That's really harsh dude!

I agree. It is really a very difficult game to officiate, maybe the hardest I know. And the officiating is made more difficult by the peculiar willingness of "fans" to not even read or know the rules. I am certain I am not alone in recounting endless memories of standing on the sidelines, usually next to a guy, who yells "just shoot it" through the defenders in shooting space, or whose daughter just jacked a kid off her feet with a horizontal stick to the ribs yelling "great D Mia!!!!!" The college rule changes have really helped not only reduce the whistles that so confounded the "fan," but the flow of the game and the officials' jobs.

The yelling from the sidelines has, anyone involved in the game with tell you, reduced interest among former players in becoming officials. So this official gets a write up about years and years of excellence, one response I guess just has to be: "but what about that Maryland-UNC game back in the day????"

[8meterPA]

The gold standard:

https://www.usalaxmagazine.com/fuel/usa ... ll-of-fame

Can you explain why she is the ‘gold standard’ in your opinion. That article does a poor job (but it is US lacrosse mag so to be expected).

She calls a good game, steady and consistent, and seems to impose structure across the field and other officials.

I know this forum isn’t a referendum on officiating but did anyone see the Md-UNC championship game a few years back where it was at least 6-7 possessions where an offensive player went into the goal circle, it was not called, and a goal was scored on that same possession after the fact.

This individual may be the best of the bunch, but the overall status of wlax officiating is as poor as it gets at the college sports level.hard to understand why the sport allows such poor officiating.maybe get the senior citizens who can’t run up and down the field out of the sport as start….

That's really harsh dude!

I agree. It is really a very difficult game to officiate, maybe the hardest I know. And the officiating is made more difficult by the peculiar willingness of "fans" to not even read or know the rules. I am certain I am not alone in recounting endless memories of standing on the sidelines, usually next to a guy, who yells "just shoot it" through the defenders in shooting space, or whose daughter just jacked a kid off her feet with a horizontal stick to the ribs yelling "great D Mia!!!!!" The college rule changes have really helped not only reduce the whistles that so confounded the "fan," but the flow of the game and the officials' jobs.

The yelling from the sidelines has, anyone involved in the game with tell you, reduced interest among former players in becoming officials. So this official gets a write up about years and years of excellence, one response I guess just has to be: "but what about that Maryland-UNC game back in the day????"

I laughed out loud - brings back memories of the sidelines of 8th grade club lax. Officials are in a tough spot, there are so many judgemental calls literally on every possession and so there is a very real difference in calls depending on who the refs are at any given point.

[DMac]

That's funny, sc, it is I who you are describing there...minus the yelling out part. The first couple of wlax games I went to I knew virtually nothing about the rules of the game, I brought my mlax mentality with me to watch the girls play. Knew nothing about shooting space, dangerous follow through, charging, or the onus of safety being on every player...and this was before the rule changes that have improved the game so much (for people like me anyway). I was sitting there thinking exactly that...why the hell doesn't she just fire it at the cage fer krissakes, or why doesn't she just keep driving to the cage, or that sure didn't look like a rough check to me. This is what I mean when I say you can not watch wlax with a mlax mentality, the game will drive you nuts (and the constant stop and repositioning as well as the game of keep away prior to the rule changes would just make your head explode), and those are the people yelling, just shoot it. What blew me away as much as anything was how little the fans in the stands knew about what was going on out there....and needless to say many/most of them are parents or siblings of the players on the field. I'm not shy about talking to the people around me and when I'd ask what the hell just happened out there, or what the call was, they were clueless. If you asked me at a mlax game I'd have answers for you, I'm pretty blown away by the number of wlax "fans" who don't know what's going on out there. I learned a whole lot right here and did have a good experience when I sat near a group of young wlaxers who came to see Alie Jimerson play. They knew what was going on and could answer my questions...fun group of gals and none of them yelled out, "Just shoot it!!". I agree, wlax has to be one of the toughest of all sports to officiate although maybe a little easier than fifteen years ago...still tough anyway you look at though. To be honest, I don't think the officiating in wlax is horrible, think they do a decent enough job all in all.

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

There isn’t a sport in existence where human error doesn’t exist in the call of the game. Young or old experienced or inexperienced it doesn’t make a difference. There isn’t an exact science to officiating a game if human beings are involved. I think the officials for lacrosse do a great job. Do they make mistakes on occasion? Of course. But that doesn’t take away from me the overall standard of excellence they bring to each game. And again, without them we don’t have any games.

[DMac]

Oh, just to add to my rant of insignificant nonsense which has little to do with officiating, here's a little gem that pretty much sums up how little most people know about what's going on on a wlax field. When Levy was playing for Cuse she fired one of her rockets from out front (this almost looked out of place in wlax at the time) which went in but was disallowed because of a dangerous follow through (you could see it on the replay but her stick did just barely make contact with the defender below the waist). The next day on the local expert's sports radio talk show the boys were going on and on about how ridiculous it was that the goal wasn't allowed because Nicole had fired the ball too hard. They heard dangerous shot and concluded that her mach speed rocket was too dangerous for the wlax game and were just all kinds of fired up about how idiotic this was. It's a call in show so I, of all people, called in and told the boys they were putting out bum dope and what they were saying was just flat out wrong. I went on to explain to the local experts that the reason Nicole's goal was disallowed was because of the dangerous follow through which I also had to explain to them, and that it had nothing to do with the speed of the ball. This, of course, led to a little discussion of the onus of safety being on the players and the reasons for that. Pretty sad state of affairs when I'm the one explaining a game which I know little about to the local experts...and it's not as if the show is coming from Baton Rouge, fer krissakes. Yup, there are a whole lot of people out there who really have no idea what's going on on a wlax field, they see sticks and a goal and figure they're going to see mlax played by women. That's your coveted casual fan who is going fix wlax.

[seacoaster]

There isn’t a sport in existence where human error doesn’t exist in the call of the game. Young or old experienced or inexperienced it doesn’t make a difference. There isn’t an exact science to officiating a game if human beings are involved. I think the officials for lacrosse do a great job. Do they make mistakes on occasion? Of course. But that doesn’t take away from me the overall standard of excellence they bring to each game. And again, without them we don’t have any games.

Agreed. But you have to go to a high school game that is not in Maryland or Pennsylvania or New Jersey. The level of officiating is simply inconsistent. Shooting space at one end is often not the same shooting space at the other. What the college ranks get is at least a modicum of consistency across the field. There are exceptions; most if not all of us on this forum have seen a relative train wreck even at the Division 1 level.

Within the first inning of so of a baseball game, you want to establish the strike zone, right? And stick to it, right? Establishing that sort of consistency across the many rules in a women's or girls lacrosse game is just really, really hard.

[seacoaster]

This made me laugh out loud:

"I'm not shy about talking to the people around me...."

Mrs. R.U. Effinuts?

[LarryGamLax]

The great JUDY WOLSTENHOLME is my all time favorite Women's Lax official. She was precise, accurate, a bit of Swag to her style and could be flamboyant. Absolutely loved her.
Despite her greatness(I'm sure she's a HOFer), I remember not agreeing with her on some calls. The thing I never did was get so aggravated by a call that I got personal with Judy or any of the other officials. It's a damn game and that's all it is.
I used to be able to ask Judy about a call that was made and she was always cordial and cooperative. When you don't know the rules, it's okay to ask. You don't have to get derogatory towards the officials.

[DMac]

This made me laugh out loud:

"I'm not shy about talking to the people around me...."

Mrs. R.U. Effinuts?

This is actually pretty funny, sc, Mrs. Effinnuts needed some talking to. I aint easy to hang with, brotha, everyone is fair game to me....gender, color, age, none of that matters. I'm thinkin' you'd keep right on walkin' if the two of us are in, say, a grocery store when I spotted a tall gal...5'10"- 6'2". There's not a chance I'm not walking up to that gal and sayin', "I'm bettin' that you've had a bunch of volleyball and basketball ball coaches sayin' come here little girl, I want to talk to you." Have done this several (actually pretty much every time there's a tall gal in the house) times, invariably brings a smile to the gal's face and usually a friendly little chat. Goes anywhere from nope, was clumsy and not a ballplayer to yup, and I play lacrosse for Ithaca college...that was a really cool one, had a real nice chat with that fit young lady...mother was there too just glowing. Comes as no surprise that I'd walk up to an Army Captain and strike up a conversation too, eh? Most people are friendly and fun and as you know, it's not so much what you say, but how you say it.

[8meterPA]

There isn’t a sport in existence where human error doesn’t exist in the call of the game. Young or old experienced or inexperienced it doesn’t make a difference. There isn’t an exact science to officiating a game if human beings are involved. I think the officials for lacrosse do a great job. Do they make mistakes on occasion? Of course. But that doesn’t take away from me the overall standard of excellence they bring to each game. And again, without them we don’t have any games.

Agreed. But you have to go to a high school game that is not in Maryland or Pennsylvania or New Jersey. The level of officiating is simply inconsistent. Shooting space at one end is often not the same shooting space at the other. What the college ranks get is at least a modicum of consistency across the field. There are exceptions; most if not all of us on this forum have seen a relative train wreck even at the Division 1 level.

Within the first inning of so of a baseball game, you want to establish the strike zone, right? And stick to it, right? Establishing that sort of consistency across the many rules in a women's or girls lacrosse game is just really, really hard.

The tournaments in Florida were always an adventure in terms of consistency...

[seacoaster]

There isn’t a sport in existence where human error doesn’t exist in the call of the game. Young or old experienced or inexperienced it doesn’t make a difference. There isn’t an exact science to officiating a game if human beings are involved. I think the officials for lacrosse do a great job. Do they make mistakes on occasion? Of course. But that doesn’t take away from me the overall standard of excellence they bring to each game. And again, without them we don’t have any games.

Agreed. But you have to go to a high school game that is not in Maryland or Pennsylvania or New Jersey. The level of officiating is simply inconsistent. Shooting space at one end is often not the same shooting space at the other. What the college ranks get is at least a modicum of consistency across the field. There are exceptions; most if not all of us on this forum have seen a relative train wreck even at the Division 1 level.

Within the first inning of so of a baseball game, you want to establish the strike zone, right? And stick to it, right? Establishing that sort of consistency across the many rules in a women's or girls lacrosse game is just really, really hard.

The tournaments in Florida were always an adventure in terms of consistency...

Yeah, the summer tournaments were always an adventure of officials "letting them play." Bruised shoulders and skinned knees.

[Can Opener]

This made me laugh out loud:

"I'm not shy about talking to the people around me...."

Mrs. R.U. Effinuts?

This is actually pretty funny, sc, Mrs. Effinnuts needed some talking to. I aint easy to hang with, brotha, everyone is fair game to me....gender, color, age, none of that matters. I'm thinkin' you'd keep right on walkin' if the two of us are in, say, a grocery store when I spotted a tall gal...5'10"- 6'2". There's not a chance I'm not walking up to that gal and sayin', "I'm bettin' that you've had a bunch of volleyball and basketball ball coaches sayin' come here little girl, I want to talk to you." Have done this several (actually pretty much every time there's a tall gal in the house) times, invariably brings a smile to the gal's face and usually a friendly little chat. Goes anywhere from nope, was clumsy and not a ballplayer to yup, and I play lacrosse for Ithaca college...that was a really cool one, had a real nice chat with that fit young lady...mother was there too just glowing. Comes as no surprise that I'd walk up to an Army Captain and strike up a conversation too, eh? Most people are friendly and fun and as you know, it's not so much what you say, but how you say it.

DMac -- The next time you call into the local sports talk station, PLEASE make a recording or give us a heads up in advance so we can tune in on the interwebs. If I'm a drive time host, I tell my producer to get your cell number so he can get you on the air any time it's a slow news day. I imagine your approach is a little like the greatest sportswriter of all time, Red Smith, who once said: "Writing is easy. You just open up a vein and bleed."