Johns Hopkins 2022

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flalax22
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by flalax22 »

hmmm wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:53 pm
flalax22 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:28 am
jhu06 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:27 am EMO which was a real strength several years ago has sort of been up and down in terms of opportunities and production. 65 percent, 38 percent, 42 percent where it was last year. Shilling got a lot of run and wasn't terribly productive. it's one of the areas you'd think w/more practice and chemistry we'll see improvement.

tucker's press release sort of reads like the desko and petro exit language. "The ad guided me through a thought process". She didn't really have a lot of postseason success.
No question she was pushed. Some may say nudged it’s either way she didn’t come to this decision without the AD spelling it out for her.
This is an absurd take. In no way, shape or form was she pushed out.
I imagine you think Petro and the Admin mutually parted ways too.

The proof will be in the 2023 season. I’m hearing she is absolutely not retiring from coaching.
hmmm
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by hmmm »

flalax22 wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:18 pm
hmmm wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:53 pm
flalax22 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:28 am
jhu06 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:27 am EMO which was a real strength several years ago has sort of been up and down in terms of opportunities and production. 65 percent, 38 percent, 42 percent where it was last year. Shilling got a lot of run and wasn't terribly productive. it's one of the areas you'd think w/more practice and chemistry we'll see improvement.

tucker's press release sort of reads like the desko and petro exit language. "The ad guided me through a thought process". She didn't really have a lot of postseason success.
No question she was pushed. Some may say nudged it’s either way she didn’t come to this decision without the AD spelling it out for her.
This is an absurd take. In no way, shape or form was she pushed out.
I imagine you think Petro and the Admin mutually parted ways too.

The proof will be in the 2023 season. I’m hearing she is absolutely not retiring from coaching.
No Petro was definitely forced out. Janine will not be coaching in 2023. You're getting bad information.
jhu06
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by jhu06 »

51percentcorn wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 7:23 pm
jhu06 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:27 am tucker's press release sort of reads like the desko and petro exit language. "The ad guided me through a thought process". She didn't really have a lot of postseason success.
OK - accuracy counts - the real quote is "When I initially discussed this possibility with her she was very supportive of my thought process and encouraged me to take as much time as I needed to work through this decision." That's WAY different than the AD "guided" the thought process which implies that it was the Hopkins administration's idea.
flalax22 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:28 am No question she was pushed. Some may say nudged it’s either way she didn’t come to this decision without the AD spelling it out for her.

Why is this necessarily the case? I have absolutely no idea what happened but why can't a coach that has been doing something for 29 years decide that it's time to do something else? I have met Janine several times - she's a better person than coach and she's a helluva coach. But if you accept the narrative that the admin from Daniels on down is lackadasical about lacrosse at best and secretly would like to see it diminished at worst - why do you push out Tucker? She's absolutely beloved by her players - by her peers etc. etc. and given the fact that Hopkins is in the same conference as Maryland and Northwestern she's under no pressure - except apparently from '06 - to win championships. So aside from the fact that as far as women lacrosse coaches go - Janine is probably on the higher end of the pay spectrum - why wouldn't you keep her around as long as she wanted to stay?

Again, I have no idea but maybe just maybe sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
jhu06 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 10:27 am EMO which was a real strength several years ago has sort of been up and down in terms of opportunities and production. 65 percent, 38 percent, 42 percent where it was last year. Shilling got a lot of run and wasn't terribly productive. it's one of the areas you'd think w/more practice and chemistry we'll see improvement.
These numbers are a little off BTW
Hopkins EMO last 5 seasons
2021 - 43%
2020 - 38%
2019 - 46% (26 for 55)
2018 - 36% - oddly enough the most successful team of the past 5
2017 - 61%

The 2017 team had Fraser and Marr and Crawley - 3 very reasonable outside threats - high IQ player in Stanwick to get them the ball and a crafty inside finisher in Dismuke who had 5 EMO goals that year - otherwise I think again - the 43% last year was not bad considering the circumstances.
https://www.ncaa.com/stats/lacrosse-men ... t/team/231
It was better than I thought. W/a longer regular season this year and more chances for injuries depth will be important and I guess shilling would've been another body w/deep experience.
Harrison had a very very nice tribute to Seth Tierney yesterday on his instagram-it is the most recent post.
https://www.instagram.com/kyleharrison18/
steel_hop
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by steel_hop »

flalax22 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:28 am No question she was pushed. Some may say nudged it’s either way she didn’t come to this decision without the AD spelling it out for her.

Why is this necessarily the case? I have absolutely no idea what happened but why can't a coach that has been doing something for 29 years decide that it's time to do something else? I have met Janine several times - she's a better person than coach and she's a helluva coach. But if you accept the narrative that the admin from Daniels on down is lackadasical about lacrosse at best and secretly would like to see it diminished at worst - why do you push out Tucker? She's absolutely beloved by her players - by her peers etc. etc. and given the fact that Hopkins is in the same conference as Maryland and Northwestern she's under no pressure - except apparently from '06 - to win championships. So aside from the fact that as far as women lacrosse coaches go - Janine is probably on the higher end of the pay spectrum - why wouldn't you keep her around as long as she wanted to stay?

Again, I have no idea but maybe just maybe sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.


So I've been saving a story about someone I ran across this summer but was waiting for the right moment to tell it. Don't know if he reads the boards and didn't want to expose him. But, my conversation with this guy aligns well with Tucker making her decision.

First, on Tucker, there is being "nudged" and then there is making it really difficult to do your job that you want to see what else is out there. Tucker might have gone to the AD to say she is thinking about evaluating her life taking into considerations that certain aspects are making the job less enjoyable. Some of those can be directly attributable to Hopkins - additional recruiting constraints, budget constraint, player academic requirements (all the stuff many of us have been talking about over the past 5+ years and see my story below). Some of these issues are not Hopkins related - COVID issues, taking care of her father, etc.

There is also the fact, she in her mid-50s. While I am sure she has been paid well, I doubt she is sitting on some DI football coach nut. I'm sure some of her books have done okay but enough to retire on? doubtful that is why she is likely to be coaching somewhere else...or, should I say doing something lax related in the near term. She probably had hoped to "retire" right now and was setting up Singleton to step in and that didn't happen doesn't sound great for Singleton filling the position.

Further, she has seen most of her colleagues that she's spent lots of time with either retire - Kennedy, Nelson, - fired Petro shuffled off for no real reason = Calder or sadly pass away - Margraff, Scott and Funk (though I think she passed away after she retired). Outside of Babb, there aren't many of those people left. That leads to some introspection. She also appears to have a lot of other lax related business out there. There is an argument she was looking for some validation from the AD i.e. "we want you to stay, what can we do so that you retire here in 15 years" or something like that." but, instead got "we support any decision you make." As always, it is what people don't say that is generally more important than what they say.

And now my story. I was taking my son to a lax camp and just sitting there minding my own business when an older gentleman came up to me and started talking to me. As we get talking, I tell him I went to Hopkins and the year I graduated. He then starts talking about one of his sons that played at Hopkins in the last 5 years or so. I figured out who is son was pretty quickly and we start talking about the program, Petro, Millman, etc. He said that it was time for Petro to leave but the way it was done was awful and it shouldn't have happened that way. He wouldn't get into more details on it but I got the sense there is a reason many former lax players were not happy last summer. It has quasi-been talked about on here.

But, what I thought was more interesting or disturbing was that he was told in several different conversations that Daniels not only would love to get the lax program to drop to D3 but when that happens it makes it that much easier to eliminate the entire athletic department. He said Daniels wanted to get rid of sports but with the NIL stuff, he really wants to get eliminate sports from Hopkins campus and more akin to a Swathmore or Chicago U (even though the both have sports programs). The belief put forth was that by limiting the support to the lax program, it would enable the argument to be made the Hopkins can't compete at the DI level and D3 is where is should be. He said there is still too much alumni pushback on that but a continual drop in success would likely allow his position to get stronger and the position against that move to wane.

It also would align with Hopkins "equity" push on new students and that many athletes are white.

And, yes, I get the H16 argument about new buildings, etc. but that's the view that was being presented to this gentleman and he conveyed to me.
DocBarrister
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by DocBarrister »

steel_hop wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 10:00 am
flalax22 wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:28 am No question she was pushed. Some may say nudged it’s either way she didn’t come to this decision without the AD spelling it out for her.

Why is this necessarily the case? I have absolutely no idea what happened but why can't a coach that has been doing something for 29 years decide that it's time to do something else? I have met Janine several times - she's a better person than coach and she's a helluva coach. But if you accept the narrative that the admin from Daniels on down is lackadasical about lacrosse at best and secretly would like to see it diminished at worst - why do you push out Tucker? She's absolutely beloved by her players - by her peers etc. etc. and given the fact that Hopkins is in the same conference as Maryland and Northwestern she's under no pressure - except apparently from '06 - to win championships. So aside from the fact that as far as women lacrosse coaches go - Janine is probably on the higher end of the pay spectrum - why wouldn't you keep her around as long as she wanted to stay?

Again, I have no idea but maybe just maybe sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.


So I've been saving a story about someone I ran across this summer but was waiting for the right moment to tell it. Don't know if he reads the boards and didn't want to expose him. But, my conversation with this guy aligns well with Tucker making her decision.

First, on Tucker, there is being "nudged" and then there is making it really difficult to do your job that you want to see what else is out there. Tucker might have gone to the AD to say she is thinking about evaluating her life taking into considerations that certain aspects are making the job less enjoyable. Some of those can be directly attributable to Hopkins - additional recruiting constraints, budget constraint, player academic requirements (all the stuff many of us have been talking about over the past 5+ years and see my story below). Some of these issues are not Hopkins related - COVID issues, taking care of her father, etc.

There is also the fact, she in her mid-50s. While I am sure she has been paid well, I doubt she is sitting on some DI football coach nut. I'm sure some of her books have done okay but enough to retire on? doubtful that is why she is likely to be coaching somewhere else...or, should I say doing something lax related in the near term. She probably had hoped to "retire" right now and was setting up Singleton to step in and that didn't happen doesn't sound great for Singleton filling the position.

Further, she has seen most of her colleagues that she's spent lots of time with either retire - Kennedy, Nelson, - fired Petro shuffled off for no real reason = Calder or sadly pass away - Margraff, Scott and Funk (though I think she passed away after she retired). Outside of Babb, there aren't many of those people left. That leads to some introspection. She also appears to have a lot of other lax related business out there. There is an argument she was looking for some validation from the AD i.e. "we want you to stay, what can we do so that you retire here in 15 years" or something like that." but, instead got "we support any decision you make." As always, it is what people don't say that is generally more important than what they say.

And now my story. I was taking my son to a lax camp and just sitting there minding my own business when an older gentleman came up to me and started talking to me. As we get talking, I tell him I went to Hopkins and the year I graduated. He then starts talking about one of his sons that played at Hopkins in the last 5 years or so. I figured out who is son was pretty quickly and we start talking about the program, Petro, Millman, etc. He said that it was time for Petro to leave but the way it was done was awful and it shouldn't have happened that way. He wouldn't get into more details on it but I got the sense there is a reason many former lax players were not happy last summer. It has quasi-been talked about on here.

But, what I thought was more interesting or disturbing was that he was told in several different conversations that Daniels not only would love to get the lax program to drop to D3 but when that happens it makes it that much easier to eliminate the entire athletic department. He said Daniels wanted to get rid of sports but with the NIL stuff, he really wants to get eliminate sports from Hopkins campus and more akin to a Swathmore or Chicago U (even though the both have sports programs). The belief put forth was that by limiting the support to the lax program, it would enable the argument to be made the Hopkins can't compete at the DI level and D3 is where is should be. He said there is still too much alumni pushback on that but a continual drop in success would likely allow his position to get stronger and the position against that move to wane.

It also would align with Hopkins "equity" push on new students and that many athletes are white.

And, yes, I get the H16 argument about new buildings, etc. but that's the view that was being presented to this gentleman and he conveyed to me.
Absurd.

If President Daniels, who has become almost a bogeyman of right-wing members of this forum, really wanted to eliminate the lacrosse program or get it demoted to Division III, he wouldn’t have allowed the hiring of Milliman, Grant Jr., and Koesterer. Hiring those three could not have been cheap.

If Hopkins were not serious about winning in lacrosse again, they would go the “Cornell” route and hire the cheapest coaches around.

If President Daniels has had a specific way of doing things, it is going BIG … like literally joining the B1G, massive donations from Bloomberg, massive growth in the endowment, massive new building in DC, massive new investments in undergraduate education (new student center, new dorms, and remember … the lacrosse center was built on his watch), and massive new investments in interdisciplinary faculty.

The notion that Daniels likes to downsize anything is ridiculous. Hopkins made some splashy hires for men’s lacrosse. Expect them to do the same for the women’s team.

President Daniels is clearly obsessed with rankings. He hasn’t overly focused on the lacrosse program, but do you think he has noticed that the lacrosse program’s rankings haven’t been up to par in recent years?

If anything, President Daniels has ensured that Hopkins lacrosse will never go smaller … that is not Daniels’ style, and it is certainly not the legacy he wants.

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MDlaxfan76
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

I'm skeptical that this story reflects reality, rather it more likely reflects fever swamp worries, extended well beyond actual legit concerns.

That said, it's certainly true that there's been a rather wholesale demand from the Admin that athletes have academic qualities more closely comparable to the rest of the student body. That's certainly made it much, much harder on the coaches in their recruiting, though best I can tell, the DI lax programs have not been held to remotely the same expectations as the DIII programs.

It's certainly possible that the Admin has, or will be, pressing the lax programs to up their academic standards. Which, IMO, is probably achievable, though not easy. (I doubt that would have been an issue for Janine's decision, though)

All that said, fever swamp or not, it's probably important for athlete alumni to continue to make clear what they want to be the future role of athletics at Hopkins, including the expectations and desires of lax alumni.
DMac
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by DMac »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 10:46 am I'm skeptical that this story reflects reality, rather it more likely reflects fever swamp worries, extended well beyond actual legit concerns.
Agree, MDlax, awful lot of guessing going on here (fever swamp).
As for Tucker, any evidence she was "nudged out"? Might have gone
to the AD? Might not have too. Twenty-eight years is a long time,
could it be she just said I'm ready for a little life style change and
just wants to step down and relax a little? Doesn't sound unreasonable
to me.
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by HopFan16 »

We will be approaching the heat death of the universe and still there will be someone whispering into the void that Hopkins is dropping to D3.

51 has said this probably close to a thousand times but Daniels does not care enough to have some secret agenda of undermining the lacrosse program to such a degree that it's forced to drop down or worse. There is no grand conspiracy. Said parent was probably just upset—perhaps rightfully so—that his kid's coach was unceremoniously shown the door, and so he either repeated or fabricated a rumor that has no basis in reality. Ron Daniels spends very little if any part of his life thinking about lacrosse. The guy is no dummy—do you think he wants to be the one responsible for canning one of the most historic collegiate sports franchises of all time? It'd cripple his legacy. That is just one of many, many different ways that this doesn't. make. any. sense. at all. I think a lot of the admin interference in the program has already happened. It was forcing Petro out. Now they brought in a guy who's more on their wavelength and more aligned with how they want to do things. There isn't going to be some further calamity. Petro's ouster was it.
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by jhu06 »

-Never really thought of the womens lax program as a wildly successful outfit. If Boston College, Florida, Northwestern and James Madison can have success you'd think our women could do better than a few first round exits.
-As I've said from the outset, if you want to lay claims that Hopkins lacrosse isn't getting the institutional support it deserves which should be everything it needs back it up w/confirmed evidence and data because (and I know I'm going to sound like doc barrister here) what I see under Daniels watch was Petro having annual top 5 and top 1 in many cases recruiting classes (including greely, shack, epstein and schellenberger who were a 1 in the nation), a new director of lacrosse operations, the move to the big ten which added travel costs, the cordish center, they brought in an elite staff to replace Petro, a player roster that's probably 25 percent bigger than the ones Petro had under brody, a student athletic facility which some lacrosse players use which was redone after just 20 years of use, the continuation of the espn contract, regular season games in NFL venues, a career center just for student athletes and now extended regular season schedules.
-I don't know enough about syracuse or Petro's direct concerns w/daniels to know what support he didn't get at homewood that he might be getting at syracuse.
-There are a lot of petro's younger players who were upset about the transition but if they'd made final fours, and won national championships he'd still be at homewood.
-The NIL stuff has been overblown w/its impact on our program limited due to our onfield lack of success. To this point the only Hopkins related NIL situation I've seen is HF16's report Connor Disimone was one of 25,000 athletes to get some free tee shirts from barstool sports (a wildly successful media company that works w/Rabil on PLL)in exchange for some social media posts.

-Daniels took a hard line against alumni in his admissions decision and while I am not an insider and have no evidence, it makes complete sense that he would follow that up by looking at the 620 student athletes and their admissions procedures and socio economic makeup. I have no problem if they want to submit the d3 teams to the same admissions standards as the rest of the student body, but similar schools to Hopkins are notorious for giving their d1 programs a pass on admissions and we need to make exceptions for lacrosse if we're going to remain viable.
https://blogs.mercurynews.com/collegesp ... standards/
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HopFan16
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by HopFan16 »

jhu06 wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:55 am To this point the only Hopkins related NIL situation I've seen is HF16's report Connor Disimone was one of 25,000 athletes to get some free tee shirts from barstool sports (a wildly successful media company that works w/Rabil on PLL)in exchange for some social media posts.
Nah a ton of players now have other endorsements. DeSo and Epstein are both sponsored by Lacrosse Unlimited (which DeSo's dad runs, so no surprise there) along with UNC's Chris Gray, Cuse's Brendan Curry, and a few other guys. Fernandez and I think Maher? have ones with protein supplement brands. Prouty has one with Faceoff Factory, which is Joe Nardella's FOGO training company. There are others but you get the point. Most of these sponsorships are extremely small potatoes and unlikely to net the player any real kind of money.

DeSo did a podcast with IL about it and it sounds like the program and school are on board and support the student athletes in navigating this new world of NIL, so long as they follow the correct process.

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/ ... nges/58279
DocBarrister
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by DocBarrister »

Let’s be blunt here … admissions standards at Hopkins have gone way up during President Daniels’ tenure.

If the Hopkins men’s lacrosse team were to REALLY be subjected to the same standards as the rest of the student class, you would have closer to six players on the team, instead of sixty.

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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by DocBarrister »

HopFan16 wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:30 pm
jhu06 wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:55 am To this point the only Hopkins related NIL situation I've seen is HF16's report Connor Disimone was one of 25,000 athletes to get some free tee shirts from barstool sports (a wildly successful media company that works w/Rabil on PLL)in exchange for some social media posts.
Nah a ton of players now have other endorsements. DeSo and Epstein are both sponsored by Lacrosse Unlimited (which DeSo's dad runs, so no surprise there) along with UNC's Chris Gray, Cuse's Brendan Curry, and a few other guys. Fernandez and I think Maher? have ones with protein supplement brands. Prouty has one with Faceoff Factory, which is Joe Nardella's FOGO training company. There are others but you get the point. Most of these sponsorships are extremely small potatoes and unlikely to net the player any real kind of money.

DeSo did a podcast with IL about it and it sounds like the program and school are on board and support the student athletes in navigating this new world of NIL, so long as they follow the correct process.

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/ ... nges/58279
Johns Hopkins is very “entrepreneurial” in its general approach to things. For example, Johns Hopkins has a very permissive policy towards faculty serving as consultants to private industry or starting up companies. A former Hopkins dean once described Johns Hopkins as the biggest biotech company in the world.

I would not be surprised to hear that Hopkins has a “helpful” or “supportive” approach to NIL revenue for athletes.

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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by hmmm »

They also just modernized and doubled the size of the varsity weight room. Not something you would be doing if you were planning on eliminating sports. This is all ridiculous to suggest the school admin wants Hopkins to move to D3 or eliminate sports.
51percentcorn
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by 51percentcorn »

As far as Janine Tucker - don't forget about camps - $495 in 2019 per player for the 2 day premier camp at Tucker lacrosse - 150 girls is $75,000 in 2 days. Janine also runs coaches clinics - the Hopkins Queen of the Turf tournament and is a great motivational speaker. She could make a comfortable living devoting herself to these and other activities in a broader capacity. Maybe she will coach again - I have no idea - but even if she does it doesn't mean Hopkins pushed her out.

As far as Daniels - let's all worry about other things we have no control over. I get it that folks didn't like Calder apparently being forced out. I get it that the Petro exit was probably not smooth despite both sides remaining publicly silent and above the low road. But there is little evidence of this complete antipathy towards athletics in general and men's lacrosse specifically. The baseball team was recently 15-6 - the men's tennis team was 11-1. The women's cross country team continues their march on the men's lax teams number of gold trophies, the women's volleyball team was undefeated national champions, last full season of women's soccer 17-3-4, last full season of women's field hockey 19-3. Last two seasons of football 8-3 and 12-2. Director's cup winners or runners up I forget. And Calder has been gone since 2016 - so this is all pretty much on the Baker/Shanahan watch.

As far as men's lax - I go back to the following items - if Daniels wanted men's lax gone or D3 the following would not have happened
- The Cordish Center would not be standing
- Petro would not have gotten virtually every single early recruit that he verballed - admissions would have been instructed to be oh so picky
- And while it's a rare day I agree with anything Doc B says - his point about the current coaching staff is valid - if RD secretly wanted lacrosse off the map - Milliman/Junior/Special K would NOT have been the JHU hires
- Johns Hopkins wouldn't have 60 friggin players on the team

Then there's the final point - if he was Custard the Dragon and realio, trulio wanted the lacrosse program at D3 or gone - and assuming he has the authority - he would do it. What would happen? 500 people would lose their collective $&!+ for a week or two and then that would be it. Signs suggest he would not lose the Bloomberg money - obviously he would clear that move with Mike. He would have to jump through all sorts of collective administrative hoops as far as the current players but if I were him and had it in for lacrosse I would go the Board of Trustees and make the case that Hopkins can't afford it. And guess what - most members of the BOT probably couldn't care less about lacrosse either.

As long as there is no schoolwork, hazing, violence, sexual or other embarrasing scandal - I don't think he cares.
Last edited by 51percentcorn on Mon Aug 30, 2021 1:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

DocBarrister wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 12:31 pm Let’s be blunt here … admissions standards at Hopkins have gone way up during President Daniels’ tenure.

If the Hopkins men’s lacrosse team were to REALLY be subjected to the same standards as the rest of the student class, you would have closer to six players on the team, instead of sixty.

DocBarrister
I don't think anyone argued otherwise...the DIII sports aren't 'equivalent' "same standards" either, but they're darn closer. Much more akin to an IVY or NESCAC admissions process than a standard DI. (maybe even tougher than Ivy and NESCAC in some cases). It's possible IMO for D1 lax to get closer to those other standards and be highly competitive, but it's definitely not easy. I'd think there'd be at least some pressure that direction, though I haven't heard even rumbles of such (other than disgruntled folks in fever swamps).

And it wouldn't be something that cause Janine to leave, IMO. Makes much more sense that she's at a stage of life where some changes might be desirable to her.
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by 51percentcorn »

jhu06 wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:55 am Never really thought of the womens lax program as a wildly successful outfit. If Boston College, Florida, Northwestern and James Madison can have success you'd think our women could do better than a few first round exits.
Have you been to any of those schools? Allow me to elaborate:
Northwestern - Chicago/Lake Michigan/One of the Top Schools in the country
Boston College - one of the most vibrant collegiate areas in the country - major D1 sports - Boston (I could throw in Tree House and Trillium Brewing but high school girls shouldn't be about that yet)
James Madison - almost 4 times the enrollment as JHU - beautiful school in the foothills of highway 81 and Shenandoah National Park - tuition still under 30,000 out of state - tons of money coming in with expanded facilities going up everywhere - 2 hours from DC area
Florida - if I have to explain that one to you - you are beyond help

Plus maybe the women's lax players are upset you don't like their sweatpants
Last edited by 51percentcorn on Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
OCanada
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by OCanada »

Lot of non sequitur D’s popping up.

Petro wasn’t able to verbal anyone he wanted.

For years Hopkins was accepting less desirable candidates because they needed students who could pay full freight. Bloomberg has eliminated the problem at least temporarily.

The involvement of the President was always a big value add. It’s now a gap that hasn’t been filled. As one HOFer said not long ago he doubts Daniels could find his way alone to the field. Try not to take that too literally.

No one mentions money but there is a lot of money in the accounts of former players and their supporters. One alone has more than a billion. Daniels was never going to be able to stop the lacrosse center.

Tedious
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by 51percentcorn »

I never said Petro got any verbal he wanted - NEVER - one area that you and I have been in agreement on is that anyone that thinks that Hopkins can gather up all lacrosse recruits and pick who they want is out of their mind. It is a two way street and traffic is flowing in one major direction against Hopkins.

What I meant to convey - apologies if unclear - is that when Xanders or IL or whomever published the latest list of Hopkins verbals when they were high school freshmen or sophomores - they almost to a kid - showed up. Sure there were decommits but they happened WAY before any admissions process so the decommits were not related to the Hopkins administration. SO almost all of Petro's verbals got ADMITTED - can't think of one kid on one of those lists where someone was putting forth they didn't get in. As I have noted before the only admissions story I can recall from the reasonable past is that Radzewicz was denied admission at Cornell. If you were Daniels and wanted to mess with the men's lacrosse program - the perfect - absolutely perfect - opportunity would have been to tell admissions - ehhhh - 18 kids - not so much. How about 12? and how about these 12? Then Petro a) has to have very difficult conversations b) is stuck because almost everyone else has picked a school.

Tedious - please - glad you know how much is in everyone's bank accounts. Obviously this is all about money and what monetary risks exists based on what decisions you make.
jhu06
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by jhu06 »

I've never seen James Madison listed anywhere on any list for strong academics or athletics other than a lacrosse top 20 list. BC and Northwestern have struggled mightily with sports aside from a Doug Flutie or Darnell Autry season here and there despite what Mike Wilbon and the clowns on ESPN think of their alma mater. People in Florida probably think a lacrosse stick is used for helping bring fish in a boat. The women have every advantage the men do less the pressure of expectations and have a facility and brand to pitch they didn't have anything to do with creating. In 4 years I was never in a class where a womens lacrosse player made a meaningful contribution to a single class or conversation. They did look great a wawa and pjs tho.

As I've said it wouldn't hurt for Daniels pr team to get him on more espn broadcasts and have him spotted in the stands w/the students and parents on tv a few times, but it's hard to argue between 51+my lists that the school isn't backing the program and he's raised a ton of $ for homewood. Again the folks who think he and baker don't back the the program are more than welcome to document the case here since they don't want to go on the record w/edward lee.

Mens lacrosse coach should be able to get in whomever he wants. The program is that important to the school in showing the world we're more than a healthcare company and about 98 percent of the high schools these recruits come from prepare them well enough regardless of their grades and stats to pass a poli sci or history curriculum at Hopkins. Those courses are not that rough. They're not maryland leisure studies majors or ohio state basket weaving lectures but you can functionally pass them.

I don't follow the NIL stuff, but you'd think as we discussed a few pages ago it would be a big weapon to pitch to recruits along the lines of the old argument that at Hopkins lacrosse players not hockey or mens basketball or football are the major focus. Obviously Rabil and Harrison have shown what a Hopkins lacrosse platform can help do for a student athlete.
DocBarrister
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Re: Johns Hopkins 2022

Post by DocBarrister »

OCanada wrote: Mon Aug 30, 2021 2:13 pm Lot of non sequitur D’s popping up.

Petro wasn’t able to verbal anyone he wanted.

For years Hopkins was accepting less desirable candidates because they needed students who could pay full freight. Bloomberg has eliminated the problem at least temporarily.

The involvement of the President was always a big value add. It’s now a gap that hasn’t been filled. As one HOFer said not long ago he doubts Daniels could find his way alone to the field. Try not to take that too literally.

No one mentions money but there is a lot of money in the accounts of former players and their supporters. One alone has more than a billion. Daniels was never going to be able to stop the lacrosse center.

Tedious
I recall one forum member suggesting that President Daniels get directly involved in lacrosse player recruitment. Hard for me to imagine a worse idea.

President Daniels has too many other important things to worry about. If he watches a replay of a game on ESPN3 once in a blue moon, that would more than satisfy me.

DocBarrister
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