I am not laughing about the tragedy of the loss of life of US citizens and military personnel. I am laughing at you. There is a difference. You said you didn’t see what I was laughing at….I told you to look in the mirror….. but hey Afghanistan is on Biden. You sound even “stupider”. I thought you quit this site? You know where the door is….I need to fix it as it obviously revolves.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:38 pmA couple of marines KIA. Yuk it up dumbflock, yuk it up. Look in your own mirror. Explain the joke to those dead marines you POS...Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:18 pmLook in the mirror.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:08 pmGlad you think this is funny. I'm not as smart as you. I don't see the humor in this situation that you do. People are dying and your chuckling about it..Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:48 amcradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 amRefresh my memory, who has been POTUS since 1/21/21? That was the day all of trump's policies and decisions were kicked to the curb by our new POTUS. Biden did so with much gusto. So now all the FLP libs on this forum are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to blame Bidens f**k ups on trump. To quote Forest Gumps mom...stupid is as stupid does. Trump's f**k ups belong to him. Bidens f**k ups belong to him. The F**k up in Afghanistan belongs to Joe Biden. On 1/22/21 whatever would happen in Afghanistan was Joe Bidens problem.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:13 amTrump sided with the Taliban…. Taliban is in control…..ISIS is an enemy of the Taliban…..therefore it’s Trump’s fault.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 10:55 amF***ing trumps fault. This was the problem Joe inherited after all. Why didn't Joe just do the same thing he did with every other trump policy? My bad, this f**k up has to blamed on somebody not named Biden..
Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
“I wish you would!”
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seacoaster
- Posts: 8866
- Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:36 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/26/opin ... rawal.html
"In 2005, my colleagues at The American Prospect Sam Rosenfeld and Matt Yglesias wrote an essay I think about often. It was called “The Incompetence Dodge,” and it argued that American policymakers and pundits routinely try to rescue the reputation of bad ideas by attributing their failure to poor execution. At the time, they were writing about the liberal hawks who were blaming the catastrophe of the Iraq war on the Bush administration’s maladministration rather than rethinking the enterprise in its totality. But the same dynamic suffuses the recriminations over the Afghanistan withdrawal.
To state the obvious: There was no good way to lose Afghanistan to the Taliban. A better withdrawal was possible — and our stingy, chaotic visa process was unforgivable — but so was a worse one. Either way, there was no hope of an end to the war that didn’t reveal our decades of folly, no matter how deeply America’s belief in its own enduring innocence demanded one. That is the reckoning that lies beneath events that are still unfolding, and much of the cable news conversation is a frenzied, bipartisan effort to avoid it.
Focusing on the execution of the withdrawal is giving virtually everyone who insisted we could remake Afghanistan the opportunity to obscure their failures by pretending to believe in the possibility of a graceful departure. It’s also obscuring the true alternative to withdrawal: endless occupation. But what our ignominious exit really reflects is the failure of America’s foreign policy establishment at both prediction and policymaking in Afghanistan.
“The pro-war crowd sees this as a mechanism by which they can absolve themselves of an accounting for the last 20 years,” Senator Chris Murphy, Democrat of Connecticut, told me. “Just think about the epic size of this policy failure. Twenty years of training. More than $2 trillion worth of expenditure. For almost nothing. It is heartbreaking to watch these images, but it is equally heartbreaking to think about all of the effort, of lives and money we wasted in pursuit of a goal that was illusory.”
Emma Ashford, a senior fellow at the Scowcroft Center for Strategy and Security, phrased it well: “There’s no denying America is the most powerful country in the world, but what we’ve seen over and over in recent decades is we cannot turn that into the outcomes we want. Whether it’s Afghanistan or Libya or sanctions on Russia and Venezuela, we don’t get the policy outcomes we want, and I think that’s because we overreach — we assume that because we are very powerful, we can achieve things that are unachievable.”
It is worth considering some counterfactuals for how our occupation could have ended. Imagine that the Biden administration, believing the Afghan government hollow, ignored President Ashraf Ghani’s pleas and began rapidly withdrawing personnel and power months ago. The vote of no-confidence ripples through Afghan politics, demoralizing the existing government and emboldening the Taliban. Those who didn’t know which side to choose, who were waiting for a signal of who held power, quickly cut deals with the Taliban. As the last U.S. troops leave, the Taliban overwhelms the country, and the Biden administration is blamed, reasonably, for speeding their victory.
Another possible scenario was suggested to me by Grant Gordon, a political scientist who works on conflict and refugee crises (and is, I should say, an old friend): If the Biden administration had pulled our allies and personnel out more efficiently, that might have unleashed the Taliban to massacre their opposition, as America and the world would have been insulated and perhaps uninterested in the aftermath. There have been revenge killings, but it has not devolved, at least as of yet, into all-out slaughter, and that may be because the American withdrawal has been messy and partial and the Taliban fears re-engagement. “What is clearly a debacle from one angle may actually have generated restraint,” Gordon told me. “Having spent time in places like this, I think people lack a real imagination for how bad these conflicts can get.”
Let me offer one more: Even though few believed Ghani’s government would prevail in our absence, and the Trump administration cut them out of its deal with the Taliban, there’s widespread disappointment that the government we supported collapsed so quickly. Biden has been particularly unsparing in his descriptions of the Afghan Army’s abdication, and I agree with those who say he’s been unfair, underestimating the courage and sacrifice shown by Afghan troops throughout the war. But put that aside: Americans might have felt better seeing our allies in Afghanistan put up a longer fight, even if the Taliban emerged victorious. But would a multiyear civil war have been better for the Afghans caught in the crossfire?
Brian Katulis, a senior fellow at the Center for American Progress, put it simply: “I think there’s a lot of cognitive dissonance, and smart people are struggling with how to rationalize defeat. Because that’s what we have here in Afghanistan — a defeat.”
I will not pretend that I know how we should have left Afghanistan. But neither do a lot of people dominating the airwaves right now. And the confident pronouncements to the contrary over the past two weeks leave me worried that America has learned little. We are still holding not just to the illusion of our control, but to the illusion of our knowledge.
This is an illusion that, for me, shattered long ago. I was a college freshman when America invaded Iraq. And, to my enduring shame, I supported it. My reasoning was straightforward: If George W. Bush and Bill Clinton and Tony Blair and Hillary Clinton and Colin Powell and, yes, Joe Biden all thought there was some profound and present danger posed by Saddam Hussein, they must have known something I didn’t.
There’s an old line: “It ain’t what you don’t know that gets you into trouble. It’s what you know for sure that just ain’t so.” And so it was with the Iraq war. Bush and Clinton and Powell and Blair knew quite a bit that wasn’t true. As Robert Draper shows in his book “To Start a War: How the Bush Administration Took America Into Iraq,” they were certain Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. Only he didn’t. They were also certain, based on decades of testimony from Iraqi expats, that Americans would be welcomed as liberators.
There were many lessons to be learned from the Iraq war, but this, for me, was the most central: We don’t know what we don’t know, and, even worse, we don’t always know what we think we know. Policymakers are easily fooled by people with seemingly relevant experience or credentials who will tell them what they want to hear or what they already believe. The flow of money, interests, enmities and factions is opaque to outsiders and even to insiders. We do not understand other countries well enough to remake them according to our ideals. We don’t even understand our own country well enough to achieve our ideals.
“Look at the countries in which the war on terror has been waged,” Ben Rhodes, who served as a top foreign policy adviser to President Barack Obama, told me. “Afghanistan. Iraq. Yemen. Somalia. Libya. Every one of those countries is worse off today in some fashion. The evidentiary basis for the idea that American military intervention leads inexorably to improved material circumstances is simply not there.”
I wrote a book on political polarization so I am often asked to do interviews where the point is to lament how awful polarization is. But the continuing power of the war-on-terror framework reflects the problems that come from too much bipartisanship. Too much agreement can be as toxic to a political system as too much disagreement. The alternative to polarization is often the suppression of dissenting viewpoints. If the parties agree with each other, then they have incentive to marginalize those who disagree with both of them.
At least for my adult life, on foreign policy, our political problem has been that the parties have agreed on too much, and dissenting voices have been shut out. That has allowed too much to go unquestioned, and too many failures to go uncorrected. It is telling that it is Biden who is taking the blame for America’s defeat in Afghanistan. The consequences come for those who admit America’s foreign policy failures and try to change course, not for those who instigate or perpetuate them.
Initially, the war in Afghanistan was as broadly supported and bipartisan as anything in American politics has ever been. That made it hard to question, and it has made it harder to end. The same is true of the assumptions lying beneath it, and much else in our foreign policy — that America is always a good actor; that we understand enough about the rest of the world, and about ourselves, to remake it in our image; that humanitarianism and militarism are easily grafted together.
The tragedy of humanitarian intervention as a foreign policy philosophy is that it binds our compassion to our delusions of military mastery. We awaken to the suffering of others when we fear those who rule them or hide among them, and in this way our desire for security finds union with our desire for decency. Or we awaken to the suffering of others when they face a massacre of such immediacy that we are forced to confront our passivity and to ask what inaction would mean for our souls and self-image. In both cases, we awaken with a gun in our hands, or perhaps we awaken because we have a gun in our hands.
To many, America’s pretensions of humanitarian motivation were always suspect. There are vicious regimes America does nothing to stop. There are vicious regimes America finances directly. It is callous to suggest that the only suffering we bear responsibility for is the suffering inflicted by our withdrawal. Our wars and drone strikes and tactical raids and the resulting geopolitical chaos directly led to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Afghans and Iraqis.
This is the deep lacuna in America’s foreign policy conversation: The American foreign policy establishment obsesses over the harms caused by our absence or withdrawal. But there’s no similar culpability for the harms we commit or that our presence creates. We are much quicker to blame ourselves for what we don’t do than what we do.
My heart breaks for the suffering we will leave behind in Afghanistan. But we do not know how to fix Afghanistan. We failed in that effort so completely that we ended up strengthening the Taliban. We should do all we can to bring American citizens and allies home. But if we truly care about educating girls worldwide, we know how to build schools and finance education. If we truly care about protecting those who fear tyranny, we know how to issue visas and admit refugees. If we truly care about the suffering of others, there is so much we could do. Only 1 percent of the residents of poor countries are vaccinated against the coronavirus. We could change that. More than 400,000 people die from malaria each year. We could change that, too.
“I want America more forward-deployed, but I want it through a massive international financing arm and a massive renewable energy arm,” Senator Murphy told me. “That’s the United States I want to see spread across the world — not the face of America today that’s by and large arms sales, military trainers and brigades.”
The choice we face is not between isolationism and militarism. We are not powerful enough to achieve the unachievable. But we are powerful enough to do far more good, and far less harm, than we do now."
"In 2005, my colleagues at The American Prospect Sam Rosenfeld and Matt Yglesias wrote an essay I think about often. It was called “The Incompetence Dodge,” and it argued that American policymakers and pundits routinely try to rescue the reputation of bad ideas by attributing their failure to poor execution. At the time, they were writing about the liberal hawks who were blaming the catastrophe of the Iraq war on the Bush administration’s maladministration rather than rethinking the enterprise in its totality. But the same dynamic suffuses the recriminations over the Afghanistan withdrawal.
To state the obvious: There was no good way to lose Afghanistan to the Taliban. A better withdrawal was possible — and our stingy, chaotic visa process was unforgivable — but so was a worse one. Either way, there was no hope of an end to the war that didn’t reveal our decades of folly, no matter how deeply America’s belief in its own enduring innocence demanded one. That is the reckoning that lies beneath events that are still unfolding, and much of the cable news conversation is a frenzied, bipartisan effort to avoid it.
Focusing on the execution of the withdrawal is giving virtually everyone who insisted we could remake Afghanistan the opportunity to obscure their failures by pretending to believe in the possibility of a graceful departure. It’s also obscuring the true alternative to withdrawal: endless occupation. But what our ignominious exit really reflects is the failure of America’s foreign policy establishment at both prediction and policymaking in Afghanistan.
“The pro-war crowd sees this as a mechanism by which they can absolve themselves of an accounting for the last 20 years,” Senator Chris Murphy, Democrat of Connecticut, told me. “Just think about the epic size of this policy failure. Twenty years of training. More than $2 trillion worth of expenditure. For almost nothing. It is heartbreaking to watch these images, but it is equally heartbreaking to think about all of the effort, of lives and money we wasted in pursuit of a goal that was illusory.”
Emma Ashford, a senior fellow at the Scowcroft Center for Strategy and Security, phrased it well: “There’s no denying America is the most powerful country in the world, but what we’ve seen over and over in recent decades is we cannot turn that into the outcomes we want. Whether it’s Afghanistan or Libya or sanctions on Russia and Venezuela, we don’t get the policy outcomes we want, and I think that’s because we overreach — we assume that because we are very powerful, we can achieve things that are unachievable.”
It is worth considering some counterfactuals for how our occupation could have ended. Imagine that the Biden administration, believing the Afghan government hollow, ignored President Ashraf Ghani’s pleas and began rapidly withdrawing personnel and power months ago. The vote of no-confidence ripples through Afghan politics, demoralizing the existing government and emboldening the Taliban. Those who didn’t know which side to choose, who were waiting for a signal of who held power, quickly cut deals with the Taliban. As the last U.S. troops leave, the Taliban overwhelms the country, and the Biden administration is blamed, reasonably, for speeding their victory.
Another possible scenario was suggested to me by Grant Gordon, a political scientist who works on conflict and refugee crises (and is, I should say, an old friend): If the Biden administration had pulled our allies and personnel out more efficiently, that might have unleashed the Taliban to massacre their opposition, as America and the world would have been insulated and perhaps uninterested in the aftermath. There have been revenge killings, but it has not devolved, at least as of yet, into all-out slaughter, and that may be because the American withdrawal has been messy and partial and the Taliban fears re-engagement. “What is clearly a debacle from one angle may actually have generated restraint,” Gordon told me. “Having spent time in places like this, I think people lack a real imagination for how bad these conflicts can get.”
Let me offer one more: Even though few believed Ghani’s government would prevail in our absence, and the Trump administration cut them out of its deal with the Taliban, there’s widespread disappointment that the government we supported collapsed so quickly. Biden has been particularly unsparing in his descriptions of the Afghan Army’s abdication, and I agree with those who say he’s been unfair, underestimating the courage and sacrifice shown by Afghan troops throughout the war. But put that aside: Americans might have felt better seeing our allies in Afghanistan put up a longer fight, even if the Taliban emerged victorious. But would a multiyear civil war have been better for the Afghans caught in the crossfire?
Brian Katulis, a senior fellow at the Center for American Progress, put it simply: “I think there’s a lot of cognitive dissonance, and smart people are struggling with how to rationalize defeat. Because that’s what we have here in Afghanistan — a defeat.”
I will not pretend that I know how we should have left Afghanistan. But neither do a lot of people dominating the airwaves right now. And the confident pronouncements to the contrary over the past two weeks leave me worried that America has learned little. We are still holding not just to the illusion of our control, but to the illusion of our knowledge.
This is an illusion that, for me, shattered long ago. I was a college freshman when America invaded Iraq. And, to my enduring shame, I supported it. My reasoning was straightforward: If George W. Bush and Bill Clinton and Tony Blair and Hillary Clinton and Colin Powell and, yes, Joe Biden all thought there was some profound and present danger posed by Saddam Hussein, they must have known something I didn’t.
There’s an old line: “It ain’t what you don’t know that gets you into trouble. It’s what you know for sure that just ain’t so.” And so it was with the Iraq war. Bush and Clinton and Powell and Blair knew quite a bit that wasn’t true. As Robert Draper shows in his book “To Start a War: How the Bush Administration Took America Into Iraq,” they were certain Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. Only he didn’t. They were also certain, based on decades of testimony from Iraqi expats, that Americans would be welcomed as liberators.
There were many lessons to be learned from the Iraq war, but this, for me, was the most central: We don’t know what we don’t know, and, even worse, we don’t always know what we think we know. Policymakers are easily fooled by people with seemingly relevant experience or credentials who will tell them what they want to hear or what they already believe. The flow of money, interests, enmities and factions is opaque to outsiders and even to insiders. We do not understand other countries well enough to remake them according to our ideals. We don’t even understand our own country well enough to achieve our ideals.
“Look at the countries in which the war on terror has been waged,” Ben Rhodes, who served as a top foreign policy adviser to President Barack Obama, told me. “Afghanistan. Iraq. Yemen. Somalia. Libya. Every one of those countries is worse off today in some fashion. The evidentiary basis for the idea that American military intervention leads inexorably to improved material circumstances is simply not there.”
I wrote a book on political polarization so I am often asked to do interviews where the point is to lament how awful polarization is. But the continuing power of the war-on-terror framework reflects the problems that come from too much bipartisanship. Too much agreement can be as toxic to a political system as too much disagreement. The alternative to polarization is often the suppression of dissenting viewpoints. If the parties agree with each other, then they have incentive to marginalize those who disagree with both of them.
At least for my adult life, on foreign policy, our political problem has been that the parties have agreed on too much, and dissenting voices have been shut out. That has allowed too much to go unquestioned, and too many failures to go uncorrected. It is telling that it is Biden who is taking the blame for America’s defeat in Afghanistan. The consequences come for those who admit America’s foreign policy failures and try to change course, not for those who instigate or perpetuate them.
Initially, the war in Afghanistan was as broadly supported and bipartisan as anything in American politics has ever been. That made it hard to question, and it has made it harder to end. The same is true of the assumptions lying beneath it, and much else in our foreign policy — that America is always a good actor; that we understand enough about the rest of the world, and about ourselves, to remake it in our image; that humanitarianism and militarism are easily grafted together.
The tragedy of humanitarian intervention as a foreign policy philosophy is that it binds our compassion to our delusions of military mastery. We awaken to the suffering of others when we fear those who rule them or hide among them, and in this way our desire for security finds union with our desire for decency. Or we awaken to the suffering of others when they face a massacre of such immediacy that we are forced to confront our passivity and to ask what inaction would mean for our souls and self-image. In both cases, we awaken with a gun in our hands, or perhaps we awaken because we have a gun in our hands.
To many, America’s pretensions of humanitarian motivation were always suspect. There are vicious regimes America does nothing to stop. There are vicious regimes America finances directly. It is callous to suggest that the only suffering we bear responsibility for is the suffering inflicted by our withdrawal. Our wars and drone strikes and tactical raids and the resulting geopolitical chaos directly led to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Afghans and Iraqis.
This is the deep lacuna in America’s foreign policy conversation: The American foreign policy establishment obsesses over the harms caused by our absence or withdrawal. But there’s no similar culpability for the harms we commit or that our presence creates. We are much quicker to blame ourselves for what we don’t do than what we do.
My heart breaks for the suffering we will leave behind in Afghanistan. But we do not know how to fix Afghanistan. We failed in that effort so completely that we ended up strengthening the Taliban. We should do all we can to bring American citizens and allies home. But if we truly care about educating girls worldwide, we know how to build schools and finance education. If we truly care about protecting those who fear tyranny, we know how to issue visas and admit refugees. If we truly care about the suffering of others, there is so much we could do. Only 1 percent of the residents of poor countries are vaccinated against the coronavirus. We could change that. More than 400,000 people die from malaria each year. We could change that, too.
“I want America more forward-deployed, but I want it through a massive international financing arm and a massive renewable energy arm,” Senator Murphy told me. “That’s the United States I want to see spread across the world — not the face of America today that’s by and large arms sales, military trainers and brigades.”
The choice we face is not between isolationism and militarism. We are not powerful enough to achieve the unachievable. But we are powerful enough to do far more good, and far less harm, than we do now."
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PizzaSnake
- Posts: 5361
- Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:36 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
"Well, well, well... if it isn't the consequences of your own actions..."
What the heck did people think was going to happen? We knew this from day forking one. Well, those of us with a brain did...
I'm thinking of a voting test -- a basic intelligence test. I'm so done with idiots. I'll let you live, but voting is out. Oh, and no progeny either. We certainly are all stocked up on stupid.
What the heck did people think was going to happen? We knew this from day forking one. Well, those of us with a brain did...
I'm thinking of a voting test -- a basic intelligence test. I'm so done with idiots. I'll let you live, but voting is out. Oh, and no progeny either. We certainly are all stocked up on stupid.
"There is nothing more difficult and more dangerous to carry through than initiating changes. One makes enemies of those who prospered under the old order, and only lukewarm support from those who would prosper under the new."
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cradleandshoot
- Posts: 15561
- Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:42 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
If ignorance is bliss you are hands down the happiest person on this forum. I was going to quit this site. I will leave that decision up to management when they decide they don't want me around anymore. I'm surprised so many of my friends here are disturbed by my coming back. Your insecurities at having to deal with a lil ole fellow like me speaks volumes to all of you folks. Do you all want me to leave? That would give all of you ample time to stroke one another. You could then decide who the best FLP member of this forum is. If I'm getting in all of your way of accomplishing that, you all just tell me and I will watch you make assholes of yourselves from a safe distance. That is what I was doing while I took my vacation and you FLP morons did not disappoint. It was a bona fide FLP jerk off fest indeed. That is what this forum has sadly become. You give me the word TLD and I will happily watch you people make assholes of yourselves from the sidelines.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:45 pmI am not laughing about the tragedy of the loss of life of US citizens and military personnel. I am laughing at you. There is a difference. You said you didn’t see what I was laughing at….I told you to look in the mirror….. but hey Afghanistan is on Biden. You sound even “stupider”. I thought you quit this site? You know where the door is….I need to fix it as it obviously revolves.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:38 pmA couple of marines KIA. Yuk it up dumbflock, yuk it up. Look in your own mirror. Explain the joke to those dead marines you POS...Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:18 pmLook in the mirror.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:08 pmGlad you think this is funny. I'm not as smart as you. I don't see the humor in this situation that you do. People are dying and your chuckling about it..Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:48 amcradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 amRefresh my memory, who has been POTUS since 1/21/21? That was the day all of trump's policies and decisions were kicked to the curb by our new POTUS. Biden did so with much gusto. So now all the FLP libs on this forum are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to blame Bidens f**k ups on trump. To quote Forest Gumps mom...stupid is as stupid does. Trump's f**k ups belong to him. Bidens f**k ups belong to him. The F**k up in Afghanistan belongs to Joe Biden. On 1/22/21 whatever would happen in Afghanistan was Joe Bidens problem.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:13 amTrump sided with the Taliban…. Taliban is in control…..ISIS is an enemy of the Taliban…..therefore it’s Trump’s fault.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 10:55 amF***ing trumps fault. This was the problem Joe inherited after all. Why didn't Joe just do the same thing he did with every other trump policy? My bad, this f**k up has to blamed on somebody not named Biden..
Given my attitude and the propensity of some posters here that whine and b***h to management, I suspect I will be watching from the sidelines again sooner rather than later.
Last edited by cradleandshoot on Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
Bob Ross:
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
Apparently they are now reporting 11 dead marines and 1 Navy medic.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:45 pmThe sooner we can get out of the the better. I am hoping we can get out as many Americans as we can as safely as we can.
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cradleandshoot
- Posts: 15561
- Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:42 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
That must make TLD very, very, very happy. I'll post the happy face for him.jhu72 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:43 pmApparently they are now reporting 11 dead marines and 1 Navy medic.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:45 pmThe sooner we can get out of the the better. I am hoping we can get out as many Americans as we can as safely as we can.
This is why you dont effing tell the bad guys what you will do and when you will do it. This entire cluster f**k should never have happened.. NEVER. It was 100 percent avoidable. You folks laughed at my 1950s analogy to Dien Bien Phu. Your troops are surrounded and become sitting ducks. We can only leave now at the benevolence and good graces of the Taliban.
Last edited by cradleandshoot on Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
Bob Ross:
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
It’s sad….laughing at you doesn’t mean I find the danger these soldiers are in as funny. With close friends with kids that are SEALs and Rangers I hope we get out as fast as possible. It’s you…not them that’s laughable…..and oh yeah..cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:49 pmThat must make TLD very, very, very happy. I'll post the happy face for him.jhu72 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:43 pmApparently they are now reporting 11 dead marines and 1 Navy medic.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:45 pmThe sooner we can get out of the the better. I am hoping we can get out as many Americans as we can as safely as we can.
“I wish you would!”
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
I only pointed out your hypocrisy. I thought you were a man of your word. I am glad you are back. It’s entertainment.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:25 pmIf ignorance is bliss you are hands down the happiest person on this forum. I was going to quit this site. I will leave that decision up to management when they decide they don't want me around anymore. I'm surprised so many of my friends here are disturbed by my coming back. Your insecurities at having to deal with a lil ole fellow like me speaks volumes to all of you folks. Do you all want me to leave? That would give all of you ample time to stroke one another. You could then decide who the best FLP member of this forum is. If I'm getting in all of your way of accomplishing that, you all just tell me and I will watch you make assholes of yourselves from a safe distance. That is what I was doing while I took my vacation and you FLP morons did not disappoint. It was a bona fide FLP jerk off fest indeed. That is what this forum has sadly become. You give me the word TLD and I will happily watch you people make assholes of yourselves from the sidelines.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:45 pmI am not laughing about the tragedy of the loss of life of US citizens and military personnel. I am laughing at you. There is a difference. You said you didn’t see what I was laughing at….I told you to look in the mirror….. but hey Afghanistan is on Biden. You sound even “stupider”. I thought you quit this site? You know where the door is….I need to fix it as it obviously revolves.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:38 pmA couple of marines KIA. Yuk it up dumbflock, yuk it up. Look in your own mirror. Explain the joke to those dead marines you POS...Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:18 pmLook in the mirror.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:08 pmGlad you think this is funny. I'm not as smart as you. I don't see the humor in this situation that you do. People are dying and your chuckling about it..Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:48 amcradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 amRefresh my memory, who has been POTUS since 1/21/21? That was the day all of trump's policies and decisions were kicked to the curb by our new POTUS. Biden did so with much gusto. So now all the FLP libs on this forum are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to blame Bidens f**k ups on trump. To quote Forest Gumps mom...stupid is as stupid does. Trump's f**k ups belong to him. Bidens f**k ups belong to him. The F**k up in Afghanistan belongs to Joe Biden. On 1/22/21 whatever would happen in Afghanistan was Joe Bidens problem.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:13 amTrump sided with the Taliban…. Taliban is in control…..ISIS is an enemy of the Taliban…..therefore it’s Trump’s fault.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 10:55 amF***ing trumps fault. This was the problem Joe inherited after all. Why didn't Joe just do the same thing he did with every other trump policy? My bad, this f**k up has to blamed on somebody not named Biden..
Given my attitude and the propensity of some posters here that whine and b***h to management, I suspect I will be watching from the sidelines again sooner rather than later.
“I wish you would!”
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
Just awful.jhu72 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:43 pmApparently they are now reporting 11 dead marines and 1 Navy medic.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:45 pmThe sooner we can get out of the the better. I am hoping we can get out as many Americans as we can as safely as we can.
“I wish you would!”
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cradleandshoot
- Posts: 15561
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Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
We have a position here we can agree on. Reading the FLP lovefest on this forum is also very entertaining. It also provides a great sense of humor.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:58 pmI only pointed out your hypocrisy. I thought you were a man of your word. I am glad you are back. It’s entertainment.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:25 pmIf ignorance is bliss you are hands down the happiest person on this forum. I was going to quit this site. I will leave that decision up to management when they decide they don't want me around anymore. I'm surprised so many of my friends here are disturbed by my coming back. Your insecurities at having to deal with a lil ole fellow like me speaks volumes to all of you folks. Do you all want me to leave? That would give all of you ample time to stroke one another. You could then decide who the best FLP member of this forum is. If I'm getting in all of your way of accomplishing that, you all just tell me and I will watch you make assholes of yourselves from a safe distance. That is what I was doing while I took my vacation and you FLP morons did not disappoint. It was a bona fide FLP jerk off fest indeed. That is what this forum has sadly become. You give me the word TLD and I will happily watch you people make assholes of yourselves from the sidelines.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:45 pmI am not laughing about the tragedy of the loss of life of US citizens and military personnel. I am laughing at you. There is a difference. You said you didn’t see what I was laughing at….I told you to look in the mirror….. but hey Afghanistan is on Biden. You sound even “stupider”. I thought you quit this site? You know where the door is….I need to fix it as it obviously revolves.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:38 pmA couple of marines KIA. Yuk it up dumbflock, yuk it up. Look in your own mirror. Explain the joke to those dead marines you POS...Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:18 pmLook in the mirror.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:08 pmGlad you think this is funny. I'm not as smart as you. I don't see the humor in this situation that you do. People are dying and your chuckling about it..Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:48 amcradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 amRefresh my memory, who has been POTUS since 1/21/21? That was the day all of trump's policies and decisions were kicked to the curb by our new POTUS. Biden did so with much gusto. So now all the FLP libs on this forum are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to blame Bidens f**k ups on trump. To quote Forest Gumps mom...stupid is as stupid does. Trump's f**k ups belong to him. Bidens f**k ups belong to him. The F**k up in Afghanistan belongs to Joe Biden. On 1/22/21 whatever would happen in Afghanistan was Joe Bidens problem.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:13 amTrump sided with the Taliban…. Taliban is in control…..ISIS is an enemy of the Taliban…..therefore it’s Trump’s fault.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 10:55 amF***ing trumps fault. This was the problem Joe inherited after all. Why didn't Joe just do the same thing he did with every other trump policy? My bad, this f**k up has to blamed on somebody not named Biden..
Given my attitude and the propensity of some posters here that whine and b***h to management, I suspect I will be watching from the sidelines again sooner rather than later.
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
Bob Ross:
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
I appreciate your service.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 3:08 pmWe have a position here we can agree on. Reading the FLP lovefest on this forum is also very entertaining. It also provides a great sense of humor.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:58 pmI only pointed out your hypocrisy. I thought you were a man of your word. I am glad you are back. It’s entertainment.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:25 pmIf ignorance is bliss you are hands down the happiest person on this forum. I was going to quit this site. I will leave that decision up to management when they decide they don't want me around anymore. I'm surprised so many of my friends here are disturbed by my coming back. Your insecurities at having to deal with a lil ole fellow like me speaks volumes to all of you folks. Do you all want me to leave? That would give all of you ample time to stroke one another. You could then decide who the best FLP member of this forum is. If I'm getting in all of your way of accomplishing that, you all just tell me and I will watch you make assholes of yourselves from a safe distance. That is what I was doing while I took my vacation and you FLP morons did not disappoint. It was a bona fide FLP jerk off fest indeed. That is what this forum has sadly become. You give me the word TLD and I will happily watch you people make assholes of yourselves from the sidelines.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:45 pmI am not laughing about the tragedy of the loss of life of US citizens and military personnel. I am laughing at you. There is a difference. You said you didn’t see what I was laughing at….I told you to look in the mirror….. but hey Afghanistan is on Biden. You sound even “stupider”. I thought you quit this site? You know where the door is….I need to fix it as it obviously revolves.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:38 pmA couple of marines KIA. Yuk it up dumbflock, yuk it up. Look in your own mirror. Explain the joke to those dead marines you POS...Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:18 pmLook in the mirror.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:08 pmGlad you think this is funny. I'm not as smart as you. I don't see the humor in this situation that you do. People are dying and your chuckling about it..Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:48 amcradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:36 amRefresh my memory, who has been POTUS since 1/21/21? That was the day all of trump's policies and decisions were kicked to the curb by our new POTUS. Biden did so with much gusto. So now all the FLP libs on this forum are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to blame Bidens f**k ups on trump. To quote Forest Gumps mom...stupid is as stupid does. Trump's f**k ups belong to him. Bidens f**k ups belong to him. The F**k up in Afghanistan belongs to Joe Biden. On 1/22/21 whatever would happen in Afghanistan was Joe Bidens problem.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:13 amTrump sided with the Taliban…. Taliban is in control…..ISIS is an enemy of the Taliban…..therefore it’s Trump’s fault.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 10:55 amF***ing trumps fault. This was the problem Joe inherited after all. Why didn't Joe just do the same thing he did with every other trump policy? My bad, this f**k up has to blamed on somebody not named Biden..
Given my attitude and the propensity of some posters here that whine and b***h to management, I suspect I will be watching from the sidelines again sooner rather than later.
“I wish you would!”
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
Fine, but let's be honest. If departure had been thought out and actually planned, our current "ignominious" situation would not be any where near as "ignominious" as it is. That is on Biden and his Build Back Better administration. Let's be careful not to "dodge" that reality.seacoaster wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:04 pm
Let’s Not Pretend That the Way We Withdrew From Afghanistan Was the Problem
"Focusing on the execution of the withdrawal is giving virtually everyone who insisted we could remake Afghanistan the opportunity to obscure their failures by pretending to believe in the possibility of a graceful departure. It’s also obscuring the true alternative to withdrawal: endless occupation. But what our ignominious exit really reflects is the failure of America’s foreign policy establishment at both prediction and policymaking in Afghanistan."
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
Apparently the US and friends have airlifted 104,000 individuals out through current time.
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cradleandshoot
- Posts: 15561
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Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
I guess I can be redundant here. When you to make a strategic withdrawal... Don't effing tell the enemy when your going to do it. Maybe some of you folks understand why that should be done.
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
Bob Ross:
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
After 20 years, draw down to a skeleton crew….throw the keys to Biden and say it’s all on you.tech37 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 3:24 pmFine, but let's be honest. If departure had been thought out and actually planned, our current "ignominious" situation would not be any where near as "ignominious" as it is. That is on Biden and his Build Back Better administration. Let's be careful not to "dodge" that reality.seacoaster wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:04 pm
Let’s Not Pretend That the Way We Withdrew From Afghanistan Was the Problem
"Focusing on the execution of the withdrawal is giving virtually everyone who insisted we could remake Afghanistan the opportunity to obscure their failures by pretending to believe in the possibility of a graceful departure. It’s also obscuring the true alternative to withdrawal: endless occupation. But what our ignominious exit really reflects is the failure of America’s foreign policy establishment at both prediction and policymaking in Afghanistan."
“I wish you would!”
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
How about when you sign a peace agreement with the Taliban, you negotiate a cease-fire so that it’s safer foe our team? More Art of The Deal…cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 3:29 pm I guess I can be redundant here. When you to make a strategic withdrawal... Don't effing tell the enemy when your going to do it. Maybe some of you folks understand why that should be done.
“I wish you would!”
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Typical Lax Dad
- Posts: 34251
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
That’s a whole lot better than what we saw on the first day.
“I wish you would!”
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cradleandshoot
- Posts: 15561
- Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:42 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
I guess I can be redundant here. When you to make a strategic withdrawal... Don't effing tell the enemy when your going to do it. Maybe some of you folks understand why that should be done.
We don't make mistakes, we have happy accidents.
Bob Ross:
Bob Ross:
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seacoaster
- Posts: 8866
- Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:36 pm
Re: Taliban reclaims Afghanistan
I agree with you to a point. But I am skeptical that keeping it a secret or not publishing the start date, or anticipated conclusion of any withdrawal would have made much difference. The Afghans on the ground would have smelt it almost immediately, and a secret involving the movement of tens of thousands of people and tons of materiale would have been -- can we be honest a little? -- impossible to keep.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 3:34 pm I guess I can be redundant here. When you to make a strategic withdrawal... Don't effing tell the enemy when your going to do it. Maybe some of you folks understand why that should be done.
I understand the interest in blaming Biden. But focusing on withdrawal and not the fatal decisions of the prior administrations (note: plural) is just stupid, and the stuff of the very "Media" elites you folks love to hate.