Trump's Russian Collusion

[youthathletics]

BTW, hot off the presses, Barr announced Mueller report coming as early as next week. Hope you have plenty of Xanax to calm you down when the report says the SC with hunt is over, big nothing burger between Trump and Russia.

You, and many others, interpret this news about a forthcoming Mueller report as a Trump victory and a conclusion to the "witch hunt". Why? Is there any actual logic or reasoning behind this interpretation?

An American victory Chips, we are already looking like idiots, we don't need it confirmed.

[tech37]

Just aksing....for a friend. Has tRump done ANYTHING good?

Of course! Started talks with Kim. Held most of the sanctions on Russia. Didn't invade new countries. That's a big deal for me. Announced we'd bail from Syria....that one was a big thumbs up from me. He just has to finish the drill there. Yes, these things take time a fan

Prison reform bill has a chance to do some serious good, although I don't understand it fully. Thumbs up there.

Wow!...not bad a fan "of course!". Be careful Mrs a fan doesn't read this post...you'll be back on the couch

[a fan]

Yes, these things take time a fan

Touche.

The only reason I added the "finish the drill" is that he was equivocating on that particular item.

There's a bunch of small things he's done----or his staff has done, just like all Presidents------ that I'm happy about.

I don't have TDS, just like I didn't have ODS.

I will accept guilt for coloring Bush with a broad brush because I was so livid over his Iraq invasion, though. That and the spend more/cut taxes crap.

[6ftstick]

You don't have to wait. HILLARY CLINTON paid for the dossier used to get FISA warrants

See, this is where your lowering of the bar wrecks your point.

We lowered the bar? Check your chronology. Hillary and Bill came way before Trump

That's not illegal, remember? YES IT IS. That's the bar you set.

Meanwhile, I get to criticize the use of foreign spies to get intel on an opponent. PROVE IT See how that works? I think both Hillary and Trump's toadies were wrong to do that.

You and the rest of the posters here who think that Hotel meeting was super-cool have no standing to go after Hillary for that.

See the problem now? Your morally equivalency FAILS every time

HILLARY CLINTON destroyed tens of thousands of documents under subpoena and then destroyed all the hard drives she and her staff used to create and circulate them.

100'000s of her correspondence as secretary of state where on a convicted felons lap top,

The director of the FBI told congress under oath that HILLARY CLINTON lied to them in congressional testimony REPEATEDLY.

Great. Put her on trial. I CAN"T the justice Department won't that's the problemYou're operating under the assumption that I'm not for doing that. YOU are the one making BS excuses for Felons, not me. WHAT FELONS Hillary's a corrupt crook. You'll get no argument from me.

But you and others here seem to think that Hillary's bad behavior means that Trump and his crew should get a pass. Nope. Sorry. Either both actions are wrong, or neither are. Take your pick.

Muellers investigation is nothing more than opposition research for the 20/20 campaign and a smoke screen to cover up all the above.

Right. So maybe next time, don't fire Comey, and all of it blows over in a matter of months.

Who fired Comey again?

Trump fired comey with Rosensteins recommendation endorsement and blessing.

If not liking Comey is grounds for this two year witch hunt we're all in trouble.

[dislaxxic]

Always interesting to hear from a Trump Base voter...

..

[a fan]

YES IT IS.

It's illegal to purchase opposition info. from a British citizen?

No. It isn't. I wish it were. Unethical? I think so.....but again, no one cares about ethics in this entire affair save me.

PROVE IT

That Trump's crew met with a Russian spy in a hotel, looking for dirt on Hillary? Uhhh. They admitted they did that. Nothing left to prove. The trouble is, that's not illegal, and guys like you don't care about that because Trump has a little R by his name.

Your morally equivalency FAILS every time

Says the guy who evaluates whether or not he likes a person or idea based on it's party affiliation. Democrat= bad. Republican= good. You have used the same math since the day you arrived at the Water Cooler.

This game of yours is why Trump and the R's made government bigger than ever, spending $2.7 Trillion more than Obama did....and you're still worried about Hillary. So you toss aside the one thing all conservatives agree on.....smaller government.... while FoxNation has you chasing after Hillary when she left the building years ago.

Just like the 1% wants. Partisans, left and right, fall for it every time. "Look, Democrats are bad! Pay no attention to what I'm doing over here".

WHAT FELONS

Flynn, Manafort, Cohen. With more to come. No big deal, right? They're Republicans, so that makes it ok with you, right? Only Dems are bad, remember?

Trump fired comey with Rosensteins recommendation endorsement and blessing.

So what? What in heaven's name does that have to do with anything?

You and I both know that you'd be screaming bloody murder if Obama had fired Comey when he was looking into Hillary.

If Trump had let Comey finish his job, this would have been over with months ago. He didn't. And we're all paying the price for this stupid boneheaded move.

[dislaxxic]

THE CONCLUSORY REPORT IS NOT COMING NEXT WEEK

"It’s possible Mueller is close to charging an overarching conspiracy indictment, laying out how Trump and his spawn entered into a quid quo pro with various representatives of the Russian government, getting dirt on Hillary and either a Trump Tower or maybe a bailout for the very same building in which Manafort met with Konstantin Kilimnik on August 2, 2016. In exchange for all that, Trump agreed to — and took steps to deliver on, with some success in the case of election plot participant Deripaska — reversing the sanctions that were such a headache to Russia’s oligarchs.

Such an indictment, if Mueller ever charges it, will look like what Trump opponents would like The Report to look like. In addition to naming Don Jr and Jared Kushner and Trump Organization and a bunch of other sleazeballs, it would also describe the actions of Individual-1 in adequate detail to launch an impeachment proceeding.

But that indictment, if Mueller ever charges it, won’t be coming on Friday or Monday, as Williams predicts, because it likely requires whatever it is Mueller is trying to parallel construct from that foreign-owned company. And even if SCOTUS denies its appeal today, it’s unlikely that evidence will be in hand in time for a Friday indictment."

..

[runrussellrun]

THE CONCLUSORY REPORT IS NOT COMING NEXT WEEK

"It’s possible Mueller is close to charging an overarching conspiracy indictment, laying out how Trump and his spawn entered into a quid quo pro with various representatives of the Russian government, getting dirt on Hillary and either a Trump Tower or maybe a bailout for the very same building in which Manafort met with Konstantin Kilimnik on August 2, 2016. In exchange for all that, Trump agreed to — and took steps to deliver on, with some success in the case of election plot participant Deripaska — reversing the sanctions that were such a headache to Russia’s oligarchs.

Such an indictment, if Mueller ever charges it, will look like what Trump opponents would like The Report to look like. In addition to naming Don Jr and Jared Kushner and Trump Organization and a bunch of other sleazeballs, it would also describe the actions of Individual-1 in adequate detail to launch an impeachment proceeding.

But that indictment, if Mueller ever charges it, won’t be coming on Friday or Monday, as Williams predicts, because it likely requires whatever it is Mueller is trying to parallel construct from that foreign-owned company. And even if SCOTUS denies its appeal today, it’s unlikely that evidence will be in hand in time for a Friday indictment."

..

So sick of waiting.

[tech37]

THE CONCLUSORY REPORT IS NOT COMING NEXT WEEK

"It’s possible Mueller is close to charging an overarching conspiracy indictment, laying out how Trump and his spawn entered into a quid quo pro with various representatives of the Russian government, getting dirt on Hillary and either a Trump Tower or maybe a bailout for the very same building in which Manafort met with Konstantin Kilimnik on August 2, 2016. In exchange for all that, Trump agreed to — and took steps to deliver on, with some success in the case of election plot participant Deripaska — reversing the sanctions that were such a headache to Russia’s oligarchs.

Such an indictment, if Mueller ever charges it, will look like what Trump opponents would like The Report to look like. In addition to naming Don Jr and Jared Kushner and Trump Organization and a bunch of other sleazeballs, it would also describe the actions of Individual-1 in adequate detail to launch an impeachment proceeding.

But that indictment, if Mueller ever charges it, won’t be coming on Friday or Monday, as Williams predicts, because it likely requires whatever it is Mueller is trying to parallel construct from that foreign-owned company. And even if SCOTUS denies its appeal today, it’s unlikely that evidence will be in hand in time for a Friday indictment."

..

What does Glenn have to say about this disss?

[Chips O'Toole]

BTW, hot off the presses, Barr announced Mueller report coming as early as next week. Hope you have plenty of Xanax to calm you down when the report says the SC with hunt is over, big nothing burger between Trump and Russia.

You, and many others, interpret this news about a forthcoming Mueller report as a Trump victory and a conclusion to the "witch hunt". Why? Is there any actual logic or reasoning behind this interpretation?

An American victory Chips, we are already looking like idiots, we don't need it confirmed.

Well, I have some bad news for you. Nothing about any of this is about to be over or resolved. The only thing we learned from CNN's reporting today (and NBC's previous reporting) about Mueller preparing a final report is that Barr will soon learn a lot more about what Mueller knows. That's all. We know nothing about what Barr will learn from Mueller, what he will do about it, how much we will learn about it, what investigations will be closed, continued or opened, what additional indictments may be recommended or issued, or how much longer all of this will go on. Nothing. Zero. Anyone reading something into this as positive or negative for anyone better explain why. His report could say the Trump campaign committed no crimes vis a vis Russia. It could recommend multiple felony prosecutions, including, when appropriate, of POTUS. It could recommend additional lines of investigation. We know nothing. And, most troubling, we may never know.

[old salt]

Benghazi ? How many Americans has Trump abandoned to die in s*hole countries he threw into chaos ?

How many died in Niger? I can link the video if you want.....

Those soldiers were not in Niger setting up an upcoming campaign event.

Stick with your passport paper conspiracy theories.

[6ftstick]

YES IT IS.

It's illegal to purchase opposition info. from a British citizen?

No. It isn't. I wish it were. Unethical? I think so.....but again, no one cares about ethics in this entire affair save me.

Its illegal to use an uncorroborated pack of lies paid for by the political opposition as the basis for a FISA warrant

PROVE IT

That Trump's crew met with a Russian spy in a hotel, looking for dirt on Hillary? Uhhh. They admitted they did that. Nothing left to prove. The trouble is, that's not illegal, and guys like you don't care about that because Trump has a little R by his name.

Your morally equivalency FAILS every time

Says the guy who evaluates whether or not he likes a person or idea based on it's party affiliation. Democrat= bad. Republican= good. You have used the same math since the day you arrived at the Water Cooler.

I've said since I came to the Water cooler that they're all Thieves and liars. FACT. And that the Leopold Bros make some good sh*t.

This game of yours is why Trump and the R's made government bigger than ever, spending $2.7 Trillion more than Obama did....and you're still worried about Hillary. So you toss aside the one thing all conservatives agree on.....smaller government.... while FoxNation has you chasing after Hillary when she left the building years ago.

Just like the 1% wants. Partisans, left and right, fall for it every time. "Look, Democrats are bad! Pay no attention to what I'm doing over here".

Blah blah blah blah blah. Kick the jukebox thats the same response you use no matter the topic. R's spend money too. Agreed already for chizzakes. But Barry Obama DOUBLED the deficit of all previous presidents combined plus had the fed add 4 trillion to their balance sheet as well

WHAT FELONS

Flynn, Manafort, Cohen. With more to come. No big deal, right? They're Republicans, so that makes it ok with you, right? Only Dems are bad, remember? PROCESS CRIMES

Trump fired comey with Rosensteins recommendation endorsement and blessing.

So what? What in heaven's name does that have to do with anything?

You and I both know that you'd be screaming bloody murder if Obama had fired Comey when he was looking into Hillary.

If Trump had let Comey finish his job, this would have been over with months ago. He didn't. And we're all paying the price for this stupid boneheaded move. Thats such over the top Bullsh*t its laughable

[old salt]

What has pushed you over the edge?

I've had the same views since day one. I've been over the edge this whole time.

1. I never thought Trump colluded with anyone, until shown otherwise. We still have zero evidence he did anything of the sort.
So why is it still dominating the news, hanging over everything the Trump Admin does & driving us deeper into an increasingly dangerous Cold War, ...as Putin publicizes his targeting list.

2. Trump has a whole mess of business conflicts that any rational person would like him to have taken care of before taking office. He didn't, and that has led to a whole mess of tinfoil hat stuff. Trump's fault, and he gets a pass.
It is what it is. No one's giving him a pass. He didn't expect to win. He was elected in spite of it. If he's so dirty, why did SDNY & FBI wait til he was the Pres to go after him ? Why did the FBI ignore Ukraine's cash ledger on Manafort until he hooked up with Trump ?
3.The hotel meeting. This USED to be a disqualifying event for a Presidential hopeful. I'm livid about this.
Bit it's ok to hire a Brit spy to troll the Kremlin with Rubels for unverifiable oppo dirt. Then foist it on the MSM & US govt via multiple vectors. You want a conspiracy to influence an election with Russian disinformation -- follow the HRC $$$ to Fusion GPS.
4. All the lies by Trump and his crew about Russian contacts. First of all, the lies aren't ok, and second of all, it's fanned the tin foil hat flames. You guys keep acting like people are nuts for wanting Mueller to look into this, and for the life of me, I don't get how you can be that far down the partisan rabbit hole to not say "yeah, we have no choice but to investigate this crap when everything these guys say about Russia turns out to be a lie".
You can watch liars Clapper, Brennan, Comey & now McCabe all over CNN & MSNBC.
5. Multiple felony indictments and convictions are treated like they're parking tickets.
Self generated by the investigation or nothing to do with Trump - Russia. I could care less how many bimbos Trump paid off. Had Slick Willie not been so cheap, we would not have been forced to see all of his dirty laundry.

There's more, but those are the highlights.

You and others either don't care about #2-#5, or do everything you can to diminish them, and it's clear it's partisanship at work. "That's not illegal" isn't a rational response by an adult American citizen. Why bother following what our leaders do if that's the only criteria for evaluation? Just read the police blotter, and ignore all else.
It's not illegal, so vote him out, like we keep sayin'.

It bothers me.

The McCabe thing annoys me because if he's telling the truth (can't imagine he'd lie about meeting 8 freaking Congressmen and briefing them), then there's no FBI Deep State. That makes no sense. Look at all the leaking, before & after. Daily NYT/WP competing "bombshells".They just did their jobs--told McConnell what they were doing---- and everyone hung them out to dry for doing what we pay them to do.Re-read the Strzok - Page texts.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Benghazi ? How many Americans has Trump abandoned to die in s*hole countries he threw into chaos ?

How many died in Niger? I can link the video if you want.....

Those soldiers were not in Niger setting up an upcoming campaign event.

Stick with your passport paper conspiracy theories.

I don’t have a theory. Facts have been released. Is Niger a “sh*’hole country? You asked the question. Not me.

[old salt]

BTW, hot off the presses, Barr announced Mueller report coming as early as next week. Hope you have plenty of Xanax to calm you down when the report says the SC with hunt is over, big nothing burger between Trump and Russia.

You, and many others, interpret this news about a forthcoming Mueller report as a Trump victory and a conclusion to the "witch hunt". Why? Is there any actual logic or reasoning behind this interpretation?

An American victory Chips, we are already looking like idiots, we don't need it confirmed.

Well, I have some bad news for you. Nothing about any of this is about to be over or resolved. The only thing we learned from CNN's reporting today (and NBC's previous reporting) about Mueller preparing a final report is that Barr will soon learn a lot more about what Mueller knows. That's all. We know nothing about what Barr will learn from Mueller, what he will do about it, how much we will learn about it, what investigations will be closed, continued or opened, what additional indictments may be recommended or issued, or how much longer all of this will go on. Nothing. Zero. Anyone reading something into this as positive or negative for anyone better explain why. His report could say the Trump campaign committed no crimes vis a vis Russia. It could recommend multiple felony prosecutions, including, when appropriate, of POTUS. It could recommend additional lines of investigation. We know nothing. And, most troubling, we may never know.

I'm still with Chips (& Trinity). We have no idea what Mueller's going to deliver. It could be anything from a nothingburger to a sweeping conspiracy indictment of the entire Trump klan with #1 as an unindicted co-conspirator. Nothing about Trump would surprise me.

I just hope it's a kill shot or a clean bill of health, so the country can move on.
...Putin's threats are making me nervous. A cornered Bear is dangerous.

[wahoomurf]

"IN MATTERS POLITICAL, NOTHING IS ILLEGAL ANY LONGER".(......................)

[tech37]

BTW, hot off the presses, Barr announced Mueller report coming as early as next week. Hope you have plenty of Xanax to calm you down when the report says the SC with hunt is over, big nothing burger between Trump and Russia.

You, and many others, interpret this news about a forthcoming Mueller report as a Trump victory and a conclusion to the "witch hunt". Why? Is there any actual logic or reasoning behind this interpretation?

An American victory Chips, we are already looking like idiots, we don't need it confirmed.

Well, I have some bad news for you. Nothing about any of this is about to be over or resolved. The only thing we learned from CNN's reporting today (and NBC's previous reporting) about Mueller preparing a final report is that Barr will soon learn a lot more about what Mueller knows. That's all. We know nothing about what Barr will learn from Mueller, what he will do about it, how much we will learn about it, what investigations will be closed, continued or opened, what additional indictments may be recommended or issued, or how much longer all of this will go on. Nothing. Zero. Anyone reading something into this as positive or negative for anyone better explain why. His report could say the Trump campaign committed no crimes vis a vis Russia. It could recommend multiple felony prosecutions, including, when appropriate, of POTUS. It could recommend additional lines of investigation. We know nothing. And, most troubling, we may never know.

I posted this on 2/13: "So, two years in and there's still no "direct" evidence of "collusion" (whatever that means). IMO, Mueller's report (whenever that materializes) or what the public is allowed to see of it, is sure to disappoint the "resistance" nation. I think C&S certainly has that right."

Well, "we may never know" the details. IMO, unless Mueller has more (old salt's "kill shot") than a circumstantial case, we wont hear more than a general summary of the report from DOJ. I know the faithful claim Mueller doesnt leak, but I believe something would have come out by now if a "kill shot" (re Russian "collusion" or obstruction) existed. My opinion may certainly be wrong and I'll be the first to admit it if that's the case.

A sealed indictment is a possibility, which would disappoint all who are hoping for some semblance of closure (including yours truly). At the same time, it will reenergize the "resistance" and kick impeachment proceedings into high gear, producing two more very ugly years... worse than the last two.

[Trinity]

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/21/politics ... index.html

Trump Tower Moscow is a long-held dream.

[dislaxxic]

More thoughts on the "end" of the Mueller probe, from Josh Marshall at TPM [Prime firewall]:

"We’re now getting a clearer picture of what appears to be the conclusion of the Mueller probe. The Post followed CNN’s initial report.

The initial CNN report was solid and now appears confirmed by other reports. But it was jagged, a few chunks of information that were hard to make sense of. The Post piece adds important context and fused the pieces together in a clearer way. At least implicit in the Post’s version of events is that this appears to coming from Mueller’s side. I mean that not just in the sense that it appears to be driven by Mueller rather than some outside force shutting down his operation. I mean it also in the sense it’s not clear to me that the people on the DOJ side, or at least the people talking to reporters, really know what Mueller has planned. There are obviously a range of potential scenarios.

Along that line I wanted to point you to a very helpful run-down by Garrett Graff. Graff is very sharp and has followed the investigation minutely. Equally important he wrote a biography of Mueller before Mueller became a household name. So he has real characterological insight into the man, which is helpful here.

One point which I saw from I think Marcy Wheeler is that there’s another, probably more accurate, way to look at the timing of all this: It likely wasn’t Barr coming in and doing something. It was much more likely Mueller waiting for Barr to be in place to act. That doesn’t mean he was ready six months ago and waited or really had six more months of work but cut it short. But Mueller likely had a real interest in not reporting or concluding during the Whitaker interregnum. Even setting aside the substantive concerns about Whitaker’s unfitness for the job, he was only there in an acting basis. There were also real questions about whether he was even legally Attorney General at all. Given an action of this consequence, with so much at stake about public confidence in what was happening and the legal durability of any result, that makes a lot of sense.

Barr is a former Attorney General who was duly confirmed in the role. Whatever the substantive questions about him, he’s a legitimate Attorney General. He also apparently has a personal relationship with Mueller – not surprising since they’ve both operated at the highest echelons of federal law enforcement. This timing also makes sense of Rod Rosenstein’s departure, though it’s pretty much a given that Barr would bring in his own person to be deputy. That’s entirely normal.

Fundamentally we simply don’t know what is going to happen next week or whenever this conclusion happens. Graff has a good explanation of the range of possibilities. More broadly, based on the subsequent reporting, I think it’s better to see this as ‘Mueller thinks he’s answered the big question, so he’s wrapping up’. As Graff notes, that could be a range of possibilities from just telling Barr that he’s done with a minimal discussion of why he didn’t charge others (and implicitly that he didn’t find collusion) to something far more dramatic.

One final point to note which to me tends to confirm the above points. There’s a passage in the Post article that seems quite significant to me.

According to people familiar with the special counsel’s work, Mueller has envisioned it as an investigative assignment, not necessarily a prosecutorial one, and for that reason does not plan to keep the office running to see to the end all of the indictments it has filed.

The takeaway from the Post is that this makes sense of Mueller’s apparent willingness to hand off the job while a number of the cases remain to be prosecuted. That makes sense. But if this characterization is accurate it suggests something else that is equally important. If it’s investigative assignment that tells me he saw it as core to his brief to determine whether collusion had happened. Or to put it more precisely, to determine whether there had been substantive contacts or coordination between members of the Trump campaign and Russia or a full blown conspiracy. As I’ve said for years now, an answer to that core question is much more important than whether this or that person spends whatever period of time in jail. If that is how he saw the assignment I suspect he is only finishing the probe because he thinks he’s answered the question. And he will at least be reporting back the answer to his superior at the DOJ, i.e., Bill Barr.

What the answer is or how much is revealed, basically what’s going to happen, we just don’t know. We just don’t know and I don’t think anyone really does."

Check out the "helpful rundown"...

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[dislaxxic]

Referenced (and linked) in my post above, this article deserves it's own post by way of highlighting the 7 SCENARIOS FOR HOW THE MUELLER PROBE MIGHT 'WRAP UP'

1. Mueller sends the attorney general a simple “declination letter"
2. Mueller compiles a detailed “roadmap"
3. Mueller authors a detailed novelistic narrative
4. He offers both a final round of “his” indictments as well as a detailed report like #2 or #3
5. He offers a report, but not the report
6. He closes up shop but refers numerous active cases to other prosecutors
7. Mueller unseals one or more long-standing sealed indictments

Read the thought provoking details in the piece...

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