MAC Freedom

[SouthernLaxGenius]

Stevens wins in OT against Widener.

Widener's 3 goal run with 4 minutes to go in the game pushed it to OT.

MAC Freedom and Commonwealth tourney's should be interesting (well maybe the Commonwealth a little bit more)

[DeepPocket]

Tonight Stevenson gets a scrappy Widener team tonight who took Stevens to OT. They play a physical game and I think they have the potential to not be such an easy out.

Also tonight York gets an Eastern team that took Stevenson to OT, proving they could play the spoiler.

If these two want their rematch Saturday, they better come to play on this soggy night.

[GrouchyOldLaxer]

So I just registered to post here because I felt the need to vent (as my username would indicate) after watching the live-stream of the Stevens - DeSales game last night.

Before I vent, it's clear that the Mac Freedom is Stevens and everybody else. Their last two games are Mac Commonwealth games so even if they lose to Eastern (possible) and/or Widener (possible but less likely) they are still at home for the Mac Freedom Tourney and will be playing teams they beat by 10-20 goals the first time around.

On to venting.......I come from a time (long ago) when most, if not all coaches would respect their opponents whether they were up or down in a game. Unwritten rules like clearing benches or at least telling starters to stop going to the goal were done in deference to the opponents. Last night Stevens entered the 4th quarter with a 17-1 lead and not only kept ALL the starters in (until there were about 4 minutes left in the game with the score 20-3). I can't imagine that their was fear of a comeback in the 4th, not too mention losing a starter to injury in a late game blowout would definitely raise lots of questions with tournaments just a week away.

If I am a DeSales player/coach I make a mental note of last night's game and use that for bulletin board fodder as they will likely meet again in a few weeks. I realize that it probably won't make that much of a difference this year, but karma is a b**ch when the tables are turned.

It is always a fine line but playing starters in the 4th quarter with that kind of a lead is not a good look. My son’s team often has a pretty significant halftime lead and the coach will start to empty the bench in the 3rd quarter. It is actually a positive for the development of first and second years and by my experience increases team cohesion. There is nothing a team loves more than a freshman scoring his first collegiate goal.
I don’t think a team should toy with the other team by deliberately trying not to score. Play straight up and maybe eat the ball the last couple of possessions in the game.

Well they did it again. Up 21-7 against DeSales with 6 minutes left and the starters NEVER came out. Must suck to be a backup for those coaches and payback’s a b*%$ch

[SouthernLaxGenius]

I understand the frustration, but is this just a Stevens thing or can we talk about when Bowen and Motto were playing late against Delaware Valley along with a couple of other starters when the game was well in hand?

Can York avenge their only loss this year and in the Commonwealth when they travel to Stevenson? Have to play all 4 quarters and make adjustments at halftime. If Stevenson loses, are they out of consideration for the tourney?

Does Misericordia have a shot to knock off Stevens in the Freedom? After a 8 goal loss earlier this year (despite 4 man-up goals) seems like little room for error especially in the clearing game and quality shots.

[GrouchyOldLaxer]

I understand the frustration, but is this just a Stevens thing or can we talk about when Bowen and Motto were playing late against Delaware Valley along with a couple of other starters when the game was well in hand?

Can York avenge their only loss this year and in the Commonwealth when they travel to Stevenson? Have to play all 4 quarters and make adjustments at halftime. If Stevenson loses, are they out of consideration for the tourney?

Does Misericordia have a shot to knock off Stevens in the Freedom? After a 8 goal loss earlier this year (despite 4 man-up goals) seems like little room for error especially in the clearing game and quality shots.

So this starter thing could be a DeSales thing? I think it’s crappy for whatever reason. Lots of backup players that deserve whatever time they can get for the effort in practice pay the price. If I’m a recruit I would take notice.

Regarding the game, Stevens played a rather sloppy game tonight and if they don’t tighten things up Mis could walk away as conference champs. Stevens hasn’t rectified their frequency of man down situations either. Without winning the conference I doubt Stevens gets an at large. They have yet to prove that they can beat a complete team.

[DeepPocket]

Can York avenge their only loss this year and in the Commonwealth when they travel to Stevenson? Have to play all 4 quarters and make adjustments at halftime. If Stevenson loses, are they out of consideration for the tourney?

I’m unapologetically biased, but I do believe the talent and coaching is there for York to avenge their loss.

At Stevenson, under the lights is a fantastic environment for a game. It will be an electric environment, and a fun game to watch.

[SouthernLaxGenius]

Can York avenge their only loss this year and in the Commonwealth when they travel to Stevenson? Have to play all 4 quarters and make adjustments at halftime. If Stevenson loses, are they out of consideration for the tourney?

I’m unapologetically biased, but I do believe the talent and coaching is there for York to avenge their loss.

At Stevenson, under the lights is a fantastic environment for a game. It will be an electric environment, and a fun game to watch.

I was unable to watch much of the Eastern game (only so many tabs can be open while working lol) so im looking for a little bit of analysis on York.

Are there any causes for concern headed into Stevenson as (per the box score) they struggled to pull away from a team they handled pretty well a couple months ago?

[DeepPocket]

Are there any causes for concern headed into Stevenson...

... they struggled to pull away from a team they handled pretty well a couple months ago?

The reality is this year, more than others for a variety of schedule related constraints, the typical “past results” and “common opponents” evaluations are just useless.

York “handled” Eastern pretty well a couple of months ago. That same Eastern team took Stevenson to OT some 2 weeks later. Then 2 weeks later Stevenson beats York. It’s across the board, look no further than the circular mess over in the ODAC.

This year seeing less opponents and seeing them more frequently has, in my opinion, heightened an already growing parity in the sport. Outside of the top 2 teams, there is more talent than ever across the board. And this year, coaches who might not be considered among the top in their field, have more looks, and more time to game plan for specific opponents.

So to answer the question of specific concerns, I don’t have any. They both needed to get to this point. Now York has the position to look at tape on the 2 quarters they went 4-1 with Stevenson, and then the 2 quarters where they went 4-10. They need to see the changes Stevenson made and recognize them on the field. If Stevenson goes double pole early and often again, somebody is open. Find him. Distribute the ball the moment that double is stepping up.

Stevenson is in the position to know what worked (2nd half) and what didn’t (1st half). And I’m sure they’ll have a few tricks up their sleeve to try and match anything Coach Childs throws at them.

I think York has a strong case for an at large bid, but this isn’t the year to leave it up to chance and that evaporates fast if there is an upset somewhere. I think Stevenson needs the AQ regardless.

[Nosey Ned]

[/quote]
I think York has a strong case for an at large bid, but this isn’t the year to leave it up to chance and that evaporates fast if there is an upset somewhere. I think Stevenson needs the AQ regardless.
[/quote]

Hey Deep .... curious how you make the strong case for an at large bid for York? If they lose to Stevenson again, where is York's quality win? Stevens- who also lost to Stevenson? I'm not picking a fight, I just don't know the teams they did play this year well enough to know.

And further more, if Stevenson doesn't get the AQ why is their body of work so obviously less impressive then York's that you think they have no shot at an at large bid? They will have a win over York AND a win over that same Stevens I'm assuming you are putting value on for York?

Again, just curious what I'm missing?

[DeepPocket]

I’m unapologetically biased....

So there’s that, but also,

I was basing my case off of the poll rankings throughout the year, but you’re absolutely right. I’m looking at it as it stands now record wise, and not what would cause said circumstances to occur. IF York wound up not getting the AQ, that means they lost to Stevenson twice, which would hurt them for an at large considerably (though many polls currently have Stevenson as at or near top ten and they would likely jump beating a better ranked team again).

Also record wise if Stevenson lost the AQ they would still have quality wins vs York and Stevens which would give them the better chance than York for an at large bid. So you are correct.

I know in the women’s bracket top ten AQ missing teams were left out. So anything could happen.

Make no mistake, I want York to win the AQ. But now you’ve convinced me it is probably necessary. (Though we could pick apart each and every team’s shot at the at large)

[Nosey Ned]

I’m unapologetically biased....

So there’s that, but also,

I was basing my case off of the poll rankings throughout the year, but you’re absolutely right. I’m looking at it as it stands now record wise, and not what would cause said circumstances to occur. IF York wound up not getting the AQ, that means they lost to Stevenson twice, which would hurt them for an at large considerably (though many polls currently have Stevenson as at or near top ten and they would likely jump beating a better ranked team again).

Also record wise if Stevenson lost the AQ they would still have quality wins vs York and Stevens which would give them the better chance than York for an at large bid. So you are correct.

I know in the women’s bracket top ten AQ missing teams were left out. So anything could happen.

Make no mistake, I want York to win the AQ. But now you’ve convinced me it is probably necessary. (Though we could pick apart each and every team’s shot at the at large)

Agreed... I think this year, even more so than usual, teams need to win the AQ - full stop! As we have already seen on the women's side, ranking doesn't seem to matter much this year. And to be honest, I'm kinda ok with that. I've been saying since the preseason polls, "this year more than most the rankings truly are a popularity contest/recent history exercise with so few quality OOCs played. And aside from the top 5 or so, the final rankings will be very different from the preseason ones - most especially the slots at 10-20."

Win and your in - that's the ONLY thing we can say with certainty this year.

[SouthernLaxGenius]

DeepPocket...

...Thank you for your un-biased and biased POV on York.

Looking forward to the game.

[GrouchyOldLaxer]

No offense but isn’t there a Mac commonwealth forum to talk about York and Stevenson? This is Mac Freedom here, the one and done side of the Mac!

[DeepPocket]

Haha. I hear ya. Next year I’ll just make a MAC 2022 thread. Maybe then we can get a few pages of chatter going bringing more into the fold.

It’d be nice if the Freedom got another top 20ish team in there. Is Stevens really beating up on teams as has been mentioned?

[SouthernLaxGenius]

It’d be nice if the Freedom got another top 20ish team in there.

That's going to take quite a bit of time.

Freedom hierarchy is lopsided, at best.

DeSales, Lycoming Misericordia, and Wilkes would probably be the 4 id pick (in no specific order) to challenge Stevens long term (well at least one of them)

[GrouchyOldLaxer]

Haha. I hear ya. Next year I’ll just make a MAC 2022 thread. Maybe then we can get a few pages of chatter going bringing more into the fold.

It’d be nice if the Freedom got another top 20ish team in there. Is Stevens really beating up on teams as has been mentioned?

I am just jealous because after the Freedom tournament nobody will care about the conference (Champ will get a low seed - likely going to play at a top 5 location for a rapid exit) while York and Stevenson focus on a quest for a potential final four finish.

Seems that Eastern left Freedom at the right time to grease the skids for Stevens. At least they would have given then some competition (outscoring them 12-6 in the second half their loss to Stevens a few weeks ago). Not for nothing, but there are several teams in the Mac Freedom with rosters the size of a high school club team (less than 25 players). Stevens is a decent but not great and arguably "borderline good" team. They can usually put together as good a quarter or a half as just about any team in the country (see the 5-1 first quarter when they played Stevenson) but then have moments (quarters/halves) where they look horrible.

The regular season matchup with Misericordia was close for the first half, but then Stevens ran away in the second. Having said that, I don't think Saturday is a gimme and Stevens needs to be wary of an "upset". Don't expect any Stevens backups in that game either!

[GrouchyOldLaxer]

I understand the frustration, but is this just a Stevens thing or can we talk about when Bowen and Motto were playing late against Delaware Valley along with a couple of other starters when the game was well in hand?

Can York avenge their only loss this year and in the Commonwealth when they travel to Stevenson? Have to play all 4 quarters and make adjustments at halftime. If Stevenson loses, are they out of consideration for the tourney?

Does Misericordia have a shot to knock off Stevens in the Freedom? After a 8 goal loss earlier this year (despite 4 man-up goals) seems like little room for error especially in the clearing game and quality shots.

So this starter thing could be a DeSales thing? I think it’s crappy for whatever reason. Lots of backup players that deserve whatever time they can get for the effort in practice pay the price. If I’m a recruit I would take notice.

Regarding the game, Stevens played a rather sloppy game tonight and if they don’t tighten things up Mis could walk away as conference champs. Stevens hasn’t rectified their frequency of man down situations either. Without winning the conference I doubt Stevens gets an at large. They have yet to prove that they can beat a complete team.

I see that Bowen and Motto were in late in the Delaware Valley game, but I will also say that 35 players on their roster go into that game. I don't believe a single bench player got on the field for Stevens last night, even with a 13 goal lead half way through the fourth quarter.

[SouthernLaxGenius]

Love the qualifiers out there and the "saltiness" and shade thrown towards a certain school in Hoboken.

With no bench guys, I guess Stevens only played 10 guys not 26 against Desales

Ive got the old and laxer part. I guess grouchy is right around the corner for me. As Bart Scott once said, CANT WAIT!

No more rhetoric from me on this matter

Stevens 19

Misericordia 9

[GrouchyOldLaxer]

Love the qualifiers out there and the "saltiness" and shade thrown towards a certain school in Hoboken.

With no bench guys, I guess Stevens only played 10 guys not 26 against Desales

Ive got the old and laxer part. I guess grouchy is right around the corner for me. As Bart Scott once said, CANT WAIT!

No more rhetoric from me on this matter

Stevens 19

Misericordia 9

I’ll look for you at our monthly meetings!

Regarding the 26, keep in mind Stevens mixes and matches 3 midfield lines, runs about 4-5 SSDMs, 2 FOGOs and 2 LSMs. There’s your 26. That leaves 25 on the bench.

I’d like to see Stevens win, but don’t want to jinks them with a prognostication. I still remember the last Empire 8 final when they got handled by St John Fisher after winning the regular season game……

[SouthernLaxGenius]

Also record wise if Stevenson lost the AQ they would still have quality wins vs York and Stevens which would give them the better chance than York for an at large bid. So you are correct.

Good thing the committee doesn't uphold (o take away) style points.

Stevenson still has a (pretty) good shot at a Pool C bid but I am utterly SHOCKED by them being shut out and shut down on offense

I don't think I have seen a quality team (shut out or) dominated like this ever, too this extent, this late in the season