Johns Hopkins 2021

[OCanada]

The shut off was used against Teat a couple of years ago. I might be wrong but it took two games for the Red to come up with an option while at the time it was popped on the QK was asking the right questions.

[Mr3Putt]

John Grant is installing behind the backs in the offense. I see a big turn around coming.

[51percentcorn]

The Teat shut-off was in 2018 - Hopkins played Duke in the other quarterfinal @ Navy that year. It appears that maybe Princeton was the first to try it in the Ivy last regular season game and they crushed a favored Cornell squad 14-8 - Teat had 0 pts and 1 shot. Brown obviously employed it in the Ivy semis and it became the thing to talk about but Cornell squeaked by 7-4. I think I watched the Ivy final on TV and Yale did NOT do it and Teat had a goal and 5 assists and the Big Red were Ivy champs. Teat had virtually no stats in the 10-9 Cornell win @ the Dome in the NCAA first round so I assume Syracuse tried it (he had a big imprint against Syracuse for 2 goals-4 assists in the regular season) and I watched Maryland do it when they manhandled Cornell in the 1/4s.

Again - what struck me about the whole thing is that there is an easy way to get a shut off player the ball - whistle one high - know its happening - back it up - give it to Teat. They never did it that I saw.

Another thing that strikes one is how good Teat is - virtually no stats for 4 games and he still finished with 99 points. Talent

[51percentcorn]

Last thoughts on Epstein:
While I guess you can use the word "benched" he was in the game at 1-0 or something like that and in crunch time he was back at his normal position - benching implies he didn't play - the correct phrase is "he didn't start at attack"

It was certainly very surprising to see Milliman's comments. He must have known he would get asked about it so he should have been better prepared with a statement that was way less inflammatory. I would have said the following - "No big deal - we thought Joey was pressing the last two games putting too much pressure on himself and we thought having him stand next to Junior for a bit and see the game from a different angle would be beneficial. He's our best player - he was in the game when we needed him the most and he made some excellent decisions in helping to lead the comeback"

[DMac]

The Teat shut-off was in 2018 - Hopkins played Duke in the other quarterfinal @ Navy that year. It appears that maybe Princeton was the first to try it in the Ivy last regular season game and they crushed a favored Cornell squad 14-8 - Teat had 0 pts and 1 shot. Brown obviously employed it in the Ivy semis and it became the thing to talk about but Cornell squeaked by 7-4. I think I watched the Ivy final on TV and Yale did NOT do it and Teat had a goal and 5 assists and the Big Red were Ivy champs. Teat had virtually no stats in the 10-9 Cornell win @ the Dome in the NCAA first round so I assume Syracuse tried it (he had a big imprint against Syracuse for 2 goals-4 assists in the regular season) and I watched Maryland do it when they manhandled Cornell in the 1/4s.

Again - what struck me about the whole thing is that there is an easy way to get a shut off player the ball - whistle one high - know its happening - back it up - give it to Teat. They never did it that I saw.

Another thing that strikes one is how good Teat is - virtually no stats for 4 games and he still finished with 99 points. Talent

This was a huge mistake in the Cuse game, didn't like it then, don't like it now. I thought Mellen could play him straight up and they did get the ball to #51 on backed up shots and whenever they could. Every time he did get the ball in his stick, Mellen owned him that day, either stripped him of the ball or kept him from doing anything at all with it. Meanwhile, your best D man is essentially taken out of the game and the field is more open for the rest of the O to operate in (Teat wasn't the only talented player on that team).

[HopFan16]

Shut offs are not always easy to counteract when they're done correctly. Look at Duke vs. UNC last weekend...Sowers hardly touched the ball and only had 1 point—arguably the worst game of his career. Macri was all over him denying him the ball. Dano didn't make much of an effort to adjust. Duke wound up winning but certainly not because of Sowers. They seemed perfectly happy to allow it to happen most of the game. The strategy by UNC definitely worked and nearly won them the game.

Anywho, if anything that was a tactical error from a young head coach back in 2018. This Epstein thing however is just common sense to me. I actually care less about the comments in the Sun—Epstein is a big boy, he can handle it—than I do the decision in the first place not to start him and play the whole mind games thing. I sincerely hope it pays dividends but I can't see how the benefits can outweigh the embarrassment of losing to Michigan.

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

[ohmilax34]

Shut offs are not always easy to counteract when they're done correctly. Look at Duke vs. UNC last weekend...Sowers hardly touched the ball and only had 1 point—arguably the worst game of his career. Macri was all over him denying him the ball. Dano didn't make much of an effort to adjust. Duke wound up winning but certainly not because of Sowers. They seemed perfectly happy to allow it to happen most of the game. The strategy by UNC definitely worked and nearly won them the game.

Anywho, if anything that was a tactical error from a young head coach back in 2018. This Epstein thing however is just common sense to me. I actually care less about the comments in the Sun—Epstein is a big boy, he can handle it—than I do the decision in the first place not to start him and play the whole mind games thing. I sincerely hope it pays dividends but I can't see how the benefits can outweigh the embarrassment of losing to Michigan.

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is it a mind game if Milliman has been open to Epstein the whole time about his expectations and his view on how Epstein is meeting or not meeting those expectations? Do we know whether he has been open with Epstein the whole time?

[jhu06]

the obvious question now is where they go from here these last 4 weeks now that the current lineup has shown with 2 months of practice in a new system it is not better than it was w/the previous regime. The first answer is seriously curtailing the playing time of veterans who've not been successful this year, won't be back next year and have younger players at their positions who could get long looks. It's hard to find an argument to continue to allow baskin, keough, shure, shilling to see the field extensively. Deso, Lyne, Williams, Kirson, Delaney have not been awful, but again they are guys who won't be here in 2023 or whenever we'll be competitive again and represent positions on the field where we need to see what we have on the current roster as far as long term answers.

[flalax22]

Shut offs are not always easy to counteract when they're done correctly. Look at Duke vs. UNC last weekend...Sowers hardly touched the ball and only had 1 point—arguably the worst game of his career. Macri was all over him denying him the ball. Dano didn't make much of an effort to adjust. Duke wound up winning but certainly not because of Sowers. They seemed perfectly happy to allow it to happen most of the game. The strategy by UNC definitely worked and nearly won them the game.

Anywho, if anything that was a tactical error from a young head coach back in 2018. This Epstein thing however is just common sense to me. I actually care less about the comments in the Sun—Epstein is a big boy, he can handle it—than I do the decision in the first place not to start him and play the whole mind games thing. I sincerely hope it pays dividends but I can't see how the benefits can outweigh the embarrassment of losing to Michigan.

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is it a mind game if Milliman has been open to Epstein the whole time about his expectations and his view on how Epstein is meeting or not meeting those expectations? Do we know whether he has been open with Epstein the whole time?

Very good questions

[tech37]

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is Terefenko back? Different team with him out there.

[AreaLax]

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is Terefenko back? Different team with him out there.

Yes. He had 4 gbs and 2 ct last weekend

[a fan]

Shut offs are not always easy to counteract when they're done correctly. Look at Duke vs. UNC last weekend...Sowers hardly touched the ball and only had 1 point—arguably the worst game of his career. Macri was all over him denying him the ball. Dano didn't make much of an effort to adjust. Duke wound up winning but certainly not because of Sowers. They seemed perfectly happy to allow it to happen most of the game. The strategy by UNC definitely worked and nearly won them the game.

Anywho, if anything that was a tactical error from a young head coach back in 2018. This Epstein thing however is just common sense to me. I actually care less about the comments in the Sun—Epstein is a big boy, he can handle it—than I do the decision in the first place not to start him and play the whole mind games thing. I sincerely hope it pays dividends but I can't see how the benefits can outweigh the embarrassment of losing to Michigan.

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is it a mind game if Milliman has been open to Epstein the whole time about his expectations and his view on how Epstein is meeting or not meeting those expectations? Do we know whether he has been open with Epstein the whole time?

Very good questions

It's why I asked another poster, who thinks Epstein is a top 10 player in D1....what makes him think that.

He's not even in the top 50 for scoring. If he's a top 10 player, he's not playing anywhere near his potential. We don't know what's happening behind the scenes, but we do know what's happening on the field.

Other posters were wise to bring up the injury, if you ask me. Epstein, like so many Hop players in the last few years with lowered point totals, may simply be gutting out an injury.

[ohmilax34]

Shut offs are not always easy to counteract when they're done correctly. Look at Duke vs. UNC last weekend...Sowers hardly touched the ball and only had 1 point—arguably the worst game of his career. Macri was all over him denying him the ball. Dano didn't make much of an effort to adjust. Duke wound up winning but certainly not because of Sowers. They seemed perfectly happy to allow it to happen most of the game. The strategy by UNC definitely worked and nearly won them the game.

Anywho, if anything that was a tactical error from a young head coach back in 2018. This Epstein thing however is just common sense to me. I actually care less about the comments in the Sun—Epstein is a big boy, he can handle it—than I do the decision in the first place not to start him and play the whole mind games thing. I sincerely hope it pays dividends but I can't see how the benefits can outweigh the embarrassment of losing to Michigan.

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is it a mind game if Milliman has been open to Epstein the whole time about his expectations and his view on how Epstein is meeting or not meeting those expectations? Do we know whether he has been open with Epstein the whole time?

Very good questions

It's why I asked another poster, who thinks Epstein is a top 10 player in D1....what makes him think that.

He's not even in the top 50 for scoring. If he's a top 10 player, he's not playing anywhere near his potential. We don't know what's happening behind the scenes, but we do know what's happening on the field.

Other posters were wise to bring up the injury, if you ask me. Epstein, like so many Hop players in the last few years with lowered point totals, may simply be gutting out an injury.

Good points. When he was playing last season, at what seemed to be about 30% of his normal capacity, I thought it was awful that the coaches allowed him to be out there. He's lucky to have gotten that year back.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Shut offs are not always easy to counteract when they're done correctly. Look at Duke vs. UNC last weekend...Sowers hardly touched the ball and only had 1 point—arguably the worst game of his career. Macri was all over him denying him the ball. Dano didn't make much of an effort to adjust. Duke wound up winning but certainly not because of Sowers. They seemed perfectly happy to allow it to happen most of the game. The strategy by UNC definitely worked and nearly won them the game.

Anywho, if anything that was a tactical error from a young head coach back in 2018. This Epstein thing however is just common sense to me. I actually care less about the comments in the Sun—Epstein is a big boy, he can handle it—than I do the decision in the first place not to start him and play the whole mind games thing. I sincerely hope it pays dividends but I can't see how the benefits can outweigh the embarrassment of losing to Michigan.

That being said, I'm with 51, that'll be my final two cents on the matter. Time to move on. If we beat Ohio State on Saturday we'd somehow still be in 3rd place in the conference at 3-5 with at least one win over all three teams below. If you're hoping for a miracle run in the B1G tourney it'd probably help a little bit to start as the 3 seed.

Is it a mind game if Milliman has been open to Epstein the whole time about his expectations and his view on how Epstein is meeting or not meeting those expectations? Do we know whether he has been open with Epstein the whole time?

Very good questions

It's why I asked another poster, who thinks Epstein is a top 10 player in D1....what makes him think that.

He's not even in the top 50 for scoring. If he's a top 10 player, he's not playing anywhere near his potential. We don't know what's happening behind the scenes, but we do know what's happening on the field.

Other posters were wise to bring up the injury, if you ask me. Epstein, like so many Hop players in the last few years with lowered point totals, may simply be gutting out an injury.

Good points. When he was playing last season, at what seemed to be about 30% of his normal capacity, I thought it was awful that the coaches allowed him to be out there. He's lucky to have gotten that year back.

You never know how a player will come back from an injury. Player can look perfectly fine but may never be the same. Happened to an old high school teammate. Was runner up in a Heisman trophy race as a junior. Broke his 5th metatarsal and played as a senior and was an All American and first round draft pick but he was never the same after his foot injury despite being fully recovered. A friend and I were talking about it just a couple of weeks ago. You never know. I believe Epstein will be fine. Just has to push through it.

[Wheels]

It's why I asked another poster, who thinks Epstein is a top 10 player in D1....what makes him think that.

He's not even in the top 50 for scoring. If he's a top 10 player, he's not playing anywhere near his potential. We don't know what's happening behind the scenes, but we do know what's happening on the field.

Other posters were wise to bring up the injury, if you ask me. Epstein, like so many Hop players in the last few years with lowered point totals, may simply be gutting out an injury.

Are you seriously asking why Joey isn't in the Top 50 in the country in scoring for a team that averages 10 goals per game? Or are you suggesting that if he is, as I think he is, a Top 10 player in the country why isn't he lifting Hopkins to more than 10 goals per game?

You could put Jared Bernhardt in that offense, and Jared wouldn't be in the Top 50 in scoring either.

I must have entered Bizarro Lacrosse World here as a Maryland fan defending a Hopkins player to Hopkins fans.

Petro certainly missed on some recruiting in early recruiting, but the current roster has more talent on it than its record shows. The talent might not fit together well and might be deployed in spots that don't make sense, but there are dozens of players on that team who would be welcomed on many Top 15 teams in the country right now.

[ohmilax34]

It's why I asked another poster, who thinks Epstein is a top 10 player in D1....what makes him think that.

He's not even in the top 50 for scoring. If he's a top 10 player, he's not playing anywhere near his potential. We don't know what's happening behind the scenes, but we do know what's happening on the field.

Other posters were wise to bring up the injury, if you ask me. Epstein, like so many Hop players in the last few years with lowered point totals, may simply be gutting out an injury.

Are you seriously asking why Joey isn't in the Top 50 in the country in scoring for a team that averages 10 goals per game? Or are you suggesting that if he is, as I think he is, a Top 10 player in the country why isn't he lifting Hopkins to more than 10 goals per game?

You could put Jared Bernhardt in that offense, and Jared wouldn't be in the Top 50 in scoring either.

I must have entered Bizarro Lacrosse World here as a Maryland fan defending a Hopkins player to Hopkins fans.

Petro certainly missed on some recruiting in early recruiting, but the current roster has more talent on it than its record shows. The talent might not fit together well and might be deployed in spots that don't make sense, but there are dozens of players on that team who would be welcomed on many Top 15 teams in the country right now.

I wouldn't call A Fan a Hopkins fan. Similarly, I am not a Hopkins fan. Right now, I think it's pretty hard to argue that Epstein is a top 10 player. If he gets back to his 2019 form, then I'd consider it.

Edit: It's hard to think of swapping Bernhardt for Epstein, because Bernhardt usually plays behind the goal and Epstein has been playing on the wing, so that rearranges the personnel. But, yeah, the JHU offense would be better with Bernhardt than Epstein right now.

[Brownlax]

Last thoughts on Epstein:
While I guess you can use the word "benched" he was in the game at 1-0 or something like that and in crunch time he was back at his normal position - benching implies he didn't play - the correct phrase is "he didn't start at attack"

It was certainly very surprising to see Milliman's comments. He must have known he would get asked about it so he should have been better prepared with a statement that was way less inflammatory. I would have said the following - "No big deal - we thought Joey was pressing the last two games putting too much pressure on himself and we thought having him stand next to Junior for a bit and see the game from a different angle would be beneficial. He's our best player - he was in the game when we needed him the most and he made some excellent decisions in helping to lead the comeback"

What did Milliman actually say? Do we have an exact quote?

[a fan]

Are you seriously asking why Joey isn't in the Top 50 in the country in scoring for a team that averages 10 goals per game? Or are you suggesting that if he is, as I think he is, a Top 10 player in the country why isn't he lifting Hopkins to more than 10 goals per game?

Yes to both. Elite attackmen score, and score a lot. It's not like we're discussing defensemen here.

You could put Jared Bernhardt in that offense, and Jared wouldn't be in the Top 50 in scoring either.

That would make sense, except you forgot that DeSimone is on that Top 50 list.

He's not scoring at an elite level. I don't think it's a criminal offense to point out the obvious. I'm not trying to demean him, or his team.

You've been around for a while....how many times have we found out that a kid having a year that disappoints fans....was simply struggling through injuries, and not complaining about it?

[wgdsr]

Are you seriously asking why Joey isn't in the Top 50 in the country in scoring for a team that averages 10 goals per game? Or are you suggesting that if he is, as I think he is, a Top 10 player in the country why isn't he lifting Hopkins to more than 10 goals per game?

Yes to both. Elite attackmen score, and score a lot. It's not like we're discussing defensemen here.

You could put Jared Bernhardt in that offense, and Jared wouldn't be in the Top 50 in scoring either.

That would make sense, except you forgot that DeSimone is on that Top 50 list.

He's not scoring at an elite level. I don't think it's a criminal offense to point out the obvious. I'm not trying to demean him, or his team.

You've been around for a while....how many times have we found out that a kid having a year that disappoints fans....was simply struggling through injuries, and not complaining about it?

seriously. bernhardt looks like superman out there at times. maybe he gets tripped up in a future game, but this is getting a little cray.
epstein, for a frosh in particular, produced. they needed him to, imo. and he delivered. what he becomes next, we'll see and his injury was unfortunate.
but now bernhardt present day comparisons are just silly.

[jrn19]

Are you seriously asking why Joey isn't in the Top 50 in the country in scoring for a team that averages 10 goals per game? Or are you suggesting that if he is, as I think he is, a Top 10 player in the country why isn't he lifting Hopkins to more than 10 goals per game?

Yes to both. Elite attackmen score, and score a lot. It's not like we're discussing defensemen here.

You could put Jared Bernhardt in that offense, and Jared wouldn't be in the Top 50 in scoring either.

That would make sense, except you forgot that DeSimone is on that Top 50 list.

He's not scoring at an elite level. I don't think it's a criminal offense to point out the obvious. I'm not trying to demean him, or his team.

You've been around for a while....how many times have we found out that a kid having a year that disappoints fans....was simply struggling through injuries, and not complaining about it?

seriously. bernhardt looks like superman out there at times. maybe he gets tripped up in a future game, but this is getting a little cray.
epstein, for a frosh in particular, produced. they needed him to, imo. and he delivered. what he becomes next, we'll see and his injury was unfortunate.
but now bernhardt present day comparisons are just silly.

Not to speak for Wheels, but he wasn't comparing Bernhardt to Epstein; he was saying that Bernhardt wouldn't be putting up #'s in Hopkins offense either. Bernhardt's clearly the better player right now but that doesn't mean he'd be up near the top in an offense that is definitely still trying to put pieces together and lacks consistent dodging threat, either.