Correct. But safe districts are not just about gerrymandering.
The underlying driver of safe districts is The Big Sort. Gerrymandering makes it worse, but the trend towards self-segregation is continuing. County lines are fixed and do not get redrawn every 10 years -- and here's the county data:
Biden carried 85 percent of counties with a Whole Foods Market and 32 percent of counties with a Cracker Barrel Old Country Store — a 53 point culture gap. This is larger than the 52 point gap between the same counties in 2016 (Trump carried 74 percent of Cracker Barrel counties and 22 percent of Whole Foods counties that year), the 43 point gap in 2008, the 31 point gap in 2000 and the 19 point gap in 1992.
Irregardless (as Sen. Hawley would say) of the cause, The Big Liars are responding to the incentives they face. If all their voters and their party are Big Lie believers/proponents, then they are massively incented to be Team Big Lie.
Last edited by ggait on Tue Jan 12, 2021 12:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Andersen wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:16 am
Can anyone send me clips of Republican leaders urging the terrorists to stand down and not mount another attack on our Capitol or Capitols around the country. Anyone? Hmmm...maybe they should do that before using the unity talking points. - Joe Lockhart
Correct. But safe districts are not just about gerrymandering.
The underlying driver of safe districts is The Big Sort. Gerrymandering makes it worse, but the trend towards self-segregation is continuing. County lines are fixed and do not get redrawn every 10 years -- and here's the county data:
Biden carried 85 percent of counties with a Whole Foods Market and 32 percent of counties with a Cracker Barrel Old Country Store — a 53 point culture gap. This is larger than the 52 point gap between the same counties in 2016 (Trump carried 74 percent of Cracker Barrel counties and 22 percent of Whole Foods counties that year), the 43 point gap in 2008, the 31 point gap in 2000 and the 19 point gap in 1992.
Irregardless (as Sen. Hawley would say) of the cause, The Big Liars are responding to the incentives they face. If all their voters and their party are Big Lie believers/proponents, then they are massively incented to be Team Big Lie.
All true, and well said.
But gerrymandering definitely exacerbates extremes.
It'll require more than addressing gerrymandering, but it's a significant piece of pro-democracy reform.
I'm actually more perplexed about how to deal with the news bubbles.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Love the fact that these morons who were so thrilled to have themselves on video or photographed while committing crimes are getting busted. Big Brother's watching? Have said for years Big Brother doesn't have to watch anything, most/too many are willing to put everything out there for them. Bet there are a whole bunch of people doing a lot of deleting on their phones, probably don't want anyone seeing them in their hero mode in the Capital Bldg. Phukin' idiots.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
How about we lighten on lying, please.
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
You can't help but laugh. The visual is pretty funny. But it is really sad, the mother's comments. This is the result of effective propaganda. These people who feel left behind, I am sorry to say, THEY HAVE HEADS FULL OF SHIRT. They are targeted by sophisticated individuals whose best interest is served by keeping them riled up (THAT WOULD BE YOU REPUBLICANS). "The liberals are out to get them." The liberals have their own lives and problems that concern them, they aren't giving these people a second thought. Or at least weren't. These people want to blame everyone but themselves for their problems. The REPUBLICANS trying to maintain minority control are just fine with this.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
How about we lighten on lying, please.
The following is quoted directly from you:
WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.
Has TLD misunderstood you? Different from lying, IF you meant something else...
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
How about we lighten on lying, please.
The following is quoted directly from you:
WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.
Has TLD misunderstood you? Different from lying, IF you meant something else...
Youthathletics wrote:
“WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.”
I am sorry if I misunderstood YA. I don’t lie and I don’t think much of liars. Like everyone, I make mistakes. I am not afraid to admit a mistake. Its sensible.
There must be something in the air today. I am sorry if I have hurt anyone’s feelings. For those that I now know are sensitive, I will give you a break going forward.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
How about we lighten on lying, please.
The following is quoted directly from you:
WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.
Has TLD misunderstood you? Different from lying, IF you meant something else...
Youthathletics wrote:
“WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.”
I am sorry if I misunderstood YA. I don’t lie and I don’t think much of liars. Like everyone, I make mistakes. I am not afraid to admit a mistake. Its sensible.
Sorry for the delay, was on a conference call...
That discussion was about voting in general, and the impacts of mailed ballots during cv-19...as noted first thing in the cited quote you pulled, but left off the first part. Where I prefaced...."CV-19 only complicated everything even more."
Further down in the conversation...
I passed over your direct question about VRA and explained my stance on cleaning all voting up (bold underline above). .
Misunderstanding?,.... definitely. I'll refrain from going there in the future.
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:11 pm
There must be something in the air today. I am sorry if I have hurt anyone’s feelings. For those that I now know are sensitive, I will give you a break going forward.
Hurt feelings, not hurt here.
I'd only ask and appreciate, that if you are going to talk about someone in this forum, you cite them by name, instead of talking about them behind their back, not cool. You never know, it could be a misunderstanding.
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
How about we lighten on lying, please.
The following is quoted directly from you:
WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.
Has TLD misunderstood you? Different from lying, IF you meant something else...
Youthathletics wrote:
“WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.”
I am sorry if I misunderstood YA. I don’t lie and I don’t think much of liars. Like everyone, I make mistakes. I am not afraid to admit a mistake. Its sensible.
Sorry for the delay, was on a conference call...
That discussion was about voting in general, and the impacts of mailed ballots during cv-19...as noted first thing in the cited quote you pulled, but left off the first part. Where I prefaced...."CV-19 only complicated everything even more."
Further down in the conversation...
I passed over your direct question about VRA and explained my stance on cleaning all voting up (bold underline above). .
Misunderstanding?,.... definitely. I'll refrain from going there in the future.
I'd also appreciate, if you are going to talk about someone in this forum, you cite them by name, instead of talking about them behind their back, not cool.
You started with: WITH REGARD TO VRA.....went on and on and then finished with “we’ve over complicated that matter”....
I thought you were talking about VRA....BTW, VRA has next to nothing to do with COVID-19 BTW.
Last edited by Typical Lax Dad on Tue Jan 12, 2021 2:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:11 pm
There must be something in the air today. I am sorry if I have hurt anyone’s feelings. For those that I now know are sensitive, I will give you a break going forward.
Hurt feelings, not hurt here.
I'd only ask and appreciate, that if you are going to talk about someone in this forum, you cite them by name, instead of talking about them behind their back, not cool. You never know, it could be a misunderstanding.
Just put it out there because my PM buddy sent me a note today.
Yup, voter suppression...this, too, is what Salty wants.
"voter irregularities" BS.
The Big Lie is not going to go away, even after 1/6. Crazy, but it is just too fundamental to the strategy and survival of the GOP.
Just listen to GOP election consigliere Ben Ginsburg:
"Proof of systemic voter fraud is the Loch Ness Monster of the Republican party. People have spent a lot of time looking for it, but it doesn’t exist."
“As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Republican party to this myth of voter fraud. Disenfranchising enough voters has become key to his re-election strategy."
“Trump has enlisted a compliant Republican party in this shameful effort. The Trump campaign and Republican entities engaged in more than 40 voting and ballot court cases around the country this year [before Election Day]. In exactly none – zero – are they trying to make it easier for citizens to vote. In many, they are seeking to erect barriers.”
So Big Lie Republicans, even after 1/6, keep blathering about how the nation is imperiled by...drop boxes.
Yep. Making it harder to vote....someone here said the VRA made it too complicated. It needed reform.
I did not say that.... you are a liar. And you never answered the question I asked about VRA, so typical, only here to throw shade.
whoa, how about we lighten up on that "liar" charge, please.
How about we lighten on lying, please.
The following is quoted directly from you:
WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.
Has TLD misunderstood you? Different from lying, IF you meant something else...
Youthathletics wrote:
“WRT to VRA - I am in favor of cleaning it all up, you have a valid ID, and meet the requirement to cast a vote, you get a single vote, simple as that. I say, scan your federal ID like a cop does or write it in on a requested absentee ballot, absentee ballots goes through an OCR machine and tabulates them. If there are duplicates while the machine is doing a checksum query (like a fingerprint scan), you can then sort through them accordingly.
We've grossly overcomplicated that matter.”
I am sorry if I misunderstood YA. I don’t lie and I don’t think much of liars. Like everyone, I make mistakes. I am not afraid to admit a mistake. Its sensible.
Sorry for the delay, was on a conference call...
That discussion was about voting in general, and the impacts of mailed ballots during cv-19...as noted first thing in the cited quote you pulled, but left off the first part. Where I prefaced...."CV-19 only complicated everything even more."
Further down in the conversation...
I passed over your direct question about VRA and explained my stance on cleaning all voting up (bold underline above). .
Misunderstanding?,.... definitely. I'll refrain from going there in the future.
I'd also appreciate, if you are going to talk about someone in this forum, you cite them by name, instead of talking about them behind their back, not cool.
You started with: WITH REGARD TO VRA.....went on and on and then finished with “we’ve over complicated that matter”....
I thought you were talking about VRA....BTW, VRA has next to nothing to do with COVID-19 BTW.
I agree, which is why staying on topic helps. I did not bring VRA in to the discussion, which is how I assume it all got misunderstood.
Moving on.
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
The liberals have their own lives and problems that concern them, they aren't giving these people a second thought. Or at least weren't. These people want to blame everyone but themselves for their problems. The REPUBLICANS trying to maintain minority control are just fine with this.