Unfit Joe Biden and Kamala Harris

[cradleandshoot]

AOC and progressives promise to push Joe to the Green New Deal:

https://nypost.com/2020/11/20/aoc-progr ... -new-deal/

If that means infrastructure...Let’s Go Git It!

I'm all for infrastructure spending. Do we need environmentally safe concrete to accomplish that?

[old salt]

Yeah. Trump had a real honeymoon transition.
The Crossfire gang & NYT/WP leakers were busy little beavers.
...while recount funding was donated to Jill Stein.

Trump deserved everything he got and more. He should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law so that - if for nothing else - he can't run in 2024 from behind bars. With luck that'll give the Tom Cotton's and Mike Pompeo's of the world some pause when they consider using Trump's crooked, corrupt playbook in the future.

It's time for Alternative Facts to end...

The ends justify the means, whatever it takes, so long as it's your candidate.

[wgdsr]

Of course it could be a pro Biden swing. Or a pro trump Swing. He had things going the right direction before the Rona hit.

All I read is it’s probably excitement about split gov and no likely major policy changes.

Aside from the stock market, which is not the economy, can you point to quantitative or measurable items that indicate the president had things going in the right direction economically? And I would point out that economists who lean both Ways have exposed massive flaws in the measurement of unemployment rate, they are all working towards a better measurement to eventually be adopted by the government which would apply underemployed, meaning people working but below the level they need to support themselves effectively. By this measurement we weren’t doing very good.

So not applying a flawed UE rate and understanding the stock market doesn’t mean anything, what did he have going well?

GDP growth?
Stability of the dollar?
Budget deficit?
Productivity?
Inflation? (Why did we have Powell lowering Fed Funds prior to Rona if inflation was stable at the long run benchmark? Deflation is 100x worse than inflation when it hits you surely know)
Other metrics?

wage growth was probably the best metric
https://www.epi.org/publication/swa-wages-2019/
a lot of numbers someone can not like in there (wage inequality, others), but as a result of the already tightening employment picture prior and since, wages had a lot of beneficiaries.

The underemployment metric would suggest it wasn’t nearly enough to declare success. I would also note it took a long time after the financial crisis for wage growth to make ground. Stabilization took 4-5yrs into 2013, then we had the “taper tantrum” that summer because, oh god the Fed is going to raise rates, then the biyach Fed backed off and let the market have their way. There was almost no way to see true wage growth until 2014 or 2015.

And while that’s a nice metric, it’s not enough to state the “economy was humming” under this soon to be prior admin. Fact is things were weakening in 2019 for sure.

https://www.bls.gov/opub/ted/2019/mobil ... r-2019.htm

total employment had been climbing.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/269 ... ed-states/
as had wages. started in 2014 for both in unison. i guess you can have any take you wish.

As can you. That one statistic in isolation without any discussion of distribution, inflation or population is hardly enough to hang ones hat on that the economy was humming or doing well, which is what was stated as fact, prior to Covid in spite of GDP, underemployment, affordability and about a hundred other metrics yet you throw it out there with no context as if to suggest it alone and with no context is sufficient evidence. So like you said you can have any take you wish.

the first link i gave you was in real terms (inflation), i also initially gave it with the caveat of wage growth inequality (your distribution?). you asked for us worker population for context vis a vis total employment/underemployment, which i gave you as flattened (and is cut off from this post as we've each had a reply since).
you asked what was going well. oh, well.

No I asked a person who stated that the economy was going well to point to something factual. You threw out one metric, sure I can agree that's a good thing and think I already acknowledged that, but it's also not nearly enough to say "the economy was going well". Your caveat isn't a minor thing either when discussing the economy as a whole don't you think. To me that negates the entire premise if it's skewed such to leave significant portion of the populace. It's as if you picked one sentence out of a conversation and threw one, flawed when including the "caveat", metric out and that's the entire counterpoint. Is that what your intention was with this? Did you read what I originally replied to at all? Or is the whole methodology to only play devils advocate to others and never take a position to stand behind?

ok. didn't catch you wanted a list. and i didn't say the caveat made it flawed, though some can argue that.
gdp growth was fine even if not late 90s.
unemployment was good to very good.
inflation, tough to judge a perfect metric but was not outside any kind of rangebound issue, so good also. ask powell why he did what he did.
non farm productivity good.
stability of the dollar historically better than average.
budget deficit horse out of the barn without a cowboy around.. so, not good.

let's hope we get on good footing when and if this is over.

Not a list, a cogent, quantitative based argument to support the statement made that “the economy was doing well before Covid). Those two sub 2% GDP prints and the Fed cutting Fed Funds alone are pretty hard to argue against.

But you also didn’t make the statement, so other than just playing devils advocate, would you state out of personal belief the economy was doing well before Covid? Basically 2nd half of 2019 maybe include Jan but not full Q1 of 2020? Or is this just a theoretical argument from you?

sub 2% prints for a quarter are pretty common. it's typically not a straight line, and if consistency by quarter matters, the prior three years were more consistent than most:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/188 ... in-the-us/
there's no question low rates and an accommodative federal government were part of what helped things along. i'm glad it got into people's pocketbooks, at the least.
can we envision an extended 3+% run on gdp with a lot of related wins on employment, wages, etc. at our size? not impossible, i guess. we haven't seen it in a long time, but sure. @ a relatively consistent 2.7 to 2.3% from 2017-2019, i'd take that if people's livelihoods are getting better.

[a fan]

Yeah. Trump had a real honeymoon transition.
The Crossfire gang & NYT/WP leakers were busy little beavers.
...while recount funding was donated to Jill Stein.

Trump deserved everything he got and more. He should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law so that - if for nothing else - he can't run in 2024 from behind bars. With luck that'll give the Tom Cotton's and Mike Pompeo's of the world some pause when they consider using Trump's crooked, corrupt playbook in the future.

It's time for Alternative Facts to end...

The ends justify the means, whatever it takes, so long as it's your candidate.

Pot. Meet Kettle. How are those unethical Giulani-led fake investigations into Hunter coming along for ya, OS?

Better hope Biden doesn't return fire. In fact, you're counting on that fact....

[old salt]

Yeah. Trump had a real honeymoon transition.
The Crossfire gang & NYT/WP leakers were busy little beavers.
...while recount funding was donated to Jill Stein.

Trump deserved everything he got and more. He should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law so that - if for nothing else - he can't run in 2024 from behind bars. With luck that'll give the Tom Cotton's and Mike Pompeo's of the world some pause when they consider using Trump's crooked, corrupt playbook in the future.

It's time for Alternative Facts to end...

The ends justify the means, whatever it takes, so long as it's your candidate.

Pot. Meet Kettle. How are those unethical Giulani-led fake investigations into Hunter coming along for ya, OS?

Better hope Biden doesn't return fire. In fact, you're counting on that fact....

I didn't like it in 2016. I don't like it in 2020.
The Bobolinski file emails were legit.
Rudy doesn't have the FBI & IC doing the work for him.

[njbill]

Even if the Bobo emails are legit, and I haven’t seen anything reliable to confirm that, they don’t implicate Joe in any wrongdoing. Joe was a private citizen at the time. He wasn’t part of the final deal. He didn’t get any money.

Bobo feels he was wronged by Hunter, which, I think, is driving his side of the narrative. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn’t. Sounds like this was simply a business deal that went bad. Bobo was expecting to make a lot of money. He didn’t. He’s unhappy.

Yes, I understand that for the next four years we will be seeing stories about Joe and Hunter, blah blah blah. Par for the course.

If anything improper is proved, then let the chips fall where they may. I’m sure Rudy and the Squid will be all over it.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Even if the Bobo emails are legit, and I haven’t seen anything reliable to confirm that, they don’t implicate Joe in any wrongdoing. Joe was a private citizen at the time. He wasn’t part of the final deal. He didn’t get any money.

Bobo feels he was wronged by Hunter, which, I think, is driving his side of the narrative. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn’t. Sounds like this was simply a business deal that went bad. Bobo was expecting to make a lot of money. He didn’t. He’s unhappy.

Yes, I understand that for the next four years we will be seeing stories about Joe and Hunter, blah blah blah. Par for the course.

If anything improper is proved, then let the chips fall where they may. I’m sure Rudy and the Squid will be all over it.

Rudy and Squid have realized that being on TV pays more than real legal work.

[old salt]

Even if the Bobo emails are legit, and I haven’t seen anything reliable to confirm that, they don’t implicate Joe in any wrongdoing. Joe was a private citizen at the time. He wasn’t part of the final deal. He didn’t get any money.

Bobo feels he was wronged by Hunter, which, I think, is driving his side of the narrative. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn’t. Sounds like this was simply a business deal that went bad. Bobo was expecting to make a lot of money. He didn’t. He’s unhappy.

Yes, I understand that for the next four years we will be seeing stories about Joe and Hunter, blah blah blah. Par for the course.

If anything improper is proved, then let the chips fall where they may. I’m sure Rudy and the Squid will be all over it.

I'm not sure we'll hear that much about it. The only ones who'd investigate is the Senate (if the R's hold it).
They'll then have to decide if it is in their interest re, holding the Senate in ' 22.
I don't think the (R)'s want to push Joe out of office. They don't want to give Harris a leg up in '24 & they probably see Joe as better to work with & to restrain the LW crazies. I think there really is a chance for Joe & Mitch to work together.

[njbill]

I think there really is a chance for Joe & Mitch to work together.

I hope you are right. I haven’t seen anything that discusses their personal relationship. I would be pretty sure, though, that Mitch doesn’t have the antipathy for Joe that he had for Obama.

But Mitch is a cold-blooded assassin. He will only work with Joe if he thinks that is in his, and the Republicans’, interest.

[PizzaSnake]

AOC and progressives promise to push Joe to the Green New Deal:

https://nypost.com/2020/11/20/aoc-progr ... -new-deal/

If that means infrastructure...Let’s Go Git It!

I'm all for infrastructure spending. Do we need environmentally safe concrete to accomplish that?

It’s already available.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... /?amp=true

[old salt]

I think there really is a chance for Joe & Mitch to work together.

I hope you are right. I haven’t seen anything that discusses their personal relationship. I would be pretty sure, though, that Mitch doesn’t have the antipathy for Joe that he had for Obama.

But Mitch is a cold-blooded assassin. He will only work with Joe if he thinks that is in his, and the Republicans’, interest.

[kramerica.inc]

There are a few clips out there of Mitch getting all schmoopie about Joe. Gonna be a good ride for Joe with all the positive juju.

MA Governor Deval Patrick a contender for AG:

https://news.yahoo.com/deval-patrick-sa ... 00346.html

[kramerica.inc]

Antony Blinken chosen as Sec of State.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washin ... utType=amp

[kramerica.inc]

Jake Sullivan chosen as National Security Advisor:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnew ... cna1248596

[CU88]

If Republican Senators still think it's too risky to acknowledge that Joe Biden will be the next President of the United States, how can we assume they'd ever have the courage to protect us against enemies, foreign or domestic?

[cradleandshoot]

Antony Blinken chosen as Sec of State.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washin ... utType=amp

All I can think about are all of the Wynken, Blynken and Nod jokes there are out there to be made in the future.

[cradleandshoot]

If Republican Senators still think it's too risky to acknowledge that Joe Biden will be the next President of the United States, how can we assume they'd ever have the courage to protect us against enemies, foreign or domestic?

Silly guy, because there is money to be made waving the flag of freedom and defending the good ole US of A. By the way do not discount trump doing something to tick of the Iranians. That will sort of be his present to Joe Biden... fix this now if you can.

[cradleandshoot]

If Republican Senators still think it's too risky to acknowledge that Joe Biden will be the next President of the United States, how can we assume they'd ever have the courage to protect us against enemies, foreign or domestic?

I think most republican senators will never admit it... but they know Biden is a guy that speaks their language. You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours. That is like back to the good ole days of wheeling and dealing in DC.

[kramerica.inc]

If Republican Senators still think it's too risky to acknowledge that Joe Biden will be the next President of the United States, how can we assume they'd ever have the courage to protect us against enemies, foreign or domestic?

I think most republican senators will never admit it... but they know Biden is a guy that speaks their language. You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours. That is like back to the good ole days of wheeling and dealing in DC.

+1

Let the good times roll. Mitch, Pelosi and Co. love Biden. Another Lifer back in office. Back to "business" as usual.

[cradleandshoot]

If Republican Senators still think it's too risky to acknowledge that Joe Biden will be the next President of the United States, how can we assume they'd ever have the courage to protect us against enemies, foreign or domestic?

I think most republican senators will never admit it... but they know Biden is a guy that speaks their language. You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours. That is like back to the good ole days of wheeling and dealing in DC.

+1

Let the good times roll. Mitch, Pelosi and Co. love Biden. Another Lifer back in office. Back to "business" as usual.

You got it, whatever BS posture most of these Republicans have at present they can't wait for Biden to take office. These are establishment republicans who secretly have despised trump from day one. trump was always an interloper in the inner sanctum of Washington DC. He never belonged there in the first place. I betcha it takes the senate all of 15 minutes to approve every singe person Biden appoints to his administration. It will be a newly constructed express lane...