Riveting discussion.
The ol' lax forum sure aint what she used to be.
Orange Duce
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Re: Orange Duce
DocBarrister wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:17 amShould a segregationist really be lecturing anyone on racism?Peter Brown wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 8:31 amDocBarrister wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:30 amIf that’s your perspective on the Civil War and slavery, then you are clearly a racist.old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 12:47 amold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 12:26 amObama didn't end the war in Iraq. He revived & extended it. The war was won by 2010. All that was needed was a small residual force to prop up the ISF. Obama bailed. ISIS arose. Obama dithered. We had to go back & are still there (without a SOFA) with the small residual force Obama needed to leave a decade ago. Obama owns ISIS & all the death & destruction they wrought in Iraq & Syria,
I agree with Gen Kelly. Our civil war was due to an inability to compromise on a way to end slavery without resorting to war.
Europe & the rest of our hemisphere ended slavery without resorting to civil war.
Based on the way our nation was born, the Confederate states were within their rights to secede, just as the original states had rebelled.
How's that CA secession movement that you were touting coming ?
The South should have ended slavery ... period. Anything short of that was a crime against humanity.
The abolitionists in the North had compromised on slavery since the dawn of the nation. By 1860, it was long past time to end an evil institution that should have never existed in the first place.
The Civil War, from a moral perspective, was entirely the fault of the Confederacy.
DocBarrister
The guy who refuses to allow black kids and parents to choose schools of their choice (because white teacher's unions and their exorbitantly-paid administrators need coin to buy Vegas hookers, and so scratch the DNC's back to keep black kids from excelling) claims someone else is a racist.
DocBarrister
Racists say what?
WHEN DEMOCRATIC presidential candidate Elizabeth Warren rolled out her plan for K-12 education, the proposal to eliminate federal funding for charter schools drew gasps from school choice supporters, including Democrats who've backed the education reform movement of the last decade, and cheers from teachers unions.
https://www.usnews.com/news/elections/a ... er-schools
Meanwhile African immigrants keep coming. They must not know what you obviously know!
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2 ... n-the-u-s/
Re: Orange Duce
More confirms from NYT and Wapo.ggait wrote: ↑Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:54 pmAlso confirmed by CNN:ggait wrote: ↑Sun Sep 06, 2020 3:47 pmConfirmed by Atlantic, AP and Fox News. Each of which had multiple sources.You're a fool if you swallow this un-sourced political disinformation.
But you're right. We never should believe any anonymous source.
I mean look at what Deep Throat served up on Nixon. Complete BS. Total fiction.
P.S. The Atlantic's Goldberg was on the Sunday shows today saying there's more coming on this story from him and other news organizations.
President Donald Trump referred to fallen US service members at the Aisne-Marne cemetery in crude and derogatory terms during a November 2018 trip to France to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the end of World War I, a former senior administration official confirmed to CNN.
And Kelly still quiet. Not denying. So pretty much confirming.
Boycott stupid. If you ignore the gator troll, eventually he'll just go back under his bridge.
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Re: Orange Duce
ggait wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:46 amMore confirms from NYT and Wapo.ggait wrote: ↑Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:54 pmAlso confirmed by CNN:ggait wrote: ↑Sun Sep 06, 2020 3:47 pmConfirmed by Atlantic, AP and Fox News. Each of which had multiple sources.You're a fool if you swallow this un-sourced political disinformation.
But you're right. We never should believe any anonymous source.
I mean look at what Deep Throat served up on Nixon. Complete BS. Total fiction.
P.S. The Atlantic's Goldberg was on the Sunday shows today saying there's more coming on this story from him and other news organizations.
President Donald Trump referred to fallen US service members at the Aisne-Marne cemetery in crude and derogatory terms during a November 2018 trip to France to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the end of World War I, a former senior administration official confirmed to CNN.
And Kelly still quiet. Not denying. So pretty much confirming.
John Kelly's COS says he didn't say it:
https://www.newsweek.com/former-white-h ... ns-1530159
Bolton says he didn't hear it.
https://thehill.com/homenews/administra ... -in-france
Ambassador to France says the story is a sham:
https://twitter.com/ChuckCallesto/statu ... 95652?s=20
Ggait has a better handle on it than these folks.
- MDlaxfan76
- Posts: 27115
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm
Re: Orange Duce
Interesting caveat...as long as we're a NATO memberold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 12:42 amSo long as there's a NATO, & we're a member, Russia must be contained. It's a lot easier now than it was during the Cold War. As our EUro allies have concluded, as they allow their military forces to atrophy, offer to hold our coat & keep Russia solvent. Trump's doing more to contain & counter Russia, with deployed combat forces, than Obama did with his rhetorical lightning bolts, ineffective sanctions & expulsion of diplomats.
Except that it's being reported (again) that Trump wanted out of NATO altogether. And who stopped him...yup those generals he just ripped yesterday.
But hey, it's "a lot easier" to contain Russian than in the old days...all you gotta do is invite them into the Middle East and they're "contained"...
The hypocrisy and double speak is so off the charts it's mind boggling...Trump crows about how much he's increased military spending, then says the generals are in the pockets of industry, want to have wars just want to make money...
and Salty supports it all...must have a bunch of military industry stocks in his retirement portfolio, I guess.
Re: Orange Duce
.. You took the bait (no surprise). If that's your interpretation of my post, it confirms you are the racist.DocBarrister wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:30 amIf that’s your perspective on the Civil War and slavery, then you are clearly a racist.old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 12:47 amold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 12:26 amObama didn't end the war in Iraq. He revived & extended it. The war was won by 2010. All that was needed was a small residual force to prop up the ISF. Obama bailed. ISIS arose. Obama dithered. We had to go back & are still there (without a SOFA) with the small residual force Obama needed to leave a decade ago. Obama owns ISIS & all the death & destruction they wrought in Iraq & Syria,
I agree with Gen Kelly. Our civil war was due to an inability to compromise on a way to end slavery without resorting to war.
Europe & the rest of our hemisphere ended slavery without resorting to civil war.
Based on the way our nation was born, the Confederate states were within their rights to secede, just as the original states had rebelled.
How's that CA secession movement that you were touting coming ?
The South should have ended slavery ... period. Anything short of that was a crime against humanity.
The abolitionists in the North had compromised on slavery since the dawn of the nation. By 1860, it was long past time to end an evil institution that should have never existed in the first place.
The Civil War, from a moral perspective, was entirely the fault of the Confederacy.
DocBarrister
Europe & every other nation in our hemisphere abolished slavery without a massive bloodletting that was our Civil War.
It was a tragic failure by our govt leaders, extending back to the founders & before.
Don't you subscribe to 1619 & the original sin of our European forefathers ?
Re: Orange Duce
I certainly have a better handle than a lying gator troll boy does!Ggait has a better handle on it than these folks.
Wrong. Fuentes statement was that he did not hear it personally. Which makes sense because his primary statement was that he was not the source for the Atlantic story:John Kelly's COS says he didn't say it.
"You can put me on the record denying that I spoke to the Atlantic!"
Which is what Bolton also says:
"I didn't hear that," Bolton told The New York Times. "I'm not saying he didn't say them later in the day or another time, but I was there for that discussion."
FYI, NY Times is reporting Bolton's statement while also continuing to confirm Trump's dis of the troops.
And Goldberg's story indicates that Gen. Kelly is not the source. So Kelly's continued silence (in contrast to Fuentes' source denial) means only one thing.
Of course Trump said it. And Kelly and others heard it.
Boycott stupid. If you ignore the gator troll, eventually he'll just go back under his bridge.
Re: Orange Duce
Reported by who ? The same unnamed sources ? Trump didn't have to approve all the NATO exercises & increased deployments of US forces.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 11:51 am
Interesting caveat...as long as we're a NATO member
Except that it's being reported (again) that Trump wanted out of NATO altogether. And who stopped him...yup those generals he just ripped yesterday.
But hey, it's "a lot easier" to contain Russian than in the old days...all you gotta do is invite them into the Middle East and they're "contained"...
The hypocrisy and double speak is so off the charts it's mind boggling...Trump crows about how much he's increased military spending, then says the generals are in the pockets of industry, want to have wars just want to make money...
and Salty supports it all...must have a bunch of military industry stocks in his retirement portfolio, I guess.
The NATO Sec Gen credits his hectoring for other NATO members increasing their defense spending.
V Corps re-established, HQ CP heading to Fort Trump in Poland.
More capable missile defense USN destroyers headed to homeport in Spain.
B-52 bombing runs on Kalingrad & Crimea.
Javelins & warships to Ukraine.
Russia was in the middle east before Trump took office. Obama invited them in to save face after backing down over Assad's CW.
They're still contained in their Syrian quagmire, banging fenders with our troops who are safeguarding our Kurdish allies & their oil, which ensures their autonomy.
Only Boeing, purchased on the dip, for long term, following the Max grounding, based mainly on future airliner fleet modernization.
Re: Orange Duce
It means that Kelly, like Mattis, refuses to comment on his conversations with a still serving CinC,
even one who fired him & publicly criticizes him.
- MDlaxfan76
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Re: Orange Duce
yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
Re: Orange Duce
Knowing Trump and his documented history, there is absolutely NO DOUBT that he said it and believes what he said.
Trump supporters, especially those with military backgrounds in our midst, remain silent about the "bone spurs" truth...remaining unconscionably silent and complicit in this moron CinC's behaviours.
..
Trump supporters, especially those with military backgrounds in our midst, remain silent about the "bone spurs" truth...remaining unconscionably silent and complicit in this moron CinC's behaviours.
..
"The purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure poor reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog." - Calvin, to Hobbes
Re: Orange Duce
Fuentes says he didn't hear it. Bolton says he didn't hear it.
I'm sure Trump would be ecstatic if Kelly would also say he didn't hear it. But Kelly hasn't done that. Although previously Kelly has talked about how Trump's character as a leader is sorely lacking:
“I think we need to look harder at who we elect,” Kelly told Anthony Scaramucci, a former White House communications director who has also turned against Trump, in a live-streamed interview on Friday. “I think we should look at people that are running for office and put them through the filter. What is their character like? What are their ethics?
And instead, Trump's VERY telling initial response:
1. Kelly is probably the source.
2. Kelly had no temperament, petered out, couldn't handle the pressure of his job. Did a bad job and I fired him.
So basically trying to discredit Kelly's credibility (as with almost all departed Trump staffers) as a disgruntled fired ex-employee with an axe to grind. Or, in other words, a..."loser."
Trump's behavior is extremely corroborative. He said it and Kelly heard it. So obvious.
Last edited by ggait on Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Boycott stupid. If you ignore the gator troll, eventually he'll just go back under his bridge.
Re: Orange Duce
Once you open that door, you can't close it.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:12 pm yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
No comment -- I will neither confirm or deny.
Mattis has refused to comment on Trump.
- MDlaxfan76
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Re: Orange Duce
old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:59 pmOnce you open that door, you can't close it.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:12 pm yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
No comment -- I will neither confirm or deny.
Mattis has refused to comment on Trump.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... on/612640/
Re: Orange Duce
As Goldberg points out, Mattis refused until the WH siege, refusing during his lengthy book tour.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:04 pmold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:59 pmOnce you open that door, you can't close it.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:12 pm yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
No comment -- I will neither confirm or deny.
Mattis has refused to comment on Trump.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... on/612640/
So why has his good friend Kelly not followed suit ?
As you say -- if Trump said it, it would be easy to confirm it.
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Re: Orange Duce
Doesn't it stand to reason that General Kelly understands that many, perhaps most, people may interpret his silence as confirmation of the Trump statements rather than anything else? "I never heard the President say what is being attributed to him in that article." Do you not see that the absence of that easy statement, through a spokesperson or a media drop, seems confirmatory?old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:08 pmSo why has his good friend Kelly not followed suit ?MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:04 pmold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:59 pmOnce you open that door, you can't close it.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:12 pm yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
No comment -- I will neither confirm or deny.
Mattis has refused to comment on Trump.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... on/612640/
As you say -- if Trump said it, it would be easy to confirm it.
Re: Orange Duce
It's not that simple. There were several things alleged in that article on different occasions. You comment on one, your silence on the others is misconstrued.seacoaster wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:12 pmDoesn't it stand to reason that General Kelly understands that many, perhaps most, people may interpret his silence as confirmation of the Trump statements rather than anything else? "I never heard the President say what is being attributed to him in that article." Do you not see that the absence of that easy statement, through a spokesperson or a media drop, seems confirmatory?old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:08 pmAs Goldberg points out, Mattis refused until the WH siege, refusing during his lengthy book tour.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:04 pmold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:59 pmOnce you open that door, you can't close it.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:12 pm yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
No comment -- I will neither confirm or deny.
Mattis has refused to comment on Trump.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... on/612640/
So why has his good friend Kelly not followed suit ?
As you say -- if Trump said it, it would be easy to confirm it.
Kelly made it clear that he did not volunteer to return to govt service. He was asked to by his good friends Mattis & Dunford.
Based on the way he was treated by the media, & then by Trump, it is not surprising that he just wants to be left alone.
He never wanted to play these political/media gotcha games.
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Re: Orange Duce
Certain LP moderators who shall not be named prohibited any discussion of Trump’s racism, purportedly to avoid upsetting certain members of the LP readership (presumably, the racists).
Is it even possible to discuss Trump without discussing his racism?
I appreciated all the work the LP folks put into what was once the leading discussion forum for college lacrosse. Having said that, their indulgence of the racists in the lacrosse community was simply disgraceful.
DocBarrister
@DocBarrister
Re: Orange Duce
You're right Doc, they cut you a lot of slack.DocBarrister wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:24 pmCertain LP moderators who shall not be named prohibited any discussion of Trump’s racism, purportedly to avoid upsetting certain members of the LP readership (presumably, the racists).
Is it even possible to discuss Trump without discussing his racism?
I appreciated all the work the LP folks put into what was once the leading discussion forum for college lacrosse. Having said that, their indulgence of the racists in the lacrosse community was simply disgraceful.
DocBarrister
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Re: Orange Duce
Totally get that, and I don't blame General Keely one bit for eschewing the media circus. By you understand what I am saying: his silence in the face of these astonishing comments attributed to the President are, I think, increasingly understood as confirmation. General Kelly doesn't need to play; he needs only to issue a statement consisting of the sentence I typed above. He could add: "I will have no further comment on this or my time as WH COS or as Secretary of the DHS."old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:20 pmIt's not that simple. There were several things alleged in that article on different occasions. You comment on one, your silence on the others is misconstrued.seacoaster wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:12 pmDoesn't it stand to reason that General Kelly understands that many, perhaps most, people may interpret his silence as confirmation of the Trump statements rather than anything else? "I never heard the President say what is being attributed to him in that article." Do you not see that the absence of that easy statement, through a spokesperson or a media drop, seems confirmatory?old salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:08 pmAs Goldberg points out, Mattis refused until the WH siege, refusing during his lengthy book tour.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:04 pmold salt wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:59 pmOnce you open that door, you can't close it.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:12 pm yet so easy to say it didn't happen...Kelly doesn't need to comment whether he thinks Trump is a POS or not. Just say, 'The President didn't say that or anything like that to me".
And no, Mattis has not actually been entirely silent on other matters. He's "commented".
No comment -- I will neither confirm or deny.
Mattis has refused to comment on Trump.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... on/612640/
So why has his good friend Kelly not followed suit ?
As you say -- if Trump said it, it would be easy to confirm it.
Kelly made it clear that he did not volunteer to return to govt service. He was asked to by his good friends Mattis & Dunford.
Based on the way he was treated by the media, & then by Trump, it is not surprising that he just wants to be left alone.
He never wanted to play these political/media gotcha games.