Race in America - Riots Explode in Chicago

[youthathletics]

I can see the main stream news report now: White officers chase black man on bicycle and jump him: https://www.reddit.com/r/JusticeServed/ ... t_of_fdny/

Apparently those were firefighters who chased the snatch and grab thief down. Good job fellas.

Let me ask the question that's been bothering me about some of the posts that Trump supporters have been posting.

Is it the logic of these various posts that because there's crime in America, that justifies police abuse?

That certainly appears to this reader to be the logic. Serious question.

Serious answer....No, its that there are bad people... people struggling with issues we often know nothing about, in this world, that cause irrational behavior at times...full stop. My point in posting the above, this is during the BLM movement, in front of a fire department, and still the brazen idiocy of an enraged criminal. Do you think reparations or a defunded police force would have made him not do this? All this protesting is not going to solve dump...there are idiots out there, of all walks of life.

Shittin' on the police is a poor excuse and low hanging fruit. The irrational, believe police can not make mistakes, and yet, will shitz on them for lack of training, and a union that looks the other way in the rare instances they make a mistake. Maybe we should defund criminals and their families.... take more taxes from them, do not provide as much SNAP money to them...sound fair, no?

hmmm, let's see, you're saying that criminals are "irrational" and police are too? at times?

First of all, a snatch and grab thief isn't thinking about BLM when he attempts his crime. He's a thief, not a protestor. It confounds me why anyone would mix the two matters, except in some sort of convoluted way as to say bad people exist, therefore bad people should be expected to exist in police departments, and...here's the real rub...we shouldn't make a big deal about the latter.

Of course police will make mistakes.
The problem which is systemic is when "mistakes" are swept under the rug, lied about by the police as a whole. When policemen who make egregious such "mistakes" are allowed to continue to carry a badge and gun, with the assumed authority of the law behind them, rather than told to go get another job without such power. When those who actually commit crimes with that badge as their authority are not prosecuted for those crimes. When potential evidence of such crimes is withheld from public view, but when potentially exculpatory evidence would be rushed to public view, when policeman with a pattern of offensive conduct are enabled to move from police department to police department without their record of past misdeeds following them...do I need to go on?

Good police don't like any of the above. And there's lots of good police.
But the systemic issues persist, the bad actors are allowed to continue in positions of power over their fellow citizens.

Time to change that.

First of all it was not a snatch and grab.....he punched him in the friggen face....nice try to minimize it. I bet you'd think differently if it were Mrs. MD.

Oh yswept under the rug, like when criminals are let loose time and time and time again for doing bad stuff and yet police are one strike and your out. That is your argument?....police can't have representation? Who's the fascist again? You are swerving all over the place, or just pandering to your fanlax base.

[cradleandshoot]

This is a bit of an interesting aspect on the death of Daniel Prude that is just becoming part of the story. Mr Prude was released from Strong Memorial hospital 4 hours before he ran naked into the winter night from his brothers house. His brother said he should have been kept for at least 72 hours so he could be evaluated and treated. The folks at strong just like him go. They did not give his brother any diagnosis, no medication no kind of direction at all about what his problem was. They just let him walk, sorry there pal, see you around. The police are not the only people who failed Daniel Prude. It is quite possible our health care system failed him as well. The man was crying for help and everybody that should have shown him the compassion any human being deserves, too many people turned their back on him. There has been a very powerful theme said by the people protesting his murder... "this has got to change"

[MDlaxfan76]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

[MDlaxfan76]

This is a bit of an interesting aspect on the death of Daniel Prude that is just becoming part of the story. Mr Prude was released from Strong Memorial hospital 4 hours before he ran naked into the winter night from his brothers house. His brother said he should have been kept for at least 72 hours so he could be evaluated and treated. The folks at strong just like him go. They did not give his brother any diagnosis, no medication no kind of direction at all about what his problem was. They just let him walk, sorry there pal, see you around. The police are not the only people who failed Daniel Prude. It is quite possible our health care system failed him as well. The man was crying for help and everybody that should have shown him the compassion any human being deserves, too many people turned their back on him. There has been a very powerful theme said by the people protesting his murder... "this has got to change"

yup, a lot went wrong that night.

[Peter Brown]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

I think Trump has wrecked your brain.

What I REALLY want to know is this: when he wins in November, what then? Do you tune it up another notch with the America is full of racists card (hint: it's not), or do you reflect that perhaps the people are brighter than you give them credit?

[MDlaxfan76]

I can see the main stream news report now: White officers chase black man on bicycle and jump him: https://www.reddit.com/r/JusticeServed/ ... t_of_fdny/

Apparently those were firefighters who chased the snatch and grab thief down. Good job fellas.

Let me ask the question that's been bothering me about some of the posts that Trump supporters have been posting.

Is it the logic of these various posts that because there's crime in America, that justifies police abuse?

That certainly appears to this reader to be the logic. Serious question.

Serious answer....No, its that there are bad people... people struggling with issues we often know nothing about, in this world, that cause irrational behavior at times...full stop. My point in posting the above, this is during the BLM movement, in front of a fire department, and still the brazen idiocy of an enraged criminal. Do you think reparations or a defunded police force would have made him not do this? All this protesting is not going to solve dump...there are idiots out there, of all walks of life.

Shittin' on the police is a poor excuse and low hanging fruit. The irrational, believe police can not make mistakes, and yet, will shitz on them for lack of training, and a union that looks the other way in the rare instances they make a mistake. Maybe we should defund criminals and their families.... take more taxes from them, do not provide as much SNAP money to them...sound fair, no?

hmmm, let's see, you're saying that criminals are "irrational" and police are too? at times?

First of all, a snatch and grab thief isn't thinking about BLM when he attempts his crime. He's a thief, not a protestor. It confounds me why anyone would mix the two matters, except in some sort of convoluted way as to say bad people exist, therefore bad people should be expected to exist in police departments, and...here's the real rub...we shouldn't make a big deal about the latter.

Of course police will make mistakes.
The problem which is systemic is when "mistakes" are swept under the rug, lied about by the police as a whole. When policemen who make egregious such "mistakes" are allowed to continue to carry a badge and gun, with the assumed authority of the law behind them, rather than told to go get another job without such power. When those who actually commit crimes with that badge as their authority are not prosecuted for those crimes. When potential evidence of such crimes is withheld from public view, but when potentially exculpatory evidence would be rushed to public view, when policeman with a pattern of offensive conduct are enabled to move from police department to police department without their record of past misdeeds following them...do I need to go on?

Good police don't like any of the above. And there's lots of good police.
But the systemic issues persist, the bad actors are allowed to continue in positions of power over their fellow citizens.

Time to change that.

First of all it was not a snatch and grab.....he punched him in the friggen face....nice try to minimize it. I bet you'd think differently if it were Mrs. MD.

Oh yswept under the rug, like when criminals are let loose time and time and time again for doing bad stuff and yet police are one strike and your out. That is your argument?....police can't have representation? Who's the fascist again? You are swerving all over the place, or just pandering to your fanlax base.

Hey, looks like what I described on the video...if as you say, I agree it's all the more egregious. Assault is significantly worse than petty theft. Assault actually intending to hurt an innocent bystander for no other purpose than to inflict damage? I'd be a tough jury member...

But why do you think that because there are criminals (and a-holes) that justifies police abuse?

Most police would not agree with you on that. Thank goodness.

[MDlaxfan76]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

I think Trump has wrecked your brain.

What I REALLY want to know is this: when he wins in November, what then? Do you tune it up another notch with the America is full of racists card (hint: it's not), or do you reflect that perhaps the people are brighter than you give them credit?

ahhh, back to Trump...you have to hide somewhere.

[Peter Brown]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

I think Trump has wrecked your brain.

What I REALLY want to know is this: when he wins in November, what then? Do you tune it up another notch with the America is full of racists card (hint: it's not), or do you reflect that perhaps the people are brighter than you give them credit?

ahhh, back to Trump...you have to hide somewhere.

Because 'Trump' is the only plausible explanation for how silly you always sound with your 'America is full of racists' posts, except maybe for that brother in law couchsurfing in your basement. I can't think of any other cause.

[MDlaxfan76]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

I think Trump has wrecked your brain.

What I REALLY want to know is this: when he wins in November, what then? Do you tune it up another notch with the America is full of racists card (hint: it's not), or do you reflect that perhaps the people are brighter than you give them credit?

ahhh, back to Trump...you have to hide somewhere.

Because 'Trump' is the only plausible explanation for how silly you always sound with your 'America is full of racists' posts, except maybe for that brother in law couchsurfing in your basement. I can't think of any other cause.

If I ever do say that "America is full of racists", please reprimand me, but that's not my belief at all, nor have I ever said such.

Now you, Petey, may be another matter. You and your "real Americans" pals.

I do think there are lots of folks like you, some wear their biases and prejudices on their sleeves, others try to gloss it over, but sure, lots of such folks...

But "full of"?
Not at all, America is alive and well with all sorts of diversity and most people appreciate it, aren't threatened by it.

Pretty much all humans harbor some level of unconscious biases, but that's a far cry from being "racists". Most of us are able to recognize this reality and actually work to be aware of how our biases may get in the way of good judgements. We fail plenty, but we try.

Others don't try.

[Typical Lax Dad]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

Most fans I have talked to love the level of play in the bubble. The games have been compelling. My son just told me yesterday that the bubble is the best thing to happen to the NBA go figure. I am going to ask another buddy who is basically retired that became an NBA fan a few years ago what he thinks of the NBA. He was a money manager for GWB. He even planted a tree with Bush in the Whitehouse lawn. One of my best friends.

I love the fan-less PGA on television, so I'm sure there are some NBA fans who love the bubble too. But the numbers are the numbers, they don't lie. If PGA players started wearing Jacob Blake's name on their RBC/NetJets shirts, I'd probably tune them out as well. Nothing to do with race., all to do with how we spend our entertainment dollars and what we expect in return. Some would tune in. Some would tune out. More would tune out than tune in.

Good riddance.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/starved-fo ... yURL_share

We don’t need you....you are being replaced.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/shlomospru ... iakam/amp/

https://sports.yahoo.com/amphtml/no-spo ... 37104.html

[a fan]

and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment.

Oh yes they do. They've had the military and police and fake patriotism crammed down their throats at games for decades now. The militarization of sporting events has been CHEERED for years and years.

What they don't like is when the preaching isn't their own preaching.

[Peter Brown]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

I think Trump has wrecked your brain.

What I REALLY want to know is this: when he wins in November, what then? Do you tune it up another notch with the America is full of racists card (hint: it's not), or do you reflect that perhaps the people are brighter than you give them credit?

ahhh, back to Trump...you have to hide somewhere.

Because 'Trump' is the only plausible explanation for how silly you always sound with your 'America is full of racists' posts, except maybe for that brother in law couchsurfing in your basement. I can't think of any other cause.

If I ever do say that "America is full of racists", please reprimand me, but that's not my belief at all, nor have I ever said such.

Now you, Petey, may be another matter. You and your "real Americans" pals.

I do think there are lots of folks like you, some wear their biases and prejudices on their sleeves, others try to gloss it over, but sure, lots of such folks...

But "full of"?
Not at all, America is alive and well with all sorts of diversity and most people appreciate it, aren't threatened by it.

Pretty much all humans harbor some level of unconscious biases, but that's a far cry from being "racists". Most of us are able to recognize this reality and actually work to be aware of how our biases may get in the way of good judgements. We fail plenty, but we try.

Others don't try.

You'll need to excuse me, but it's perhaps easy to confuse a guy like yourself who's always trying to 'woke' his posts, with another guy who believes for real that America is awful, certainly all Republicans. That's how you come off in your posts anyway. Someone pointed out the other day that for a self-professed Republican, you've never posted anything positive about any Republican here, ever. Hogan? Not even sure he counts as one.

We always teach our teams how to recognize their blind spots; I've got mine, yours is the above. I doubt in person you sound as pessimistic about Americans as you write. But you do sound pessimistic about Americans. I trust them, even when I disagree with them. For some reason, democracy balances out the various needs we all have, so I tend to react to diverging tax and other policies without losing my head.

I think (for good friggin reason!) Democrats have a bat-shinola philosophy wholly at odds with what's made America great for as long as it has, and further I see the hard Left taking over that party (you presumably do not), but for most Democrats, they're simply pleasant but misguided fellow citizens; I'd buy them all a round or two, regardless. Not the Antifa wing, but for most of them, for sure.

My posts sometimes veer into silly territory to make a point, but for you, I actually feel that you truly do not like many of your fellow Americans. Those same Americans you don't like are your police, firefighters, doctors, etc. Most generous country in history by far. There's a reason for that, and it ain't socialism, I assure you.

Trump will be re-elected. I'd get your head on before that occurs.

[Peter Brown]

and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment.

Oh yes they do. They've had the military and police and fake patriotism crammed down their throats at games for decades now. The militarization of sporting events has been CHEERED for years and years.

What they don't like is when the preaching isn't their own preaching.

I've never been a big fan of all that, so I won't disagree. But for the record, it's not actually the owners that wholly demand that; the military likes doing it as it is considered good and cheap advertising.

[old salt]

Most fans I have talked to love the level of play in the bubble. The games have been compelling. My son just told me yesterday that the bubble is the best thing to happen to the NBA go figure. I am going to ask another buddy who is basically retired that became an NBA fan a few years ago what he thinks of the NBA. He was a money manager for GWB. He even planted a tree with Bush in the Whitehouse lawn. One of my best friends.

Roster demographics aside, has the game changed since the days of Clyde Frazier & Willis Reed vs Wes Unseld & Earl Monroe ?
I find my interest in the NBA has waned since then. I just don't find the game as interesting. It fails to hold my attention.
I ask you because you're a serious student of the game.

I grew up a StL Hawks fan & was crushed when they moved to Atlanta.
Bill Bradley played for my HS rival, watched him in our gym.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Most fans I have talked to love the level of play in the bubble. The games have been compelling. My son just told me yesterday that the bubble is the best thing to happen to the NBA go figure. I am going to ask another buddy who is basically retired that became an NBA fan a few years ago what he thinks of the NBA. He was a money manager for GWB. He even planted a tree with Bush in the Whitehouse lawn. One of my best friends.

Roster demographics aside, has the game changed since the days of Clyde Frazier & Willis Reed vs Wes Unseld & Earl Monroe ?
I find my interest in the NBA has waned since then. I just don't find the game as interesting. It fails to hold my attention.
I ask you because you're a serious student of the game.

I grew up a StL Hawks fan & was crushed when they moved to Atlanta.
Bill Bradley played for my HS rival, watched him in our gym.

Yes. The game is very different....not unlike 2018 lacrosse versus 1978 lacrosse. Bill Bradley was excellent. I liked 1970’s basketball and I like 2020 basketball. It’s different. Some aspects of the older game I like better. There are lots of things about the modern game I don’t like but the players are better. Far more defense than people realize....the offensive skill is off the charts and the rules lean towards the offensive player. Football is the same way. Soccer is the purest game of all of them.

You may have read this....if not, you would enjoy it:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1965 ... re-you-are

[MDlaxfan76]

yeah, the sport really is too black...

Only thing keeping the NBA afloat are international viewers who don't care about the color of the players...

Maybe fans tune into sport to see sport as entertainment and not get lectures with viewpoints that are far more nuanced than printing a rapist’s name on your jersey.

right, that's what has "fans" all hot and bothered.

You mean white American fans, right?
You know, "real Americans" like your pals.

I've never been a real NBA fan so I'm probably not a great demographic; I doubt I've watched even 5 minutes since Jordan retired. But what I mean is not white fans nor black fans, just fans. Fans are tuning out. My gut tells me they are both bored with the NBA as currently constituted, and many (white and black) don't love being preached to when what they're paying for is entertainment. Numbers don't lie, MD, no matter how woke you beg or claim to be.

yup, you're definitely not their fan base.

Their #'s keep growing internationally, the racial composition doesn't cause any consternation at all to those fans, nor their being outspoken on racial justice issues.

But, hey, you're undoubtedly correct that there are still a lot of white folks in America who look at the typical NBA team and don't identify racially, and who still think that's important...

I think Trump has wrecked your brain.

What I REALLY want to know is this: when he wins in November, what then? Do you tune it up another notch with the America is full of racists card (hint: it's not), or do you reflect that perhaps the people are brighter than you give them credit?

ahhh, back to Trump...you have to hide somewhere.

Because 'Trump' is the only plausible explanation for how silly you always sound with your 'America is full of racists' posts, except maybe for that brother in law couchsurfing in your basement. I can't think of any other cause.

If I ever do say that "America is full of racists", please reprimand me, but that's not my belief at all, nor have I ever said such.

Now you, Petey, may be another matter. You and your "real Americans" pals.

I do think there are lots of folks like you, some wear their biases and prejudices on their sleeves, others try to gloss it over, but sure, lots of such folks...

But "full of"?
Not at all, America is alive and well with all sorts of diversity and most people appreciate it, aren't threatened by it.

Pretty much all humans harbor some level of unconscious biases, but that's a far cry from being "racists". Most of us are able to recognize this reality and actually work to be aware of how our biases may get in the way of good judgements. We fail plenty, but we try.

Others don't try.

You'll need to excuse me, but it's perhaps easy to confuse a guy like yourself who's always trying to 'woke' his posts, with another guy who believes for real that America is awful, certainly all Republicans. That's how you come off in your posts anyway. Someone pointed out the other day that for a self-professed Republican, you've never posted anything positive about any Republican here, ever. Hogan? Not even sure he counts as one.

We always teach our teams how to recognize their blind spots; I've got mine, yours is the above. I doubt in person you sound as pessimistic about Americans as you write. But you do sound pessimistic about Americans. I trust them, even when I disagree with them. For some reason, democracy balances out the various needs we all have, so I tend to react to diverging tax and other policies without losing my head.

I think (for good friggin reason!) Democrats have a bat-shinola philosophy wholly at odds with what's made America great for as long as it has, and further I see the hard Left taking over that party (you presumably do not), but for most Democrats, they're simply pleasant but misguided fellow citizens; I'd buy them all a round or two, regardless. Not the Antifa wing, but for most of them, for sure.

My posts sometimes veer into silly territory to make a point, but for you, I actually feel that you truly do not like many of your fellow Americans. Those same Americans you don't like are your police, firefighters, doctors, etc. Most generous country in history by far. There's a reason for that, and it ain't socialism, I assure you.

Trump will be re-elected. I'd get your head on before that occurs.

baloney, keep flailing Petey.
Your characterizations of my views are just ridiculous on their face.

[old salt]

Most fans I have talked to love the level of play in the bubble. The games have been compelling. My son just told me yesterday that the bubble is the best thing to happen to the NBA go figure. I am going to ask another buddy who is basically retired that became an NBA fan a few years ago what he thinks of the NBA. He was a money manager for GWB. He even planted a tree with Bush in the Whitehouse lawn. One of my best friends.

Roster demographics aside, has the game changed since the days of Clyde Frazier & Willis Reed vs Wes Unseld & Earl Monroe ?
I find my interest in the NBA has waned since then. I just don't find the game as interesting. It fails to hold my attention.
I ask you because you're a serious student of the game.

I grew up a StL Hawks fan & was crushed when they moved to Atlanta.
Bill Bradley played for my HS rival, watched him in our gym.

Yes. The game is very different....not unlike 2018 lacrosse versus 1978 lacrosse. Bill Bradley was excellent. I liked 1970’s basketball and I like 2020 basketball. It’s different. Some aspects of the older game I like better. There are lots of things about the modern game I don’t like but the players are better. Far more defense than people realize....the offensive skill is off the charts and the rules lean towards the offensive player. Football is the same way. Soccer is the purest game of all of them.

You may have read this....if not, you would enjoy it:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1965 ... re-you-are

Agree re football, as well. The NFL & most NCAA FB teams no longer hold my attention. That's why I can only endure watching teams where the QB still lines up under center & the O-linemen still come out of 3 pont stances & pull. Other than the service academies, I only watch Iowa, WI, Stanford & Arkansas (before last coach fired). Even Harbaugh at MI gave up.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Most fans I have talked to love the level of play in the bubble. The games have been compelling. My son just told me yesterday that the bubble is the best thing to happen to the NBA go figure. I am going to ask another buddy who is basically retired that became an NBA fan a few years ago what he thinks of the NBA. He was a money manager for GWB. He even planted a tree with Bush in the Whitehouse lawn. One of my best friends.

Roster demographics aside, has the game changed since the days of Clyde Frazier & Willis Reed vs Wes Unseld & Earl Monroe ?
I find my interest in the NBA has waned since then. I just don't find the game as interesting. It fails to hold my attention.
I ask you because you're a serious student of the game.

I grew up a StL Hawks fan & was crushed when they moved to Atlanta.
Bill Bradley played for my HS rival, watched him in our gym.

Yes. The game is very different....not unlike 2018 lacrosse versus 1978 lacrosse. Bill Bradley was excellent. I liked 1970’s basketball and I like 2020 basketball. It’s different. Some aspects of the older game I like better. There are lots of things about the modern game I don’t like but the players are better. Far more defense than people realize....the offensive skill is off the charts and the rules lean towards the offensive player. Football is the same way. Soccer is the purest game of all of them.

You may have read this....if not, you would enjoy it:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1965 ... re-you-are

Agree re football, as well. The NFL & most NCAA FB teams no longer hold my attention. That's why I can only endure watching teams where the QB still lines up under center & the O-linemen still come out of 3 pont stances & pull. Other than the service academies, I only watch Iowa, WI, Stanford & Arkansas (before last coach fired). Even Harbaugh at MI gave up.

BTW, I learned how to shoot a basketball watching film of Lou Hudson and Dan Issel. Lou Hudson could shoot the ball.....regarding football, I was a big Single Wing Offense fan

[old salt]

You may have read this....if not, you would enjoy it:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1965 ... re-you-are

Thanks for finding that. Watching Bradley in our HS gym, I recall his hook shot was a thing of beauty, it reminded me of Clif Hagan's & his overall game reminded me of Bob Petit (then the Hawk's 2 star forwards). Now I know, it wasn't a coincidence. He put on a show in pregame warm ups in HS too.

[Typical Lax Dad]

You may have read this....if not, you would enjoy it:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1965 ... re-you-are

Thanks for finding that. Watching Bradley in our HS gym, I recall his hook shot was a thing of beauty, it reminded me of Clif Hagan's & his overall game reminded me of Bob Petit (then the Hawk's 2 star forwards). Now I know, it wasn't a coincidence. He put on a show in pregame warm ips in HS too.

I saw him give a talk to a room full of bankers in NYC years ago. Remarkable guy. Anything John McPhee writes is worth reading.