All things CoronaVirus

[Brooklyn]

Prepare to be immunized!

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/first-co ... 21758.html

Hope you boys own some Moderna.

We, the taxpayers, own the National Institute of Health.

Moderna, which has foreign owners, is about to charge Americans twice of this vaccine if it works. Once in R&D, and then again if we buy the vaccine.

How did we get to be this stupid?

moderna (or any co.) should have the opportunity to make 10% net, no accounting tricks or paybacks on technology pre-covid. variable cost. i'd be ok with not having to pay the guberment for initial investment for all dollars that went to specific development. have them agree to independent audit.
big gov goes 50/50 with those covered by insurance, no deductibles.

i'm not ready for the u.s. to start nationalizing our businesses through equity as a common practice whenever we get into trouble. though it's already happening way too frequently in taking stakes and causing whatever moral hazards.

Moderna - tRUMP's pals make big profit from government contract:


The former pharmaceutical executive tapped by President Trump to lead the federal effort to develop a coronavirus vaccine owns stock options worth more than $10 million in a company receiving funding from that same program, Stat News reports. Until his appointment, Dr. Moncef Slaoui was on the board of the company, Moderna, one of the leading companies in the race for a vaccine and the first to enter a vaccine into clinical trials.

Slaoui’s ownership of 156,000 Moderna stock options, disclosed in required federal financial filings, sparked concerns about a conflict of interest. Democratic Massachusetts Senator Elizabeth Warren called Slaoui out over the matter on Twitter: “It is a huge conflict of interest for the White House’s new vaccine czar to own $10 million of stock in a company receiving government funding to develop a COVID-19 vaccine. Dr. Slaoui should divest immediately.”

The company's shares skyrocketed last month after news broke of the $483 million in federal funding to work on a coronavirus vaccine.



https://www.thedailybeast.com/trumps-va ... id-19-work

Trump’s Vaccine Czar Holds Millions in Stock Options at Company That Got Federal Funding for COVID-19 Work

Dr. Moncef Slaoui reportedly owns 156,000 stock options in Moderna, the first company to enter a coronavirus vaccine into clinical trials.

[DocBarrister]

When I posted this got no response.

I started elementary school with Small pox, chicken pox, measles, mumps and POLIO.

Parents were on record that only Nuclear war worried them more than polio.

All i carried to protect me was a Davy Crockett lunch box and a Howdy Doody pencil holder.

Never a discussion of closing schools. No discussion at all really.

believe a lot of you grew up at the same time

You missed the biggest, most obvious, most comparable, data point. Lots and lots of schools were closed for lots and lots of weeks during the 1918 pandemic. You know that one time when everyone had to wear a mask by law?

It would probably be worth a look to see what the impact of that was. Did the schools open/close too late, too early? Did closing schools work or not?

Went to school in the 50's not 1918. We also had influenza to deal with a long with the others I mentioned

Wow ... did not realize you were so old and expendable.

By all means ... if a bar is open, go ahead and have a few drinks ... send the tab to me.

DocBarrister

Been there done that. Wishing me to get sick. That makes you one of the ones who inherit the earth eh

Nah ... makes me one of the folks who are replacing you.

Here’s to your good health.

DocBarrister

[ggait]

Bad day today.

USA 937 deaths. 7 day average 734 and rising.
CA 139 deaths. Average 96 and rising.
FL 132 deaths. Average 81 and rising.
TX 131 deaths. Average 93 and rising.

Why do all those Democrats (i.e. gay dudes and ugly women like Petey's wife) keep trying to tell us that deaths are increasing?

As math whiz Petey Brown keeps telling us, deaths are decreasing.

MAGA!!

[JoeMauer89]

Bad day today.

USA 937 deaths. 7 day average 734 and rising.
CA 139 deaths. Average 96 and rising.
FL 132 deaths. Average 81 and rising.
TX 131 deaths. Average 93 and rising.

Why do all those Democrats (i.e. gay dudes and ugly women like Petey's wife) keep trying to tell us that deaths are increasing?

As math whiz Petey Brown keeps telling us, deaths are decreasing.

MAGA!!

https://covidtracking.com/data
736 Deaths today, not 937. This is the most accurate unbiased source, Worldometer is highly inconsistent.

[ggait]

Joe -- are the deaths trending up or down in your source?

[JoeMauer89]

Joe -- are the deaths trending up or down in your source?

They are down comparative to last tuesday, which was after a holiday weekend when the numbers are always higher. They may not be decreasing at the level they were the past few weeks. But I don't think they are going to start getting anywhere near 1500-2000 a day. One step a at a time. Just my .02

[ggait]

Joe -- welcome to the boards.

Seems like the trends in your numbers are also up.

I don't think anyone expects to see us get back to the 1500-2000 per day of March/April.

FWIW, UW IHME thinks we are going to mostly plateau until September 1, and then start rising again.

So not a huge death spike, but continuing deaths month after month. With little evidence of a death decline, as some on here keep claiming.

[Farfromgeneva]

When I posted this got no response.

I started elementary school with Small pox, chicken pox, measles, mumps and POLIO.

Parents were on record that only Nuclear war worried them more than polio.

All i carried to protect me was a Davy Crockett lunch box and a Howdy Doody pencil holder.

Never a discussion of closing schools. No discussion at all really.

believe a lot of you grew up at the same time

You missed the biggest, most obvious, most comparable, data point. Lots and lots of schools were closed for lots and lots of weeks during the 1918 pandemic. You know that one time when everyone had to wear a mask by law?

It would probably be worth a look to see what the impact of that was. Did the schools open/close too late, too early? Did closing schools work or not?

Went to school in the 50's not 1918. We also had influenza to deal with a long with the others I mentioned

Wow ... did not realize you were so old and expendable.

By all means ... if a bar is open, go ahead and have a few drinks ... send the tab to me.

DocBarrister

Been there done that. Wishing me to get sick. That makes you one of the ones who inherit the earth eh

Nah ... makes me one of the folks who are replacing you.

Here’s to your good health.

DocBarrister

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FoYC_8cutb0

[Typical Lax Dad]

When I posted this got no response.

I started elementary school with Small pox, chicken pox, measles, mumps and POLIO.

Parents were on record that only Nuclear war worried them more than polio.

All i carried to protect me was a Davy Crockett lunch box and a Howdy Doody pencil holder.

Never a discussion of closing schools. No discussion at all really.

believe a lot of you grew up at the same time

You missed the biggest, most obvious, most comparable, data point. Lots and lots of schools were closed for lots and lots of weeks during the 1918 pandemic. You know that one time when everyone had to wear a mask by law?

It would probably be worth a look to see what the impact of that was. Did the schools open/close too late, too early? Did closing schools work or not?

Went to school in the 50's not 1918. We also had influenza to deal with a long with the others I mentioned

Wow ... did not realize you were so old and expendable.

By all means ... if a bar is open, go ahead and have a few drinks ... send the tab to me.

DocBarrister

Been there done that. Wishing me to get sick. That makes you one of the ones who inherit the earth eh

Nah ... makes me one of the folks who are replacing you.

Here’s to your good health.

DocBarrister

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FoYC_8cutb0

Was that Trump!

[Typical Lax Dad]

When I posted this got no response.

I started elementary school with Small pox, chicken pox, measles, mumps and POLIO.

Parents were on record that only Nuclear war worried them more than polio.

All i carried to protect me was a Davy Crockett lunch box and a Howdy Doody pencil holder.

Never a discussion of closing schools. No discussion at all really.

believe a lot of you grew up at the same time

You missed the biggest, most obvious, most comparable, data point. Lots and lots of schools were closed for lots and lots of weeks during the 1918 pandemic. You know that one time when everyone had to wear a mask by law?

It would probably be worth a look to see what the impact of that was. Did the schools open/close too late, too early? Did closing schools work or not?

Went to school in the 50's not 1918. We also had influenza to deal with a long with the others I mentioned

Wow ... did not realize you were so old and expendable.

By all means ... if a bar is open, go ahead and have a few drinks ... send the tab to me.

DocBarrister

Been there done that. Wishing me to get sick. That makes you one of the ones who inherit the earth eh

Nah ... makes me one of the folks who are replacing you.

Here’s to your good health.

DocBarrister

That explains a lot!



6ft wants that door closed!

MAGA

[a fan]

moderna (or any co.) should have the opportunity to make 10% net, no accounting tricks or paybacks on technology pre-covid. variable cost. i'd be ok with not having to pay the guberment for initial investment for all dollars that went to specific development. have them agree to independent audit.
big gov goes 50/50 with those covered by insurance, no deductibles.

i'm not ready for the u.s. to start nationalizing our businesses

That's precisely what Moderna is doing. They're using YOUR money, not giving it back, and then turning around and making a massive profit using our money. That's nationalizing the risk, and privatizing the profits.

I'm working on a new whiskey. As a taxpayer, should you be forced to pay for my R&D? Because that's what you're saying here.

This is what's known as gaslighting. Under no circumstances does it make sense to give the risk to taxpayers, and all the profits to a private business. But that's the sales pitch being made here.

------------
Put me in charge. I'd create a national lab, run by government scientists. No drug company would stand a chance against us.

And when you open your Federal Tax Bill every year? You'd see a line item that reads : "Congratulations! The USA Drug Empire turned a massive profit this year, and because of that, you owe half of what you paid last year in taxes. You can send thank you notes to "a fan" ".

Now that would never happen---so instead, I'd be just fine with charging royalties, just like any other patent holder, to Moderna. We wouldn't own the company. Just a piece of the patent----a patent that you and I as taxpayers paid for, remember? How is this not reasonable? ROI.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Buckle up boys.....we are entering eastern block territory:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/14/us/p ... s.amp.html

Trust the White House:

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/5 ... orting?amp

[Bart]

But we waste critical time with this pointless discussion, because the facts are already quite clear: herd immunity will likely never be achieved for Covid-19 or any other coronavirus. We know this thanks to new research on the development and decline of Covid antibodies and from a wealth of epidemiological evidence on coronaviruses as a whole.

Antibodies to the virus would increase sharply after infection and peak after about two weeks. But then their presence would decline, generally disappearing entirely somewhere between four months and one year. In one case, a person was reinfected with the same strain of coronavirus after just four weeks from first infection.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/13/opinions ... index.html

This is very bad news. Calls into question whether an effective vaccine will ever be developed. COVID-19 may revisit us constantly, like a superpowerful flu. Perhaps a better comparison is the plague in medieval Europe, which exploded from time to time over a period of centuries.

What these findings suggest is that a person previously infected with COVID-19 could still get reinfected several months later.

That would be catastrophic if true.

DocBarrister

There are certainly alot of ifs and buts and perhaps in this article. IMO he certainly down plays the role of T cells in the entire process. Neutralizing antibodies will wax and wayne but preprimed immuno response may (notice may) be important. The data on this is all over the place, depending on original viral load, severity of illness and other factors.

I see nothing from what I have been reading that suggests that a vaccine is not possible. The mutation frequency lends to it. There is some question regarding the mutation that showed up in February making the virus more infectous but how this translates from the dish to real humans is not understood or questioned. Depending on what a vaccine is developed against the mutations would need to be significant enough to confer no cross reactivity between the response and the new virus. Could it happen? Yup. Probable? Good question. It may be that any potential vaccine become more like the seasonal Flu vaccine.

[seacoaster]

Buckle up boys.....we are entering eastern block territory:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/14/us/p ... s.amp.html

Trust the White House:

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/5 ... orting?amp

Yes, the Executive Branch needs to capture and isolate this data for the next 112 days or so.

Soon, you’ll be able to read about it from a single truthful source too.

[CU88]

https://dianerehm.org/shows/2020-07-14/ ... can-do-now

One of my key takeaways is how important it is that we have someone who is both very knowledgeable in the subject matter and also very good at communicating to be able to talk to the American people on a regular basis.

In a perfect world, we would have Fauci, Birx or Redfield doing daily briefing with a senior member of the both political parties supporting them on the podium.

We are all in this together and only as strong as the weakest link.

Solve the COVID and the economy will follow, in time. Aid people to allow them to stay home and stay healthy.

Aid essential workers to work safe and keep them healthy.

[Peter Brown]

But we waste critical time with this pointless discussion, because the facts are already quite clear: herd immunity will likely never be achieved for Covid-19 or any other coronavirus. We know this thanks to new research on the development and decline of Covid antibodies and from a wealth of epidemiological evidence on coronaviruses as a whole.

Antibodies to the virus would increase sharply after infection and peak after about two weeks. But then their presence would decline, generally disappearing entirely somewhere between four months and one year. In one case, a person was reinfected with the same strain of coronavirus after just four weeks from first infection.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/13/opinions ... index.html

This is very bad news. Calls into question whether an effective vaccine will ever be developed. COVID-19 may revisit us constantly, like a superpowerful flu. Perhaps a better comparison is the plague in medieval Europe, which exploded from time to time over a period of centuries.

What these findings suggest is that a person previously infected with COVID-19 could still get reinfected several months later.

That would be catastrophic if true.

DocBarrister

While DocB and other Democrats pray for more fatalities, American doers are close to vaccine success.

America thrives in spite of the negative nabob/rioting/looting/burning from one Party.

Watch the stock market this morning, please.

[cradleandshoot]

https://dianerehm.org/shows/2020-07-14/ ... can-do-now

One of my key takeaways is how important it is that we have someone who is both very knowledgeable in the subject matter and also very good at communicating to be able to talk to the American people on a regular basis.

In a perfect world, we would have Fauci, Birx or Redfield doing daily briefing with a senior member of the both political parties supporting them on the podium.

We are all in this together and only as strong as the weakest link.

Solve the COVID and the economy will follow, in time. Aid people to allow them to stay home and stay healthy.

Aid essential workers to work safe and keep them healthy.

The problem is, even with all the time and effort spent to educate people about the virus, stupid people just don't get it. Stupid people throw social distancing to the wind and have huge parties so everybody can get together, get hammered and infect everybody all over again. Ron White says it best when he says you can't fix stupid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDvQ77JP8nw

[CU88]

https://dianerehm.org/shows/2020-07-14/ ... can-do-now

One of my key takeaways is how important it is that we have someone who is both very knowledgeable in the subject matter and also very good at communicating to be able to talk to the American people on a regular basis.

In a perfect world, we would have Fauci, Birx or Redfield doing daily briefing with a senior member of the both political parties supporting them on the podium.

We are all in this together and only as strong as the weakest link.

Solve the COVID and the economy will follow, in time. Aid people to allow them to stay home and stay healthy.

Aid essential workers to work safe and keep them healthy.

The problem is, even with all the time and effort spent to educate people about the virus, stupid people just don't get it. Stupid people throw social distancing to the wind and have huge parties so everybody can get together, get hammered and infect everybody all over again. Ron White says it best when he says you can't fix stupid.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=yo ... 6PC%3dU531

Good morning and thanks for the humor, that is a classic skit. You and Ron are correct.

We are all held at risk due to their stupidity.

[wgdsr]

moderna (or any co.) should have the opportunity to make 10% net, no accounting tricks or paybacks on technology pre-covid. variable cost. i'd be ok with not having to pay the guberment for initial investment for all dollars that went to specific development. have them agree to independent audit.
big gov goes 50/50 with those covered by insurance, no deductibles.

i'm not ready for the u.s. to start nationalizing our businesses

That's precisely what Moderna is doing. They're using YOUR money, not giving it back, and then turning around and making a massive profit using our money. That's nationalizing the risk, and privatizing the profits.

I'm working on a new whiskey. As a taxpayer, should you be forced to pay for my R&D? Because that's what you're saying here.

This is what's known as gaslighting. Under no circumstances does it make sense to give the risk to taxpayers, and all the profits to a private business. But that's the sales pitch being made here.

------------
Put me in charge. I'd create a national lab, run by government scientists. No drug company would stand a chance against us.

And when you open your Federal Tax Bill every year? You'd see a line item that reads : "Congratulations! The USA Drug Empire turned a massive profit this year, and because of that, you owe half of what you paid last year in taxes. You can send thank you notes to "a fan" ".

Now that would never happen---so instead, I'd be just fine with charging royalties, just like any other patent holder, to Moderna. We wouldn't own the company. Just a piece of the patent----a patent that you and I as taxpayers paid for, remember? How is this not reasonable? ROI.

i understand what i wrote. i'm capping the profits and making a special exemption for a vaccine in a pandemic. some of these companies have other focus and some have less means.

"investing" in these businesses should come with a return, if there is one. depends on what that return is, money, turnaround, quality, etc.

this is not a drug that has been out there for a year or 50. we're asking or telling companies -- here's some cash -- do this, take resources, do it quick.

i'm speaking in the hypothetical, bc of course whoever comes up with vaccine(s) is just going to charge whatever they want outside of any early agreement we have with them. just simply what i would say is an agreeable scenario. consumers aren't overcharged, insurance picks up some. if we were talking about potentially more than one round of this vaccine going out... annually, bi-annually.. i'd want our money back (from all invests) thru the winners and a piece of the action on invest.

[kramerica.inc]

I asked a while ago. Who on this board is raising their hand to be the first in line to get that vaccine?