JUST the Stolen Documents/Mar-A-Lago/"Judge" Cannon Trial

[Kismet]

https://news.usni.org/2020/07/12/breaki ... chard-fire

UPDATED: 11 Sailors Injured, Explosion Reported in USS Bonhomme Richard Fire

Sailors have been hurt in a fire and explosion on hanger deck aboard amphibious warship USS Bonhomme Richard (LHD-6) that’s docked the pier at Naval Base San Diego, Calif., local officials said on Sunday.

The San Diego Union-Tribune reported 11 sailors had been taken to a hospital to be treated for minor injuries, citing Navy officials.

Looking at the FNC video -- looks like she's in a yard maint period. Numerous containers on the flight deck. No aircraft or acft handling vehicles visible.
Not at sea or deployed, so weapons magazines & fuel tanks should be at low levels.
FNC reports the fire started in the well deck (a large open, easy to access space). Likely started by a welding job or other "hot work".
Should be containable with limited damage.

You might want to rethink your happy news attitude (only an estimated 1 MILLION gallons of fuel on board)

This morning's update (as the ship still burns)

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-nav ... B4.twitter

"The fire is believed to have started below those spaces, in the lower cargo hold of the ship, known as the “Deep V,” Sobeck said.

San Diego Fire Chief Colin Stowell told CNN Sunday that the fire could burn for days “down to the water line.”

While what caused the fire and when it will be extinguished remained unclear Sunday night, the inferno aboard the 23-year-old ship risks becoming a so-called “constructive total loss” if the fire is allowed to burn itself out, according to Lawrence Brennan, a retired Navy captain who now teaches admiralty law at Fordham University’s School of Law."

“This could cost the U.S. Navy an important aviation asset, capable of handling modern F-35s,” he said in an email. “Repair prices, if practical, will be hundreds of millions of dollars, or replacement will take many years and cost about a billion dollars.”

[6ftstick]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

[a fan]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

When Putin keeps ratcheting up the attacks? First cyber, now arming the Taliban to kill our troops?

I'm not ok with them killing our Troops. I'm frankly surprised that you are.

[6ftstick]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

When Putin keeps ratcheting up the attacks? First cyber, now arming the Taliban to kill our troops?

I'm not ok with them killing our Troops. I'm frankly surprised that you are.

Theres no proof that they are.

[seacoaster]

Not unpredictably, turns out the Russian bounty on American forces was total horse shinola.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/nation ... e-n1233199

Will anyone apologize for their hysterical takes?

Did you, umm, read the article you posted?

The question is, did you?

It’s worse when you read it. Dilanian admits they intel doesn’t support the accusations but he says that isn’t important, the narrative is.

Excerpt:

"Three retired generals who served in the chain of command over the war in Afghanistan told NBC News they saw indications Russia was supplying weapons, money, supplies and, on occasion, even transport to Taliban fighters as far back as 2016. The Taliban often received the weapons and support in northern Afghanistan, but by 2017 the Russian-supplied support was believed to be used by Taliban fighters as far south as Kandahar.

In 2017, Gen. Joseph Votel, commander of U.S. Central Command, said it was a “possibility” that Russia was arming the Taliban. By March 2018, Gen. John Nicholson, then commander of U.S. forces in Afghanistan, told the BBC the Russians were conducting exercises along the Afghan border with Tajikistan, and then leaving weapons and equipment behind for the Taliban to retrieve. He said the Russian support began when the U.S. and Russia were at odds in Syria.

"This activity really picked up in the last 18 to 24 months," Nicholson said. "Prior to that we had not seen this kind of destabilizing activity by Russia here. When you look at the timing it roughly correlates to when things started to heat up in Syria. So it's interesting to note the timing of the whole thing."

The initial New York Times story about the intelligence on Russian bounties characterized it as a "finding" of the intelligence community, but subsequent reporting has painted a more nuanced picture. U.S. officials tell NBC News the CIA has concluded with "moderate confidence" that there was such a bounty program, a term of art that means analysts find it plausible but less than certain. The National Security Agency — the Pentagon's digital spying arm — has said it could not corroborate the intelligence reporting from detainees, officials say.

Although an official briefed on the intelligence told NBC News it shows American service members died as a result of the bounties, McKenzie told reporters he had not seen evidence of that. He said the military was aware of the intelligence, but didn't specify when it became aware.

"You see a lot of indicators, many of them are troubling many of them you act on. But, but in this case there just wasn't enough there," he said. "I sent the intelligence guys back to continue to dig on it, and I believe they're continuing to dig right now, but I just didn't see enough there to tell me that the circuit was closed in that regard."

I am not seeing or reading the "horse shinola" part. Show me.

I honestly have no idea if the Left is simply obtuse or just engaging in devil's advocacy.

Here is the very first sentence and paragraph:

A growing chorus of American officials have said in recent days that the intelligence suggesting Russians paid "bounties" to induce the Taliban to kill American service members in Afghanistan is less than conclusive.


Please tell the board which part of that confuses you

The part that confuses me is the delta between "total horse shinola," on the one hand, and "indications Russia was supplying weapons, money, supplies and, on occasion, even transport to Taliban fighters as far back as 2016" and "less than conclusive," on the other.

Why hasn't the Trump Administration just said and demonstrated that the allegations are some diplomatic version of "total horse shinola"?

The Powell quotes posted by 6ft are more interesting than the article you posted Pete, because Powell has some credibility -- and you don't.

Your gift for overstatement in order to make a point about this imaginary monolithic "Left" is at the root of this problem. It is a big part of why no one can have a serious interaction or conversation with you.

[a fan]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

When Putin keeps ratcheting up the attacks? First cyber, now arming the Taliban to kill our troops?

I'm not ok with them killing our Troops. I'm frankly surprised that you are.

Theres no proof that they are.

Three of our Generals said they are. Are they lying?

[Farfromgeneva]

Not unpredictably, turns out the Russian bounty on American forces was total horse shinola.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/nation ... e-n1233199

Will anyone apologize for their hysterical takes?

Did you, umm, read the article you posted?

The question is, did you?

It’s worse when you read it. Dilanian admits they intel doesn’t support the accusations but he says that isn’t important, the narrative is.

Excerpt:

"Three retired generals who served in the chain of command over the war in Afghanistan told NBC News they saw indications Russia was supplying weapons, money, supplies and, on occasion, even transport to Taliban fighters as far back as 2016. The Taliban often received the weapons and support in northern Afghanistan, but by 2017 the Russian-supplied support was believed to be used by Taliban fighters as far south as Kandahar.

In 2017, Gen. Joseph Votel, commander of U.S. Central Command, said it was a “possibility” that Russia was arming the Taliban. By March 2018, Gen. John Nicholson, then commander of U.S. forces in Afghanistan, told the BBC the Russians were conducting exercises along the Afghan border with Tajikistan, and then leaving weapons and equipment behind for the Taliban to retrieve. He said the Russian support began when the U.S. and Russia were at odds in Syria.

"This activity really picked up in the last 18 to 24 months," Nicholson said. "Prior to that we had not seen this kind of destabilizing activity by Russia here. When you look at the timing it roughly correlates to when things started to heat up in Syria. So it's interesting to note the timing of the whole thing."

The initial New York Times story about the intelligence on Russian bounties characterized it as a "finding" of the intelligence community, but subsequent reporting has painted a more nuanced picture. U.S. officials tell NBC News the CIA has concluded with "moderate confidence" that there was such a bounty program, a term of art that means analysts find it plausible but less than certain. The National Security Agency — the Pentagon's digital spying arm — has said it could not corroborate the intelligence reporting from detainees, officials say.

Although an official briefed on the intelligence told NBC News it shows American service members died as a result of the bounties, McKenzie told reporters he had not seen evidence of that. He said the military was aware of the intelligence, but didn't specify when it became aware.

"You see a lot of indicators, many of them are troubling many of them you act on. But, but in this case there just wasn't enough there," he said. "I sent the intelligence guys back to continue to dig on it, and I believe they're continuing to dig right now, but I just didn't see enough there to tell me that the circuit was closed in that regard."

I am not seeing or reading the "horse shinola" part. Show me.

I honestly have no idea if the Left is simply obtuse or just engaging in devil's advocacy.

Here is the very first sentence and paragraph:

A growing chorus of American officials have said in recent days that the intelligence suggesting Russians paid "bounties" to induce the Taliban to kill American service members in Afghanistan is less than conclusive.


Please tell the board which part of that confuses you

The part that confuses me is the delta between "total horse shinola," on the one hand, and "indications Russia was supplying weapons, money, supplies and, on occasion, even transport to Taliban fighters as far back as 2016" and "less than conclusive," on the other.

Why hasn't the Trump Administration just said and demonstrated that the allegations are some diplomatic version of "total horse shinola"?

The Powell quotes posted by 6ft are more interesting than the article you posted Pete, because Powell has some credibility -- and you don't.

Your gift for overstatement in order to make a point about this imaginary monolithic "Left" is at the root of this problem. It is a big part of why no one can have a serious interaction or conversation with you.

It’s a game to waste everyone else’s time.

[Peter Brown]

Not unpredictably, turns out the Russian bounty on American forces was total horse shinola.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/nation ... e-n1233199

Will anyone apologize for their hysterical takes?

Did you, umm, read the article you posted?

The question is, did you?

It’s worse when you read it. Dilanian admits they intel doesn’t support the accusations but he says that isn’t important, the narrative is.

Excerpt:

"Three retired generals who served in the chain of command over the war in Afghanistan told NBC News they saw indications Russia was supplying weapons, money, supplies and, on occasion, even transport to Taliban fighters as far back as 2016. The Taliban often received the weapons and support in northern Afghanistan, but by 2017 the Russian-supplied support was believed to be used by Taliban fighters as far south as Kandahar.

In 2017, Gen. Joseph Votel, commander of U.S. Central Command, said it was a “possibility” that Russia was arming the Taliban. By March 2018, Gen. John Nicholson, then commander of U.S. forces in Afghanistan, told the BBC the Russians were conducting exercises along the Afghan border with Tajikistan, and then leaving weapons and equipment behind for the Taliban to retrieve. He said the Russian support began when the U.S. and Russia were at odds in Syria.

"This activity really picked up in the last 18 to 24 months," Nicholson said. "Prior to that we had not seen this kind of destabilizing activity by Russia here. When you look at the timing it roughly correlates to when things started to heat up in Syria. So it's interesting to note the timing of the whole thing."

The initial New York Times story about the intelligence on Russian bounties characterized it as a "finding" of the intelligence community, but subsequent reporting has painted a more nuanced picture. U.S. officials tell NBC News the CIA has concluded with "moderate confidence" that there was such a bounty program, a term of art that means analysts find it plausible but less than certain. The National Security Agency — the Pentagon's digital spying arm — has said it could not corroborate the intelligence reporting from detainees, officials say.

Although an official briefed on the intelligence told NBC News it shows American service members died as a result of the bounties, McKenzie told reporters he had not seen evidence of that. He said the military was aware of the intelligence, but didn't specify when it became aware.

"You see a lot of indicators, many of them are troubling many of them you act on. But, but in this case there just wasn't enough there," he said. "I sent the intelligence guys back to continue to dig on it, and I believe they're continuing to dig right now, but I just didn't see enough there to tell me that the circuit was closed in that regard."

I am not seeing or reading the "horse shinola" part. Show me.

I honestly have no idea if the Left is simply obtuse or just engaging in devil's advocacy.

Here is the very first sentence and paragraph:

A growing chorus of American officials have said in recent days that the intelligence suggesting Russians paid "bounties" to induce the Taliban to kill American service members in Afghanistan is less than conclusive.


Please tell the board which part of that confuses you

The part that confuses me is the delta between "total horse shinola," on the one hand, and "indications Russia was supplying weapons, money, supplies and, on occasion, even transport to Taliban fighters as far back as 2016" and "less than conclusive," on the other.

Why hasn't the Trump Administration just said and demonstrated that the allegations are some diplomatic version of "total horse shinola"?

The Powell quotes posted by 6ft are more interesting than the article you posted Pete, because Powell has some credibility -- and you don't.

Your gift for overstatement in order to make a point about this imaginary monolithic "Left" is at the root of this problem. It is a big part of why no one can have a serious interaction or conversation with you.

It’s a game to waste everyone else’s time.

The Left is the greatest threat to America since the Soviet Union. They root for riots, looting, statues coming down, history being rewritten, police being shot, and economies being ruined. If pointing out basic honesty is 'wasting your time', maybe reality is you're fearful of who you're allied with.

[old salt]

https://news.usni.org/2020/07/12/breaki ... chard-fire

UPDATED: 11 Sailors Injured, Explosion Reported in USS Bonhomme Richard Fire

Sailors have been hurt in a fire and explosion on hanger deck aboard amphibious warship USS Bonhomme Richard (LHD-6) that’s docked the pier at Naval Base San Diego, Calif., local officials said on Sunday.

The San Diego Union-Tribune reported 11 sailors had been taken to a hospital to be treated for minor injuries, citing Navy officials.

Looking at the FNC video -- looks like she's in a yard maint period. Numerous containers on the flight deck. No aircraft or acft handling vehicles visible.
Not at sea or deployed, so weapons magazines & fuel tanks should be at low levels.
FNC reports the fire started in the well deck (a large open, easy to access space). Likely started by a welding job or other "hot work".
Should be containable with limited damage.

You might want to rethink your happy news attitude (only an estimated 1 MILLION gallons of fuel on board)

This morning's update (as the ship still burns)

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-nav ... B4.twitter

"The fire is believed to have started below those spaces, in the lower cargo hold of the ship, known as the “Deep V,” Sobeck said.

San Diego Fire Chief Colin Stowell told CNN Sunday that the fire could burn for days “down to the water line.”

While what caused the fire and when it will be extinguished remained unclear Sunday night, the inferno aboard the 23-year-old ship risks becoming a so-called “constructive total loss” if the fire is allowed to burn itself out, according to Lawrence Brennan, a retired Navy captain who now teaches admiralty law at Fordham University’s School of Law."

“This could cost the U.S. Navy an important aviation asset, capable of handling modern F-35s,” he said in an email. “Repair prices, if practical, will be hundreds of millions of dollars, or replacement will take many years and cost about a billion dollars.”

Not looking good for the Bonnie Dick. When I posted my initial thoughts, it was based on initial reporting that the fire originated in the well deck. Nor did initial reporting indicate that the ship was in a shipyard maint period with reduced manning onboard. This reduced the available crew for damage control teams onboard. Additionally, there was much more flammable matl exposed due to the yard maint & more compartments & passageways were open & could not be quickly locked down, as they would be if ship were fully manned & rapid damage control lockdown of compartments & passageways could be accomplished. Most importantly, the HALON suppression system was disabled for maint. This allowed the fire to increase quickly with the heat flashing to the superstructure & other locations, requiring the evacuation of some of the ships crew fire fighting teams. It's now a fight to save the ship. The engineering spaces & fuel tanks (holding a million gallons) are intact. It's now a fight to keep the fire away from them. Thankfully, there's no ordnance on board.
When a ship's in a yard maint period, much of the organic fire safety design & manpower designed into Navy ships is compromised.
It becomes more like a steel building than a ahip.
I fear this may be La Morte de Bonnie Dick. Unfortunately she's one of our LHD's that have been retrofitted to deploy & operate the F-35B.
This messes up the Amphib Readiness Group's deployment schedule & may require switching a, E coast LHD to the W coast for home port.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/milita ... san-diego/
only 160 of the 1,000 sailors normally assigned on the ship were aboard at the time.
https://news.usni.org/2020/07/13/fire-f ... spitalized
The big-deck amphib, commissioned in 1998, returned from being forward deployed to Japan in 2018. Bonhomme Richard had just completed a $249 million repair period at the nearby General Dynamics NASSCO shipyard before transferring to the naval base.

[old salt]

13 lessons from the Crozier affair. #11 & the conclusion are worth noting :

https://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2020/0 ... e_today_nl

11. Another danger: decision by “Twitter mob.” The tool of “creating a false narrative then get the public to amplify that false narrative” has existed for some time, but the military was thought to be somewhat insulated from it. No longer. Once the report of Theodore Roosevelt’s status began spinning out of control, the “Twitter mob” phenomenon began, where a large number of media outlets, “influencers,” and members of the general public became outraged by the inaccurate status and demanded action. There was even concern that this social media pressure might influence senior defense leaders, which would be worrisome in any situation, more so in an operational event. There is extreme risk that ill-informed, or well-informed but malign, social media forces will intentionally or inadvertently drive a decision in the wrong direction. This is a matter that must be understood and dealt with at all levels of command, and the higher up you get, the more critical the response likely will be.

It is remarkable that so many people commenting on the Crozier affair got so much so wrong. The signs were there from the beginning, for those who felt inclined to look for them.

[old salt]

Now on the Bonnie Dick :

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/3 ... me-richard

The key new details from this latest press conference are:

The ship is stable and the structure is safe.
No major damage to the ship's four main engineering spaces.
No threat to the ship's fuel tanks at present.
The fuel tanks are well below any of the remaining active fires or heat sources, so any risk to them at this point is low.
The ship has salt water-filled compensation tanks that also help keep the fuel tanks cool.
There is at least one active fire in a forward area of the ship.
Firefighters had been unable to get to those spaces until today.
There is another heat source that could be another fire aft.
These two areas are isolated from each other.
Helicopter Sea Combat Squadron Three (HSC-3), based at nearby Naval Air Station North Island, has conducted more than 1,200 water bucket drops, in total.
In addition to other external firefighting operations, these drops have been essential in allowing firefighters to actually get on the ship.
61 personnel have been injured, in total, so far, 38 sailors and 23 civilians.
None of those individuals are hospitalized.
An explosion occurred while the crew was securing the space where the initial fire had broken out before they could safely energize the fire suppression system.
The fire spread rapidly from the front to the rear of the ship.
Navy is working with San Diego authorities to step up monitoring of potential adverse environmental impacts.
Coast Guard is prepared to respond to any potential environmental issues, including an oil spill.
No visible evidence of oil spill at present.
Hope that all fires will be out within the next 24 hours.
Too early to tell the full extent of the damage.

[CU88]

White House officials sent document to Pentagon criticizing Lt. Col. Alex Vindman after his impeachment testimony. The Pentagon got the document as Vindman was on track to be promoted to colonel.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/military/w ... _nn_tw_mtp


July 15, 2020, 1:23 PM EDT
By Carol E. Lee and Courtney Kube
WASHINGTON — The National Security Council sent a list of allegations about Lt. Col. Alex Vindman to the Pentagon after he testified before the House in impeachment proceedings against President Donald Trump, according to one person who has seen the document and two others briefed on it.

The Pentagon received the document, which alleged Vindman created a hostile work environment at the NSC, as he was on track to be promoted to colonel. The accusations outlined in it, if substantiated, would have kept him from moving up a rank in the Army, the people familiar with the document said. They said it was not the typical evaluation that military officers serving on the NSC are given when their temporary positions end and they are set to return to the Defense Department, as Vindman was scheduled to do about six months after this document was sent to the Pentagon.

The NSC is housed in the White House and chaired by the president, though it's managed day-to-day by the national security adviser.

[Kismet]

https://news.usni.org/2020/07/12/breaki ... chard-fire

UPDATED: 11 Sailors Injured, Explosion Reported in USS Bonhomme Richard Fire

Sailors have been hurt in a fire and explosion on hanger deck aboard amphibious warship USS Bonhomme Richard (LHD-6) that’s docked the pier at Naval Base San Diego, Calif., local officials said on Sunday.

The San Diego Union-Tribune reported 11 sailors had been taken to a hospital to be treated for minor injuries, citing Navy officials.

Looking at the FNC video -- looks like she's in a yard maint period. Numerous containers on the flight deck. No aircraft or acft handling vehicles visible.
Not at sea or deployed, so weapons magazines & fuel tanks should be at low levels.
FNC reports the fire started in the well deck (a large open, easy to access space). Likely started by a welding job or other "hot work".
Should be containable with limited damage.

You might want to rethink your happy news attitude (only an estimated 1 MILLION gallons of fuel on board)

This morning's update (as the ship still burns)

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-nav ... B4.twitter

"The fire is believed to have started below those spaces, in the lower cargo hold of the ship, known as the “Deep V,” Sobeck said.

San Diego Fire Chief Colin Stowell told CNN Sunday that the fire could burn for days “down to the water line.”

While what caused the fire and when it will be extinguished remained unclear Sunday night, the inferno aboard the 23-year-old ship risks becoming a so-called “constructive total loss” if the fire is allowed to burn itself out, according to Lawrence Brennan, a retired Navy captain who now teaches admiralty law at Fordham University’s School of Law."

“This could cost the U.S. Navy an important aviation asset, capable of handling modern F-35s,” he said in an email. “Repair prices, if practical, will be hundreds of millions of dollars, or replacement will take many years and cost about a billion dollars.”

Not looking good for the Bonnie Dick. When I posted my initial thoughts, it was based on initial reporting that the fire originated in the well deck. Nor did initial reporting indicate that the ship was in a shipyard maint period with reduced manning onboard. This reduced the available crew for damage control teams onboard. Additionally, there was much more flammable matl exposed due to the yard maint & more compartments & passageways were open & could not be quickly locked down, as they would be if ship were fully manned & rapid damage control lockdown of compartments & passageways could be accomplished. Most importantly, the HALON suppression system was disabled for maint. This allowed the fire to increase quickly with the heat flashing to the superstructure & other locations, requiring the evacuation of some of the ships crew fire fighting teams. It's now a fight to save the ship. The engineering spaces & fuel tanks (holding a million gallons) are intact. It's now a fight to keep the fire away from them. Thankfully, there's no ordnance on board.
When a ship's in a yard maint period, much of the organic fire safety design & manpower designed into Navy ships is compromised.
It becomes more like a steel building than a ahip.
I fear this may be La Morte de Bonnie Dick. Unfortunately she's one of our LHD's that have been retrofitted to deploy & operate the F-35B.
This messes up the Amphib Readiness Group's deployment schedule & may require switching a, E coast LHD to the W coast for home port.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/milita ... san-diego/
only 160 of the 1,000 sailors normally assigned on the ship were aboard at the time.
https://news.usni.org/2020/07/13/fire-f ... spitalized
The big-deck amphib, commissioned in 1998, returned from being forward deployed to Japan in 2018. Bonhomme Richard had just completed a $249 million repair period at the nearby General Dynamics NASSCO shipyard before transferring to the naval base.

Cascading effects of the Bonnie Dick fire on the Navy and future operation around the world

https://warontherocks.com/2020/07/more- ... tastrophe/

"As I write this, the USS Bonhomme Richard — a Wasp-class amphibious assault ship — burns at Pier 2, Naval Station San Diego. Scores of Navy and civilian firefighters have fought the blaze for over 72 hours and it is difficult to tell from afar how much progress is being made. One thing is clear: The ship will likely be, at best, out of action for years or, at worst, stricken from Navy rolls. In either case, there will be considerable impact to ongoing naval operations, force development efforts, and naval integration initiatives. While navalists tend to judge navies by the number of ships that comprise them, the plain truth is that not all ships are created equal. The loss of some ships is much worse than others. That is what Americans are watching happen before their eyes. Confidence in the Navy is shaken.

To provide conventional deterrence and forward-deployed assurance, the U.S. Navy relies on a finite number of force packages. They include the carrier strike group — comprised of a large, nuclear-powered aircraft carrier, a carrier air wing, and three to five surface combatants (cruisers and destroyers) and logistics ships — and the expeditionary strike group — comprised of an amphibious assault ship (such as the Bonhomme Richard), two additional amphibious warships, and a Marine expeditionary unit of over 2,000 marines whose mobility is provided by the ships and aircraft of the overall expeditionary strike group. Additionally, one to two surface combatants provide offensive and defensive power to the expeditionary strike group. Attack submarines may be associated with a larger formation but generally operate independently. Moreover, ships deploy independently or in small groups to support combatant commander requirements for exercise participation and other allied engagement."

Update of the firefighting Damage control - fire teams were evacuated yesterday evening as the ship's list inverted rapidly to port (towards the pier) from starboard

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/3 ... wards-pier

[old salt]

Cascading effects of the Bonnie Dick fire on the Navy and future operation around the world

https://warontherocks.com/2020/07/more- ... tastrophe/

"As I write this, the USS Bonhomme Richard — a Wasp-class amphibious assault ship — burns at Pier 2, Naval Station San Diego. Scores of Navy and civilian firefighters have fought the blaze for over 72 hours and it is difficult to tell from afar how much progress is being made. One thing is clear: The ship will likely be, at best, out of action for years or, at worst, stricken from Navy rolls. In either case, there will be considerable impact to ongoing naval operations, force development efforts, and naval integration initiatives. While navalists tend to judge navies by the number of ships that comprise them, the plain truth is that not all ships are created equal. The loss of some ships is much worse than others. That is what Americans are watching happen before their eyes. Confidence in the Navy is shaken.

To provide conventional deterrence and forward-deployed assurance, the U.S. Navy relies on a finite number of force packages. They include the carrier strike group — comprised of a large, nuclear-powered aircraft carrier, a carrier air wing, and three to five surface combatants (cruisers and destroyers) and logistics ships — and the expeditionary strike group — comprised of an amphibious assault ship (such as the Bonhomme Richard), two additional amphibious warships, and a Marine expeditionary unit of over 2,000 marines whose mobility is provided by the ships and aircraft of the overall expeditionary strike group. Additionally, one to two surface combatants provide offensive and defensive power to the expeditionary strike group. Attack submarines may be associated with a larger formation but generally operate independently. Moreover, ships deploy independently or in small groups to support combatant commander requirements for exercise participation and other allied engagement."

Update of the firefighting Damage control - fire teams were evacuated yesterday evening as the ship's list inverted rapidly to port (towards the pier) from starboard

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/3 ... wards-pier

The cascading effects of the loss of the Bonnie Dick on the Navy's global posture can be somewhat mitigated by the fact that our newest LHA -- the Tripoli was just commissioned. These new LHA's are just at the beginning of their production run. We've been operating with 9 LHD/LHA's. They do not require a multi-year mid-life overhaul like our nuc carriers do because of the need to remove & refuel the reactor. The overhaul & extended maint periods of the 7 remaining LHD's may be adjusted to maintain the current deployment pace as the newer LHA's enter service.

The LHD's are 1980's vintage, designed to operate helos & AV-8B Harriers. The LHA's are state of the art, designed to operate the F-35B, V-22 tilt-rotor & helos. The first 2 LHA's do not have a well deck, enabling them to carry more F-35s rather than landing craft. These 2 "lightning carriers" are being assigned to PACFLT with the America homeported in Japan & the Tripoli homeported in San Diego, giving us added F-35 capability in W Pac.

COVID may dictate a change to our deployment scheduling paradigm anyway. We're adapting in the short term by keeping our ships at sea for extended intervals. Our ships & crews can't maintain this pace indefinitely. A return to a new normal will likely reflect the ripple effects of these extended deployments. It will be a challenge to maintain this level of forward deployed global presence. We may have to endure more gaps in the ME & cover the CENTCOM AOR with just E coast based strike groups, while devoting our W coast & Japan based strike groups soley to W Pac, without rotating them to cover the ME, ...unless & until we go to war there (again)

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/2 ... of-its-own

https://news.usni.org/2020/07/15/second ... ommissions

[old salt]

I went back to 2016 & dug out this cyber intel interview I remembered.
Timely now for what he says about China.
https://charlierose.com/videos/29298

[DocBarrister]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

When Putin keeps ratcheting up the attacks? First cyber, now arming the Taliban to kill our troops?

I'm not ok with them killing our Troops. I'm frankly surprised that you are.

You are wasting your time arguing with the Putin/Trump cultists.

Putin is a white supremacist.
Trump is a white supremacist.

Putin is anti-Muslim.
Trump is anti-Muslim.

Putin is anti-LGBTQ.
Trump is anti-LGBTQ.

Putin is a misogynist.
Trump is a misogynist.

The Putin/Trump cultists on this forum will support them as long as Putin and Trump share their racism, bigotry, and misogyny.

For the Putin/Trump cultists on this forum, their racism, bigotry, and misogyny are more important to them than our troops, democracy, Constitution, and nation.

That is the repugnant truth, a fan.

Once you acknowledge that, then you will understand with whom you are arguing.

DocBarrister

[6ftstick]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

When Putin keeps ratcheting up the attacks? First cyber, now arming the Taliban to kill our troops?

I'm not ok with them killing our Troops. I'm frankly surprised that you are.

You are wasting your time arguing with the Putin/Trump cultists.

Putin is a white supremacist.
Trump is a white supremacist.

Putin is anti-Muslim.
Trump is anti-Muslim.

Putin is anti-LGBTQ.
Trump is anti-LGBTQ.

Putin is a misogynist.
Trump is a misogynist.

The Putin/Trump cultists on this forum will support them as long as Putin and Trump share their racism, bigotry, and misogyny.

For the Putin/Trump cultists on this forum, their racism, bigotry, and misogyny are more important to them than our troops, democracy, Constitution, and nation.

That is the repugnant truth, a fan.

Once you acknowledge that, then you will understand with whom you are arguing.

DocBarrister

So now I'm a Russian Agent too.

Does that make me eligible for a retirement package from the DNC.

[CU88]

What makes you assume we are?

We're still trading with them.

9 billion in a 17 trillion economy.

Would you rather all doors were closed.

When Putin keeps ratcheting up the attacks? First cyber, now arming the Taliban to kill our troops?

I'm not ok with them killing our Troops. I'm frankly surprised that you are.

You are wasting your time arguing with the Putin/Trump cultists.

Putin is a white supremacist.
Trump is a white supremacist.

Putin is anti-Muslim.
Trump is anti-Muslim.

Putin is anti-LGBTQ.
Trump is anti-LGBTQ.

Putin is a misogynist.
Trump is a misogynist.

The Putin/Trump cultists on this forum will support them as long as Putin and Trump share their racism, bigotry, and misogyny.

For the Putin/Trump cultists on this forum, their racism, bigotry, and misogyny are more important to them than our troops, democracy, Constitution, and nation.

That is the repugnant truth, a fan.

Once you acknowledge that, then you will understand with whom you are arguing.

DocBarrister

So now I'm a Russian Agent too.

Does that make me eligible for a retirement package from the DNC.

You can get GOYA for life, on the side

Trump goya.jpg (62.28 KiB) Viewed 856 times

[DocBarrister]

An unmarked federal paramilitary force ... reportedly Border Control personnel being converted by the Department of Homeland Security into a Naziesque storm trooper force loyal to Trump ... shot a kid when he was just holding a speaker above his head. Fractured his face and skull and the kid required facial reconstruction surgery. There is no need for this SS-like force in Portland ... it’s just part of Trump’s efforts to look like a law and order president.

https://www.kgw.com/mobile/article/news ... 6b408b6475

Donald Trump is a threat to us all.

Any of you who continue to support Trump are supporting his thuggery and the continued degradation of our democracy. Your continued support of Trump is simply disgusting.

DocBarrister

[old salt]

Now of the Bonnie Dick -- this incident highlights 3 issues which need to be addressed for our 21st century naval capability --

-- on the micro scale -- how we man our ship's watch sections during ship yard maint periods when shipboard compartments cannot be closed & sealed &/or shipboard fire suppression systems may be disabled. I think some heads may roll from this incident & some significant new requirements generated.

-- the need to repair or replace Bonnie Dick highlights the limitations of our warship building capacity compared to WW-II.
There's no way we can surge that way now. We'll have to fight our next war with the Navy we have at the outset. We no longer have the ability to rapidly expand or repair or replace combat losses.
https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2020/07 ... me-richard Rough Seas for our Navy.

-- this loss (along with COVID) will exacerbate our existing shortfall in meeting existing taskings.
Our Nuc carriers (CVN) & Large Deck Amphib Assault Ships (LHD/LPA).
Our national security strategy is based upon having 12 CVN's & 10 LHD/LHA's in serivce.
We've been operating for years with 10-11 CVN's & 9 LHD/LHA's.
We do not currently have the industrial capacity to reach 12 & 10.
We must scale back our global strategy & reduce our deployed naval presence somewhere.
https://taskandpurpose.com/pentagon-run ... russia-war