Johns Hopkins 2021

[51percentcorn]

there's a half dozen kids right now who if you read their bios and look at what they've done so far have no business on the roster anymore, probably another 12-15 who the staff doesn't think fit and that's just a start. The problem is each one of these kids comes from a program, a community, a network of younger players and how they're treated especially in the corona times of uncertainty for a new staff when the JHUML has been down for awhile is going to be remembered and either rewarded or punished by these current players hs coaches, communities etc.

While the start of your point is fairly harsh and debatable - who knows what the staff thinks fits or not and with rosters of Hopkins' recent size how do you know they don't belong - the conclusion of that paragraph is a good point in that PM does need to think about the impact on his relationship with coaches and programs that he may not have recruited as heavily being up in Ithaca. Hopefully, the coaches will realize that he had to do something and he had to address an issue that was not his creation. If I am Coach Schmidlap of the Ridgemont High lacrosse team maybe I won't be happy if Lil Johnny got encouraged to look at other opportunities or outright cut. However, maybe I will understand that the Hopkins coach would have kept everybody if the roster size was anywhere near rational and it was not his original intention to clear out anyone just because they weren't originally his guys.

The point remains - it does not seem feasible to have a team where 35-40 kids don't play competitive minutes at all. This isn't big time college football. I don't know how you prevent implosion

[flalax22]

there's a half dozen kids right now who if you read their bios and look at what they've done so far have no business on the roster anymore, probably another 12-15 who the staff doesn't think fit and that's just a start. The problem is each one of these kids comes from a program, a community, a network of younger players and how they're treated especially in the corona times of uncertainty for a new staff when the JHUML has been down for awhile is going to be remembered and either rewarded or punished by these current players hs coaches, communities etc.

While the start of your point is fairly harsh and debatable - who knows what the staff thinks fits or not and with rosters of Hopkins' recent size how do you know they don't belong - the conclusion of that paragraph is a good point in that PM does need to think about the impact on his relationship with coaches and programs that he may not have recruited as heavily being up in Ithaca. Hopefully, the coaches will realize that he had to do something and he had to address an issue that was not his creation. If I am Coach Schmidlap of the Ridgemont High lacrosse team maybe I won't be happy if Lil Johnny got encouraged to look at other opportunities or outright cut. However, maybe I will understand that the Hopkins coach would have kept everybody if the roster size was anywhere near rational and it was not his original intention to clear out anyone just because they weren't originally his guys.

The point remains - it does not seem feasible to have a team where 35-40 kids don't play competitive minutes at all. This isn't big time college football. I don't know how you prevent implosion

According to this forum PM just can’t have a team with 60+ players but Petro was going to and intentionally went in that direction.

[HopFan16]

While I certainly hope PM can still recruit well from the Baltimore area schools and the other hotbeds Petro tapped into often, even if some of those diminish somewhat, I think he will access different pipelines that Petro for whatever reason didn't seem to use as much. I'm talking Chaminade, Delbarton, Deerfield, Ward Melville, Hill Academy, Taft, etc. Lots of talented players from those places who might given Hopkins a harder look with Milliman and Junior in the fold. Annino is also a Chaminade grad so that probably can't hurt. Culver has a new coach so not sure how that is going to affect recruiting from there. One thing you definitely do not want to lose is the MIAA connection, particularly to schools like Calvert Hall, Boys Latin, and McDonogh—I know a fairly valid argument can be made that we may have over-recruited from there at the expense of some nontraditional areas but you absolutely can't just give up on it either. Way too much homegrown talent right in your backyard—kids who grow up going to Homewood and whom you'd think would be quite amenable to one day getting the chance to put on the columbia blue and black. There's no way Milliman knows those high school and club coaches as well as Petro did—he has to build up some of those relationships.

[MDlaxfan76]

While I certainly hope PM can still recruit well from the Baltimore area schools and the other hotbeds Petro tapped into often, even if some of those diminish somewhat, I think he will access different pipelines that Petro for whatever reason didn't seem to use as much. I'm talking Chaminade, Delbarton, Deerfield, Ward Melville, Hill Academy, Taft, etc. Lots of talented players from those places who might given Hopkins a harder look with Milliman and Junior in the fold. Annino is also a Chaminade grad so that probably can't hurt. Culver has a new coach so not sure how that is going to affect recruiting from there. One thing you definitely do not want to lose is the MIAA connection, particularly to schools like Calvert Hall, Boys Latin, and McDonogh—I know a fairly valid argument can be made that we may have over-recruited from there at the expense of some nontraditional areas but you absolutely can't just give up on it either. Way too much homegrown talent right in your backyard—kids who grow up going to Homewood and whom you'd think would be quite amenable to one day getting the chance to put on the columbia blue and black. There's no way Milliman knows those high school and club coaches as well as Petro did—he has to build up some of those relationships.

Wondering whether you meant to only point to those 3 MIAA schools in particular for some reason as potential fertile recruiting territory or did you mean all the MIAA schools and those were just examples? All of which are within about a half hour drive, if not closer? DC schools within an hour...

[HopFan16]

While I certainly hope PM can still recruit well from the Baltimore area schools and the other hotbeds Petro tapped into often, even if some of those diminish somewhat, I think he will access different pipelines that Petro for whatever reason didn't seem to use as much. I'm talking Chaminade, Delbarton, Deerfield, Ward Melville, Hill Academy, Taft, etc. Lots of talented players from those places who might given Hopkins a harder look with Milliman and Junior in the fold. Annino is also a Chaminade grad so that probably can't hurt. Culver has a new coach so not sure how that is going to affect recruiting from there. One thing you definitely do not want to lose is the MIAA connection, particularly to schools like Calvert Hall, Boys Latin, and McDonogh—I know a fairly valid argument can be made that we may have over-recruited from there at the expense of some nontraditional areas but you absolutely can't just give up on it either. Way too much homegrown talent right in your backyard—kids who grow up going to Homewood and whom you'd think would be quite amenable to one day getting the chance to put on the columbia blue and black. There's no way Milliman knows those high school and club coaches as well as Petro did—he has to build up some of those relationships.

Wondering whether you meant to only point to those 3 MIAA schools in particular for some reason as potential fertile recruiting territory or did you mean all the MIAA schools and those were just examples? All of which are within about a half hour drive, if not closer? DC schools within an hour...

I meant the entire area although those three have probably been in a tier unto themselves lately in the MIAA in terms of producing D1-ready prospects. St. Mary's and Loyola aren't too far behind. Obviously I include the DC-area schools—Landon, Bullis, Gonzaga, DeMatha, GPrep, etc.—among those where Milliman needs to build connections in the coming years. That said I don't expect he will recruit from there as much as Petro did. Nor should he, if he's got those aforementioned other pipelines to draw from.

[51percentcorn]

According to this forum PM just can’t have a team with 60+ players but Petro was going to and intentionally went in that direction.

Well - Petro certainly created the mess but no one said having 60+ was a great idea if he remained the coach. Perhaps he overestimated the fall out or underestimated how many would actually show up given the numbers. I would have said he needed to do the exact same thing I am saying Milliman needs to do - trim the roster

[MDlaxfan76]

While I certainly hope PM can still recruit well from the Baltimore area schools and the other hotbeds Petro tapped into often, even if some of those diminish somewhat, I think he will access different pipelines that Petro for whatever reason didn't seem to use as much. I'm talking Chaminade, Delbarton, Deerfield, Ward Melville, Hill Academy, Taft, etc. Lots of talented players from those places who might given Hopkins a harder look with Milliman and Junior in the fold. Annino is also a Chaminade grad so that probably can't hurt. Culver has a new coach so not sure how that is going to affect recruiting from there. One thing you definitely do not want to lose is the MIAA connection, particularly to schools like Calvert Hall, Boys Latin, and McDonogh—I know a fairly valid argument can be made that we may have over-recruited from there at the expense of some nontraditional areas but you absolutely can't just give up on it either. Way too much homegrown talent right in your backyard—kids who grow up going to Homewood and whom you'd think would be quite amenable to one day getting the chance to put on the columbia blue and black. There's no way Milliman knows those high school and club coaches as well as Petro did—he has to build up some of those relationships.

Wondering whether you meant to only point to those 3 MIAA schools in particular for some reason as potential fertile recruiting territory or did you mean all the MIAA schools and those were just examples? All of which are within about a half hour drive, if not closer? DC schools within an hour...

I meant the entire area although those three have probably been in a tier unto themselves lately in the MIAA in terms of producing D1-ready prospects. St. Mary's and Loyola aren't too far behind. Obviously I include the DC-area schools—Landon, Bullis, Gonzaga, DeMatha, GPrep, etc.—among those where Milliman needs to build connections in the coming years. That said I don't expect he will recruit from there as much as Petro did. Nor should he, if he's got those aforementioned other pipelines to draw from.

pretty sure that St.P and Gilman have produced quite a few D1-ready prospects too, but we can let that pass.

I have zero advice for Milliman in terms of specifically where to recruit other than, like anyone else, he should hope to land the best of those actually interested in going to school at Hopkins.

As most of these schools have some natural attraction to families within a car ride, it's likewise natural that the pool may be larger to draw upon nearby than far flung. And it's also natural that those schools nearby that produce more D1 players than those that rarely do would likewise produce more recruits potentially interested in Hopkins as well.

Frankly, I don't think Dave had a great track record of landing the best local talent, much less the best of those who wanted to stay in the area. With some notable exceptions, of course. One of whom lands next year.

But arguably far less so than in prior eras.

I think the more interesting question will be whether the recruiting dynamics for Hopkins will need to become more akin to Ivy recruiting in the next era, and whether Milliman is able to successfully sell Hopkins in that respect. I like his chances of doing so, but we'll see.

[HopFan16]

pretty sure that St.P and Gilman have produced quite a few D1-ready prospects too, but we can let that pass.

I specifically qualified that statement with "lately." By my count (according to Inside Lacrosse data), St. Paul's and Gilman are not getting quite as many guys into D1 as those other schools I mentioned (and even fewer of them qualify as high-end prospects, IMO). For instance, Calvert Hall has nearly doubled Gilman's output of D1 commits since the '18 class. CH has sent 31 to D1 schools—the majority of them to top 10 teams—while Gilman has sent 16, which includes only 1 to the ACC, 1 to the B1G (Rutgers), and 2 Ivies. St. Paul's is closer at 18, which is roughly the same as BL and St. Mary's over that time frame but short of McDonogh, LB, and CH.

[MDlaxfan76]

pretty sure that St.P and Gilman have produced quite a few D1-ready prospects too, but we can let that pass.

I specifically qualified that statement with "lately." By my count (according to Inside Lacrosse data), St. Paul's and Gilman are not getting quite as many guys into D1 as those other schools I mentioned (and even fewer of them qualify as high-end prospects, IMO). For instance, Calvert Hall has nearly doubled Gilman's output of D1 commits since the '18 class. CH has sent 31 to D1 schools—the majority of them to top 10 teams—while Gilman has sent 16, which includes only 1 to the ACC, 1 to the B1G (Rutgers), and 2 Ivies. St. Paul's is closer at 18, which is roughly the same as BL and St. Mary's over that time frame but short of McDonogh, LB, and CH.

I think you're actually out of date on Gilman's most recent 2 classes (6 Ivy: 2 Yale, 2 Harvard, 1 Brown) and what we're going to see over the next decade, but you are certainly correct that Calvert Hall has been in a big run lately. Not so sure how many will actually turn out to be top players, but I wouldn't bet against a bunch of them doing so. Some really superb teams.

[nyjay]

It's has nothing to do with particular schools in the MIAA, it has to do with getting the best kids. Yes, CHC has been on a run lately, but if you get the best kids every year from the best teams in the MIAA A conference, you're good. Doesn't matter if it's SP, SM, MCD, CHC, LB, GIL, MSJ or whoever I forgot. The old staff dd fine, possibly because of the HS connections, but also via club connections (MadLax, Crabs, Hawks, etc).

The place we've missed recently has been Long Island. It's a big area, and Chaminade and St. A's don't cover it. It's really covered via the 2 preeminent LI club teams - Team 91 and LI Express, neither of which we've been really successful with. We haven't pulled one of the best kids off of either of those teams in years. Yes, Zinn came from Express, but from the CT/Westchester version, which happens to be run by John Schreiber's (#18 in your program) dad, Chris Schreiber (class of 85 and Tom's uncle). The issue isn't and hasn't been with the HS coaches, its' been with the clubs. The Duke-91 connection (i.e Danowski-Spallina) has been the single best recruiting pipeline in the sport over the last five years. And Spallina's kid, Joey, a 2022, is unbelievable, so he'll probably end up at Duke soon too. Can't see a situation where he ends up at Hop.

My hope is that PM and JGJr will be able to pull the best kids from a much broader area, including Canada, upstate NY, CO, CA and TX, and, that, together with strong recruiting in the MIAA and DC/VA/PHL prep school world, would be able to counter our inability to get the best kids off the Island.

[51percentcorn]

There's an interesting question - one would think Petro would have been revered on the Island and yet the traditional LI to JHU pipeline has really dried up. He got one Team 91 kid in the latest class - Martin - and 4 current players from the Island - one is of course Petro's nephew - but it's a little surprising. Maybe JGJR can help pry some more out. From a lacrosse perspective, Hopkins should be attractive to someone like Spallina - JR will likely be around for at least 2-3 years, Epstein will either be gone or have one year - Grimes doesn't need to carry the ball - could step in and be the man right away.

[DocBarrister]

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Explains much.

We now resume our regular programming.

DocBarrister (dog advocate)

[HopFan16]

I think it's less that Petro struggled to recruit from LI and more that the guys he did recruit—many of whom were very highly rated coming out of high school—did not pan out the way he probably hoped.

DeSimone—top 5 player in his class, a contributor but not what we thought he'd be by this point
Giacalone—another Under-Armour All-American and top 100 player but has barely made it onto the field in his career
Keogh—another top LI kid and looked relatively promising but injuries have kept him off the field
Keneally—so far a non-factor
Gomez—non-factor, now transferring
Concannon—good player, but lots of injuries, can't really fault anyone for that
Capobianco-Hogan—didn't play, left the team
Jones—certainly had his moments but limited by size

There were others (Feit comes to mind) but I tried to keep it mostly within the last couple of years of recruits. The two big exceptions of course were Pellegrino and Crawley but since then we haven't had a truly excellent LI player despite several tries. Brett Martin and a healthy Jack Keogh might be able to change the narrative. For what it's worth I do think JGJR puts us in play for the Spallina kid, especially if Sunderland elects to go elsewhere. If you're a young attackman, the chance to learn directly from that guy while getting a world-class education would be pretty enticing IMO.

[nyjay]

I guess the point is that we've had all of two UA AAs from LI over the last 5 or so years - DeSimone and Giacalone - that's it. The other guys mentioned were all in IL's top 100, but not UA level. I don't think that's enough given the quality of the talent pool there. It just feels like we've been doing comparatively better with the MIAA/IAC schools and in some of the other hotbeds, but maybe that's not actually true.

Will really be interesting to see how how much of a recruiting draw JG actually is. Seems almost a certainty that we'll do better with the Canadians in and CO. I think anything beyond that is somewhat speculative. I know just how good he's been, but is he really that big of a hero to kids who've grown up watching NCAA lacrosse and don't play box at all?

[HopFan16]

Will really be interesting to see how how much of a recruiting draw JG actually is. Seems almost a certainty that we'll do better with the Canadians in and CO. I think anything beyond that is somewhat speculative. I know just how good he's been, but is he really that big of a hero to kids who've grown up watching NCAA lacrosse and don't play box at all?

Fair point but he's also arguably the best MLL player in history—if kids grew up having any awareness at all of professional lacrosse (field OR box) then there is no bigger name than JGJR. He's played for something like six or seven different teams throughout his pro field career so he likely has some important connections to coaches, players, families, etc. all over the country (including Long Island, where he briefly played for the Lizards). Between being from Canada, playing at UDel, playing NLL in upstate NY and Colorado, playing MLL in NY, Canada, Maryland, Denver, and Ohio, not sure there's a lacrosse figure on the planet who has covered as much ground literally and figuratively as Junior. And if you've ever met the guy you'd know pretty quickly why so many people love him. He'll be a major recruiting asset IMO—whether or not he can coach X's and O's and develop players as well as he played the game himself is a different question.

[nyjay]

All true - but there a lot of folks who love NCAA lax who just never really got into the MLL (count me among them).

[jhu06]

https://www.barstoolsports.com/blog/259 ... als-mascot

https://umdarchives.wordpress.com/2018/ ... g-testudo/

Unfortunate that maryland decided to eliminate fun by cementing the turtle. I guess they're afraid of PETA in not wanting a live one. Mild shock no one's made a run at the schwartzman crab. Would be a legendary move to yank that thing and put on their campus or for it to wind up at towson/loyola. Imagine the pc wonks going nuts over the loss of the crab and the rush to have the kids locked up for it.

[51percentcorn]

For what it's worth I do think JGJR puts us in play for the Spallina kid, especially if Sunderland elects to go elsewhere. If you're a young attackman, the chance to learn directly from that guy while getting a world-class education would be pretty enticing IMO.

Is that idle speculation on Sunderland - I thought Hop was potentially in the running?

[HopFan16]

For what it's worth I do think JGJR puts us in play for the Spallina kid, especially if Sunderland elects to go elsewhere. If you're a young attackman, the chance to learn directly from that guy while getting a world-class education would be pretty enticing IMO.

Is that idle speculation on Sunderland - I thought Hop was potentially in the running?

Yeah sorry, total speculation—just saying I think it's unlikely we'd land them both given they're both quarterback types. So in the event Sunderland decides Hopkins isn't for him then maybe we'd be in play for Spallina, or vice versa. Still assume Sunderland is the more likely one given the obvious geographic connections and the kid's apparent affinity for the Blue Jays. Before JGJR I'd have said there was no way we'd land the Spallina kid, but now that he's on staff—while still probably unlikely and Duke remains the prohibitive favorite—it wouldn't shock me if he is now more intrigued by the idea of suiting up for the Jays. If you're a superstar type player with aspirations of a long fruitful career playing lacrosse professionally, then not sure there is a better dude to be your coach/mentor/connection than Junior.

[viper]

For what it's worth I do think JGJR puts us in play for the Spallina kid, especially if Sunderland elects to go elsewhere. If you're a young attackman, the chance to learn directly from that guy while getting a world-class education would be pretty enticing IMO.

Is that idle speculation on Sunderland - I thought Hop was potentially in the running?

Yeah sorry, total speculation—just saying I think it's unlikely we'd land them both given they're both quarterback types. So in the event Sunderland decides Hopkins isn't for him then maybe we'd be in play for Spallina, or vice versa. Still assume Sunderland is the more likely one given the obvious geographic connections and the kid's apparent affinity for the Blue Jays. Before JGJR I'd have said there was no way we'd land the Spallina kid, but now that he's on staff—while still probably unlikely and Duke remains the prohibitive favorite—it wouldn't shock me if he is now more intrigued by the idea of suiting up for the Jays. If you're a superstar type player with aspirations of a long fruitful career playing lacrosse professionally, then not sure there is a better dude to be your coach/mentor/connection than Junior.

As far as speculation goes with Sunderland - the question is whether his affinity to JHU was to JHU or to Petro. I believe he plays for Koopers Lax Club - with the Petro twins. Lots of exposure to Petro the senior that way. I know of other players (not nearly in the recruiting level of Sunderland) but who were also CHC/Koopers kids and they all were very fond of Petro.