calourie wrote: ↑Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:49 pm
old salt wrote: ↑Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:13 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:05 am
old salt wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:21 pm
calourie wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:50 pm
old salt wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:42 pm
ToastDunk wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:17 pm
Forget the f’ing tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, flash bangs, et all. The President of the United States used police/military force to disrupt US citizens from expressing their 1st Amendment rights to clear a path for a photo op. Unacceptable. I don’t imagine even Old Salt will defend these actions initiated by the President. It’s un-American.
Either lift all covid related restrictions on public gatherings & social distancing or apply them to these " peaceful protests" which mask rioting, looting, arson & anarchy.
Spare me the 1st Amendment tears for this, how many of our rights have been usurped the past 2.5 mos ?
In addition to the harm these peaceful protests are doing to public safety & property damage, they're a needless public health risk that threatens to undo all that we've been sacrificing for the past 4 mos.
Hi OS. Hope you get a chance to read James Mattis' scathing criticism of Trump and his behavior not only surrounding the current protests and rioting, but actually indicting Trump's entire tenure in office. I referenced an article outlining it in my post at the top of this page. Might have some influence on your thinking about what is going on. Perhaps not. In any regard I hope you are well.
Doing weii thanks. Good to hear from you.
I disagree with Mattis that using the National Guard is militarizing the response. In the states, the Guard are under the command of the Governors. Only in DC is the Guard under the direction of the President. The Guard is not being used in any way different than they have been used in previous times of civil unrest when they deployed in support of law enforcement.
If Trump had Federalized the state Guard units, invoked the Insurrection Act, declared martial law or deployed active duty forces,
then Mattis might have a point, depending on the magnitude of the public disorder.
I thought Esper was pitch perfect today (Mattis approved him as Sec of Army, btw)
I agree with Trump's tactics in suppressing the public disorder. I agree with the underlying public message of strength that he's sending.
He's using his WWE promotional style to convey that message to his base, to make the MSM apoplectic & to make his critics look weak.
Did you
really read it?
Or is your comprehension skills and/or TDS really that bad?
I'm guessing the last. TDS.
Mattis did NOT critique Governors using the Guard...and he said, way, way, way more than what you have responded to.
Your response is a cop out.
Mattis is decrying Trump militarizing the response. All Trump has done is use the National Guard in DC, just as Governors have done in their states. He has not deployed active duty troops under the Insurrection Act to restore order or to guarantee civil rights, as previous Presidents have.
The problem as I see it , OS, is the rhetoric and posturing Trump employs, as emphasized in this view expressed by General Allen:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/retired-mari ... 43340.html
I understand your disapproval of the looting and rioting as well as the risk of a coronavirus resurgence as a result of what is now transpiring, but I feel it incumbant to point out the unhelpful and incendiary and often unconstitutional words and actions of Trump.
I understand why retired senior military officers like Mattis, Allen, Mullen, McCraven & others may disagree with the tone of Trump's rhetoric & fear that the public may think that National Guard forces are active duty forces, may not appreciate the distinction, & mistakenly think that Trump has deployed active duty forces.
It's the media's responsibility to inform the public of this critical distinction. I'm not surprised that they are contributing to the public's misunderstanding.
My contention is that it is reasonable & prudent to use Federal law enforcement & DC National Guard forces to protect the WH perimeter & to quell rioting near (& defacing of) the Federal buildings & monuments that those Federal law enforcement agencies are responsible for protecting.
Critics may disagree with Trump's style & rhetoric, & feel that his photo ops are exploiting the situation. Trump supporters maintain that he is showing strength, signalling that the WH & Federal buildings & monuments are off limits to rioters & will be defended, & demonstrating to Mayors & Governors how to effectively use their Police & National Guard.
Critics may disagree with Trump's style, but the tactics on the ground (& overhead) in DC on Mon night, were effective. If I were a resident or business owner in NYC, Philly, StL, Santa Monica, the Twin Cities & other looted cities, I'd welcome such a response in my city.
Stay safe. Be well.