Johns Hopkins 2021

[wgdsr]

Restrained. If "instruction" is code for screaming, then definitely not.

And what's this about the B1G not being a good idea? I knew old-time Hop fans were passionate, but I hadn't thought that they were as delusional as old-time Navy fans …

Yeah the B1G isn't helping or hurting these days.

The B1G partnership might have looked suspect at the outset of the undertaking years ago. Count me amongst those who were against it originally. Penn State, Ohio State, and even Rutgers are way better most years than at the B1G Lacrosse conference origin when you were potentially talking about cutting out some Top-10 opponents to fit a bunch of potentially bubble Top-20 teams onto the schedule. These are now some Top-10 or Top-20 teams, not having the freedom to schedule Duke isn't the end of the world anymore.

And given that Hopkins is doing its best to be the sub Top-20 team its beyond irrelevant what conference Hopkins does or doesn't belong to.

i would say the b1g has probably helped psu, probably osu, rutgers. they have all gotten better.

i was with you until "not having the freedom to schedule Duke isn't the end of the world anymore."
c'mon, man. the b1g, freedom, etc. had and has absolutely nothing to do with dropping duke. or not rescheduling them. hopkins has a difficult schedule, but let's not rewrite history.

[Ruffled_Feathers]

I shouldn't have chosen Duke as the [insert perennial top 5-10 team here]. That scheduling item was changed and that ship had sailed before the advent of the B1G I concur. Insert Notre Dame or any other of the Final Four weekend "regulars" from the last 5 years that aren't currently on the JHU schedule.

My bigger point is "this constrains the schedule with middling opponents that may drag down your RPI and SOS"; that is not the case at all anymore as it might have been perceived at the start of the conference.

[CU77]

Yeah the B1G isn't helping or hurting these days.

It always helps. Ask Andy Shay about the Ivy tournament and how it helped Yale reach the heights.

Without a conference tournament, you get no 2nd chance. If your early season is rough, too bad. The conf tournament gives your team something to work towards, and a way into the NCAAs that's totally under your control.

And if your other conf teams are good, it pads your SOS in case you don't win it.

And it gives you some tougher competition at the end of the season, on your way to the NCAAs.

And if you're going to get into the NCAAs anyway, it gives you a chance to have an off game at the end of the season. The year Yale won, they lost the Ivy championship to Cornell.

Not being in a conference is dumb. Petro, Baker, and Daniels understood that much.

[nyjay]

Don't understand really the anti-B1G thing at all and not sure anyone's really explained it. PSU and OSU and UM and Rutgers were always going to exist as recruiting rivals whether Hop in the conference or not. The only possible way this hurt Hop - and maybe this is what they're saying? - is that by joining the B1G, Hop elevated those other programs by making them direct rivals, whereas without being in the same conference they wouldn't be viewed as equivalent programs to Hop and Maryland? Maybe there's some truth to that. I mean when the conference started, was anyone really worried about having to play anyone else other than Maryland? It wasn't that long ago, but PSU as a juggernaut and OSU in the FF is a very new phenomena.

I think being a member of the conference has been a net plus for Hop, though probably less of a net plus for Hop than it's been for the other non-Maryland members. For Maryland, their success notwithstanding, B1G lacrosse has probably been a small net minus (Maryland will always be, and should be, an ACC program in my mind).

[CU77]

PSU as a juggernaut and OSU in the FF is a very new phenomena.

OSU was the #3 seed in 2013, 2 years before Hop joined the B1G. (But OSU lost to unseeded Cornell in the quarterfinals.)

[Typical Lax Dad]

Don't understand really the anti-B1G thing at all and not sure anyone's really explained it. PSU and OSU and UM and Rutgers were always going to exist as recruiting rivals whether Hop in the conference or not. The only possible way this hurt Hop - and maybe this is what they're saying? - is that by joining the B1G, Hop elevated those other programs by making them direct rivals, whereas without being in the same conference they wouldn't be viewed as equivalent programs to Hop and Maryland? Maybe there's some truth to that. I mean when the conference started, was anyone really worried about having to play anyone else other than Maryland? It wasn't that long ago, but PSU as a juggernaut and OSU in the FF is a very new phenomena.

I think being a member of the conference has been a net plus for Hop, though probably less of a net plus for Hop than it's been for the other non-Maryland members. For Maryland, their success notwithstanding, B1G lacrosse has probably been a small net minus (Maryland will always be, and should be, an ACC program in my mind).

Yes. It was good for the other members. From a pure resource perspective, JHU can’t invest in athletes the way a power 5 schools can. It’s a different animal. Hopkins is closer to an Ivy or Patriot League school from a philosophical student athlete perspective. At those power 5 schools, it’s athlete-student. Those players also have good outcomes buts it is a different experience. Hopkins Lacrosse is more like ND Football.

[nyjay]

There are already too many pissing matches over dumb things in this forum, but pretty sure OSU had won a grand total of 2 NCAA tournament games in its history before joining the conference. So the point stands. But can we stop? Or maybe that's what a lot of folks are here for. Again, the existence of the conference, including Hop and MD, elevated the other programs none of which are historic powers. If you don't agree with that, not sure what really to say.

Maybe I should start footnoting my posts with sourcing to avoid this nonsense. It's like listening to my kids bicker among themselves.

[jrn19]

Don't understand really the anti-B1G thing at all and not sure anyone's really explained it. PSU and OSU and UM and Rutgers were always going to exist as recruiting rivals whether Hop in the conference or not. The only possible way this hurt Hop - and maybe this is what they're saying? - is that by joining the B1G, Hop elevated those other programs by making them direct rivals, whereas without being in the same conference they wouldn't be viewed as equivalent programs to Hop and Maryland? Maybe there's some truth to that. I mean when the conference started, was anyone really worried about having to play anyone else other than Maryland? It wasn't that long ago, but PSU as a juggernaut and OSU in the FF is a very new phenomena.

I think being a member of the conference has been a net plus for Hop, though probably less of a net plus for Hop than it's been for the other non-Maryland members. For Maryland, their success notwithstanding, B1G lacrosse has probably been a small net minus (Maryland will always be, and should be, an ACC program in my mind).

Yes. It was good for the other members. From a pure resource perspective, JHU can’t invest in athletes the way a power 5 schools can. It’s a different animal. Hopkins is closer to an Ivy or Patriot League school from a philosophical student athlete perspective. At those power 5 schools, it’s athlete-student. Those players also have good outcomes buts it is a different experience. Hopkins Lacrosse is more like ND Football.

Except just because those schools *can* invest in a different way than Hopkins, doesn’t mean they actually do. Hopkins still has facilities that are top notch, still has an amazing stadium that’s as good as any. Ohio State could be the best lacrosse team in the country every year, but they’re not because, well, lacrosse is so far down the totem pole. There’s this assumption that Hopkins needs to get out bc they don’t have the resources these big schools have but those big schools still aren’t allocating the resources Hopkins is bc Lacrosse is king at Hopkins and is not at Ohio State or Michigan and only slightly more important at Penn State

[Typical Lax Dad]

Don't understand really the anti-B1G thing at all and not sure anyone's really explained it. PSU and OSU and UM and Rutgers were always going to exist as recruiting rivals whether Hop in the conference or not. The only possible way this hurt Hop - and maybe this is what they're saying? - is that by joining the B1G, Hop elevated those other programs by making them direct rivals, whereas without being in the same conference they wouldn't be viewed as equivalent programs to Hop and Maryland? Maybe there's some truth to that. I mean when the conference started, was anyone really worried about having to play anyone else other than Maryland? It wasn't that long ago, but PSU as a juggernaut and OSU in the FF is a very new phenomena.

I think being a member of the conference has been a net plus for Hop, though probably less of a net plus for Hop than it's been for the other non-Maryland members. For Maryland, their success notwithstanding, B1G lacrosse has probably been a small net minus (Maryland will always be, and should be, an ACC program in my mind).

Yes. It was good for the other members. From a pure resource perspective, JHU can’t invest in athletes the way a power 5 schools can. It’s a different animal. Hopkins is closer to an Ivy or Patriot League school from a philosophical student athlete perspective. At those power 5 schools, it’s athlete-student. Those players also have good outcomes buts it is a different experience. Hopkins Lacrosse is more like ND Football.

Except just because those schools *can* invest in a different way than Hopkins, doesn’t mean they actually do. Hopkins still has facilities that are top notch, still has an amazing stadium that’s as good as any. Ohio State could be the best lacrosse team in the country every year, but they’re not because, well, lacrosse is so far down the totem pole. There’s this assumption that Hopkins needs to get out bc they don’t have the resources these big schools have but those big schools still aren’t allocating the resources Hopkins is bc Lacrosse is king at Hopkins and is not at Ohio State or Michigan and only slightly more important at Penn State

Have you ever taken an athletic visit to OSU, Maryland, Penn State, or Michigan?

[44WeWantMore]

When the Jays joined the Big 10, I believed we could have had a better regular-season SOS with less travel against opponents I would rather see by remaining independent. However, the Conference Championship is a second bite at the apple (2015) and a real boost for the full-year SOS. Also, as conferences have grown, it is possible the JHU could have found itself with open Saturdays in late April and early May because it becomes more difficult to schedule traditional rivals.

[nyjay]

The point is this - Hop would be competing with those schools for recruits whether or not Hop was in the B1G. PSU and OSU don't have lots of resources because they're in the B1G for lacrosse, they have lots of resources because they're enormous state institutions with huge athletic budgets. So yes, Hop is a very different flavor from the other schools in its conference and at a disadvantage in the facilities/resources department. But those schools, and other just like them, would (a) still exist, (b) have lax programs and (c) be in competition for recruits, even if Hop wasn't in the conference. Other than perhaps heightening the contrast, the facts would be the same for Hop as an independent. So I'm not sure exactly how Hop being a member of the conference hurts them from a recruiting perspective. So kids would come to Hop if Michigan, OSU, PSU, RU and tourney games were replaced with games against, I don't know, Duke, ND, Army and UMBC? Don't think that changes anything.

[Typical Lax Dad]

The point is this - Hop would be competing with those schools for recruits whether or not Hop was in the B1G. PSU and OSU don't have lots of resources because they're in the B1G for lacrosse, they have lots of resources because they're enormous state institutions with huge athletic budgets. So yes, Hop is a very different flavor from the other schools in its conference and at a disadvantage in the facilities/resources department. But those schools, and other just like them, would (a) still exist, (b) have lax programs and (c) be in competition for recruits, even if Hop wasn't in the conference. Other than perhaps heightening the contrast, the facts would be the same for Hop as an independent. So I'm not sure exactly how Hop being a member of the conference hurts them from a recruiting perspective. So kids would come to Hop if Michigan, OSU, PSU, RU and tourney games were replaced with games against, I don't know, Duke, ND, Army and UMBC? Don't think that changes anything.

In the old days, there was no competition. Hopkins will be competitive. Nobody is questioning that....it’s the resources to develop athletes.

[AreaLax]

For those of you with an Instagram account Joey Epstein took over the gomadlax account today. He even took questions about the new coach.

[HopFan16]

For those of you with an Instagram account Joey Epstein took over the gomadlax account today. He even took questions about the new coach.

This was his response when asked about the coaching change:

"I was very close with Coach Petro and he will remain a close friend and mentor for me. With that being said, Coach Milliman seems like a great man and an elite coach. Has had a lot of success over the past few years with Cornell, and I'm very excited to see what we can accomplish and restore Hopkins lacrosse to where it should be."

[Typical Lax Dad]

For those of you with an Instagram account Joey Epstein took over the gomadlax account today. He even took questions about the new coach.

This was his response when asked about the coaching change:

"I was very close with Coach Petro and he will remain a close friend and mentor for me. With that being said, Coach Milliman seems like a great man and an elite coach. Has had a lot of success over the past few years with Cornell, and I'm very excited to see what we can accomplish and restore Hopkins lacrosse to where it should be."

[wgdsr]

The point is this - Hop would be competing with those schools for recruits whether or not Hop was in the B1G. PSU and OSU don't have lots of resources because they're in the B1G for lacrosse, they have lots of resources because they're enormous state institutions with huge athletic budgets. So yes, Hop is a very different flavor from the other schools in its conference and at a disadvantage in the facilities/resources department. But those schools, and other just like them, would (a) still exist, (b) have lax programs and (c) be in competition for recruits, even if Hop wasn't in the conference. Other than perhaps heightening the contrast, the facts would be the same for Hop as an independent. So I'm not sure exactly how Hop being a member of the conference hurts them from a recruiting perspective. So kids would come to Hop if Michigan, OSU, PSU, RU and tourney games were replaced with games against, I don't know, Duke, ND, Army and UMBC? Don't think that changes anything.

they just can't compete with those schools for recruits or with their facilities. in fact, i don't know how denver, loyola and the ivies do it.
plus, they have to play on sundays sometimes.

[44WeWantMore]

TIMTOWTDI

Denver does it because they have the best coach since Chic.
Loyola does it by being the Catholic school in the hotbed.
The Ivies do it by being the Ivies.
And of course, we do it with our incomparable posters here.

[Typical Lax Dad]

TIMTOWTDI

Denver does it because they have the best coach since Chic.
Loyola does it by being the Catholic school in the hotbed.
The Ivies do it by being the Ivies.
And of course, we do it with our incomparable posters here.

I am not sure I have read anywhere that Hopkins can’t be competitive. I don’t see Hopkins being any different than a lot of schools now.....Not the case 10 years ago. Also, if anyone thinks JHU has the same resources to invest in athletes as a Power 5 school they are naive. We focus on recruiting when the real focus should be player development. An UA high school all american that doesn’t develop in college will still be a HS all american. Yes you can still field competitive teams. Look at those Power 5 schools and the improvement the players make year over year. Those football / basketball training & nutrition staffs know something about athletic development. Hopkins has done more for Big Ten lacrosse than Big Ten Lacrosse has done for them.

[FlyEaglesFly]

I agree with jrn19, lacrosse is big enough at Hop to compete. If you are worried about the big 10 atmosphere visits at OSU, PSU, Mich, MD - then you are recruiting the wrong kids. You don’t need to play in that pool. If you compete for the top kids looking at Yale, Loyola, Penn, Gtown, Princeton etc... you will certainly be talented enough to beat those big 10 teams. And the history of Homewood field and Hopkins lacrosse combined with the education could help seal the deal with some of those recruits.

I actually look at a school like Rutgers as screwed in that conference. Not gonna compete with the big 10 atmosphere, and not gonna compete with Hop for others.

[Typical Lax Dad]

I agree with jrn19, lacrosse is big enough at Hop to compete. If you are worried about the big 10 atmosphere visits at OSU, PSU, Mich, MD - then you are recruiting the wrong kids. You don’t need to play in that pool. If you compete for the top kids looking at Yale, Loyola, Penn, Gtown, Princeton etc... you will certainly be talented enough to beat those big 10 teams. And the history of Homewood field and Hopkins lacrosse combined with the education could help seal the deal with some of those recruits.

I actually look at a school like Rutgers as screwed in that conference. Not gonna compete with the big 10 atmosphere, and not gonna compete with Hop for others.

I agree on the recruiting.