Ivy League

[Typical Lax Dad]

Just got Cornell email no decision before July 1st at the earliest for fall semester. Expect a $160-210 million loss for next year IF school is ON campus. If school is online in the fall expecting $400 million plus loss. Weill medicine (Cornell’s med school/Hospital) has already seen a $200 million loss as well. Even for a school like Cornell that is a huge loss and big layoffs are coming especially if online fall semester (said planning worst case scenario is 20%, with more realistic 5% and 10% scenarios). Can’t imagine some of these smaller less established schools, undoubtedly if classes are online in fall you will see a lot of schools fold.

My guess is numbers will be good enough to get students back on campus and then monitor. We let it get away from us but I believe we will have learned a lot by July 1. I am hoping kids can get back to school. You may see school breaks condensed to keep kids on campus and away from travel.

[westcoastlax]

How many cases of Coronavirus on campus in the fall is too many and leads to another round school closures and online learning?

I am getting less and less optimistic about the fall. May need to wait till a vaccine.

[Typical Lax Dad]

How many cases of Coronavirus on campus in the fall is too many and leads to another round school closures and online learning?

I am getting less and less optimistic about the fall. May need to wait till a vaccine.

We will get a better idea in the next few months. May determine it’s not so virulent that everyone needs to shelter in place and we may develop more effective treatment. We may not ever have a vaccine.

[Big Dog]

Excellent points, QS. I had made a similar observation on the "How many schools will drop lacrosse?" page, but hadn't considered the link to the Ivies' no do-over decision. If they announce online classes for fall semester, there is no way they can charge full tuition. This amounts to >$1 billion impact across the league if they cut tuition in half and room & board is eliminated. (6k students x $30k tuition/housing cut x 8 schools) That is real $ regardless of cumulative endowment size. Realistically it will be very hard for the Ivies to force kids to pay any price and attend online classes in the fall. That is not anywhere close to what those students signed up for. The Ivies will survive, but what about the vast majority of colleges that are 90% dependent on tuition? I think where this nets out is that there will be enormous pressure to open campuses in September.

Disagree on most points. Less than half of Ivy students pay sticker (most generous finaid available), so charging full tuition impacts the other half. Moreover, HYP could double the price and they''d have folks lined up to pay sticker for online classes. And yes, empty dorms are a financial hit, but heating and security for empty, locked buildings is not that expensive. No food service, no shuttle busses between campuses, minimal maintenance and other utilities.

But yes, no question that there is enormous pressure to open campuses.

[Can Opener]

Excellent points, QS. I had made a similar observation on the "How many schools will drop lacrosse?" page, but hadn't considered the link to the Ivies' no do-over decision. If they announce online classes for fall semester, there is no way they can charge full tuition. This amounts to >$1 billion impact across the league if they cut tuition in half and room & board is eliminated. (6k students x $30k tuition/housing cut x 8 schools) That is real $ regardless of cumulative endowment size. Realistically it will be very hard for the Ivies to force kids to pay any price and attend online classes in the fall. That is not anywhere close to what those students signed up for. The Ivies will survive, but what about the vast majority of colleges that are 90% dependent on tuition? I think where this nets out is that there will be enormous pressure to open campuses in September.

Disagree on most points. Less than half of Ivy students pay sticker (most generous finaid available), so charging full tuition impacts the other half. Moreover, HYP could double the price and they''d have folks lined up to pay sticker for online classes. And yes, empty dorms are a financial hit, but heating and security for empty, locked buildings is not that expensive. No food service, no shuttle busses between campuses, minimal maintenance and other utilities.

But yes, no question that there is enormous pressure to open campuses.

What do I know? I’m just a dad living in the burbs. But the President of UMich just said this year’s losses could hit $1 billion. https://www.freep.com/story/news/educat ... 166574002/

The other thing to keep in mind is that huge chunks of Ivy endowments are restricted to certain specific uses: faculty chairs, scholarships, buildings, etc. At most Ivies, less than half of their endowments are available to cover basic operating losses. Again, they are in better shape than most schools, but things will be ugly for all institutions if they don’t reconvene in September.

[Big Dog]

^^be careful interpreting the gross numbers, as they include the loss to the Hospital system for stopping elective surgeries, which is a big money-maker. (More health care dollars on the way with the bill currently being passed.) In any event, that loss is not all related to the education shut-down.

[QuakerSouth]

As an FYI

This was to be the final weekend of Ivy play. You know the final ILT participants and seeding would still be very much up in the air at this point...as we all would have expected. Would have been an epic season. I think we would have gotten three at-Larges...

[AreaLax]

GABBY ROSENZWEIG ENTERS TRANSFER PORTAL; PENN WORKING WITH SENIORS

Penn has shown a willingness to work with senior student-athletes so they can be eligible for the 2021 season

Looks like is try to keep Sr where they can.

[Typical Lax Dad]

GABBY ROSENZWEIG ENTERS TRANSFER PORTAL; PENN WORKING WITH SENIORS

Penn has shown a willingness to work with senior student-athletes so they can be eligible for the 2021 season

Looks like is try to keep Sr where they can.

That was my understanding.

[FannOLax]

As an FYI

This was to be the final weekend of Ivy play. You know the final ILT participants and seeding would still be very much up in the air at this point...as we all would have expected. Would have been an epic season. I think we would have gotten three at-Larges...

Yes, it was shaping up to be an epic season for Ivy lacrosse. In addition to the composition of the ILT (slated to have been played at Hofstra, of all places), there was the question of whether Dartmouth would notch a conference win. Oh, the season that might have been...

[bearlaxfan]

Maybe one positive to come out of this horror is that the League offices will be too busy otherwise occupied to bury the ILT in non-lax or non-Ivy locations. League Champs, or rotating schedule (yes yes include Columbia if you must).
What a waste of resources: let's grow the game in NYC! How many programs are there close by? Is the city (sorry: THE City) not in the middle of the Conn-LI-NJ-Philly nexus? Columbia already has a women's team. If they wanted a men's team they would have it. Or let Kraft do for Columbia what the Alibaba guy (that's correct, isn't it?) does for Yale.

[Farfromgeneva]

Found an old ticket stub while cleaning out my mothers house this am for a football game between Cornell and Brown from Oct 21, 1978 (I was four months old so my memory of that period is a little weak).

Anyone remember this game by chance? And Surprised that tickets were $6 back then. Seems steep for an Ivy League football game from the 70s.

[joewillie78]

Found an old ticket stub while cleaning out my mothers house this am for a football game between Cornell and Brown from Oct 21, 1978 (I was four months old so my memory of that period is a little weak).

Anyone remember this game by chance? And Surprised that tickets were $6 back then. Seems steep for an Ivy League football game from the 70s.

Im sure I was there as even though I graduated in June of 78, my girlfriend and now Wife, was class of 79, and I used to come visit her every weekend and we always went to the football games if they were home. Back then, like now actually, the football team was AWFUL. Blackmon actually may have been the coach, but thats fuzzy also. My memory of Cornell LAX is much better. Also, Students I believe got in free, but as an alum then, I probably had to pay the $6 bucks, which Im sure I had to borrow from someone.

GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

[MDlaxfan76]

Found an old ticket stub while cleaning out my mothers house this am for a football game between Cornell and Brown from Oct 21, 1978 (I was four months old so my memory of that period is a little weak).

Anyone remember this game by chance? And Surprised that tickets were $6 back then. Seems steep for an Ivy League football game from the 70s.

Im sure I was there as even though I graduated in June of 78, my girlfriend and now Wife, was class of 79, and I used to come visit her every weekend and we always went to the football games if they were home. Back then, like now actually, the football team was AWFUL. Blackmon actually may have been the coach, but thats fuzzy also. My memory of Cornell LAX is much better. Also, Students I believe got in free, but as an alum then, I probably had to pay the $6 bucks, which Im sure I had to borrow from someone.

GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

That sounds right. Students free, even some guest tickets...but others paid.
And back then, stadiums actually filled for many of the games.
It was major part of social life at Dartmouth, pretty close to the entire freshmen class sat together at football games.
Hockey games were the toughest ticket.

Not much for lax until the weather finally got nice, then field lined with fans, beer keg in one corner, etc.

[Can Opener]

Back in the early '80s, even a mediocre program like Brown would draw 12,000 fans for home games. They could be pretty raucous Bacchus affairs with fraternity tailgates kicking off at around 9:30 am. Back then you could also bring kegs into the stadium until the administration put the kibosh on that in around '84. I recall one fraternity getting creative and building a throne for their house President and carrying him into the student section wearing a bed sheet robe. It was actually a pretty well-designed Trojan horse that concealed a full keg under his seat. I think stadium security looked the other way as a tip of the cap to his cleverness. The days of 12,000 people watching middling local college football ended with a 1984 Supreme Court ruling that broke up the NCAA's stranglehold on TV rights. In one season, we went from having two or three games to choose from on TV to about 20. This had the unintended consequence of putting butts on couches instead of in D1AA stadiums.

[Farfromgeneva]

So your saying my father brought me to a keg party in Ithaca when I was 4mo old?

Sounds about right. We are Irish.

[faircornell]

This may be old news, but IL has reported that Michael Sowers will be going to Duke (pending admission) to play for the Blue Devils in 2021.

[Chousnake]

Found an old ticket stub while cleaning out my mothers house this am for a football game between Cornell and Brown from Oct 21, 1978 (I was four months old so my memory of that period is a little weak).

Anyone remember this game by chance? And Surprised that tickets were $6 back then. Seems steep for an Ivy League football game from the 70s.

I was a sophomore then and was at that game because I went to just about every football, hockey, and lax game when I was at Cornell. Bob Blackman was the coach. In 77 they won one game - vs Columbia who won none, I think. The 78 team was pretty good with Joe Holland at RB having a great year. They lost to Brown 21-13 (I looked it up) after opening the season 3-0.

Also, the games were well attended. Back then, the students all sat in the small stands at Schoellkopf opposite the crescent. Those stands are not there anymore. Attending football games was a big fraternity event with beer balls under the stands and "passing" people up and down the stands. It was a different era then with 18 being the legal drinking age.

[faircornell]

Found an old ticket stub while cleaning out my mothers house this am for a football game between Cornell and Brown from Oct 21, 1978 (I was four months old so my memory of that period is a little weak).

Anyone remember this game by chance? And Surprised that tickets were $6 back then. Seems steep for an Ivy League football game from the 70s.

I was a sophomore then and was at that game because I went to just about every football, hockey, and lax game when I was at Cornell. Bob Blackman was the coach. In 77 they won one game - vs Columbia who won none, I think. The 78 team was pretty good with Joe Holland at RB having a great year. They lost to Brown 21-13 (I looked it up) after opening the season 3-0.

Also, the games were well attended. Back then, the students all sat in the small stands at Schoellkopf opposite the crescent. Those stands are not there anymore. Attending football games was a big fraternity event with beer balls under the stands and "passing" people up and down the stands. It was a different era then with 18 being the legal drinking age.

Cornell was very slow at providing free student admission to games (I am not sure when or if they did). In those days (and I believe still, somehow) many people purchased season "coupon books" that were exchanged for tickets, so the actual cost may have been lower. Also, in Ithaca, there was not much to do back then, so games (especially in the Marinaro years) were extremely well attended and drew people from around upstate New York. Ticket revenue from Football and Ice Hockey paid for the entire athletic budget for many years.

[Chousnake]

Found an old ticket stub while cleaning out my mothers house this am for a football game between Cornell and Brown from Oct 21, 1978 (I was four months old so my memory of that period is a little weak).

Anyone remember this game by chance? And Surprised that tickets were $6 back then. Seems steep for an Ivy League football game from the 70s.

I was a sophomore then and was at that game because I went to just about every football, hockey, and lax game when I was at Cornell. Bob Blackman was the coach. In 77 they won one game - vs Columbia who won none, I think. The 78 team was pretty good with Joe Holland at RB having a great year. They lost to Brown 21-13 (I looked it up) after opening the season 3-0.

Also, the games were well attended. Back then, the students all sat in the small stands at Schoellkopf opposite the crescent. Those stands are not there anymore. Attending football games was a big fraternity event with beer balls under the stands and "passing" people up and down the stands. It was a different era then with 18 being the legal drinking age.

Cornell was very slow at providing free student admission to games (I am not sure when or if they did). In those days (and I believe still, somehow) many people purchased season "coupon books" that were exchanged for tickets, so the actual cost may have been lower. Also, in Ithaca, there was not much to do back then, so games (especially in the Marinaro years) were extremely well attended and drew people from around upstate New York. Ticket revenue from Football and Ice Hockey paid for the entire athletic budget for many years.

Now what budget do they have? They need to open up the purse strings and keep a lax coach if they want to continue as a top program. This is so disheartening.........