All things CoronaVirus

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01098-x

I posted this Swedish interview the other day. The head health guy in Sweden is being pretty open about what he is doing and why. He still thinks it is the right plan.

He's waaaaaay behind at halftime. Up to 192 deaths per million pop -- that is 3X Denmark and 6X Norway. UW is projecting Sweden is still three weeks from the peak. UW projecting 9,200 deaths for Sweden -- which would be 900 deaths per million pop. For reference, Italy is currently at 415.

He's betting that he'll win in the second half -- because Sweden will have developed herd immunity sooner than other countries. Very much TBD.

Yes. It remains to be seen. The philosophy seems to be, "we will let some of these old people die off and hopefully the younger people will develop some immunity". The question seems to be what is an acceptable number of deaths?... for the greater good.

the conversation was sweden. you're either conflating or contrasting the 2 countries' political moves, making another argument,or whatevs i can't follow.
again, don't need to. peace.

That seemed to be the Swedish view based on that article..... Old people need to be more careful. They are going to let the virus run it’s course. They are not going to shut down the country. Seems like they have decided that the more vulnerable population is what it is...more vulnerable. We will see if it works. I was initially of that mind....shelter the old people and let everyone else move about. But I discovered that a number of people 55 and under end up in the hospital and a chunk of them die. Changed my opinion. If you go to the hospital in Sweden with COVID 19, there is a 75% chance you won’t be leaving. Our numbers are better.

going by what they've said recently on miscalculating and put in place originally, there was supposed to be a big emphasis on isolating the elderly and vulnerable. the virus either was more severe than they anticipated or more easily slipped thru their cracks there.
they've also admitted more testing would have helped in that regard, particularly with the elderly, and are supposedly ramping that.

not knowing exactly what level of social contact is there vs. other places like ours, i still would've guessed their case numbers would be growing a lot more rapidly than they are by now. immunity? lack of enough tests? we'll see. if it's the former (and there is such a thing), their outcomes may not be nearly as bad as predicted. and wrapped sooner.
[/quote]

I am not sure the numbers we’ll be as bad as anyone predicted. If we end up with 60k dead by May 15th. That will be a win. Early on, I posted a death rate of 1% or lower here would be a win. This is worse than the flu but may not be catastrophic. Social distancing has “likely” helped. The number of dead bodies in the short amount of time is a barometer of how lethal the virus can be and I believe we have an undercount on deaths as well as those that have already been exposed. We learn more as we go. This virus could not have been avoided but we are paying the price for lack of preparation.

[wgdsr]

The philosophy seems to be, "we will let some of these old people die off and hopefully the younger peopl

the conversation was sweden. you're either conflating or contrasting the 2 countries' political moves, making another argument,or whatevs i can't follow.
again, don't need to. peace.

Those thoughts have been echoed here in the USA, discussed before on this forum, and reflects the type of prevailing right wing delusionalism that is so typical of Republican ideology. I understand there is an ultra right wing group in Sweden called Sweden Democrats {sic} that subscribes to much of their delusionalism. Not sure, however, that they have declared a willingness to sacrifice old people for the greater "good" as they see it. But may check on it some day soon.

brooklyn... the conversation was sweden. to me, you had it made it sound like it was republicans/similar republican idealogues in sweden who had initiated their policy, then equating it to exterminating old folks.

i merely pointed out that sweden's most influential governing group (including the pm) are in fact social democrats, and are actually called the sweden social democratic party (capitalized). been that way for over 100 years. they enacted the policies effectively.

have at the rest with comparing them to republicans in the usa, this forum, germany, wherever.

[ggait]

WGDSR is right.

The ruling party in Sweden is center-left. So the resistance to full lockdown (and the related economic damage) is not coming from the right like it is here in the USA. So somewhat ironic that the Hannity/Carlson/Ingraham crowd are rep-ing a high tax social democrat operation so hard.

Most accurately, though, is that the Swedish shots are really being called by the non-partisan government health officials. What we'd call the bureaucracy or deep state. Those shots may/may not turn out to be correct, but they're not really partisan.

That's the main reason why Sweden (a very high trust country) is actually able to run its current experiment. If your death rate was running 3-6X worse than your close neighbor peer countries, the politicians (if they were making the calls) would have been forced to abandon the strategy a long time ago.

[MDlaxfan76]

Ticked Off Vic: "Patriots" and Nazi Flags







And it comes as no surprise that the USA's self anointed "Chosen" supports those radical lunatics.

Everyone still love this guy??

[Typical Lax Dad]

WGDSR is right.

The ruling party in Sweden is center-left. So the resistance to full lockdown (and the related economic damage) is not coming from the right like it is here in the USA. So somewhat ironic that the Hannity/Carlson/Ingraham crowd are rep-ing a high tax social democrat operation so hard.

Most accurately, though, is that the Swedish shots are really being called by the non-partisan government health officials. What we'd call the bureaucracy or deep state. Those shots may/may not turn out to be correct, but they're not really partisan.

That's the main reason why Sweden (a very high trust country) is actually able to run its current experiment. If your death rate was running 3-6X worse than your close neighbor peer countries, the politicians (if they were making the calls) would have been forced to abandon the strategy a long time ago.

The article I read didn’t strike me as political.

[Cooter]

I think in shutting a state down for a period of a month, the state legislature should be allowed to vote on it.

Every survey taken on the matter reveals that the majority says keep the mitigation safeguards in place. Because of that, most likely the legislatures will vote for their continuation.

I don't know that I really trust surveys that much.

[njbill]

I'd be remiss if I didn't pump my favorite stock, Gilead, at least once a day.

The second clinical trial had very promising results too! Man, I tell you, the free market is a beautiful thing.

https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news ... t-covid-19

The savior drug, run by a dude that House Democrats on the house whatever committee tried to shame for being smart. Thank god for American ingenuity. Let's roll. And...

Back to work!

Pete, the stock is still down 4.5% from its high last week. Pretty significant drop in a few trading days.

All of the FanLax posters who, like me, hang on your every word for financial advice have lost a lot of money.

https://www.google.com/search?client=sa ... gws-wiz-hp

[a fan]

PSA: those of you stuck at home who want to make few bucks, a friend is a professor at SUNY Bing.,,,,,,

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[MDlaxfan76]

I think in shutting a state down for a period of a month, the state legislature should be allowed to vote on it.

Every survey taken on the matter reveals that the majority says keep the mitigation safeguards in place. Because of that, most likely the legislatures will vote for their continuation.

I don't know that I really trust surveys that much.

good one.
Pretty sure the only 'survey' the R's who are squawking would care about is their specific districts and only what the most rapid of their base believe.

[Brooklyn]

brooklyn... the conversation was sweden. to me, you had it made it sound like it was republicans/similar republican idealogues in sweden who had initiated their policy, then equating it to exterminating old folks.
i merely pointed out that sweden's most influential governing group (including the pm) are in fact social democrats, and are actually called the sweden social democratic party (capitalized). been that way for over 100 years. they enacted the policies effectively.
have at the rest with comparing them to republicans in the usa, this forum, germany, wherever.

Yes, I got your point. I was just adding that it was not unique and that it is evident here as well.

[old salt]

in that Fla. poll:

Biden is up 52-42 among 65+ year old voters.

No sweat -- they'll screw up their ballots.

[Brooklyn]

I don't know that I really trust surveys that much.

The other day someone in the forum said the current CV19 crisis (one largely attributable to tRUMP's stupidity) has and will continue to hurt the Moron-In-Chief. I countered that while this may seem so, in fact, the current surveys that I read did not indicate that at all. On the contrary, in one state (I believe it was Pennsylvania) that idiot continues to have a majority of the state's support. Don't know how this is possible but that's what the survey indicated. As Will Rogers said, all I know is what I read in the newspapers.

[old salt]

Also in general, I expect Swedes are healthier than say Italians. I bet that fact weighed in favor of their decision/approach.

Fredo is holding on line 2 for you, and he doesn’t sound happy.

I know it's stereotypical, generalized, and probably not PC to many here but the fact remains, Swedes are a pragmatic lot living a pragmatic culture as compared...

Put another way, Greta Thunberg is Swedish, not Italian. Is that worse?

Ingrid Bergman vs. Sophia Loren. Debate among yourselves.

It's my Dennis Miller theory of homosexuality shot through the movie "Boy and the Dolphin." If you're a 12-year-old boy and you're watching the movie "Boy and a Dolphin" and a 27-year-old Sofia Loren crawls up out of the Aegean Sea after sponge diving, she's standing there in the deck of the boat in a see-through gauze top, rivulets of water dripping off her torso onto the deck of the boat. If you're a 12-year-old boy and you're watching that and you still want to make it with the captain of the boat, you're gay.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0050208/me ... 1671141376

This wasn't Sophia, but was still a good litmus test for a 12 yr old.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2eIC4YiEq8

For this 12 year old there were 2 women that gave me the Chris Matthews tingle down my leg. Top of the list... Raquel Welch and she is still hot. Not far behind... Barbara Eden... I did dream of Jeanie.

My mom was scandalized by Solomon & Sheba -- she took our Sunday School class to see it, expecting to see a Bible story.

I had escort duty for Barbara Eden when the Bob Hope USO Xmas show visited our base in 1987. Also drank beer & shot pool with Connie Stevens & her daughters. Both ladies aged well. Lee Greenwood asked me for my leather flight jacket. A fun group on the last stop in their tour. They weren't sched to visit us, but diverted to our base when the crosswinds were too great to land & refuel on the Azores. It was the Sun before Xmas, we got a 4 hr advance warning of their arrival & still managed to host them & pulled off a show in the base theater.

[jhu72]

Not exactly new, but good to keep in mind.

[Cooter]

I don't know that I really trust surveys that much.

The other day someone in the forum said the current CV19 crisis (one largely attributable to tRUMP's stupidity) has and will continue to hurt the Moron-In-Chief. I countered that while this may seem so, in fact, the current surveys that I read did not indicate that at all. On the contrary, in one state (I believe it was Pennsylvania) that idiot continues to have a majority of the state's support. Don't know how this is possible but that's what the survey indicated. As Will Rogers said, all I know is what I read in the newspapers.

I'm not sure that I feel Trump is as culpable in the coronavirus crisis as you do.
I like that he seems desirous at getting the economy started again.

[Brooklyn]

I'm not sure that I feel Trump is as culpable in the coronavirus crisis as you do.
I like that he seems desirous at getting the economy started again.

culpable - responsibility always goes to the top. His cries about "I inherited a mess" is total bullshtt


economy - he can always jump start it by calling in the $31 trillion hidden away in foreign tax shelters. That will energize the economy, end the nation's debt, and ultimately finance the rebuilding of the infrastructure.

His demands that states with Democratic governors be "liberated" was an utterly stupid thing to say. Where was the Fox network to condemn his failure to do the same to Republican run states?

[a fan]

I like that he seems desirous at getting the economy started again.

I agree that he's not as culpable on the virus as some critics say. But I completely disagree that he wants to get the economy going....because he's certainly not acting as if there's any hurry to get things moving.


Have a look at his own criteria for Opening America that HE approved.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/openingamerica/#criteria

Do we have enough tests, PPE, thermometers...and a plan to monitor and isolate those who have it?

No, no, no, and no.

So.....we wait. Wait for someone in our government to do what we pay them to do.

And in this case, that means Trump.

[Brooklyn]

Not exactly new, but good to keep in mind.

The writer asks, "Is there a way to do livestock farming that diminishes the threat of zoonotic disease? And perhaps, in the process, also diminishes other problems with industrialized farming, like the impact on climate change and cruelty to animals?

The answer is yes. We can absolutely have a meat production system that is better for human health, the climate, and animal welfare — if we’re willing to abandon factory farming.''


Taken out of context, this is too extreme. Thankfully, the writer says more regulation, healthier work conditions, better sanitary standards, and more practical procedure rather than to abandon meat production entirely constitutes the real solution. I sure as heck am all for that.

[Brooklyn]

I like that he seems desirous at getting the economy started again.

I agree that he's not as culpable on the virus as some critics say. But I completely disagree that he wants to get the economy going....because he's certainly not acting as if there's any hurry to get things moving.


Have a look at his own criteria for Opening America that HE approved.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/openingamerica/#criteria

Do we have enough tests, PPE, thermometers...and a plan to monitor and isolate those who have it?

No, no, no, and no.

So.....we wait. Wait for someone in our government to do what we pay them to do.

And in this case, that means Trump.

The socialist health care systems in China, South Korea, and Germany managed to provide the safeguards which reduced the outbreak of the plague. Trump and his delusional disciples all told us that tRUMPcare could succeed where Obamacare care couldn't. To this day I have heard one word of criticism about his failed tRUMPnoncare system from those righties.

[Cooter]

The socialist health care systems in China, South Korea, and Germany managed to provide the safeguards which reduced the outbreak of the plague. Trump and his delusional disciples all told us that tRUMPcare could succeed where Obamacare care couldn't. To this day I have heard one word of criticism about his failed tRUMPnoncare system from those righties.

Is the plague upon us now too?