All things CoronaVirus

[6ftstick]

So, if Trump somehow manages to stay in power, what will prevent Trump and his cultists from beginning to kill their perceived enemies?

Shame?

Remorse?

Compassion?

Empathy?

DocBarrister

Anyone else find this post as the new bottom here.

Let's just say that I found calourie's and Salty's exchange to be heartwarming, both your and Doc's posts not so much.

Doc, I think this particular post belonged on Orange Duce.
Frankly, I agree with your tough view of Trump's authoritarian tendencies, his lack of empathy, his his shameless dishonesty, and the cult-like behavior of many of his supporters. However, let me make a plea that this thread be devoted more to sharing information about COVID-19, measures being taken to battle the pandemic, challenges to those efforts, etc. The study about hydoxychloroquine is very relevant and the adverse impact of hyping this drug is relevant, including the point that stupidity and dishonesty and incompetence is costing lives. As well as Barr's quite outrageous threats. But the projections about future authoritarian behavior in a second term better fits on the other thread.

Just my opinion of course.

There are no hard lines between subject matter any more. Trump’s deficiencies, usually appropriate subject matter under “Orange Deuce,” are almost certainly the single greatest factor in what we’re seeing in the coronavirus pandemic. Trump prioritized his own political fortunes over public health. He’s now doing it again by making a huge gamble and pressing for an early reopening of the economy. He is literally gambling with the lives of tens of thousands of Americans, just as he did in January-March.

I hear what you’re saying, but how can we possibly keep the subjects separate?

Trump’s apparent willingness to sacrifice some American lives for his political survival is perhaps the most disturbing thing I have ever seen in American politics. It is all tied together with his response to the pandemic. “Orange Deuce” and the coronavirus pandemic have become intricately, irreversibly intertwined.

DocBarrister

Yes, that point is one you've made dozens of times...and for which Trump and crew keep providing more ammunition, almost daily. I get it, and I'm not saying that the point shouldn't be made here when there's a new reason to do so.

But the musings about where his authoritarianism, etc could take us in a second term really isn't virus related. That part has a perfect home in Orange Duce.

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

The only fascists I can see are democrat governors and mayors reaching for more and more control. They even admit OUT LOUD give no consideration to the Bill of Rights when they MANDATE. Snitching gets rewards!

Protect and defend the constitution—who cares about that sh*t—its ABOVE their pay grade.

[wgdsr]

It is sometimes difficult to understand the deficiencies in morals, ethics, character, and intellect that would permit a person to become a Trump cultist, but the entire hydroxychloroquine fiasco is puzzling even in that context.

Fox News has fallen out of love with hydroxychloroquine. After weeks of unrelenting coverage hyping the antimalarial drug as a potential game-changing treatment for the coronavirus, the network has all but stopped mentioning it on its airwaves. So has President Donald Trump.

The [quiet] abandonment of hydroxychloroquine comes as studies indicate it is not an effective treatment against the coronavirus. A French study found last week that the drug does not help patients with the virus. And on Tuesday, a study of hundreds of patents at US Veterans Health Administration medical centers found that patients who took hydroxychloroquine were no less likely to need ventilation and had higher death rates than those who didn't take the drug.

"Will anyone who breathlessly pitched hydroxychloroquine as a miracle drug show a modicum of regret or even self-awareness over this? Doubtful," The Daily Beast's Sam Stein predicted. "More likely is they'll ignore the study entirely." Stein appears to have been right on the money.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/22/media/fo ... index.html

As with any cult, dishonesty is key. We have seen such dishonesty from Trump cultists on our own little forum.

What is truly dangerous about the Trump cult is their shamelessness. The hydroxychloroquine fiasco is just a small example. Trump’s willful recklessness, incompetence, and malignant narcissism has already resulted in the needless deaths of tens of thousands of Americans. Yet, do we even sense any remorse or shame from those who have consistently supported Trump? I don’t.

Which begs this question ... what if Trump somehow steals the election this November and eventually gains the authoritarian power that he seems to admire so much in Vladimir Putin, Xi Jinping, or Kim Jong Un? What if he and his cultists actually start killing people intentionally, like they’re already beginning to do during this pandemic? If Trump starts making people like Barack Obama, Nancy Pelosi, and various reporters disappear, will his cultists show any remorse or shame?

Trump has already corrupted the Department of Justice, the State Department, and the Office of the Director of National Intelligence. He has been doing his best to corrupt the Department of Defense. He long ago corrupted and subjugated the Republican Party.

Trump already believes he can get away with shooting someone on Fifth Avenue. He apparently thinks he can get away with killing tens of thousands of Americans during the pandemic. His gun-toting cultists are apparently willing to trade people’s lives for profit (“There are more important things than living.”).

So, if Trump somehow manages to stay in power, what will prevent Trump and his cultists from beginning to kill their perceived enemies?

Shame?

Remorse?

Compassion?

Empathy?

We see their shamelessness in all the “smaller” things. The hydroxychloroquine fiasco is just one example. Even on our own forum, we have seen his cultists argue that it would be worth some American deaths to open up commerce. They continue to support Trump, sometimes while denying they are supporting him.

And all with a degree of shamelessness that is difficult to understand. What will that shamelessness empower them to do next?

DocBarrister

is it even possible this post could be more hypocritical?

see mods,i didn't even call him a hypocrite.

I don't want to go down a rabbit hole, but what is doc saying that is hypocritical?
I think part of it belongs on a different thread, but I'm not following your point....yet.

"study" that gives nothing more than a data point. info collected on patients that had utilized different treatment options.
not a randomized double blind trial, not even a trial at all.
300 patients go into a hospital. 100 of them don't progress to warrant resort treatment options. they recover nicely with normal protocols. vast vast majority are released. thankfully.
other 200 require or at least by a dr's measure need some other intervention to be tried. hcq or hcq + z are initiated. not as many recover.

comorbitities also slanted.

ipso facto hcq is killing people, push own political agenda. conveniently forget that many arguments were made by author that non-legitimate trials/studies were pushing a political agenda for opposition. i can only give some benefit of the doubt that he didn't bother to read the study, though i'm not sure if that's better. the media has done it as well.

how possible, or rather likely, is this "study" not really indicative of anything at all given its construct? but let's headline what works for my side, and throw in the garden variety invective. advancing the discussion fo sho.

rinse and repeat.

[Oldbarndog]

"Beware of men with theories that explain everything. Trust those who approach the world with humility and cautious insight."

Mark Bowden
From: Hue 1968

An excellent read. As good or better than Blackhawk Down

[MDlaxfan76]

So, if Trump somehow manages to stay in power, what will prevent Trump and his cultists from beginning to kill their perceived enemies?

Shame?

Remorse?

Compassion?

Empathy?

DocBarrister

Anyone else find this post as the new bottom here.

Let's just say that I found calourie's and Salty's exchange to be heartwarming, both your and Doc's posts not so much.

Doc, I think this particular post belonged on Orange Duce.
Frankly, I agree with your tough view of Trump's authoritarian tendencies, his lack of empathy, his his shameless dishonesty, and the cult-like behavior of many of his supporters. However, let me make a plea that this thread be devoted more to sharing information about COVID-19, measures being taken to battle the pandemic, challenges to those efforts, etc. The study about hydoxychloroquine is very relevant and the adverse impact of hyping this drug is relevant, including the point that stupidity and dishonesty and incompetence is costing lives. As well as Barr's quite outrageous threats. But the projections about future authoritarian behavior in a second term better fits on the other thread.

Just my opinion of course.

There are no hard lines between subject matter any more. Trump’s deficiencies, usually appropriate subject matter under “Orange Deuce,” are almost certainly the single greatest factor in what we’re seeing in the coronavirus pandemic. Trump prioritized his own political fortunes over public health. He’s now doing it again by making a huge gamble and pressing for an early reopening of the economy. He is literally gambling with the lives of tens of thousands of Americans, just as he did in January-March.

I hear what you’re saying, but how can we possibly keep the subjects separate?

Trump’s apparent willingness to sacrifice some American lives for his political survival is perhaps the most disturbing thing I have ever seen in American politics. It is all tied together with his response to the pandemic. “Orange Deuce” and the coronavirus pandemic have become intricately, irreversibly intertwined.

DocBarrister

Yes, that point is one you've made dozens of times...and for which Trump and crew keep providing more ammunition, almost daily. I get it, and I'm not saying that the point shouldn't be made here when there's a new reason to do so.

But the musings about where his authoritarianism, etc could take us in a second term really isn't virus related. That part has a perfect home in Orange Duce.

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

I do get the connection, but really do suggest that Orange Duce is the place to go down that line of argument.

[DMac]

If you guys are going to post videos, can they be more like 2 minutes max?

Sorry everything can't be a two or three minute sound bite for you. I know you have 45 minutes to watch that, just take the 45 minutes of bullschidt you hand us all daily and watch that entire video instead, we can all live without you for that long. It explains volumes about your ilk and why it's impossible to have any sort of reasonable discussion. I am sincerely interested in your opinion of the video and what in there you disagree with. Looking forward to your response.
Here, I'll post the video for you right here so you don't even have to go back and look for it.
You're welcome, now sit back and enjoy (suggest you watch it alone, this one's going to get you all excited).

[Peter Brown]

If you guys are going to post videos, can they be more like 2 minutes max?

Sorry everything can't be a two or three minute sound bite for you. I know you have 45 minutes to watch that, just take the 45 minutes of bullschidt you hand us all daily and watch that entire video instead, we can all live without you for that long. It explains volumes about your ilk and why it's impossible to have any sort of reasonable discussion. I am sincerely interested in your opinion of the video and what in there you disagree with. Looking forward to your response.
Here, I'll post the video for you right here so you don't even have to go back and look for it.
You're welcome, now sit back and enjoy (suggest you watch it alone, this one's going to get you all excited).

you hand us 'Us'. "your ilk".

Such tolerance from the left...

Reminds me:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... s-should-/

[MDlaxfan76]

It is sometimes difficult to understand the deficiencies in morals, ethics, character, and intellect that would permit a person to become a Trump cultist, but the entire hydroxychloroquine fiasco is puzzling even in that context.

Fox News has fallen out of love with hydroxychloroquine. After weeks of unrelenting coverage hyping the antimalarial drug as a potential game-changing treatment for the coronavirus, the network has all but stopped mentioning it on its airwaves. So has President Donald Trump.

The [quiet] abandonment of hydroxychloroquine comes as studies indicate it is not an effective treatment against the coronavirus. A French study found last week that the drug does not help patients with the virus. And on Tuesday, a study of hundreds of patents at US Veterans Health Administration medical centers found that patients who took hydroxychloroquine were no less likely to need ventilation and had higher death rates than those who didn't take the drug.

"Will anyone who breathlessly pitched hydroxychloroquine as a miracle drug show a modicum of regret or even self-awareness over this? Doubtful," The Daily Beast's Sam Stein predicted. "More likely is they'll ignore the study entirely." Stein appears to have been right on the money.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/22/media/fo ... index.html

As with any cult, dishonesty is key. We have seen such dishonesty from Trump cultists on our own little forum.

What is truly dangerous about the Trump cult is their shamelessness. The hydroxychloroquine fiasco is just a small example. Trump’s willful recklessness, incompetence, and malignant narcissism has already resulted in the needless deaths of tens of thousands of Americans. Yet, do we even sense any remorse or shame from those who have consistently supported Trump? I don’t.

Which begs this question ... what if Trump somehow steals the election this November and eventually gains the authoritarian power that he seems to admire so much in Vladimir Putin, Xi Jinping, or Kim Jong Un? What if he and his cultists actually start killing people intentionally, like they’re already beginning to do during this pandemic? If Trump starts making people like Barack Obama, Nancy Pelosi, and various reporters disappear, will his cultists show any remorse or shame?

Trump has already corrupted the Department of Justice, the State Department, and the Office of the Director of National Intelligence. He has been doing his best to corrupt the Department of Defense. He long ago corrupted and subjugated the Republican Party.

Trump already believes he can get away with shooting someone on Fifth Avenue. He apparently thinks he can get away with killing tens of thousands of Americans during the pandemic. His gun-toting cultists are apparently willing to trade people’s lives for profit (“There are more important things than living.”).

So, if Trump somehow manages to stay in power, what will prevent Trump and his cultists from beginning to kill their perceived enemies?

Shame?

Remorse?

Compassion?

Empathy?

We see their shamelessness in all the “smaller” things. The hydroxychloroquine fiasco is just one example. Even on our own forum, we have seen his cultists argue that it would be worth some American deaths to open up commerce. They continue to support Trump, sometimes while denying they are supporting him.

And all with a degree of shamelessness that is difficult to understand. What will that shamelessness empower them to do next?

DocBarrister

is it even possible this post could be more hypocritical?

see mods,i didn't even call him a hypocrite.

I don't want to go down a rabbit hole, but what is doc saying that is hypocritical?
I think part of it belongs on a different thread, but I'm not following your point....yet.

"study" that gives nothing more than a data point. info collected on patients that had utilized different treatment options.
not a randomized double blind trial, not even a trial at all.
300 patients go into a hospital. 100 of them don't progress to warrant resort treatment options. they recover nicely with normal protocols. vast vast majority are released. thankfully.
other 200 require or at least by a dr's measure need some other intervention to be tried. hcq or hcq + z are initiated. not as many recover.

comorbitities also slanted.

ipso facto hcq is killing people, push own political agenda. conveniently forget that many arguments were made by author that non-legitimate trials/studies were pushing a political agenda for opposition. i can only give some benefit of the doubt that he didn't bother to read the study, though i'm not sure if that's better. the media has done it as well.

how possible, or rather likely, is this "study" not really indicative of anything at all given its construct? but let's headline what works for my side, and throw in the garden variety invective. advancing the discussion fo sho.

rinse and repeat.

ahhh, thanks.

Yes, this study was not a blind trial, not 100% dispositive, just refutes the 'anecdotal' BS suggesting miracle cure.
Fair?

I think doc's fundamental point (he'll correct or expand I'm sure!) is that the messaging to folks not to worry about the virus, no big deal, cures are already available, etc, etc, leads to behaviors that do get people killed. Taken as a whole, I think that's correct.

and why that's important is because it's an ongoing problem, not just past tense.

[DMac]

If you guys are going to post videos, can they be more like 2 minutes max?

Sorry everything can't be a two or three minute sound bite for you. I know you have 45 minutes to watch that, just take the 45 minutes of bullschidt you hand us all daily and watch that entire video instead, we can all live without you for that long. It explains volumes about your ilk and why it's impossible to have any sort of reasonable discussion. I am sincerely interested in your opinion of the video and what in there you disagree with. Looking forward to your response.
Here, I'll post the video for you right here so you don't even have to go back and look for it.
You're welcome, now sit back and enjoy (suggest you watch it alone, this one's going to get you all excited).

you hand us 'Us'. "your ilk".

Such tolerance from the left...

Reminds me:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... s-should-/

Never mind the petty bullschidt, just click on the video and watch it, you could already be ten minutes in. I want to know what you think of it.

[wgdsr]

i'll leave you to defend him and his methods.

[Peter Brown]

If you guys are going to post videos, can they be more like 2 minutes max?

Sorry everything can't be a two or three minute sound bite for you. I know you have 45 minutes to watch that, just take the 45 minutes of bullschidt you hand us all daily and watch that entire video instead, we can all live without you for that long. It explains volumes about your ilk and why it's impossible to have any sort of reasonable discussion. I am sincerely interested in your opinion of the video and what in there you disagree with. Looking forward to your response.
Here, I'll post the video for you right here so you don't even have to go back and look for it.
You're welcome, now sit back and enjoy (suggest you watch it alone, this one's going to get you all excited).

you hand us 'Us'. "your ilk".

Such tolerance from the left...

Reminds me:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... s-should-/

Never mind the petty bullschidt, just click on the video and watch it, you could already be ten minutes in. I want to know what you think of it.

It probably would not be wise to hold your breath.

[MDlaxfan76]

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

Trump is such a fascist! Except for these Democratic governors of course!

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/ ... t-of-hand/

I read the NR opinion piece (someone needs to tell the author that POTUS is the one who keeps calling it a WAR and the HIDDEN ENEMY).

Serious question to you and 6ft.

Exactly what Constitutionally guaranteed rights under the Bill of Rights are being abridged during this period?

I'm not seeing what 'rights' I've given up. I'm not seeing what rights the protesters in Michigan had taken away from them, either.

Please be specific as to which Amendment and the specific right abridged.

Presumably, that's a 'softball' question. You should be able to crush it out of the park.

[Brooklyn]

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

Funny thing is that while Dump proclaims himself "the Chosen" with total authority, dim witted delusional Tea Bagging right wingers in Michigan equate their governor with Hitler:

[DMac]

If you guys are going to post videos, can they be more like 2 minutes max?

Sorry everything can't be a two or three minute sound bite for you. I know you have 45 minutes to watch that, just take the 45 minutes of bullschidt you hand us all daily and watch that entire video instead, we can all live without you for that long. It explains volumes about your ilk and why it's impossible to have any sort of reasonable discussion. I am sincerely interested in your opinion of the video and what in there you disagree with. Looking forward to your response.
Here, I'll post the video for you right here so you don't even have to go back and look for it.
You're welcome, now sit back and enjoy (suggest you watch it alone, this one's going to get you all excited).

you hand us 'Us'. "your ilk".

Such tolerance from the left...

Reminds me:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... s-should-/

Never mind the petty bullschidt, just click on the video and watch it, you could already be ten minutes in. I want to know what you think of it.

It probably would not be wise to hold your breath.

That's a shame, you'd give this five stars and two thumbs up.
Your kind of guy, rosary beads and all.

[6ftstick]

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

Trump is such a fascist! Except for these Democratic governors of course!

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/ ... t-of-hand/

I read the NR opinion piece (someone needs to tell the author that POTUS is the one who keeps calling it a WAR and the HIDDEN ENEMY).

Serious question to you and 6ft.

Exactly what Constitutionally guaranteed rights under the Bill of Rights are being abridged during this period?

I'm not seeing what 'rights' I've given up. I'm not seeing what rights the protesters in Michigan had taken away from them, either.

Please be specific as to which Amendment and the specific right abridged.

Presumably, that's a 'softball' question. You should be able to crush it out of the park.

Freedom of association

Freedom of assembly

Freedom of Religion

Freedom of movement

Freedom to earn a living

Freedom to support my family

I have a new born grandchild I haven't been able to hold

Another on the way—???

[RedFromMI]

Autopsies find first U.S. coronavirus death occurred in early February, weeks earlier than previously thought

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2 ... alifornia/

At least two people who died in early and mid-February had contracted the novel coronavirus, health officials in California said Tuesday, signaling that the virus may have spread — and claimed lives — in the United States weeks earlier than previously thought.

Tissue samples taken during autopsies of two individuals who died at home in Santa Clara County, Calif., tested positive for the virus, local health officials said in a statement. The victims died on Feb. 6 and Feb. 17, respectively.

Initially, the nation’s earliest coronavirus fatality was believed to have occurred on Feb. 29, in Kirkland, Wash., a suburb of Seattle that rapidly became a hotspot. In March, health officials there linked two Feb. 26 deaths to covid-19, the disease caused by the new virus.

The Santa Clara County fatalities push the earliest coronavirus-related fatality back by weeks, with the new findings potentially altering the timeline of the U.S. outbreak.

“The fact that there were deaths related to covid back in early February is very significant because it means the virus was around for a lot longer than was initially realized,” Jeff Smith, a physician and the county executive in Santa Clara, told The Washington Post. “It’s been around for a while and it’s probably been spreading in the community for quite some time.”

It is not yet known exactly how the two people became infected, but Sara Cody, the county’s public health officer, told The Post that the cases are believed to be community transmissions.

“From what I understand, we don’t know of any travel history,” said Cody, who is also a doctor. “More investigation will be done to try and confirm that that’s the case.”

The connection between the February deaths and coronavirus did not become apparent until now due to strict limitations on testing at the time, Cody said.

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/22/media/fo ... index.html

Let science and public health officials discuss the efficacy of this. Not politicians.

[MDlaxfan76]

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

Trump is such a fascist! Except for these Democratic governors of course!

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/ ... t-of-hand/

I read the NR opinion piece (someone needs to tell the author that POTUS is the one who keeps calling it a WAR and the HIDDEN ENEMY).

Serious question to you and 6ft.

Exactly what Constitutionally guaranteed rights under the Bill of Rights are being abridged during this period?

I'm not seeing what 'rights' I've given up. I'm not seeing what rights the protesters in Michigan had taken away from them, either.

Please be specific as to which Amendment and the specific right abridged.

Presumably, that's a 'softball' question. You should be able to crush it out of the park.

Freedom of association

Freedom of assembly

Freedom of Religion

Freedom of movement

Freedom to earn a living

Freedom to support my family

Go ahead and name the Amendments in specific, please.

But let's take a couple that are definitely in the Bill of Rights.

What does "association" mean in this context? Are you not able to join whatever group, trade union, political organization, etc you wish?

Are you not able to peaceably assemble, while maintaining distancing? This might be arguable, I think, with the strictest temporary quarantining orders, but I think you'll find that other rights, such as public safety have been found to be legitimate reasons to constrict these rights...but it needs to be well justified.

Can you not pray to whatever God you want?

Please tie these to the actual amendments and their language. And of course, none of these rights are absolute, they all work in context with one another and with the base Constitution.

[Brooklyn]

today's Tea Baggers:

[6ftstick]

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

Trump is such a fascist! Except for these Democratic governors of course!

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/ ... t-of-hand/

I read the NR opinion piece (someone needs to tell the author that POTUS is the one who keeps calling it a WAR and the HIDDEN ENEMY).

Serious question to you and 6ft.

Exactly what Constitutionally guaranteed rights under the Bill of Rights are being abridged during this period?

I'm not seeing what 'rights' I've given up. I'm not seeing what rights the protesters in Michigan had taken away from them, either.

Please be specific as to which Amendment and the specific right abridged.

Presumably, that's a 'softball' question. You should be able to crush it out of the park.

Freedom of association

Freedom of assembly

Freedom of Religion

Freedom of movement

Freedom to earn a living

Freedom to support my family

Go ahead and name the Amendments in specific, please.

But let's take a couple that are definitely in the Bill of Rights.

What does "association" mean in this context? Are you not able to join whatever group, trade union, political organization, etc you wish?

Are you not able to peaceably assemble, while maintaining distancing? This might be arguable, I think, with the strictest temporary quarantining orders, but I think you'll find that other rights, such as public safety have been found to be legitimate reasons to constrict these rights...but it needs to be well justified.

Can you not pray to whatever God you want?

Please tie these to the actual amendments and their language. And of course, none of these rights are absolute, they all work in context with one another and with the base Constitution.

Oh please can you be any more tiresome. You know exactly what I'm talking about. You're on another thread arguing gun control.

They're using drones to make us maintain our distance from one another.

They're discussing using temperature sensors without our knowledge

In front of his daughter they arrested, handcuffed and perp walked a father playing ball with her in an empty park.

They're spending half a TRILLION every two weeks WITHOUT VOTING. Unanimous consent!

Are you a fool.

[Peter Brown]

Actually, Trump’s potential authoritarianism and the coronavirus are entirely related.

Authoritarianism doesn’t arise during prosperity and calm. It arises during chaos and emergency. The Nazis first came to power during the Great Depression. They were elected to become the largest party in parliament in German federal elections in July 1932.

The coronavirus pandemic is not just a threat to Trump ... it is, perversely, an opportunity.

Does anyone here think Trump was kidding when he declared himself to have “total authority?”

DocBarrister

Trump is such a fascist! Except for these Democratic governors of course!

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/ ... t-of-hand/

I read the NR opinion piece (someone needs to tell the author that POTUS is the one who keeps calling it a WAR and the HIDDEN ENEMY).

Serious question to you and 6ft.

Exactly what Constitutionally guaranteed rights under the Bill of Rights are being abridged during this period?

I'm not seeing what 'rights' I've given up. I'm not seeing what rights the protesters in Michigan had taken away from them, either.

Please be specific as to which Amendment and the specific right abridged.

Presumably, that's a 'softball' question. You should be able to crush it out of the park.

Perhaps not for us personally, but for others:

...detaining sick people in government facilities, conscripting people to work, prohibiting the spreading of misinformation, and banning all people (citizens and noncitizens alike) from entering the country....efforts to roll back civil liberties face political opposition, but now bipartisan support for rights-restricting COVID-19 responses could smooth the path for constitutional erosion. James Madison predicted as much when he described constitutional rights as “parchment barriers,” easily transgressed when the majority is so inclined. And indeed, history presents numerous examples of liberty violations made in the face of security threats: the Alien and Sedition Acts signed into law by President John Adams, Japanese American internment camps during WWII, and the use of torture after 9/11. After the threat has subsided, Americans must recognize any constitutional violations for what they were, lest they become the new normal.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... on/608665/