All things CoronaVirus

The odds are excellent that you will leave this forum hating someone.

How many of your friends and family members have died of the Chinese Corona Virus?

0 people
45
64%
1 person.
10
14%
2 people.
3
4%
3 people.
5
7%
More.
7
10%
 
Total votes: 70

Peter Brown
Posts: 12878
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:19 am

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by Peter Brown »

holmes435 wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:03 pm Uh oh, Trump is messing with the free markets here by making all Coronavirus treatment "in-network". This is just a lack of personal responsibility on the part of consumers. Patients should shop ahead and know what hospitals and doctors to use in those hospitals to make sure they're in-network before getting sick. They shouldn't be getting bailed out by the government for their bad choices in where to get treatment.

Good move by Trump (HEY PETE, HERE'S SOME PRAISE FOR TRUMP!!!), but the fact that he has to do it shows us one of the many broken parts of our healthcare system.


Well, first, I appreciate your grace to Trump; it's a rare sight here as you know.

And second, I agree our healthcare system is a complete mess. a fan hates me for saying so, but we need a two-tiered structure similar to Europe. One, a M4A system, but the trade for that is don't expect JHU Hospital/Mass Gen Hospital levels of care. You get what you get and no one gets to sue. But it also does not cost you a direct penny, other than of course it gets paid for by tax dollars (no such thing as a free lunch).

Then, if people wish to pay for a private system, they have that option too. And by directly paying, you will get much better care. This is how it works in Europe.

https://www.vox.com/health-care/2019/2/ ... is-sanders
seacoaster
Posts: 8866
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:36 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by seacoaster »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:08 pm RUN RUN THE SKY IS FALLING! PANIC PANIC EVERYWHERE!

Hospital are laying off workers in the middle of the coronavirus pandemic

Medical University of South Carolina in Charleston is laying off 900 people from its 17,000-person staff and asking full-time salaried employees to take a 15 percent pay cut, according to the Post & Courier; the hospital says it’s not laying off front-line workers at this time.

Essentia Health, a major medical system of clinics and hospitals in Duluth, Minnesota, is laying off 500 workers, per KBJR.

The Cookeville Regional Medical Center in Tennessee will be furloughing 400 of its 2,400-person staff, and a few hundred others will see a cut in their hours, Fox 17 Nashville reports.

Boston Medical Center is furloughing 10 percent of its staff, about 700 people, according to the Boston Globe.

Trinity Health Mid-Atlantic, which runs five hospitals in the Philadelphia area and employs 125,000 people there, will furlough an unspecific percentage of its staff, per the Philadelphia Inquirer.

Mercy Health, the largest health system in Ohio, is temporarily laying off 700 workers.

Two hospital systems in West Virginia are furloughing upward of 1,000 employees combined, Metro News reports.

The largest hospital system in eastern Kentucky is laying off 500 workers, according to the Lexington Herald-Leader.

Seattle’s Army-built field hospital is coming down without treating a single patient
https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2020/0 ... e-patient/
I think the real story -- not the one you are desperately trying to tell -- is better told here:

https://www.vox.com/2020/4/8/21213995/c ... -hospitals

"Hospitals have typically said in these announcements that they are starting with nonmedical staff for furloughs and reduced hours, which is no solace to those workers but softens the impact on our medical capacity.

But it’s not clear how long medical systems can avoid cutting doctors and nurses as well, and some of them clearly cannot. I heard from a nurse in Texas, who asked that neither she nor her hospital be named for fear of professional repercussions, who has been furloughed because of the ongoing economic crisis.

She said how constrained she felt by the news. If she wanted to help with the coronavirus response by taking a job with a travel nursing service offering temporary postings in Covid-19 hot spots, for example, she would lose her old job and her health insurance.

”It really is frustrating to hear that you’re a hero but also we don’t value you enough to prepare or pay you,” she said. “I would be happy to temporarily relocate, work in a hot spot, and make the same wages as I normally would. I can’t afford to work for free, exactly, but it’s frustrating if I can’t work at all.”

Hospitals have taken huge revenue losses as they postpone elective surgeries and other routine care so they can make more staff and space available for the Covid-19 response. Some hospitals expect to lose half their income, and the top industry trade groups have warned that hundreds of hospitals could close after this crisis.

Congress pumped $100 billion into US hospitals as part of its first stimulus package, and Democratic leaders are already calling for another $100 billion in the next stimulus bill they hope Congress will pass.

But that may still not be enough, in the end. When one in four rural hospitals were already vulnerable to closure before the coronavirus struck, the current pandemic is almost certainly going to leave some hospitals with no choice but to close, no matter how much money the federal government provides.

“Even with all of that, there are going to be hospitals that close because of this,” Susan Dentzer, senior policy fellow at Duke University’s Margolis Center for Health Policy, told me recently.

Although today the need for increased health care capacity — for workers and facilities — is more apparent than ever, a grim future may await. And the fewer nurses and doctors we can keep employed in the meantime, the more difficult it will be to get the coronavirus under control in the first place."

They are businesses trying to survive. Remember: 70 days.
a fan
Posts: 19891
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by a fan »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:08 pm RUN RUN THE SKY IS FALLING! PANIC PANIC EVERYWHERE!

Hospital are laying off workers in the middle of the coronavirus pandemic

Medical University of South Carolina in Charleston is laying off 900 people from its 17,000-person staff and asking full-time salaried employees to take a 15 percent pay cut, according to the Post & Courier; the hospital says it’s not laying off front-line workers at this time.

Essentia Health, a major medical system of clinics and hospitals in Duluth, Minnesota, is laying off 500 workers, per KBJR.

The Cookeville Regional Medical Center in Tennessee will be furloughing 400 of its 2,400-person staff, and a few hundred others will see a cut in their hours, Fox 17 Nashville reports.

Boston Medical Center is furloughing 10 percent of its staff, about 700 people, according to the Boston Globe.

Trinity Health Mid-Atlantic, which runs five hospitals in the Philadelphia area and employs 125,000 people there, will furlough an unspecific percentage of its staff, per the Philadelphia Inquirer.

Mercy Health, the largest health system in Ohio, is temporarily laying off 700 workers.

Two hospital systems in West Virginia are furloughing upward of 1,000 employees combined, Metro News reports.

The largest hospital system in eastern Kentucky is laying off 500 workers, according to the Lexington Herald-Leader.

Seattle’s Army-built field hospital is coming down without treating a single patient
https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2020/0 ... e-patient/
We have literally shut down not just America, but also many countries around the world.

And you're telling me that you're surprised that this is slowing the virus to a crawl.

Um. This is what's SUPPOSED to happen. The hospitals are SUPPOSED to not be overwhelmed with the virus. Please tell me that you understand this.
a fan
Posts: 19891
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by a fan »

Peter Brown wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:17 pm And second, I agree our healthcare system is a complete mess. a fan hates me for saying so, but we need a two-tiered structure similar to Europe. One, a M4A system, but the trade for that is don't expect JHU Hospital/Mass Gen Hospital levels of care. You get what you get and no one gets to sue. But it also does not cost you a direct penny, other than of course it gets paid for by tax dollars (no such thing as a free lunch).

Then, if people wish to pay for a private system, they have that option too. And by directly paying, you will get much better care. This is how it works in Europe.

https://www.vox.com/health-care/2019/2/ ... is-sanders
What are you talking about? Why would I hate you for saying this?

I agree completely that our healthcare system is a mess. And I would have NO PROBLEM signing up for this hybrid system of yours.....
6ftstick
Posts: 3194
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:19 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by 6ftstick »

seacoaster wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:27 pm
6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:08 pm RUN RUN THE SKY IS FALLING! PANIC PANIC EVERYWHERE!

Hospital are laying off workers in the middle of the coronavirus pandemic

Medical University of South Carolina in Charleston is laying off 900 people from its 17,000-person staff and asking full-time salaried employees to take a 15 percent pay cut, according to the Post & Courier; the hospital says it’s not laying off front-line workers at this time.

Essentia Health, a major medical system of clinics and hospitals in Duluth, Minnesota, is laying off 500 workers, per KBJR.

The Cookeville Regional Medical Center in Tennessee will be furloughing 400 of its 2,400-person staff, and a few hundred others will see a cut in their hours, Fox 17 Nashville reports.

Boston Medical Center is furloughing 10 percent of its staff, about 700 people, according to the Boston Globe.

Trinity Health Mid-Atlantic, which runs five hospitals in the Philadelphia area and employs 125,000 people there, will furlough an unspecific percentage of its staff, per the Philadelphia Inquirer.

Mercy Health, the largest health system in Ohio, is temporarily laying off 700 workers.

Two hospital systems in West Virginia are furloughing upward of 1,000 employees combined, Metro News reports.

The largest hospital system in eastern Kentucky is laying off 500 workers, according to the Lexington Herald-Leader.

Seattle’s Army-built field hospital is coming down without treating a single patient
https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2020/0 ... e-patient/
I think the real story -- not the one you are desperately trying to tell -- is better told here:

https://www.vox.com/2020/4/8/21213995/c ... -hospitals

"Hospitals have typically said in these announcements that they are starting with nonmedical staff for furloughs and reduced hours, which is no solace to those workers but softens the impact on our medical capacity.

But it’s not clear how long medical systems can avoid cutting doctors and nurses as well, and some of them clearly cannot. I heard from a nurse in Texas, who asked that neither she nor her hospital be named for fear of professional repercussions, who has been furloughed because of the ongoing economic crisis.

She said how constrained she felt by the news. If she wanted to help with the coronavirus response by taking a job with a travel nursing service offering temporary postings in Covid-19 hot spots, for example, she would lose her old job and her health insurance.

”It really is frustrating to hear that you’re a hero but also we don’t value you enough to prepare or pay you,” she said. “I would be happy to temporarily relocate, work in a hot spot, and make the same wages as I normally would. I can’t afford to work for free, exactly, but it’s frustrating if I can’t work at all.”

Hospitals have taken huge revenue losses as they postpone elective surgeries and other routine care so they can make more staff and space available for the Covid-19 response. Some hospitals expect to lose half their income, and the top industry trade groups have warned that hundreds of hospitals could close after this crisis.

Congress pumped $100 billion into US hospitals as part of its first stimulus package, and Democratic leaders are already calling for another $100 billion in the next stimulus bill they hope Congress will pass.

But that may still not be enough, in the end. When one in four rural hospitals were already vulnerable to closure before the coronavirus struck, the current pandemic is almost certainly going to leave some hospitals with no choice but to close, no matter how much money the federal government provides.

“Even with all of that, there are going to be hospitals that close because of this,” Susan Dentzer, senior policy fellow at Duke University’s Margolis Center for Health Policy, told me recently.

Although today the need for increased health care capacity — for workers and facilities — is more apparent than ever, a grim future may await. And the fewer nurses and doctors we can keep employed in the meantime, the more difficult it will be to get the coronavirus under control in the first place."

They are businesses trying to survive. Remember: 70 days.
Nonsense. The purpose of the lockdowns was to make sure the whole US healthcare system wasn't overtaxed or stressed. Out of panic about the model numbers to keep open beds and rooms and OR's—all elective procedures were cancelled. So the hospital work and procedures that could've been completed and billed for the last 5 weeks at al hospitals/clinics across the country were pushed out.
a fan
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Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by a fan »

Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
6ftstick
Posts: 3194
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:19 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by 6ftstick »

a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:36 pm Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
Jeezus you can be obtuse.

Those rooms were supposed to be filled and overrun.

Save for NY and a handful of places—some haven't had a patient in them
6ftstick
Posts: 3194
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:19 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by 6ftstick »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:41 pm
a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:36 pm Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
Jeezus you can be obtuse.

Those rooms were supposed to be filled and overrun.

Save for NY and a handful of places—some haven't had a patient in them
So shutting down the economy is destroying the Healthcare System that we shut down the economy to protect?
ggait
Posts: 4474
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:23 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by ggait »

I think the data coming out of Scandinavia is pretty interesting as we all debate under/over-reaction, health vs. economy, and stay closed/back to work questions.

Sweden is the outlier, having adopted a milder form of SD than most other countries -- HSs and colleges closed, elementary schools still open, bars/restaurants/stores/malls still open with modest restrictions, ban on gatherings over 50 people. People are encouraged but not required to work from home and stay distanced. So far from a do-nothing approach, but significantly more laid back than the full SD plan being used in the other fairly similar Scandinavian countries.

Results so far:

On 4/2, Sweden had 28 deaths per 1M pop. Denmark 21.

On 4/7, Sweden 59, Denmark 35, Norway 16, Finland 6.

On 4/10, Sweden 86, Denmark 43, Norway 20, Finland 9. For reference, USA currently 54. Spain 342. UK 132, Germany 31.

TBD what the variance will be among the Scandinavian countries in terms of unemployment, deficits, recession.

Sweden's plan pretty clearly is (no surprise) resulting in more deaths. Double or more than what its neighbors are getting per capita. Extrapolated to the USA, we'd be trending towards 96k deaths vs. the current projection of 60k.

If that was the final outcome, I think I'd say the Swedish approach was an acceptable outcome and balancing of competing interests. Of course, we don't know how long Sweden's already worse trends will continue to worsen. Geometric growth being a b*tch wolf.

Sweden (very different than USA) is an extremely high trust society. So the choices of govt and health officials are given a large benefit of the doubt. So far, the Swedes seem to be mostly OK with it. TBD if that continues.
Boycott stupid. Country over party.
User avatar
Nigel
Posts: 1568
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:43 pm
Location: Squatney District

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by Nigel »

6x6 wrote: Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:51 pm
DMac wrote: Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:35 pm
a fan wrote: Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:19 pm Yep. WVa liquor stores in adjacent counties actually refused to sell to anyone with a PA Driver's license.
Wow, how crazy is that??
Couple a them West, by God, Virginia boys gonna be buyin' the outta staters liquor for an extra $10 (no credit cards) a bottle.
Is this going on with beer too? Used to be you had to go to Pa to get Yuengling, now they gotta come here?
I have time on my hands maybe I should start a little side business. Load up the F150 with a selection from NY stores and find a nice spot down around the NY/PA state line south of Corning. Of course with this being a capitalistic economy where supply and demand drives prices, there might be a slight surcharge added to the sticker price. Just to cover my overhead of course. :lol:
Don't forget to send some of that surcharge up to King Andrew in Albany!
If we need that extra push over the cliff, ya know what we do...eleven, exactly.
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old salt
Posts: 18956
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Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by old salt »

Typical Lax Dad wrote: Thu Apr 09, 2020 11:01 pm
Brooklyn wrote: Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:56 pm
Typical Lax Dad wrote: Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:06 pm


Hate to jump a post but this is another excellent documentary.... the is what union busting left in its wake....this is basically a companion piece to American Factory. These are the people that have been disinter-mediated from their prior middle class existence.



First break the unions, then buyout older employed making a decent wage, hire young people to work for 1/2 the wage, then move the jobs to people who will work for 1/4..... then complain about China and get angry.


Too bad Ohio decided to go red after blaming Obama for problems he never created. Hate to say I told you so but ...
It’s an excellent Frontline documentary... the people in Ohio were desperate. They were conned by Trump.
When did the UAW jobs depart Ohio, & the rest of the midwest ?
User avatar
RedFromMI
Posts: 5080
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:42 pm

Re: All things COVID-19

Post by RedFromMI »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:58 pm
6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:41 pm
a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:36 pm Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
Jeezus you can be obtuse.

Those rooms were supposed to be filled and overrun.

Save for NY and a handful of places—some haven't had a patient in them
So shutting down the economy is destroying the Healthcare System that we shut down the economy to protect?
Shutting down things is keeping all of us safer - and at the same time keeping the ICUs and other hospital resources needed to fight the coronavirus from being as overwhelmed. That means more of us live, and we don't have as much of a disaster as if we would if we did not have the shutdown. In some places (NY, NJ, MI, LA) bad early reactions led to the systems being overwhelmed. Those places are also nearing/at their peak usage of the particular things needed to treat CV (ICU beds, ventilators, PPE). Other states, mostly from a combination of luck and lower density, as well as a few other things, have not yet seen anywhere close to peak usage. Take a look at https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-s ... ca/florida to see how the IMHE model predicts Florida is more than 2 weeks from peak usage.

But hospitals have, because they are treating so many patients with CV-19, become quite dangerous to the other patients who would normally be in the hospital. So "elective" procedures have basically been killed until they become safer places. And that is hurting hospital revenue - so that is why you see layoffs. Those people might work in parts of the hospital system that is close to dead at this time, due to those cancellations.

Just for example - think about how many people visiting patients might eat in a hospital cafeteria/restaurant. No outside people now, because for their own safety they are kept out. Keeps the gift shop closed. And with empty rooms, you might not need as many janitors...

And outside the hospital - nobody is going to the family doctor or dentist unless it is an emergency. My best friends are married dentists. Their practice employs around 10-12 people normally. Now it is 3 max per day, and it is only emergency treatment - no regular checkups. (No one wants to be sitting in a waiting room with other people who might have CV.

So yes - we are hurting portions of our healthcare system.
User avatar
RedFromMI
Posts: 5080
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:42 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by RedFromMI »

ggait wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 2:05 pm I think the data coming out of Scandinavia is pretty interesting as we all debate under/over-reaction, health vs. economy, and stay closed/back to work questions.

Sweden is the outlier, having adopted a milder form of SD than most other countries -- HSs and colleges closed, elementary schools still open, bars/restaurants/stores/malls still open with modest restrictions, ban on gatherings over 50 people. People are encouraged but not required to work from home and stay distanced. So far from a do-nothing approach, but significantly more laid back than the full SD plan being used in the other fairly similar Scandinavian countries.

Results so far:

On 4/2, Sweden had 28 deaths per 1M pop. Denmark 21.

On 4/7, Sweden 59, Denmark 35, Norway 16, Finland 6.

On 4/10, Sweden 86, Denmark 43, Norway 20, Finland 9. For reference, USA currently 54. Spain 342. UK 132, Germany 31.

TBD what the variance will be among the Scandinavian countries in terms of unemployment, deficits, recession.

Sweden's plan pretty clearly is (no surprise) resulting in more deaths. Double or more than what its neighbors are getting per capita. Extrapolated to the USA, we'd be trending towards 96k deaths vs. the current projection of 60k.

If that was the final outcome, I think I'd say the Swedish approach was an acceptable outcome and balancing of competing interests. Of course, we don't know how long Sweden's already worse trends will continue to worsen. Geometric growth being a b*tch wolf.

Sweden (very different than USA) is an extremely high trust society. So the choices of govt and health officials are given a large benefit of the doubt. So far, the Swedes seem to be mostly OK with it. TBD if that continues.
Current IHME projections for Sweden is a bit over 13200 deaths (ballpark 1300 per 1M). And even though there is no "shutdown", a lot of slowdown has been happening within the Swedish economy as a lot of people are staying closer/close to home.

USA is trending toward a number closer to 200 per 1M, but that is heavily influenced by our late start - leading to it hitting hard and fast.
Last edited by RedFromMI on Fri Apr 10, 2020 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
jhu72
Posts: 14542
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:52 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by jhu72 »

holmes435 wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:03 pm Uh oh, Trump is messing with the free markets here by making all Coronavirus treatment "in-network". This is just a lack of personal responsibility on the part of consumers. Patients should shop ahead and know what hospitals and doctors to use in those hospitals to make sure they're in-network before getting sick. They shouldn't be getting bailed out by the government for their bad choices in where to get treatment.

Good move by Trump (HEY PETE, HERE'S SOME PRAISE FOR TRUMP!!!), but the fact that he has to do it shows us one of the many broken parts of our healthcare system.
Peanut Butters is a socialist. :lol:
Image STAND AGAINST FASCISM
a fan
Posts: 19891
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by a fan »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:41 pm
a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:36 pm Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
Jeezus you can be obtuse.

Those rooms were supposed to be filled and overrun.

Save for NY and a handful of places—some haven't had a patient in them
Yes! What you are telling us is that you would be happier if the beds were more full, and more people were dying.

You're not making any sense. You're complaining that what we are doing is "working too well".

Take it up with Trump, I guess.
6ftstick
Posts: 3194
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:19 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by 6ftstick »

Another clue we're coming clear of coronavirus is that the discussion has shifted to how communities of color are disproportionately affected by this global PANDEMIC.

RACE!
Peter Brown
Posts: 12878
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:19 am

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by Peter Brown »

a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:29 pm
Peter Brown wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:17 pm And second, I agree our healthcare system is a complete mess. a fan hates me for saying so, but we need a two-tiered structure similar to Europe. One, a M4A system, but the trade for that is don't expect JHU Hospital/Mass Gen Hospital levels of care. You get what you get and no one gets to sue. But it also does not cost you a direct penny, other than of course it gets paid for by tax dollars (no such thing as a free lunch).

Then, if people wish to pay for a private system, they have that option too. And by directly paying, you will get much better care. This is how it works in Europe.

https://www.vox.com/health-care/2019/2/ ... is-sanders
What are you talking about? Why would I hate you for saying this?

I agree completely that our healthcare system is a mess. And I would have NO PROBLEM signing up for this hybrid system of yours.....


Must have misunderstood.
6ftstick
Posts: 3194
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:19 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by 6ftstick »

a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 2:25 pm
6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:41 pm
a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:36 pm Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
Jeezus you can be obtuse.

Those rooms were supposed to be filled and overrun.

Save for NY and a handful of places—some haven't had a patient in them
Yes! What you are telling us is that you would be happier if the beds were more full, and more people were dying.

You're not making any sense. You're complaining that what we are doing is "working too well".

Take it up with Trump, I guess.
Happier if the beds were full?

If at this point I have to explain yet again that I'm on the side of fewer deaths then estimated, that the models were deliberately overweighted to panic us and drive us into isolation then Forget it. Just forget it!
Peter Brown
Posts: 12878
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:19 am

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by Peter Brown »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 2:32 pm
a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 2:25 pm
6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:41 pm
a fan wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:36 pm Yes. All the hospital work was pushed out. People are following instructions, and staying home. Result? Hospitals aren't overwhelmed.

Why in the heck are you complaining about this outcome? You should be thrilled.
Jeezus you can be obtuse.

Those rooms were supposed to be filled and overrun.

Save for NY and a handful of places—some haven't had a patient in them
Yes! What you are telling us is that you would be happier if the beds were more full, and more people were dying.

You're not making any sense. You're complaining that what we are doing is "working too well".

Take it up with Trump, I guess.
Happier if the beds were full?

If at this point I have to explain yet again that I'm on the side of fewer deaths then estimated, that the models were deliberately overweighted to panic us and drive us into isolation then Forget it. Just forget it!


I don't believe the models were 'deliberately overweighted'; I think like most doomsday prognostications, models almost always fail to account for human ingenuity and reaction. Any time someone tells you that America is about to fail or can't react to any negative agent, those are the same people who fail to understand freedom; freedom is the only vaccine man needs to excel.
a fan
Posts: 19891
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: All things Chinese CoronaVirus

Post by a fan »

6ftstick wrote: Fri Apr 10, 2020 2:32 pm If at this point I have to explain yet again that I'm on the side of fewer deaths then estimated, that the models were deliberately overweighted to panic us and drive us into isolation then Forget it. Just forget it!
Again, why are you yelling at me? Yell at Trump. He's the one giving out the models.

The news is good, and you're mad at that. You REALLY don't understand how crazy your complaint is? Our officials did the best that they could with the limited and entirely imperfect data that they had on hand.

And your honest complaint is: why aren't there more dead people? Seriously? Really? How you can you POSSIBLY be upset about that?




For me? I'm THRILLED that what we're doing is working.
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