Ivy League

[AreaLax]

Also according to Dana O’Neil twitter

Ivy League seniors CANNOT just become grad transfers. They'd count against the scholarship limits that had otherwise been waived by NCAA for spring sports. So it's a double kick in the pants

[thetruth]

Just reported via Twitter by Mike Jensen, an excellent college sports columnist/reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer (and a Princeton grad, I think):

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

That is what I figured. Kids can withdraw and keep their eligibility as approved by the NCAA but league isn’t going to allow graduate students to play. I am happy for the seniors. Good luck to all.

Are we sure that's what the Ivies are saying? I'm hearing that the Ivy League actually is counting this past spring as a season of play.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Just reported via Twitter by Mike Jensen, an excellent college sports columnist/reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer (and a Princeton grad, I think):

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

That is what I figured. Kids can withdraw and keep their eligibility as approved by the NCAA but league isn’t going to allow graduate students to play. I am happy for the seniors. Good luck to all.

Are we sure that's what the Ivies are saying? I'm hearing that the Ivy League actually is counting this past spring as a season of play.

Let me look. I would find that hard to believe.

EDIT:

Despite the NCAA’s ruling, the Ivy League will still stick to their rules of not allowing graduate students player sports, according to Dana O’Neil of the Athletic. And since those players can not stay in conference if they chose to take an extra year, they will count against the scholarship limit at the school they land at.

Seems to apply to kids that graduate. If you withdraw, you retain your NCAA eligibility. I figured this would be the case.

[thetruth]

Just reported via Twitter by Mike Jensen, an excellent college sports columnist/reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer (and a Princeton grad, I think):

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

That is what I figured. Kids can withdraw and keep their eligibility as approved by the NCAA but league isn’t going to allow graduate students to play. I am happy for the seniors. Good luck to all.

Are we sure that's what the Ivies are saying? I'm hearing that the Ivy League actually is counting this past spring as a season of play.

Let me look. I would find that hard to believe.

All I can find is that they are not changing their rules. If that's the case, then I think the athlete would need to petition both the school and the league to be able to get their extra year of NCAA eligibility within the league. Also, I believe the dates to withdraw for this semester and keep eligibility or not have to re-apply for entry have passed at most schools. Need a lot more clarity on this.

[QuakerSouth]

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

Doesn't surprise me one bit. The League has been quite strident in the past with this. I would have been surprised if they allowed it,

For athletes: No special dorms. No special dining halls. No athletic scholarships. No special treatment.

Every Ivy recruit knows this going in. The schools don't hide it, and are completely above board with this practice. And top players still go. Why? They think attending the schools and being a student first is worth it over the long run. You may agree with the decision, you may disagree with the decision, but its been this way for a long time.

That being said, I feel awful for these kids. Its terrible, and its not their fault. And the Ivies were poised to really make some noise this year...

[Typical Lax Dad]

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

Doesn't surprise me one bit. The League has been quite strident in the past with this. I would have been surprised if they allowed it,

For athletes: No special dorms. No special dining halls. No athletic scholarships. No special treatment.

Every Ivy recruit knows this going in. The schools don't hide it, and are completely above board with this practice. And top players still go. Why? They think attending the schools and being a student first is worth it over the long run. You may agree with the decision, you may disagree with the decision, but its been this way for a long time.

That being said, I feel awful for these kids. Its terrible, and its not their fault. And the Ivies were poised to really make some noise this year...

You don’t see many Penn guys withdrawing and coming back?

[Typical Lax Dad]

Just reported via Twitter by Mike Jensen, an excellent college sports columnist/reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer (and a Princeton grad, I think):

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

That is what I figured. Kids can withdraw and keep their eligibility as approved by the NCAA but league isn’t going to allow graduate students to play. I am happy for the seniors. Good luck to all.

Are we sure that's what the Ivies are saying? I'm hearing that the Ivy League actually is counting this past spring as a season of play.

Let me look. I would find that hard to believe.

All I can find is that they are not changing their rules. If that's the case, then I think the athlete would need to petition both the school and the league to be able to get their extra year of NCAA eligibility within the league. Also, I believe the dates to withdraw for this semester and keep eligibility or not have to re-apply for entry have passed at most schools. Need a lot more clarity on this.

The operative word is “graduate” and play. That remains unchanged.

[thetruth]

Just reported via Twitter by Mike Jensen, an excellent college sports columnist/reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer (and a Princeton grad, I think):

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

That is what I figured. Kids can withdraw and keep their eligibility as approved by the NCAA but league isn’t going to allow graduate students to play. I am happy for the seniors. Good luck to all.

Are we sure that's what the Ivies are saying? I'm hearing that the Ivy League actually is counting this past spring as a season of play.

Let me look. I would find that hard to believe.

EDIT:

Despite the NCAA’s ruling, the Ivy League will still stick to their rules of not allowing graduate students player sports, according to Dana O’Neil of the Athletic. And since those players can not stay in conference if they chose to take an extra year, they will count against the scholarship limit at the school they land at.

Seems to apply to kids that graduate. If you withdraw, you retain your NCAA eligibility. I figured this would be the case.

TLD, these schools just don't let students say "hey, I'm going to take 2 semesters off and I'll see you next spring so make room for me." The schools have defined timetables and requirements around leaves of absence. Doesn't appear there will be any exceptions for athletes who played this past spring which will actually make this quite difficult to pull off. And even if the school approves it, then the league has to approve it with academic considerations playing an important part in that decision.

[youthathletics]

Just reported via Twitter by Mike Jensen, an excellent college sports columnist/reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer (and a Princeton grad, I think):

"Just in: Ivy League says no to changing rules to help spring-sport athletes graduate and play next year."

That is what I figured. Kids can withdraw and keep their eligibility as approved by the NCAA but league isn’t going to allow graduate students to play. I am happy for the seniors. Good luck to all.

Are we sure that's what the Ivies are saying? I'm hearing that the Ivy League actually is counting this past spring as a season of play.

Let me look. I would find that hard to believe.

EDIT:

Despite the NCAA’s ruling, the Ivy League will still stick to their rules of not allowing graduate students player sports, according to Dana O’Neil of the Athletic. And since those players can not stay in conference if they chose to take an extra year, they will count against the scholarship limit at the school they land at.

Seems to apply to kids that graduate. If you withdraw, you retain your NCAA eligibility. I figured this would be the case.

TLD, these schools just don't let students say "hey, I'm going to take 2 semesters off and I'll see you next spring so make room for me." The schools have defined timetables and requirements around leaves of absence. Doesn't appear there will be any exceptions for athletes who played this past spring which will actually make this quite difficult to pull off. And even if the school approves it, then the league has to approve it with academic considerations playing an important part in that decision.

We were talking about this last night and I really no nothing about this process. Is this exposing the 'preferential treatment' athletes receive? How can a student 'withdraw' from school x, and assume they can merely walk back in next year?

[QuakerSouth]

You don’t see many Penn guys withdrawing and coming back?

Hey TLD,

Always like your posts here.

Not close enough to the program to know if any of the guys have those plans. And it may be too late. The semester is almost over. Don't know if one could withdraw now. Even if you could, there are no details of procedures of how to do everything "by the book." These kids are a month away from an Ivy degree that it took them 4 years to earn. I'm not saying its doesn't taste bad, but they may have to take that bitter pill. Every person in the country-the world-is negatively impacted in many ways. Its not fair that the world isn't fair. But its unfair to everyone, it just touches people in different ways. So,

Graduate next month

or

futz around with all the unknown details for the next how many months so you can pay to come back and play another season of lacrosse? Withdrawing now without all the details is dangerous, and could be costly in many ways. I hope mistakes are not made.

[thetruth]

How can a student 'withdraw' from school x, and assume they can merely walk back in next year?

They can't. In order to get a leave of absence for a year at any Ivy, there is a comprehensive process where academics are the priority. If you are not a good student that can articulate a good reason as to why you want/need a leave of absence for a year for academic or personal reasons (not athletic), then you are not going to get it. Also, the time may have already passed at some of these schools to do such a thing for this term and next.

[QuakerSouth]

Also, the time may have already passed at some of these schools to do such a thing for this term and next.

^^^ This.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Also, the time may have already passed at some of these schools to do such a thing for this term and next.

^^^ This.

Yes. My guess is that under these incredible circumstances, the administration would be accommodating. Princeton second academic semester didn’t start until February so those students have more runway. How late did Pannel withdraw, under less disruptive circumstances.

My wife teaches and my daughter is a college student. The are getting through it but neither constituency likes this “ distance learning”. A lot of my wife’s students are struggling with it.

[semsox]

To give the timing some context, Pannell broke his foot in the 2nd game of the season in 2012, which was March 3rd. It wasn't until trying to prepare for the Brown game on April 21st that he re-injured it, essentially ending any bid for a comeback that season. He gave an interview with Lax Magazine in September 2012, and had this exchange:

What's the application process for a fifth year like?

As long as you don't graduate on time with enough credits, you can apply for a fifth year with the Ivy League. I took an Incomplete for a class, Introduction to Philosophy, because I wasn't able to do the work. I was going to be away from school, working with doctors and making sure my rehab was going well. Then when I re-injured it, I had to go back to meeting with doctors. I was off-campus for a while, and I was going to miss my final exam in this class. I came up with an academic plan, that if I were allowed to come back to Cornell, there were a couple classes offered in the spring that would allow me to fulfill a second specialization — strategy — within my applied economics and management major. That would help me out from a career standpoint, and I would love spending another semester at Cornell.

In the same interview, he mentioned he would have withdrawn sooner had he realized he wouldn't be able to come back, which gives some context to the Sowers withdrawal. I'm sure a lot of seniors are weighing this difficult decision, but it does appear they'll at least have some time to think it over

[QuakerSouth]

Well, that's a bit of a roadmap. The League can be a bit like the Supreme Court...precedence means oh so much. That could actually work to the seniors' advantage.

[faircornell]

I have no idea of how this will all play out, but HYP with their massive endowments are better positioned to help provide athletes another semester of financial aid if it's required. I think that it will be difficult for a school like Cornell to offer another Senior Semester to an athlete in exchange for being underfunded for a freshman in financial need. I hope that I'm wrong.

[Typical Lax Dad]

To give the timing some context, Pannell broke his foot in the 2nd game of the season in 2012, which was March 3rd. It wasn't until trying to prepare for the Brown game on April 21st that he re-injured it, essentially ending any bid for a comeback that season. He gave an interview with Lax Magazine in September 2012, and had this exchange:

What's the application process for a fifth year like?

As long as you don't graduate on time with enough credits, you can apply for a fifth year with the Ivy League. I took an Incomplete for a class, Introduction to Philosophy, because I wasn't able to do the work. I was going to be away from school, working with doctors and making sure my rehab was going well. Then when I re-injured it, I had to go back to meeting with doctors. I was off-campus for a while, and I was going to miss my final exam in this class. I came up with an academic plan, that if I were allowed to come back to Cornell, there were a couple classes offered in the spring that would allow me to fulfill a second specialization — strategy — within my applied economics and management major. That would help me out from a career standpoint, and I would love spending another semester at Cornell.

In the same interview, he mentioned he would have withdrawn sooner had he realized he wouldn't be able to come back, which gives some context to the Sowers withdrawal. I'm sure a lot of seniors are weighing this difficult decision, but it does appear they'll at least have some time to think it over

Thanks. If you, exclude Spring Break, Princeton has had 7 or 8 weeks of classes. After 9 weeks at Princeton, withdrawing is more of a process I believe. I am sure these guys will get good advice.

[another fan]

I have no idea of how this will all play out, but HYP with their massive endowments are better positioned to help provide athletes another semester of financial aid if it's required. I think that it will be difficult for a school like Cornell to offer another Senior Semester to an athlete in exchange for being underfunded for a freshman in financial need. I hope that I'm wrong.

I believe Cornell recently announced a freeze on hiring and raises for faculty and staff

[thetruth]

Not all Ivies have the same withdrawal or leave of absence requirements and rules. For example, the rules/requirements at Yale and Princeton are stricter than they are at Cornell.
Yale - http://catalog.yale.edu/ycps/academic-r ... statement/
Princeton - https://ua.princeton.edu/contents/acade ... nstatement
Cornell - https://as.cornell.edu/leave-absence-and-withdrawal

[Mid-Lax]

During a national health crisis like we have not seen since 1918, this is a terrible decision, elitist to the core. Screw the seniors and the athletes. Archaic, just like when they resisted Ivy League Tournaments and postseason NCAA participation... and then they did.

Do the one time exemption and let the graduate seniors play.