Who is supporting the immigrant caravan?

[jhu72]

Clearly those propping up e-verify have not worked in construction, farming, landscaping, hospitality cleaning, residential handyman, just name a handful. It’s like a contractor biding a job, having been awarded the project for low bid, he staffs the job with 1....yes 1 legal foreman and rest are filled with under the table, non english speaking, low wage labor. See it every day.

The only jobs that are clean, for the most part, are Davis-Bacon/certified payroll, and there even loopholes in that process. You all are assuming business owners/employers are ALL forthright and on the up&up....HA! It’s a mess out there.

No, we are telling you that you can't stop it without putting some slimy employers in jail, until every one gets it. Your solution (the wall) is to put up an ineffective real expensive solution and let the internal corruption continue (slimy employers) unabated.

[youthathletics]

Clearly those propping up e-verify have not worked in construction, farming, landscaping, hospitality cleaning, residential handyman, just name a handful. It’s like a contractor biding a job, having been awarded the project for low bid, he staffs the job with 1....yes 1 legal foreman and rest are filled with under the table, non english speaking, low wage labor. See it every day.

The only jobs that are clean, for the most part, are Davis-Bacon/certified payroll, and there even loopholes in that process. You all are assuming business owners/employers are ALL forthright and on the up&up....HA! It’s a mess out there.

No, we are telling you that you can't stop it without putting some slimy employers in jail, until every one gets it. Your solution (the wall) is to put up an ineffective real expensive solution and let the internal corruption continue (slimy employers) unabated.

I am not saying abandon e-verify, I am simply saying it is not all its cracked up to be. You know full well that few employers will go to jail...maybe pay some fines or get their hands slapped after a a few lawyers work the system in the employees favor. The wall, as I see it, is like the hoover damn....it serves an extremely valuable purpose and "controls" what gets by. The saying "you can not manage, what you can not control", is fitting. We are pouring so much money into the border in its current state, slow the bleeding to a manageable state, coupled with e-verify, and you avoid the tourniquet approach that we are currently experiencing. IMO, the wall hurts no-one, helps many, and is a symbol of check yourself-before your wreck yourself to those considering entering the US.

[a fan]

IMO, the wall hurts no-one, helps many, and is a symbol of check yourself-before your wreck yourself to those considering entering the US.

This is why all the borrowing we are doing is so dangerous.

Hike your taxes to pay for the construction and maintenance of this stupid thing, and you'd be singing a different tune.

Or better still, cut your Medicare bennies to pay for it.

[youthathletics]

IMO, the wall hurts no-one, helps many, and is a symbol of check yourself-before your wreck yourself to those considering entering the US.

This is why all the borrowing we are doing is so dangerous.

Hike your taxes to pay for the construction and maintenance of this stupid thing, and you'd be singing a different tune.

Or better still, cut your Medicare bennies to pay for it.

Stop worrying about money so much (we can just print more ), your children's safety and future employment is just as important. The money is going there anyway...in perpetuity for border security. I would be curious what the ROI would be? IF it reduces border security and coupled with e-verify brings in more taxes from legitimate employees.

[a fan]

Oh sure. Make fun.

I would have never pegged you and tech37 as the leaders of the "don't worry man, America's finances will all work out in the end" crew.

You know what's coming, right? Trump will get parts of his wall, it will cost 10 times what they estimate, and we'll find all kinds of Trump's buddies getting in on the bids.

And we still won't turn on e-verify, and we still won't have any kind of immigration reform.

So we'll blow another $500 Billion, and the problem will still be right there, staring us in the face.....

[Trinity]

Where does your wall go? On the Texas side of the RioGrande or the Mexican? The middle of the river?

[youthathletics]

Think of it this way....if your biggest batch ever of brew has just been pumped into barrels, cleaned up, stowed and stacked away with kid gloves, and as you turn to shut the doors you notice the staves are leaking on each barrel, beyond repair....what do you do? You use logic, and fix the leaks....you do not call the consumers to come buy it before the product is ready for market. Sure that is a simplistic analogy, but our problem is that we are bleeding money anyway on illegals in benefits, hospital stays, medical claims, uninsured motorists, border patrol, etc, etc. Just fix the d@mn leaks before its too late, then we can clean up the 1 million illegal backlog and on all future immigrant entrants.

[old salt]

That's just an excuse for doing nothing, maintaining the status quo, & letting the underground undocumented population grow from 11 to 22 million & beyond.
Making the perfect the enemy of the good enough.

Let 'em keep dying in the desert or packed into tractor trailers, while wasting millions on catch & release ankle bracelets & overwhelmed immigration courts.

Eveify is only one part of the solution. It does not address what to do about the 11 - 22 million already here.

The beauty of e-verify is that it does actually address the millions here already. They aren't going to be able to get a job, so many will leave on their own. You'll still have a good number staying due to having kids here, working on the black market, etc, but it will have a big impact.

Heck, what about this for amnesty - anyone willing to self-deport gets their illegal entry expunged so they get to try again legally?

The wall isn't going to do anything except drain billions of dollars of tax revenue.

That's not just Everify -- you have to do something about the 11-22 million already here illegally.
You can't just expect them to selfdeport. There's not enough off the books work for all of them.
Businesses who've hired them, based on fake ID's, would be devastated.
It's ez to get fake ID & the "slimy" employer is off the hook.
Everify is just the easy part of a very complex issue. There needs to be a way to legitimize the presence of self-supporting, noncriminal. illegal workers already here & working.

It's simplistic to say that Everify will fix the problem. That's a dodge, used as an excuse to not do anything to enforce existing laws.
That's why it's proposed as an alternative to doing anything.

The wall is going to increase the odds of apprehending illegal entrants & drug smugglers.

[runrussellrun]

Clearly those propping up e-verify have not worked in construction, farming, landscaping, hospitality cleaning, residential handyman, just name a handful. It’s like a contractor biding a job, having been awarded the project for low bid, he staffs the job with 1....yes 1 legal foreman and rest are filled with under the table, non english speaking, low wage labor. See it every day.

The only jobs that are clean, for the most part, are Davis-Bacon/certified payroll, and there even loopholes in that process. You all are assuming business owners/employers are ALL forthright and on the up&up....HA! It’s a mess out there.

No, we are telling you that you can't stop it without putting some slimy employers in jail, until every one gets it. Your solution (the wall) is to put up an ineffective real expensive solution and let the internal corruption continue (slimy employers) unabated.

I am not saying abandon e-verify, I am simply saying it is not all its cracked up to be. You know full well that few employers will go to jail...maybe pay some fines or get their hands slapped after a a few lawyers work the system in the employees favor. The wall, as I see it, is like the hoover damn....it serves an extremely valuable purpose and "controls" what gets by. The saying "you can not manage, what you can not control", is fitting. We are pouring so much money into the border in its current state, slow the bleeding to a manageable state, coupled with e-verify, and you avoid the tourniquet approach that we are currently experiencing. IMO, the wall hurts no-one, helps many, and is a symbol of check yourself-before your wreck yourself to those considering entering the US.

Got it....so, in other words, TOO much money is being made, why bother? Especially on the border, with Obamas mandatory immigrant bed count payments. ( I've posted it before, the info. Ignore at your own ignorance )

Yes, tech is only good for getting Kardashian updates on your "dumb" phone. Why use it for employment and tax purposes.

[old salt]

Where does your wall go? On the Texas side of the RioGrande or the Mexican? The middle of the river?

You put the wall where CBP tells you it will be most effective in helping them do their job.

[runrussellrun]

Clearly those propping up e-verify have not worked in construction, farming, landscaping, hospitality cleaning, residential handyman, just name a handful. It’s like a contractor biding a job, having been awarded the project for low bid, he staffs the job with 1....yes 1 legal foreman and rest are filled with under the table, non english speaking, low wage labor. See it every day.

The only jobs that are clean, for the most part, are Davis-Bacon/certified payroll, and there even loopholes in that process. You all are assuming business owners/employers are ALL forthright and on the up&up....HA! It’s a mess out there.

No, we are telling you that you can't stop it without putting some slimy employers in jail, until every one gets it. Your solution (the wall) is to put up an ineffective real expensive solution and let the internal corruption continue (slimy employers) unabated.

This IS in your neck of the woods:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/ice- ... aids-46823

Ten years later, this guy is posting this on his website.

https://www.annapolispainting.com/ (didn't know owners could rate themselves )

Do you simply hire temporary workers off the street to do the job?
Unlike some competitors, we only use legal U.S. residents that are trained, screened and experienced painters on every job. While we respect the hard work of local day laborers and recognize that some do excellent work for local individuals and businesses, we believe that it wouldn’t be possible to achieve the consistent quality that our company has become famous for without carefully choosing crew members that have extensive experience in house painting and can commit to upholding our high standards. As our crew works together regularly, they’re able to deliver superior results and quality every day. Many of our team members have been with us for several years and are proud to work for a local business that has grown to become a champion in the residential painting sector.

[runrussellrun]

Clearly those propping up e-verify have not worked in construction, farming, landscaping, hospitality cleaning, residential handyman, just name a handful. It’s like a contractor biding a job, having been awarded the project for low bid, he staffs the job with 1....yes 1 legal foreman and rest are filled with under the table, non english speaking, low wage labor. See it every day.

The only jobs that are clean, for the most part, are Davis-Bacon/certified payroll, and there even loopholes in that process. You all are assuming business owners/employers are ALL forthright and on the up&up....HA! It’s a mess out there.

No, we are telling you that you can't stop it without putting some slimy employers in jail, until every one gets it. Your solution (the wall) is to put up an ineffective real expensive solution and let the internal corruption continue (slimy employers) unabated.

I am not saying abandon e-verify, I am simply saying it is not all its cracked up to be. You know full well that few employers will go to jail...maybe pay some fines or get their hands slapped after a a few lawyers work the system in the employees favor. The wall, as I see it, is like the hoover damn....it serves an extremely valuable purpose and "controls" what gets by. The saying "you can not manage, what you can not control", is fitting. We are pouring so much money into the border in its current state, slow the bleeding to a manageable state, coupled with e-verify, and you avoid the tourniquet approach that we are currently experiencing. IMO, the wall hurts no-one, helps many, and is a symbol of check yourself-before your wreck yourself to those considering entering the US.

While I like the general idea of e verify, this part has me in the taats corner again. Where the to small to succeed folks can't hack the fines. We.... already know walmart and cargill meat cutting plants can. (home of the illegal voters in dodge city......oooppps )

[runrussellrun]

Oh sure. Make fun.

I would have never pegged you and tech37 as the leaders of the "don't worry man, America's finances will all work out in the end" crew.

You know what's coming, right? Trump will get parts of his wall, it will cost 10 times what they estimate, and we'll find all kinds of Trump's buddies getting in on the bids.

And we still won't turn on e-verify, and we still won't have any kind of immigration reform.

So we'll blow another $500 Billion, and the problem will still be right there, staring us in the face.....

Illegals don't donate to PAC's or political candidates..........produce growers do. Having to pay US Citizens overtime will cut into those donations. There's a reason why the majority population of Dodge city can't be ruled by the majority. They are lazy wetbacks (Hillaryous Clinton font ) Or, perhaps, they are NOT legal voters/candidates.

And cargil hiring illegals is SO ten years ago.....way better at hiding it today.

[holmes435]

That's not just Everify -- you have to do something about the 11-22 million already here illegally.
You can't just expect them to selfdeport. There's not enough off the books work for all of them.
Businesses who've hired them, based on fake ID's, would be devastated.
It's ez to get fake ID & the "slimy" employer is off the hook.
Everify is just the easy part of a very complex issue. There needs to be a way to legitimize the presence of self-supporting, noncriminal. illegal workers already here & working.

It's simplistic to say that Everify will fix the problem. That's a dodge, used as an excuse to not do anything to enforce existing laws.
That's why it's proposed as an alternative to doing anything.

The wall is going to increase the odds of apprehending illegal entrants & drug smugglers.

You see economic migrants flow whichever way the wind blows - we had more Mexicans leaving than entering during the recession - if they don't have work here, they'll leave for better climes, so you could definitely see many people leaving.

Yes, some businesses would be devastated, but if all businesses have to hire legal workers, all boats will rise with the tide (and rising wages) and prices will adjust accordingly. It's basic free market stuff.

You're correct that E-verify is just one part of a complex issue. And notice I didn't say it would fix the problem completely, but it would be a big step and help with a lot of issues. It's easy, low-hanging fruit to implement with large effects. A border wall will have a much smaller effect, and does absolutely nothing to address the 11-22 million already here illegally, whereas E-Verify will have at least a small effect, if not more on them.

Conduct raids on businesses much as you are now if you're concerned with the black market businesses. You should have a smaller pond in which to fish.

Trump should be trumpeting shame upon businesses who hire illegals - it's an easy target, you can call them un-American and un-Patriotic, and it riles up his base. It's a win for him and Republicans.

[runrussellrun]

That's just an excuse for doing nothing, maintaining the status quo, & letting the underground undocumented population grow from 11 to 22 million & beyond.
Making the perfect the enemy of the good enough.

Let 'em keep dying in the desert or packed into tractor trailers, while wasting millions on catch & release ankle bracelets & overwhelmed immigration courts.

Eveify is only one part of the solution. It does not address what to do about the 11 - 22 million already here.

The beauty of e-verify is that it does actually address the millions here already. They aren't going to be able to get a job, so many will leave on their own. You'll still have a good number staying due to having kids here, working on the black market, etc, but it will have a big impact.

Heck, what about this for amnesty - anyone willing to self-deport gets their illegal entry expunged so they get to try again legally?

The wall isn't going to do anything except drain billions of dollars of tax revenue.

That's not just Everify -- you have to do something about the 11-22 million already here illegally.
You can't just expect them to selfdeport. There's not enough off the books work for all of them.
Businesses who've hired them, based on fake ID's, would be devastated.
It's ez to get fake ID & the "slimy" employer is off the hook.
Everify is just the easy part of a very complex issue. There needs to be a way to legitimize the presence of self-supporting, noncriminal. illegal workers already here & working.

It's simplistic to say that Everify will fix the problem. That's a dodge, used as an excuse to not do anything to enforce existing laws.
That's why it's proposed as an alternative to doing anything.

The wall is going to increase the odds of apprehending illegal entrants & drug smugglers.

The illegals here already? Umm....you make EVERYONE do e-verify for current employees. From roofers to roofie Pharma developers.
Yup, the 'non-profit' world, we know, it's a HR nightmare. Oh well. Get federal welfare from the local packy instead. It's really not that hard. Your prescious killing machine companies are already using e verify. Aren't they?

As far as devastating the current companies that employ illegals.... WHO effing cares. You don't think underbidding contractors aren't devastating the competition already. The competition that hires LEGAL workers?

Why bother auditing the Pentagon......crimes like the Pac fleet and fat leonard will happen anyway.

[runrussellrun]

Where does your wall go? On the Texas side of the RioGrande or the Mexican? The middle of the river?

Drones. Did you learn nothing from Obama?

[runrussellrun]

That's not just Everify -- you have to do something about the 11-22 million already here illegally.
You can't just expect them to selfdeport. There's not enough off the books work for all of them.
Businesses who've hired them, based on fake ID's, would be devastated.
It's ez to get fake ID & the "slimy" employer is off the hook.
Everify is just the easy part of a very complex issue. There needs to be a way to legitimize the presence of self-supporting, noncriminal. illegal workers already here & working.

It's simplistic to say that Everify will fix the problem. That's a dodge, used as an excuse to not do anything to enforce existing laws.
That's why it's proposed as an alternative to doing anything.

The wall is going to increase the odds of apprehending illegal entrants & drug smugglers.

You see economic migrants flow whichever way the wind blows - we had more Mexicans leaving than entering during the recession - if they don't have work here, they'll leave for better climes, so you could definitely see many people leaving.

Yes, some businesses would be devastated, but if all businesses have to hire legal workers, all boats will rise with the tide (and rising wages) and prices will adjust accordingly. It's basic free market stuff.

You're correct that E-verify is just one part of a complex issue. And notice I didn't say it would fix the problem completely, but it would be a big step and help with a lot of issues. It's easy, low-hanging fruit to implement with large effects. A border wall will have a much smaller effect, and does absolutely nothing to address the 11-22 million already here illegally, whereas E-Verify will have at least a small effect, if not more on them.

Conduct raids on businesses much as you are now if you're concerned with the black market businesses. You should have a smaller pond in which to fish.

Trump should be trumpeting shame upon businesses who hire illegals - it's an easy target, you can call them un-American and un-Patriotic, and it riles up his base. It's a win for him and Republicans.

Ummm....no, it's not. Republicans don't own US Sweatshops? Ok dokie.

[old salt]

holmes said :
You see economic migrants flow whichever way the wind blows - we had more Mexicans leaving than entering during the recession - if they don't have work here, they'll leave for better climes, so you could definitely see many people leaving.

You're correct that E-verify is just one part of a complex issue. And notice I didn't say it would fix the problem completely, but it would be a big step and help with a lot of issues. It's easy, low-hanging fruit to implement with large effects. A border wall will have a much smaller effect, and does absolutely nothing to address the 11-22 million already here illegally, whereas E-Verify will have at least a small effect, if not more on them.

Mexican migrants are no longer the problem. They can now be expeditiously deported. Central American migrants are now the problem.

You can't impose E-verify until the other parts are in place to deal with the near term side effects.
You can't immediately remove the workforce here under fake ID, without crippling the economy.
When you legitimize the presence of the non-criminal workers among the 11-22 million already here, it will (rightly) be viewed as amnesty.
It will be a magnet to anyone in Central America seeking a better life, just as the asylum catch & release scam has become.

You can't activate that big magnet before you have viable border security, of which a physical barrier (aka wall) is an integral part.
These Central American migrants are also a big disruption & expense for Mexico, caused by our implementation of asylum laws.

[foreverlax]

The opinion of a nationally respected immigration attoryney


It’s more complicated than it seems but the long and the short of it is:

• States can’t really regulate in this space. The state laws on the books are largely unenforced and less than 20% of employers in the “mandatory” states actually use E-Verify…

• E-Verify could be improved and a good faith defense created for employers (if you use it then you’ve complied with the law) and as a result employers would voluntarily use it. But as of now it is a voluntary program (except for federal contractors) and only 10% of the nation’s employers participate.

• If E-Verify is mandatory that means _every_ American has to be able to prove s/he is authorized to work.

• Yes, it’s a good idea to include an improved E-Verify system in an improved immigration system but there are a few layers of interconnected issues that have to be addressed - protecting privacy of information, verifying identity without a national identity card, ensuring employers self-select to comply because there is no enforcement system that will work for 5 million employers (so you have to rely on the fact that the system works and most employers will do it), there is one known set of rules (no separate state systems), the system has to be accurate enough that US citizens will reliably be confirmed.

[jhu72]

11:45 -- 10/31/18

Not much news. Caravan traveled 30 miles yesterday to overnight in Juchitan de Zaragoza. No change in size or makeup noted. They have traveled about 40% of the way to Mexico City.