The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

The odds are excellent that you will leave this forum hating someone.
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

SCLaxAttack wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:18 pm I'm now going to take this post as an affirmation of your opinion and that of Women's Declaration international, an organization with a very specific agenda based on their beliefs, and the authors of the pdf.
That is correct. Their agenda is to defend and promote the rights of women, an agenda I fully endorse and support.

Another similar organization, based in the US, is the Women's Liberation Front (WoLF):

https://womensliberationfront.org
kramerica.inc
Posts: 6202
Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by kramerica.inc »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:07 pm
kramerica.inc wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 1:12 pm This isn't about gender or sexual discrimination.
Sororities generally accept people who they like OR are legacies.
She was neither liked OR a legacy.
Actually, it appears that for at least 18 sororities, it was entirely about gender.
We don't know whether the other 2 actually considered her or just went through the motions.

Of course, she might not have been "liked" as well. But we don't know.

But I think we can assume that this was about gender.
She certainly sounds like she has a good attitude about the effort to be considered and accepted.

CU77 says the sororities were "right" to reject her...would a sorority have been "wrong" to accept her?
Would that have equally been equally within their "rights" to do so?
Perhaps I mis-read, but it seems like she was up-front about advertising her journey through rush.
Many sorority and fraternity members I know would not have wanted to offer an invite someone who was doing it for a publicity stunt, or would be potentially documenting the ritual part of the pledge process.
a fan
Posts: 17525
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by a fan »

Brooklyn wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:47 pm
a fan wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:29 pm
Brooklyn wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 12:34 pm Discrimination! Blatant sexist discrimination. Shame on all of them.
:lol: Brookie, my man. Sororities and Fraternies ALREADY discriminate based on sex. Have been since they were invented.

Did you protest this practice in your college days?

Title IX wasn't around back then. ;)
:lol:
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:52 am Frankly, I've never fully understood people's great discomfort over the idea that someone might look at someone else sexually in a wide open locker room area...what, there aren't gay men that might look at me? Get over it.
So states a lifetime member of the bigger & stronger sex, a person who has never in his life had to worry about being sexually assaulted by someone who can easily overpower him.

Thanks for the mansplain.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

CU77 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:56 pm
SCLaxAttack wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 3:18 pm I'm now going to take this post as an affirmation of your opinion and that of Women's Declaration international, an organization with a very specific agenda based on their beliefs, and the authors of the pdf.
That is correct. Their agenda is to defend and promote the rights of women, an agenda I fully endorse and support.

Another similar organization, based in the US, is the Women's Liberation Front (WoLF):

https://womensliberationfront.org
They are specifically anti-trans, they have no other purpose.
Don't otherwise have any other women's "rights" issue.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

CU77 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 7:26 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:52 am Frankly, I've never fully understood people's great discomfort over the idea that someone might look at someone else sexually in a wide open locker room area...what, there aren't gay men that might look at me? Get over it.
So states a lifetime member of the bigger & stronger sex, a person who has never in his life had to worry about being sexually assaulted by someone who can easily overpower him.

Thanks for the mansplain.
You were talking about ogling, not physical safety.

yup, that's been my perspective as a heterosexual man; I'm not concerned about ogling... but re safety, if you don't think there are men who rape other men...I dunno...

I 100% agree with the concern about safety; I just don't buy for an instant that this trans person posed such a risk.

Moreover, I'd be quite concerned about her being in a men's locker room, and the risks not only of rape, but of getting beat up by transphobic men.

And, if there is such a concern for whoever might have a risk, there are ways to mediate that risk, which I described.
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

MDlaxfan76 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:13 pm They are specifically anti-trans, they have no other purpose.
Don't otherwise have any other women's "rights" issue.
Try doing a little reading:

https://womensliberationfront.org/2022-focus-statement
User avatar
NattyBohChamps04
Posts: 2171
Joined: Tue May 04, 2021 11:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by NattyBohChamps04 »

CU77 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 7:26 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:52 am Frankly, I've never fully understood people's great discomfort over the idea that someone might look at someone else sexually in a wide open locker room area...what, there aren't gay men that might look at me? Get over it.
So states a lifetime member of the bigger & stronger sex, a person who has never in his life had to worry about being sexually assaulted by someone who can easily overpower him.

Thanks for the mansplain.
Trans women are at much higher risk of sexual assault and violence and murder than women overall. Trans teens restricted from bathroom access are at higher risk for sexual assault than average. A few variables at play there obviously.

In the end, trans women aren't the ones doing nearly all the assaults in the US. Men pretending to be trans to assault people are also insanely rare.

Yes you can find the rare headlines over the years to say "look, look!". Buried in the mountain of headlines of trans people getting sexually assaulted and killed. Of the threats I have to teach my kids about as they grow up, actual trans people are pretty close to the bottom. Clergy are way, way higher for example sadly.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

CU77 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 9:20 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:13 pm They are specifically anti-trans, they have no other purpose.
Don't otherwise have any other women's "rights" issue.
Try doing a little reading:

https://womensliberationfront.org/2022-focus-statement
Yup, but those are cover for their only actual activity and agenda.

Come on '77, this isn't really that difficult."Try doing a little reading".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s ... ernational

Feel free to agree with their agenda, just don't be fooled by it.
DMac
Posts: 8689
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:02 am

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by DMac »

MDlaxfan76 wrote

Frankly, I've never fully understood people's great discomfort over the idea that someone might look at someone else sexually in a wide open locker room area...what, there aren't gay men that might look at me? Get over it. OR, and I'm perfectly fine with this, don't shower there, or, better yet, lobby management to provide some private stalls...
Given this mentality, what say ye about just having coed showers/locker rooms?
If we don't have coed showers/locker rooms, those with penises should not be allowed in the shower/locker rooms with those who don't. This aint hard...perhaps I should say difficult here. Put me in CU77's camp.
Brings a whole new twist to singin' in the shower though, eh?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfkktjfNgbo
User avatar
Brooklyn
Posts: 9589
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:16 am
Location: St Paul, Minnesota

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by Brooklyn »

DMac wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:34 am
Given this mentality, what say ye about just having coed showers/locker rooms?
If we don't have coed showers/locker rooms, those with penises should not be allowed in the shower/locker rooms with those who don't. This aint hard...perhaps I should say difficult here. Put me in CU77's camp.
Brings a whole new twist to singin' in the shower though, eh?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfkktjfNgbo

The Swedish and Norwegian military use coed showers and bedrooms. No problem there at all. :)
It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.

Charles Francis "Socker" Coe, Esq
DMac
Posts: 8689
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2018 10:02 am

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by DMac »

You betchya, we and our puritanical ways are real prudes and have a very unhealthy attitude about nudity in this country, IMO.
Given that though it makes for no penises in women's locker rooms/showers.
SCLaxAttack
Posts: 1528
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:24 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by SCLaxAttack »

But my daughter couldn't possibly lose to a "real" girl:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/sore-lose ... r?ref=home
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

I support investigations into whether or not a compettion was fair. Allowing boys to compete as girls, men to compete as women, is not fair.

So we could avoid these investigations if everyone would just agree to that basic principle.
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

DMac wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:38 pm You betchya, we and our puritanical ways are real prudes and have a very unhealthy attitude about nudity in this country, IMO.
Given that though it makes for no penises in women's locker rooms/showers.
Absolutely. If someone wants to advocate for full unisex facilities everywhere, they are free to do so.

Let's put it up for a popular vote. Since we're all such big believers in democracy around here, that's the fair way to do it, right?

And until then, no pensises in women's spaces.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

DMac wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:34 am
MDlaxfan76 wrote

Frankly, I've never fully understood people's great discomfort over the idea that someone might look at someone else sexually in a wide open locker room area...what, there aren't gay men that might look at me? Get over it. OR, and I'm perfectly fine with this, don't shower there, or, better yet, lobby management to provide some private stalls...
Given this mentality, what say ye about just having coed showers/locker rooms?
If we don't have coed showers/locker rooms, those with penises should not be allowed in the shower/locker rooms with those who don't. This aint hard...perhaps I should say difficult here. Put me in CU77's camp.
Brings a whole new twist to singin' in the shower though, eh?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfkktjfNgbo
As I said earlier, it’s entirely workable to have coed facilities, with private stalls.

That’s the serious best answer, not relegating trans to abuse.
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

Sure, with a massive nationwide construction project costing multiple billions of dollars.

And how does this work for lockerrooms and showers? Are there a bunch of private single-person changing rooms, each with its own shower and toilet?

Meanwhile, while we wait for Mdlaxfan to fund-raise the needed billions, how about this: women get penis-free lockerrooms, just like they've always had.
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

CU77 wrote: Fri Aug 19, 2022 2:24 pm Sure, with a massive nationwide construction project costing multiple billions of dollars.

And how does this work for lockerrooms and showers? Are there a bunch of private single-person changing rooms, each with its own shower and toilet?

Meanwhile, while we wait for Mdlaxfan to fund-raise the needed billions, how about this: women get penis-free lockerrooms, just like they've always had.
Nope, not billions.

In many shower situations, the shower stall is plenty large enough to hang your clothes, small bench, step inside shower, all private...sinks etc are genderless. Easy enough to adapt.

In the meantime, women who want that sort of privacy can demand it of whatever institution they belong to. Sure, it does cost to renovate. Women who care about that (or men) should push for it. Or...not get hung up about an actual trans woman being in the same locker room. It's a choice.

However, in new construction, it's simple to build out that way from the get go. That's what I was seeing in Europe.

Again, the trans woman in your article clearly was quite committed to being trans and was extremely unlikely to be any sort of risk to those women. Far more likely to get assaulted walking to the parking lot than with her in the locker room.
User avatar
CU77
Posts: 3463
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:49 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by CU77 »

Now we can argue about which accommodations are reasonable and which requests conflict with or undermine the rights of other groups like women who need legal recognition as a sex class and spaces free from males, and children who need special protections from indoctrination and medical experimentation. A conversation about reasonable accommodations is a nuanced conversation. Instead, we got a radical trans movement that wants to erase sex in law and society, put men in women's prisons and boys in girls' sports, and run an unregulated medical experiment on gender-nonconforming children.

What we have now is a trans movement that has adopted radical ideologies about biology and, in doing so, now seeks to erase sex in law and society. This has given rise to an absurd and dystopian reality where men are granted access to women’s prisons, sports, and other protected spaces, and where gender-nonconforming children have become the target of unregulated medical experiments that involve puberty blocking drugs, cross-sex hormones, and extreme surgeries.
https://www.realityslaststand.com/p/tra ... -not-taken

551d2d3d-6bd7-45a2-858f-abd5d55117b2_1800x1200.jpeg
551d2d3d-6bd7-45a2-858f-abd5d55117b2_1800x1200.jpeg (115.4 KiB) Viewed 597 times
User avatar
MDlaxfan76
Posts: 25666
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm

Re: The Hate Directed at the LGBTQ+

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

well, I think you've made your views clear '77, but your sources ain't persuasive.
At least not to me, and I'm a far cry from a radical anything...
Post Reply

Return to “POLITICS”