All Things China

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dislaxxic
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All Things China

Post by dislaxxic »

Who's heard of the "Belt and Road" project?

me neither...

China's Road to Global Dominance

Is The Don the guy to lead us (April, 2019) in this vital area?

A little more on Belt and Road

..
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old salt
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Re: All Things China

Post by old salt »

dislaxxic wrote: Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:58 am Who's heard of the "Belt and Road" project?

me neither...

China's Road to Global Dominance

Is The Don the guy to lead us (April, 2019) in this vital area?

A little more on Belt and Road..
BBC, PBS & NPR have been reporting on it since inception.

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/business-39 ... t-one-road

Google "PBS or NPR" with "one belt one road" or "silk road" for lots of good explainers.
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Re: All Things China

Post by holmes435 »

Yeah, I remember hearing about this a while ago, but I certainly welcome it being brought to light more. Lots of people haven't heard of it yet.

There are a bunch of things we need to be keeping an eye on - their forays into Africa and how they are trying to shape their area of the world and keep countries from dealing with and allying with the US.

Here's an interesting article about Thailand relying on Huawei for their 5G network and the risks it means to which side they may take in the future: https://www.npr.org/2019/03/27/70735809 ... 5g-network
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Re: All Things China

Post by old salt »

China is in the midst of building a significant naval base in Djibouti, on the Horn of Africa.
Adjacent to a significant US base. A very strategic location.
The Chinese are also building a naval base in Pakistan.

The USS San Pablo is enroute to join the Fifth Fleet.
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Re: All Things China

Post by OCanada »

I was in Manaus, Brazil just before the World Cup. Manaus is at the merge of the Amazon and the Rio Negro. About 1,800 miles from Rio. It was the site. of the World Cup game in the rain forest. They were finishing the athletes housing and some visitor’s housing. Out of curiosity I asked my guide how much the condos would sell for. His answer was about 1.5 million dollars. I was stunned. It was the middle of the jungle. He said the Chinese were buying everything. They are also heavily investing in the states. In Naples FL after the 2008 fiasco they were buying 40 or more houses at a time.

One of the biggest boosts we have given China has been backing away from green energy and pulling out of the TPP.

After WW ll our redevelopment plan originally thought China would provide the markets where Japan would sell its goods. Japan’s infrastructure was not almost destroyed by the war and MacArthur opposed leveling it. There was sentiment to eliminate manufacturing in both Japan and Germany. Mao’s victory ended the market idea for Japan.

By some measures China is already the strongest economy in the world. The consensus is by standard measures they will be by 2050 at the latest.

China is buying commodities and influence with its investment strategies and seem to be doing it well. We are withdrawing from engagement and calling into question our role globally. A role we carved out and created. The EU evolved our of that plan.
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Re: All Things China

Post by OCanada »

TPP decision

When the United States withdrew from Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP), it forfeited strategic advantages and economic benefits that would likely have emerged through the mega trade deal and partnership with 11 other economies, according to findings presented in a new study.

TPP afforded clear economic advantages and a template for containing China and addressing its flouting of international trade rules, said co-lead author Ian Sheldon, a professor in the Department of Agricultural, Environmental, and Development Economics at The Ohio State University.

“TPP expanded beyond the remit of the WTO in an effort to deal with issues sensitive to China,” said Sheldon, Anderson Chair of Agricultural Marketing, Policy and Trade. “It had the clear potential to push China to play by the rules and stop stealing intellectual property, stop forcing American firms to hand over technology through joint ventures and put an end to China’s practice of sponsoring firms that are state owned enterprises.”

The study appears in the November 2018 issue of the University of Pennsylvania Journal of Law & Public Affairs.

Sheldon and co-author Professor Daniel C.K. Chow, of The Ohio State University Moritz College of Law, explain in detail the likely consequences from the termination of the nearly eight-year effort by the Obama administration to create the world’s largest free trade zone. While the article is not intended to be a lesson in what could have been, the study’s timeliness will not be lost on those trying to make sense of the current Administration’s attempts to reduce the U.S. trade deficit and force China to the bargaining table by imposing import tariffs on $200 billion of Chinese goods.

“We hope that current law and policymakers will read the article because it is not too late for the U.S. to reverse course and rejoin the TPP,” said Chow. “But time is a factor because if China first joins then China could make it much more difficult for the United States to reenter the TPP.”

Although President Trump announced that the withdrawal was justified because TPP did not align with, “…the policy of my Administration to represent the American people…and to create fair and economically beneficial trade deals that serve their interests…”*, the authors of the article argue that the Administration seems to have ignored or at least been unaware of the likely negative consequences of the decision.

“Trump wants a quick fix to the U.S. trade relationship with China, but it is a much more nuanced problem,” said Sheldon. “We have lost the opportunity to drive the trade playbook in the Asia-Pacific region.”

According to conclusions drawn from a large body of economic studies analyzed in the article, the U.S. plan to complete TPP without China was strategic. China would have been forced to choose between either rejecting TPP and losing the trade benefits that would have come with membership, or joining TPP and being subjected to tough new standards that addressed U.S. concerns regarding China’s most controversial trade practices.

“The strategy of the Obama Administration was to box China in through the use of the TPP and force China to make some tough choices,” said Chow. “It looked to be an effective approach and could have laid the foundation for a new way to limit China’s distortions of international trade.”

Excluding China from TPP led the country to initiate talks in 2012 for the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership (RCEP), a competing free trade agreement for Asia which when completed and in effect, will include 45% of the world’s population and 40% of world trade. RCEP does not include provisions on environmental protections, workers’ rights or technology transfer and gives China the pen to write the trade playbook for Asia for the twenty first century.

Another interesting insight of the article is that in addition to the negative economic consequences of pulling out of TPP, the U.S. has also alienated key allies through application of tariffs on steel imports from the European Union, Japan and Canada, undermining any multilateral pressure being placed on China.

“If President Trump manages to get China to play by the rules during the 90-day trade truce, that would be a good thing,” said Sheldon. “However, collective action on trade rules is stronger than unilateral or bilateral action, and remember, it took eight years and 12 countries to figure out TPP.”

Read the full study.

*MEMORANDUM FOR THE UNITED STATES TRADE REPRESENTATIVE, SUBJECT: Withdrawal of the United States from the Trans-Pacific Partnership Negotiations and Agreement.

Source Contacts:
Professor Ian Sheldon
614-292-2194
[email protected]

Professor Dan K. Chow
614) 292-0948
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Re: All Things China

Post by runrussellrun »

If you could provide a direct link to the actual TPP agreement/language, it would be awesome.

Because, clearly, THIS can't be part of it

https://ustr.gov/sites/default/files/TP ... onment.pdf

because, this sure reads to many, that the TPP enforces NOTHING, collectively. Every country for itself, especially with this kind of language.
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Re: All Things China

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The U.S. Can’t Make Allies Take Sides Over China

"Italy’s snub may appear to be yet another sign that American power is on the wane while China’s is on the rise. Score: China 1, United States 0. But Italy’s decision is even more an indication of how such thinking has become dangerously out of date in the modern world order. While Washington still often perceives foreign policy in us-against-them terms, much of the rest of the world no longer does. That’s why in its attempts to contain China, the U.S. is discovering, to its dismay, that its allies aren’t always on board."

..
"The purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure poor reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog." - Calvin, to Hobbes
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Re: All Things China

Post by runrussellrun »

dislaxxic wrote: Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:05 am The U.S. Can’t Make Allies Take Sides Over China

"Italy’s snub may appear to be yet another sign that American power is on the wane while China’s is on the rise. Score: China 1, United States 0. But Italy’s decision is even more an indication of how such thinking has become dangerously out of date in the modern world order. While Washington still often perceives foreign policy in us-against-them terms, much of the rest of the world no longer does. That’s why in its attempts to contain China, the U.S. is discovering, to its dismay, that its allies aren’t always on board."

..
What do you think of this:

“We are concerned that while some of these efforts may seem innocuous when taken independently, collectively they represent an attempt to increase the appeal of autocracy and strengthen Chinese leverage over U.S. allies,” said the senators. “We want to make clear that we believe our government should welcome transparent diplomacy from all nations. We recognize that the United States and many nations around the world engage in public relations and strategic communications efforts designed to improve the nation's public image, shape international policy debates, and promote economic opportunities. These efforts are fundamentally different from those that seek to suppress information, and undermine democratic institutions and internationally accepted human rights.”

The senators continued, “We firmly believe the United States must continue to support the free and transparent flow of information and the independence of democratic institutions from undue influence, particularly when other governments are seeking to undermine them. Indeed, without developing a clear strategy to counter these efforts, the independence of democratic societies may be at risk. That risk extends beyond the borders of our allies – for one of democracy’s greatest defenses against autocracy is the support of other likeminded nations.”

The letter is co-signed by U.S. Senators Michael Bennet (D-Colo.), Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio), Catherine Cortez Masto (D-Nev.), Ted Cruz (R-Texas), Cory Gardner (R-Colo.), Angus King (I-Maine), Ed Markey (D-Mass.), Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.), Gary Peters (D-Mich.), Marco Rubio (R-Fla.), and Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.).


https://www.coons.senate.gov/newsroom/p ... -democracy

nothing?????? exactly
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Re: All Things China

Post by dislaxxic »

Anything Brown, Coons and Warren are behind - in this regard - has my support.

..
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Re: All Things China

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dislaxxic wrote: Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:05 am The U.S. Can’t Make Allies Take Sides Over China

"Italy’s snub may appear to be yet another sign that American power is on the wane while China’s is on the rise. Score: China 1, United States 0. But Italy’s decision is even more an indication of how such thinking has become dangerously out of date in the modern world order. While Washington still often perceives foreign policy in us-against-them terms, much of the rest of the world no longer does. That’s why in its attempts to contain China, the U.S. is discovering, to its dismay, that its allies aren’t always on board."
Heard on BBC yesterday that the Brits are going ahead with Huawei for 5G, sticking a thumb in their allies 4 Eyes.
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Re: All Things China

Post by old salt »

Sacre bleu ! French warship completes Freedom of Navigation transit of Taiwan straits, raining on China's naval parade.
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Re: All Things China

Post by OCanada »

You know VOA is a political agency?

The attempt by China to extend its territorial water is not new and is a source of conflict now and in the future. My take is we will continue to push back but China is becoming more aggressive at a time we are retrenching in many ways making hard power our go to. That is dangerous imo


The Chinese navy warned off a French warship which entered the Taiwan Strait earlier this month, Beijing said on Thursday, adding that it had submitted an official protest to Paris over the move.

According to the Chinese Defence Ministry, the French warship “illegally entered China’s territorial waters” on 7 April.

Reuters has, meanwhile, cited a French Defence Ministry source as saying that the French navy “transits through the Taiwan Strait once a year on average without any incident or reaction”. Paris, has, meanwhile, stressed that it affirms right to “freedom of shipping” amid spat with China over the Taiwan Strait passages, AFP reports.



This comes after Taiwan’s Ministry of National Defence (MND) said earlier this month that two Chinese J-11 fighter jets had crossed the Taiwan Strait’s “median line” on 31 March, prompting Taipei to scramble several aircraft in order to intercept the warplanes.



Also, the 7 April French warship incident comes amid regular passages by US Navy ships through the strategic waterway. In late March, the US Navy’s Seventh Fleet said in a statement that they had sent the naval destroyer USS Curtis Wilbur and the Coast Guard cutter Bertholf through the Taiwan Strait.

The statement pointed out that the ships had “conducted a routine Taiwan Strait transit [on] 24-25 March (local time) in accordance with international law.”

READ MORE: US Warships Cross Strait Between China and Taiwan Amid Trade Row

Beijing made a representation to Washington over the US warships’ passage, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Geng Shuang sai
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Re: All Things China

Post by old salt »

You know VOA is a political agency?
Huh ? I saw this Reuters report.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-taiw ... SKCN1S10Q7
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Re: All Things China

Post by OCanada »

Referenced it because VOA ran a blurb. Poorly worded. Sorry
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Re: All Things China

Post by old salt »

old salt wrote: Thu Apr 25, 2019 12:56 pm
dislaxxic wrote: Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:05 am The U.S. Can’t Make Allies Take Sides Over China

"Italy’s snub may appear to be yet another sign that American power is on the wane while China’s is on the rise. Score: China 1, United States 0. But Italy’s decision is even more an indication of how such thinking has become dangerously out of date in the modern world order. While Washington still often perceives foreign policy in us-against-them terms, much of the rest of the world no longer does. That’s why in its attempts to contain China, the U.S. is discovering, to its dismay, that its allies aren’t always on board."
Heard on BBC yesterday that the Brits are going ahead with Huawei for 5G, sticking a thumb in their allies 4 Eyes.
BBC backed off on that report today, saying it was based on a leak from the Brit's NSC.

Much angst as their NSC investigates the leak. .:oops:. welcome to our world.
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Re: All Things China

Post by dislaxxic »

Washington Is Dismissing China’s Belt and Road. That’s a Huge Strategic Mistake.

"Last week, leaders and officials representing more than three dozen countries from across the world gathered in Beijing for the second Belt and Road summit. The event marks the two-year anniversary since China first convened its flagship initiative to coordinate trillions of dollars of infrastructure across Eurasia and the Indian Ocean in a broad effort to recreate the old Silk Roads.

One nation that was missing from the summit: The U.S.

The fashionable position in Washington today is to dismiss the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) as a power play that won’t last—an attempt at neocolonial debt trap diplomacy, in which China uses unpayable debts to control less powerful states, that is ultimately destined to collapse under the weight of financially spurious projects. On the other hand, there are also those who view BRI as a serious threat—a sign of China’s continued quest for global hegemony and the presence of a new Cold War between the U.S. and China.

Either way, the U.S. position so far has been to shrug at China’s new initiative. In this, Washington is making a grave mistake."


..
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Re: All Things China

Post by OCanada »

Essentially giving China Asian markets was a huge mistake. China has made significant inroads around the globe. It gets down played by those wanting a different narrative but the fact remains they have established presence in countries around the world. One of them is here. They have purchased a lot of real estate and moved money here. They buy our debt meanwhile they are working to establish a global alternative to the dollar as the world’s default currency.

They also have a very big presence in Brazil
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Re: All Things China

Post by old salt »

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Re: All Things China

Post by OCanada »

China has lifted 800 million out of poverty. They should be part of our solution but instead Trump
has raised tariffs again which are paid for by us. Trump is lying when he says otherwise. But then he said tariff wars as easy to win
Last edited by OCanada on Fri May 10, 2019 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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