A suggestion about trolling...

[Matnum PI]

The Putin Rule: Posts that are characterized by misinformation/disinformation, outright lies, and all tactics designed to insult, inflame, divide, undermine faith in democracy, make civil discourse impossible, etc. This may be a good solution for our Trolling issue. Definitely relevant for the Politics Forum and also relevant to the Lacrosse Forums.

[MDlaxfan76]

The Putin Rule: Posts that are characterized by misinformation/disinformation, outright lies, and all tactics designed to insult, inflame, divide, undermine faith in democracy, make civil discourse impossible, etc. This may be a good solution for our Trolling issue. Definitely relevant for the Politics Forum and also relevant to the Lacrosse Forums.

seacoaster posted this on "media matters" and I think it's relevant to understanding the stakes on the larger stage. This forum is a tiny piece of the challenge, but we see the same behaviors here. We can and should take a stand against it.

Seacoaster:
I’ll park this here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... s-were-it/

“In 2015, word spread online that a routine military exercise in the southwest, called Jade Helm 15, was a plot by President Barack Obama to impose martial law and seize everyone’s guns. The paranoia was “fueled by conservative bloggers and Internet postings,” the New York Times reported. So far did the claim spread that Gov. Greg Abbott ordered the Texas State Guard to monitor the exercise.

At the time, Americans responded to such bizarre online happenings with exasperation and bemusement. But the paranoia was fueled by more than conservative bloggers and Internet postings. Former CIA director Michael Hayden later said that Russian propagandists were behind the campaign. They were probing for vulnerabilities to disinformation — and found them. “At that point I think they made the decision, ‘We’re going to play in the electoral process,’” Hayden said.
Americans are no longer so naive about foreign attacks on our information space. The news media, the government and the public did a better job of recognizing and resisting information warfare from outside adversaries in 2020 than four years earlier.
But what if a far larger, more sophisticated and more ruthless disinformation campaign against American democracy originated within the United States? Would we recognize and respond to the threat? The answer so far is no — or, at best, only partially.

Most people regard Republicans’ #StopTheSteal campaign, also known as the “big lie,” as an attempt to re-litigate the 2020 election and pander to a radicalized, Trumpy base. It is that, but it is also a massive and devastatingly effective deployment of Russian-style information warfare against American democracy — by Americans themselves — with an eye toward the future. We should think of it not as a momentary partisan outburst but a kind of epistemic 9/11: a moment when a menace that has been developing for years reaches maturity and displays its full prowess.

Attacks on the concept of objective truth are not new. Left-wing attacks on objectivity date at least to the 1970s, with the rise of academic trends such as deconstructionism and postmodernism. Not long after, conservative media began attacking truth systematically, for example, through the rise of demagogues like Rush Limbaugh, who railed against the “four corners of deceit” (government, academia, science and the media).

The digital era raised the stakes by making misinformation easy to spread. GamerGate and online trolls refined viral outrage. Anti-vaccine groups pioneered digitally amplified misinformation. Russia spread divisive hoaxes and conspiracy theories. Misinformation became weaponized as disinformation — not a mistake but an intentional obfuscation created by those with interests at stake.

Specialists in the U.S. intelligence and military communities understand the power of information warfare to divide, disorient and demoralize the public. The Army Cyber Institute at the U.S. Military Academy has published a graphic novel warning against it. But few others have paid much attention, and many who do still blame cognitive bias and social media.

The rise of Donald Trump brought a turning point. He and his allies in conservative media and Republican politics seized upon Russian-style disinformation techniques and applied them to domestic politics. In his 2016 campaign, Trump lied so frequently and flagrantly that the media couldn’t keep up and the public lost track, a favorite Russian tactic known as the fire hose of falsehood.

With the #StopTheSteal campaign, the turning point became a point of no return. In April 2020, Trump launched a propaganda onslaught against mail-in balloting. Much as the Russians had used Jade Helm 15 to test their disinformation methods, Trump used the attack on mail-in balloting to organize the propaganda campaign he would launch if he lost the election. The already-high rate of Trump’s falsehoods ticked up sharply. After he lost, he and his allies unleashed a flood of exaggerations, lies and conspiracy theories through the White House, conservative media, social media and even the courts.

#StopTheSteal is not merely Trump’s way of being a sore loser or clinging to relevance (though it is those things). It is the most audacious disinformation campaign ever attempted against Americans by any actor, foreign or domestic. And it has been devastatingly effective. According to a recent Ipsos-Reuters poll, the majority of Republicans think the 2020 election was stolen, and almost half of independents either think the election was rigged or are unsure. Vladimir Putin could only dream of creating so much cynicism, doubt and distrust.

The “big lie” is a wake-up call, and not just about Trump. Even today, most scholars and commentators talk about America’s rising levels of polarization, extremism, and distrust of institutions and expertise as if they were natural disasters or products of generalized forces such as social media quirks, institutions’ failings and individuals’ gullibility. While those explanations have validity, they miss the more immediate threat: For years, Americans have been targeted with epistemic warfare — that is, with attacks on the credibility of the mainstream media, academia, government agencies, and other institutions and professionals we rely on to keep us collectively moored to facts. Those doing the targeting are nameable individuals and organizations, including Trump, conservative media outlets, Republican politicians, anti-vaccine groups and Russia’s Internet Research Agency.

Since epistemic warfare has proved its mettle so spectacularly in U.S. politics, it is likely here for good. Measures may allow us to fight back, such as revamping social media and teaching media literacy. But our primary means of defense is to be awake to the scope and origin of the threat. The first step toward winning the war on truth is to accept that we are in one.”

[Bart]

And it never ends.

[wgdsr]

And it never ends.

it really doesn't.

[Bart]

And it never ends.

it really doesn't.

yep..........it really doesn't

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

Why is this a topic at all in this thread?

What does it matter to you?
The small number of topics/posts/posters result in things meandering in this forum.

[Seacoaster(1)]

Sigh.

[DMac]

Sigh.

+179

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

Sigh.

+179

You guys are waaaaaay too rigid--seriously. What in the world is sigh worthy about me expressing appreciation for what Bart said? I choose to use a GIF where DMac chooses to use +179. You both really need to lighten up and get over yourselves.

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

Bart wrote
Now if I were to have a team I would gladly take either and I can enjoy what both bring to the field but to me Ms Appuzzo is the more rounded player per stats.

Move this up to the pro league and it becomes clearly evident who the more rounded player is/was. North was chosen first the first week and I think one other time. Meanwhile, Mastroianni was chosen first several times (a more well rounded player). Had Appuzzo not been the Captain doing the choosing so many weeks she likely would have been the first choice every time over North...well rounded matters. CN is a force, to say she's a one trick pony is shorting her, but saying she's a well rounded player is not seeing her for what she is.

Who said North was a well rounded player?

[Seacoaster(1)]

Sigh.

+179

You guys are waaaaaay too rigid--seriously. What in the world is sigh worthy about me expressing appreciation for what Bart said? I choose to use a GIF where DMac chooses to use +179. You both really need to lighten up and get over yourselves.

I probably should have just walked on by. But I think the little video clips are annoying -- and probably intended, at some level, to annoy. Maybe you could keep them for your private thread and not burden the rest of us with them elsewhere? I know: you get to do what you want within the "Charter." I just think you are unnecessarily tedious. Have a good day.

[MDlaxfan76]

Why is this a topic at all in this thread?

What does it matter to you?
The small number of topics/posts/posters result in things meandering in this forum.

It doesn't.
Just that if people wish to grind on the exact same subject over and over again, the usual practice is to create a specific thread for such, and then to confine the back and forth on that subject to there...no hard and fast rule, but it enables other readers and posters to have some level of reasonable expectation as to where to find discussions they are interested in...and which they wish to avoid.

Back to being polite, some courtesy to other readers and posters.
It's pretty clear that some posters aren't interested in such courtesy, they wish only to battle.

The word that seacoaster just used was 'tedious'. Fits.

so, I asked...if the North discussion and its various permutations are relevant to this thread's title, I don't see it as yet...

[DMac]

Sigh.

+179

You guys are waaaaaay too rigid--seriously. What in the world is sigh worthy about me expressing appreciation for what Bart said? I choose to use a GIF where DMac chooses to use +179. You both really need to lighten up and get over yourselves.

I probably should have just walked on by. But I think the little video clips are annoying -- and probably intended, at some level, to annoy. Maybe you could keep them for your private thread and not burden the rest of us with them elsewhere? I know: you get to do what you want within the "Charter." I just think you are unnecessarily tedious. Have a good day.

Agree....and oh, Dear Admin, Please lock and shut down the OuttaNowhereWregget—Opinions, photos, highlights, news, etc. thread as it is no longer of any use. The need for attention and spreading of horseschidt everywhere has made the thread obsolete. TIA.

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

Sigh.

+179

You guys are waaaaaay too rigid--seriously. What in the world is sigh worthy about me expressing appreciation for what Bart said? I choose to use a GIF where DMac chooses to use +179. You both really need to lighten up and get over yourselves.

I probably should have just walked on by. But I think the little video clips are annoying -- and probably intended, at some level, to annoy. Maybe you could keep them for your private thread and not burden the rest of us with them elsewhere? I know: you get to do what you want within the "Charter." I just think you are unnecessarily tedious. Have a good day.

Now that's just your preference Seacoaster, and you know it. Matnum P.I. uses GIF's all the time, right out in the open, all over the site. Indeed, it was he who inspired me to use them in the first place. You don't like GIF's and YouTube video clips--fine. That's your opinion which you are entitled to. But don't read ulterior motives into them and speak for the whole when it comes to how I choose to use them. That's annoying and unnecessarily tedious. As Matnum expressed in another place--the GIF/YT video clip expresses it much better than I choose to with words in a given context. That's my right and privilege as a card carrying member of FanLax.

[MDlaxfan76]

APD.

[DMac]

Second request, please Admin, shut down the OuttaNowhereWregget—Opinions, photos, highlights, news, etc. thread, it is redundant and no longer serves a purpose as its intent is being completely ignored by its originator.

[Seacoaster(1)]

Sigh.

+179

You guys are waaaaaay too rigid--seriously. What in the world is sigh worthy about me expressing appreciation for what Bart said? I choose to use a GIF where DMac chooses to use +179. You both really need to lighten up and get over yourselves.

I probably should have just walked on by. But I think the little video clips are annoying -- and probably intended, at some level, to annoy. Maybe you could keep them for your private thread and not burden the rest of us with them elsewhere? I know: you get to do what you want within the "Charter." I just think you are unnecessarily tedious. Have a good day.

Now that's just your preference Seacoaster, and you know it. Matnum P.I. uses GIF's all the time, right out in the open, all over the site. Indeed, it was he who inspired me to use them in the first place. You don't like GIF's and YouTube video clips--fine. That's your opinion which you are entitled to. But don't read ulterior motives into them and speak for the whole when it comes to how I choose to use them. That's annoying and unnecessarily tedious. As Matnum expressed in another place--the GIF/YT video clip expresses it much better than I choose to with words in a given context. That's my right and privilege as a card carrying member of FanLax.

Yes, I mentioned that your default to virtually any criticism of advice is that you "'get to do what you want within the "Charter.'" It's part of what makes you tedious. And I'm being kind.

[OuttaNowhereWregget]

I probably should have just walked on by. But I think the little video clips are annoying -- and probably intended, at some level, to annoy. Maybe you could keep them for your private thread and not burden the rest of us with them elsewhere? I know: you get to do what you want within the "Charter." I just think you are unnecessarily tedious. Have a good day.

Now that's just your preference Seacoaster, and you know it. Matnum P.I. uses GIF's all the time, right out in the open, all over the site. Indeed, it was he who inspired me to use them in the first place. You don't like GIF's and YouTube video clips--fine. That's your opinion which you are entitled to. But don't read ulterior motives into them and speak for the whole when it comes to how I choose to use them. That's annoying and unnecessarily tedious. As Matnum expressed in another place--the GIF/YT video clip expresses it much better than I choose to with words in a given context. That's my right and privilege as a card carrying member of FanLax.

Yes, I mentioned that your default to virtually any criticism of advice is that you "'get to do what you want within the "Charter.'" It's part of what makes you tedious. And I'm being kind.

So which is it--you criticizing and advising me against my use of video clips? Or asserting my right to express myself the way I choose within the rules on Fanlax? Your original comments were regarding my use of video clips.

You know Seacoaster--since you feel entitled to continue to make personal attacks against me--I'll offer a little feedback to you. What makes you tedious are your condescending, nasty comments. It is a subtle form of bullying and intimidation--plain and simple. I don't appreciate it.

[Seacoaster(1)]

I probably should have just walked on by. But I think the little video clips are annoying -- and probably intended, at some level, to annoy. Maybe you could keep them for your private thread and not burden the rest of us with them elsewhere? I know: you get to do what you want within the "Charter." I just think you are unnecessarily tedious. Have a good day.

Now that's just your preference Seacoaster, and you know it. Matnum P.I. uses GIF's all the time, right out in the open, all over the site. Indeed, it was he who inspired me to use them in the first place. You don't like GIF's and YouTube video clips--fine. That's your opinion which you are entitled to. But don't read ulterior motives into them and speak for the whole when it comes to how I choose to use them. That's annoying and unnecessarily tedious. As Matnum expressed in another place--the GIF/YT video clip expresses it much better than I choose to with words in a given context. That's my right and privilege as a card carrying member of FanLax.

Yes, I mentioned that your default to virtually any criticism of advice is that you "'get to do what you want within the "Charter.'" It's part of what makes you tedious. And I'm being kind.

So which is it--you criticizing and advising me against my use of video clips? Or asserting my right to express myself the way I choose within the rules on Fanlax? Your original comments were regarding my use of video clips.

You know Seacoaster--since you feel entitled to continue to make personal attacks against me--I'll offer a little feedback to you. What makes you tedious are your condescending, nasty comments. It is a subtle form of bullying and intimidation--plain and simple. I don't appreciate it.

Thanks for the feedback. I confess I can be condescending on occasion. But I am not bullying anyone. And "intimidating" is just a silly thing to say. I am only suggesting (and I confess, I strongly suspected or knew this would be the outcome) that you take heed of the several, perhaps many, posters who take you to task for the manner in which you engage people, the sometimes awkward things you post, and your -- ready? -- sort of childish insistence on having your way, irrespective of the expressions of distaste that your posts occasionally get. I think communities like this one are based less on a "Charter" than on a give and take of acceptable and accepted conduct. It's all fine; carry on.

[DMac]

You have your very own thread you created, ONW, stay in there as was your original intent and your sensitivities are far less likely to be challenged.