Who won the 2020 Presidential election?

[seacoaster]

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/artic ... unbeatable

"U.S. financial markets are outperforming the world by the biggest margin in the 21st century, and with good reason: America’s economy improved more in Joe Biden's first 12 months than any president during the past 50 years notwithstanding the contrary media narrative contributing to dour public opinion.

Exceptional returns from dollar-denominated assets, especially the S&P 500 Index in both absolute terms and relative to its global counterparts, can be attributed to record-low debt ratios enabling companies to reap the biggest profit margins since 1950. Corporate America is booming because the Biden administration's Covid-19 vaccination programs and $1.9 trillion American Rescue Plan reduced the jobless rate to 4.2% in November from 6.2% in February, continuing an unprecedented rate of decline during the Covid-19 pandemic.

Consider that real, or inflation adjusted, gross domestic product surged at an average annual rate of 5.03% in each of the first three quarters of 2021, and is poised to expand 5.6% for the year based on the average estimate of more than 80 economists surveyed Bloomberg. If that forecast proves accurate, it would be more than 2.8 times the average between 2000 and 2019 and double the average since 1976.

All of which makes Biden's first year in the White House the standout among the seven previous presidents, based on 10 market and economic indicators given equal weight. According to data compiled by Bloomberg, no one comes close to matching Biden's combination of No. 1 and No. 2 rankings for each of the measures:

Gross domestic product (1)
Profit growth (1)
S&P 500 performance (2)
Consumer credit (1)
Non-farm payrolls (2)
Manufacturing jobs (2)
Business productivity (2)
Dollar appreciation (2)
S&P 500 relative performance (2)

Per capita disposable income, which rose 1.08% this year, is the only comparable weakness for Biden, trailing Donald Trump’s 2.17%, George W. Bush’s 2.01%, Jimmy Carter’s 1.80% and Ronald Reagan’s 1.42%.

GDP growth in every incoming administration during the past four decades never exceeded 2.74% until 2021. Biden is now positioned to surpass Carter (5.01%) as the GDP champion of presidents since 1976. Much of the credit goes to The American Rescue Plan, which poured $66 billion into 36 million households and reduced the child poverty rate by 50%, helping the U.S. recover faster from the pandemic than most other nations.

Corporate America was never healthier than under Biden in 2021. Efforts to support consumers flowed through to America’s companies, which are enjoying profit margins of around 15%, the widest since 1950, according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis. Non-financial profit increased 39.3%, making Biden No. 1 among eight presidents with Obama a distant second at 21.6%.

The boom times have allowed companies to reduce net debt as a percentage of earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization to the lowest since data was compiled in 1990 for companies in the S&P 500. All this helps explain why the stock market under Biden is second only to George H.W. Bush of any incoming president since Carter.

Americans are certainly feeling good. Consumer credit surged $196 billion through October, a record under Biden that is 27% more than the increase under No. 2 Donald Trump ($154 billion). Although some of the gains reflect a rebound from 2020 when the pandemic caused many consumers to retrench, they wouldn’t be adding debt if they weren’t feeling confident.

The way the jobs market is improving, it’s not hard to see why consumers are in such a good mood. Biden is the only president over the past half century with robust increases in non-farm payrolls (4.3%) and manufacturing jobs (2.6%), approaching the gains enjoyed by Carter in general employment (4.6%) and factory workers (3.9%). Trump, who inherited the longest expansion in modern times and said in 2015 he would “be greatest jobs producer that God ever created,” is an also-ran, with non-farm and manufacturing payrolls inching up 1.4% and 1.3%, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

Companies need all the workers they can get. U.S. business output, a measure of productivity, increased 4.4%, putting Biden ahead of every predecessor except Carter, where it gained 6.25%. No wonder confidence among chief executive officers of the largest U.S. companies soared to a record this year as expectations for hiring, capital investment and sales improved. The Business Roundtable's CEO Economic Outlook index, launched in 2004, rose 10 points to 124 in the fourth quarter, the highest in 20 years.

America’s economy is the envy of the world, looking at the foreign-exchange market. The dollar has strengthened 7.37% this year. That is the most under a first-year president since the greenback gained 17.8% for Reagan, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

In another sign that the U.S. economy is a global leader under Biden, U.S. stocks outperformed the world equity market by 6.3 percentage points, the widest advantage since 1988, when George H.W. Bush was in the White House, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

The good times may extend into 2022. Biden's bipartisan $1.2 trillion Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act bodes well for the economy and American labor because it will rebuild the nation's deteriorating roads and bridges as well as fund climate and broadband initiatives that create jobs. Even Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, who said his priority was preventing the Biden agenda, voted for the law along with 18 fellow Republicans.

Biden, like Carter, now faces the political fallout of the accelerating inflation from global supply chain breakdowns associated with the pandemic even though maintaining stable inflation and interest rates are the primary responsibility of the Federal Reserve, and the Fed said it's prepared to tighten monetary policy in 2022.

Biden, unlike Carter, benefits from the $29 trillion U.S. debt market. In contrast to the 1970s and early 1980s, confidence in the Fed’s ability to get inflation back under control is unimpaired, reflected in the yield on the benchmark 10-year Treasury note fluctuating below 1.7% as inflation hovers at 4.1%. When Carter was in the White House, investors lost confidence in the Fed, evidenced by the 10-year yield rising to 12.6% with inflation reaching 9.65%.

The clear message from the market that tells all other markets what to do is that the people with the most at stake are betting on the Biden economy."

[MDlaxfan76]

Of course, this too above is not the point of this thread.

Not who we wished won, or who we are glad won, but rather simply who actually did win.

Democracy.

And we have 5 of us who apparently believe the guy with fewer votes, both general populace and Electoral College, actually was the rightful winner.

Who, other than get it to X, wants to say they're in the Big Lie cult?

[RedFromMI]

In an interview for a show on evangelist Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel Trump actually utters the phrase “if we had won the election” talking about the Wall…

So I guess even he is now admitting he actually lost…

[Kismet]

This "cult" of yours appears to be a little bigger than you think. More than half of voters in this October 2021 Rasmussen poll believe "cheating" affected the outcome of the 2020 election, including 32% of Democrats.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/rebeccado ... n-n2597481

Think maybe this has something to do with the tireless effort on the part of the right, and the Trump functionaries, to paint the election as illegitimate? Jeez man, you are just proving your culthood credentials.

https://www.reuters.com/investigates/sp ... -military/

Seriously? You don't think people can see for themselves? It has to be some kind of Jedi mind trick? It's the staggering number of anomalies, one being all but one House toss up race going red. Trump won every "bell weather" county but a few. No one had ever lost who had won FL, OH and IA. More than a dozen more of these, so Biden may have tallied the most votes, and even the most legitimate votes nationwide. However, there were some counties that stopped counting, sent observers home and then resumed counting. Those counties were key to flipping deciding states. This has been going on forever, like Nixon with Texas and Kennedy with Illinois in 1960.

Thank you for mechanically repeating the vacant points which have been refuted -- repeatedly -- since the election in November. We don't vote by county. The down ballot GOP did well, suggesting or even demonstrating that the American voter had at least the discernment to toss the Moron and still abide by their choice for Congress. Biden won PA, AZ, WI, MI, and GA, counterbalancing the loss of OH and Florida. No "counties" stopped counting. Observers were present throughout the election and post-election recounts and audits. Even the "audits" done by state GOP crazies like you were ineffective in proving anything but what was reported on election day.

So yes, "seriously." We really appreciate your efforts to undermine confidence in the vote, all in the service of a complete Moron who flouted every American institution and debased the one he held. Goodnight little fella. Sorry you don't like democracy.

All this loss rationalizing sounds like a pillow salesman to me....... ..and folks have stopped listening to that tripe for quite some time now

In fact, in a televised interview yesterday Orange Cheeto former DOPUS admitted out loud he lost the election.

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/23/politics ... index.html

[Kismet]

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/23/10652772 ... 6-election

Excellent summary by NPR entitled - The clear and present danger of Trump's enduring 'Big Lie'

worth a read or a listen

[get it to x]

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/23/10652772 ... 6-election

Excellent summary by NPR entitled - The clear and present danger of Trump's enduring 'Big Lie'

worth a read or a listen

So why did the Attorney General and Secretary of State of Pennsylvania file an emergency petition to prevent Fulton Co., PA from inspecting the voting machines in their county? What is the emergency? Luckily a judge ruled against them. They may find nothing but there has been strong resistance to audits or re canvassing in almost every contested state.

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/23/10652772 ... 6-election

Excellent summary by NPR entitled - The clear and present danger of Trump's enduring 'Big Lie'

worth a read or a listen

So why did the Attorney General and Secretary of State of Pennsylvania file an emergency petition to prevent Fulton Co., PA from inspecting the voting machines in their county? What is the emergency? Luckily a judge ruled against them. They may find nothing but there has been strong resistance to audits or re canvassing in almost every contested state.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/12/16/medi ... index.html

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/12/16/medi ... index.html

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/20 ... g-systems/

https://coloradosun.com/2021/12/23/eric ... show-host/

[kramerica.inc]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

[a fan]

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/23/10652772 ... 6-election

Excellent summary by NPR entitled - The clear and present danger of Trump's enduring 'Big Lie'

worth a read or a listen

So why did the Attorney General and Secretary of State of Pennsylvania file an emergency petition to prevent Fulton Co., PA from inspecting the voting machines in their county? What is the emergency? Luckily a judge ruled against them. They may find nothing but there has been strong resistance to audits or re canvassing in almost every contested state.

What happens when the liberals start buying what you’re selling, get it to X?

What happens when tens of millions of liberals think the elections are fixed ? Do you have a plan for this nonsense?

And you STILL haven’t explained ONLY the Trump part of the ballots are rigged—-but the rest of the elections are fine.

Or better still—-how do you explain that any Republican has ever won an election anywhere if all elections are rigged by the Dems?

You’re not making any sense, and you know it. It’s why you’re not answering my questions.

[MDlaxfan76]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

Republican legislatures around the country are keeping it "alive", and more importantly, acting upon it.
Trump is doing so, as are many in the right wing media.

And a majority of Republicans think that believing the Big Lie is and should be important for identification as a Republican.

Most of the other Republicans have a bit more nuanced view, but only slightly, as they think Biden won, but only because the rules favored Democrats, and these rules were unfair and there was rampant voter fraud, or could have been.

That's the tack that FOX is taking, by and large, whereas OAN, Breitbart, and lots of further fringe media remain in close to full throat "Trump won" mode. https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyl ... 1-lawsuit/ And a few on Fox, ala Tucker Carlson, are among the worst such continuing proponents of the Big Lie. Just a month ago he put out an absolutely ridiculous documentary promoting incredible conspiracy theories about it.

Very few remaining Republicans are willing to admit that election was run fair and square and that Biden won, that there was very little actual fraud, much less anything remotely close to meaningful to the outcome. That's the small group, like me, who understand that Republicans down ballot often won in their areas, while Trump did not do so as reliably.

[RedFromMI]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

Republican legislatures around the country are keeping it "alive", and more importantly, acting upon it.
Trump is doing so, as are many in the right wing media.

And a majority of Republicans think that believing the Big Lie is and should be important for identification as a Republican.

Most of the other Republicans have a bit more nuanced view, but only slightly, as they think Biden won, but only because the rules favored Democrats, and these rules were unfair and there was rampant voter fraud, or could have been.

That's the tack that FOX is taking, by and large, whereas OAN, Breitbart, and lots of further fringe media remain in close to full throat "Trump won" mode.

Very few remaining Republicans are willing to admit that election was run fair and square and that Biden won, that there was very little actual fraud, much less anything remotely close to meaningful to the outcome. That's the small group, like me, who understand that Republicans down ballot often won in their areas, while Trump did not do so as reliably.

And the rules that the R's are objecting to basically make it easier to get more voters voting. Not allowing any more "fraud" but actually making it easier to vote (as it should be). That not only allowed Biden to win in an environment that favors Rs (Electoral College) but the Ds to take the Senate in the runoffs in GA.

[seacoaster]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

Hard to believe this is a serious post. Open. Your. Eyes.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

Hard to believe this is a serious post. Open. Your. Eyes.

He’s right….it’s like racism…most of the people that keep the issue going are black people. It’s overblown.

BTW, Merry Christmas

[CU88]

r's were right about voter fraud, and they know this because they commit 99% of it.

Newly obtained surveillance video shows fake Trump elector escorted operatives into Georgia county's elections office before voting machine breach


https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/06/politics ... index.html

[CU88]

Still wondering why Mark Meadows was never "busted" for his fraud, he has to be "Deep Throat" for all pending investigations

[Kismet]

More funny business in Georgia

https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/06/politics ... index.html

Newly obtained surveillance video shows fake Trump elector escorted operatives into Georgia county's elections office before voting machine breach

The breach is now under investigation by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation and is of interest to the Fulton County District Attorney, who is conducting a wider criminal probe of interference in the 2020 election. "

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/01/2 ... nes-527572

Read the never-issued Trump order that would have seized voting machines

The Jan. 6 select panel has obtained the draft order and a document titled "Remarks on National Healing." Both are reported here in detail for the first time."

Traitors Waldron and Flynn were all in. Not a process crime.


Highly recommend this piece via Ari Melber at NBC (updated last night) how the coup evolved from the initial plan to use the military to seize voting machines. Legal analysis on criminal intent is fascinating

[PizzaSnake]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

This hasn't aged well.

[MDlaxfan76]

Out of curiosity, who is really keeping the big lie alive? All of Trump's media coverage has vanished. He's gone off of all media platforms of record- Unless you consider Kenneth Copeland’s Victory Channel real media attention. The only people I still hear talking about "the big lie" are Kenneth Copeland fringe, and all the left who wants their pound of flesh.

This hasn't aged well.

ugh...

[Farfromgeneva]

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/artic ... unbeatable

"U.S. financial markets are outperforming the world by the biggest margin in the 21st century, and with good reason: America’s economy improved more in Joe Biden's first 12 months than any president during the past 50 years notwithstanding the contrary media narrative contributing to dour public opinion.

Exceptional returns from dollar-denominated assets, especially the S&P 500 Index in both absolute terms and relative to its global counterparts, can be attributed to record-low debt ratios enabling companies to reap the biggest profit margins since 1950. Corporate America is booming because the Biden administration's Covid-19 vaccination programs and $1.9 trillion American Rescue Plan reduced the jobless rate to 4.2% in November from 6.2% in February, continuing an unprecedented rate of decline during the Covid-19 pandemic.

Consider that real, or inflation adjusted, gross domestic product surged at an average annual rate of 5.03% in each of the first three quarters of 2021, and is poised to expand 5.6% for the year based on the average estimate of more than 80 economists surveyed Bloomberg. If that forecast proves accurate, it would be more than 2.8 times the average between 2000 and 2019 and double the average since 1976.

All of which makes Biden's first year in the White House the standout among the seven previous presidents, based on 10 market and economic indicators given equal weight. According to data compiled by Bloomberg, no one comes close to matching Biden's combination of No. 1 and No. 2 rankings for each of the measures:

Gross domestic product (1)
Profit growth (1)
S&P 500 performance (2)
Consumer credit (1)
Non-farm payrolls (2)
Manufacturing jobs (2)
Business productivity (2)
Dollar appreciation (2)
S&P 500 relative performance (2)

Per capita disposable income, which rose 1.08% this year, is the only comparable weakness for Biden, trailing Donald Trump’s 2.17%, George W. Bush’s 2.01%, Jimmy Carter’s 1.80% and Ronald Reagan’s 1.42%.

GDP growth in every incoming administration during the past four decades never exceeded 2.74% until 2021. Biden is now positioned to surpass Carter (5.01%) as the GDP champion of presidents since 1976. Much of the credit goes to The American Rescue Plan, which poured $66 billion into 36 million households and reduced the child poverty rate by 50%, helping the U.S. recover faster from the pandemic than most other nations.

Corporate America was never healthier than under Biden in 2021. Efforts to support consumers flowed through to America’s companies, which are enjoying profit margins of around 15%, the widest since 1950, according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis. Non-financial profit increased 39.3%, making Biden No. 1 among eight presidents with Obama a distant second at 21.6%.

The boom times have allowed companies to reduce net debt as a percentage of earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization to the lowest since data was compiled in 1990 for companies in the S&P 500. All this helps explain why the stock market under Biden is second only to George H.W. Bush of any incoming president since Carter.

Americans are certainly feeling good. Consumer credit surged $196 billion through October, a record under Biden that is 27% more than the increase under No. 2 Donald Trump ($154 billion). Although some of the gains reflect a rebound from 2020 when the pandemic caused many consumers to retrench, they wouldn’t be adding debt if they weren’t feeling confident.

The way the jobs market is improving, it’s not hard to see why consumers are in such a good mood. Biden is the only president over the past half century with robust increases in non-farm payrolls (4.3%) and manufacturing jobs (2.6%), approaching the gains enjoyed by Carter in general employment (4.6%) and factory workers (3.9%). Trump, who inherited the longest expansion in modern times and said in 2015 he would “be greatest jobs producer that God ever created,” is an also-ran, with non-farm and manufacturing payrolls inching up 1.4% and 1.3%, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

Companies need all the workers they can get. U.S. business output, a measure of productivity, increased 4.4%, putting Biden ahead of every predecessor except Carter, where it gained 6.25%. No wonder confidence among chief executive officers of the largest U.S. companies soared to a record this year as expectations for hiring, capital investment and sales improved. The Business Roundtable's CEO Economic Outlook index, launched in 2004, rose 10 points to 124 in the fourth quarter, the highest in 20 years.

America’s economy is the envy of the world, looking at the foreign-exchange market. The dollar has strengthened 7.37% this year. That is the most under a first-year president since the greenback gained 17.8% for Reagan, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

In another sign that the U.S. economy is a global leader under Biden, U.S. stocks outperformed the world equity market by 6.3 percentage points, the widest advantage since 1988, when George H.W. Bush was in the White House, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

The good times may extend into 2022. Biden's bipartisan $1.2 trillion Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act bodes well for the economy and American labor because it will rebuild the nation's deteriorating roads and bridges as well as fund climate and broadband initiatives that create jobs. Even Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, who said his priority was preventing the Biden agenda, voted for the law along with 18 fellow Republicans.

Biden, like Carter, now faces the political fallout of the accelerating inflation from global supply chain breakdowns associated with the pandemic even though maintaining stable inflation and interest rates are the primary responsibility of the Federal Reserve, and the Fed said it's prepared to tighten monetary policy in 2022.

Biden, unlike Carter, benefits from the $29 trillion U.S. debt market. In contrast to the 1970s and early 1980s, confidence in the Fed’s ability to get inflation back under control is unimpaired, reflected in the yield on the benchmark 10-year Treasury note fluctuating below 1.7% as inflation hovers at 4.1%. When Carter was in the White House, investors lost confidence in the Fed, evidenced by the 10-year yield rising to 12.6% with inflation reaching 9.65%.

The clear message from the market that tells all other markets what to do is that the people with the most at stake are betting on the Biden economy."

I’m happy with the outcome of the election relative to the choice. But there’s a lot of shaky arguments/analysis in here. Biggest issues is not recognizing the impact Covid had on YOY numbers and that declaring things good now is silly when we are in the eye of the storm. Bragging about consumer credit being up, for example, is dumb. And is was clearly supported by two rounds for direct stimulus payments in 20 & 21 that increased savings - align with rent and CC payment moratoriums.