Number of Games Played

[Gorilla Fan]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

[wgdsr]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

rpi is based on w-l percentages, so the number of games doesn't matter. you're not at a disadvantage vs teams playing more games than you, other than they can get more top wins potentially. but those could also be losses.

[youthathletics]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

rpi is based on w-l percentages, so the number of games doesn't matter. you're not at a disadvantage vs teams playing more games than you, other than they can get more top wins potentially. but those could also be losses.

Agree, to a degree. With such a small samples size and many teams having limited ability to schedule OOC games, it complicates the output of RPI/team/conference. For example, the PL with 9 teams in the conference is handcuffed by availability of OOC scheduling based on their scheduled bye week, tournament time for conferences, very early season games, etc.

I assume GF is making a case, one that has always been an issue....is RPI really the best way to be determining outcome for tournament selection. I say no, but currently, like in most business the answer is "well, we've always done it this way", and it's the best we've got at the moment.

Expanding the tournament or forcing all programs into a conference for Lacrosse and only selecting conference winners are options....the latter is just logically thinking outload.

[BigTurn]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

rpi is based on w-l percentages, so the number of games doesn't matter. you're not at a disadvantage vs teams playing more games than you, other than they can get more top wins potentially. but those could also be losses.

Expanding the tournament or forcing all programs into a conference for Lacrosse and only selecting conference winners are options....the latter is just logically thinking outload.

What teams are not in a conference for lacrosse

[youthathletics]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

rpi is based on w-l percentages, so the number of games doesn't matter. you're not at a disadvantage vs teams playing more games than you, other than they can get more top wins potentially. but those could also be losses.

Expanding the tournament or forcing all programs into a conference for Lacrosse and only selecting conference winners are options....the latter is just logically thinking outload.

What teams are not in a conference for lacrosse

Thanks for question, sorry, that was a bit confusing and I did not complete my thought....I was thinking that since the ACC does not have an AQ and with only 4 teams there needs to be a way to balance out the SOS's among all the other conferences. The way it is now, the ACC schools pick and chose how, when and who they want to schedule, whereas most of the other conferences are handcuffed, as I explained earlier.

Sure the argument is 'hey PL, just win your conference and shut up....I get it and agree, to a point. But how does a program rise in develop talent at an ACC/B10 level, if you only get 1 maybe 2 of those games a year. It is why for the last 20+ years, an ACC team has predominantly owned the coveted championship.

[BigTurn]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

rpi is based on w-l percentages, so the number of games doesn't matter. you're not at a disadvantage vs teams playing more games than you, other than they can get more top wins potentially. but those could also be losses.

Expanding the tournament or forcing all programs into a conference for Lacrosse and only selecting conference winners are options....the latter is just logically thinking outload.

What teams are not in a conference for lacrosse

Thanks for question, sorry, that was a bit confusing and I did not complete my thought....I was thinking that since the ACC does not have an AQ and with only 4 teams there needs to be a way to balance out the SOS's among all the other conferences. The way it is now, the ACC schools pick and chose how, when and who they want to schedule, whereas most of the other conferences are handcuffed, as I explained earlier.

Sure the argument is 'hey PL, just win your conference and shut up....I get it and agree, to a point. But how does a program rise in develop talent at an ACC/B10 level, if you only get 1 maybe 2 of those games a year. It is why for the last 20+ years, an ACC team has predominantly owned the coveted championship.

Using PL as your example

Loyola: Maryland, Hopkins, Duke, gtown (1-3)
Boston: Duke, Yale, brown (1-2)
Colgate: cuse, Yale (0-2)
Navy: Penn state, Hopkins (1-1)
Lehigh: Cornell, Princeton (0-2)
Army: cuse, unc (2-0)

I think you get the picture. PL is getting several OOC games a year, they just aren’t winning most. I also see your point, but the starting point has to be strong performance within the PL such that it doesn’t hurt an ACC/B10s tournament resume just by having you on the schedule. Army and Loyola don’t have issues scheduling games against ACC/B10 for this reason.

[youthathletics]

With the imperfect system of RPI, wouldn't it at least make sense for all teams to play the same number of games?

rpi is based on w-l percentages, so the number of games doesn't matter. you're not at a disadvantage vs teams playing more games than you, other than they can get more top wins potentially. but those could also be losses.

Expanding the tournament or forcing all programs into a conference for Lacrosse and only selecting conference winners are options....the latter is just logically thinking outload.

What teams are not in a conference for lacrosse

Thanks for question, sorry, that was a bit confusing and I did not complete my thought....I was thinking that since the ACC does not have an AQ and with only 4 teams there needs to be a way to balance out the SOS's among all the other conferences. The way it is now, the ACC schools pick and chose how, when and who they want to schedule, whereas most of the other conferences are handcuffed, as I explained earlier.

Sure the argument is 'hey PL, just win your conference and shut up....I get it and agree, to a point. But how does a program rise in develop talent at an ACC/B10 level, if you only get 1 maybe 2 of those games a year. It is why for the last 20+ years, an ACC team has predominantly owned the coveted championship.

Using PL as your example

Loyola: Maryland, Hopkins, Duke, gtown (1-3)
Boston: Duke, Yale, brown (1-2)
Colgate: cuse, Yale (0-2)
Navy: Penn state, Hopkins (1-1)
Lehigh: Cornell, Princeton (0-2)
Army: cuse, unc (2-0)

I think you get the picture. PL is getting several OOC games a year, they just aren’t winning most. I also see your point, but the starting point has to be strong performance within the PL such that it doesn’t hurt an ACC/B10s tournament resume just by having you on the schedule. Army and Loyola don’t have issues scheduling games against ACC/B10 for this reason.

That's the conundrum I was presenting, but trying to limit an in depth conversation. PL teams have essentially resolved that any OOC game is just a hope and a prayer that they 'may' back in in the event they lose the PL Tourney. Whereas, if they had few teams in their conference or added one more and broke it into a PL North and PL South, they could have some x-over games, and more OOC competitions, which would then elevate the team..... a rising tide lifts all boats. So when you only get 1-2 top ranked teams/yr, the games become borderline meaningless for the PL program and risky for an ACC/B1G.

I often ignore Loyola, they are not really a PL school.

[Gorilla Fan]

How many games did Notre Dame play when they missed the tourney?

[BigTurn]

How many games did Notre Dame play when they missed the tourney?

12 games in 2022 when they missed the tourney. Started season 2-4 with no Jake Taylor, then closed the season with 6 straight wins.

@youthatletics - highly unlikely, but would be interesting to see Loyola move to ACC and give them back a 6th team + AQ